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Of the 43 samples I gave most talk about the ability of Christ to deliver those who have once believed - or that we have been translated from death to life forever - or about the divine election of believers by the Father - or the eternal nature of the life we have been given - or our current status on the throne with the Lord, ruling in the Kingdom of God - or the intercessory ministry of Christ - or the eternal sealing by the Holy Spirit of God - or the sufficiency of His sacrifice at Calvary - or that we are not to suffer the wrath of God - or that He is the author of our faith and that He will finish what He began in us - or the blotting out of our sins "forever" --- and many other such things.
The most important thing for you to realize according to your post above is that He is the author of our faith and that He will complete the good work He began in us - no ifs ands or buts.
You seem to think that He is not and that He will not.
You are wrong.
Many of you here seem to have an abysmal lack of understanding concerning the "mechanics of salvation", the basic reason for our salvation, it's assurity and what that assurity says about the faithfulness of the author of our faith who drew us to the Son and whom the Son will deliver up on the day of judgment as trophies of His success at completing all that God sent Him forth to accomplish.
You seem to have conveniently skipped over the lion's share of the N.T. theology concerning salvation in order to preach a gospel of works - which is no gospel at all when all is said and done.
I’m not sure if you noticed my post concerning Ephesians 5
Actually it only addressed two of them and then not very effectively IMO.
I listed over 40 and those just scratched the surface.
Don't go to the trouble.
I hadn't intended to stay this long on the thread and your work might be wasted on me. I hate to see you go to all that trouble.
You might want to save your labor to debate others who will be here longer.
Did you read post 144? This explains most of the verses you quoted friend.
Actually it only addressed two of them and then not very effectively IMO.
Here’s my post #144
Before you read John 10:28 please read John 10:27. My sheep hear my voice, I know them and they follow Me. He doesn’t say they followed Him. They follow present tense.
Before you read John 6:39 please read John 6:37
“All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will certainly not cast out.”
Notice the definition of the Greek word érchomai which is translated to the word comes or cometh. This is only used in the present and imperfect tense meaning anyone who is presently and continuously coming to Him He will certainly not cast out.
cometh
G2064
Lemma:
ἔρχομαι
Transliteration:
érchomai
Pronounce:
el'-tho
Part of Speech:
Verb
Language:
greek
Description:
1) to come a) of persons
1) to come from one place to another, and used both of persons arriving and of those returning
2) to appear, make one's appearance, come before the public
2) metaph. a) to come into being, arise, come forth, show itself, find place or influence b) be established, become known, to come (fall) into or unto
3) to go, to follow one
Grammar:
middle voice of a primary verb (used only in the present and imperfect tenses, the others being supplied by a kindred (middle voice) , or (active) , which do not otherwise occur); to come or go (in a great variety of applications, literally and figuratively):--accompany, appear, bring, come, enter, fall out, go, grow, X light, X next, pass, resort, be set.
Allow me to provide the definitions of the Greek words translated to faith, believe, and believers.
faith
G4102
G4102
Lemma:
πίστις
Transliteration:
pístis
Pronounce:
pis'-tis
Part of Speech:
Noun Feminine
Language:
greek
Description:
1) conviction of the truth of anything, belief; in the NT of a conviction or belief respecting man's relationship to God and divine things, generally with the included idea of trust and holy fervour born of faith and joined with it a) relating to God
1) the conviction that God exists and is the creator and ruler of all things, the provider and bestower of eternal salvation through Christ b) relating to Christ
1) a strong and welcome conviction or belief that Jesus is the Messiah, through whom we obtain eternal salvation in the kingdom of God c) the religious beliefs of Christians d) belief with the predominate idea of trust (or confidence) whether in God or in Christ, springing from faith in the same
2) fidelity, faithfulness a) the character of one who can be relied on
believe
G4100
G4100
Lemma:
πιστεύω
Transliteration:
pisteúō
Pronounce:
pist-yoo'-o
Part of Speech:
Verb
Language:
greek
Description:
1) to think to be true, to be persuaded of, to credit, place confidence in a) of the thing believed
1) to credit, have confidence b) in a moral or religious reference
1) used in the NT of the conviction and trust to which a man is impelled by a certain inner and higher prerogative and law of soul
2) to trust in Jesus or God as able to aid either in obtaining or in doing something: saving faith
3) mere acknowledgment of some fact or event: intellectual faith
2) to entrust a thing to one, i.e. his fidelity a) to be intrusted with a thing
believers
G4103
G4103
Lemma:
πιστός
Transliteration:
pistós
Pronounce:
pis-tos'
Part of Speech:
Adjective
Language:
greek
Description:
1) trusty, faithful a) of persons who show themselves faithful in the transaction of business, the execution of commands, or the discharge of official duties b) one who kept his plighted faith, worthy of trust c) that can be relied on
2) easily persuaded a) believing, confiding, trusting b) in the NT one who trusts in God's promises
1) one who is convinced that Jesus has been raised from the dead
2) one who has become convinced that Jesus is the Messiah and author of salvation
All three of these imply a certain level of trustworthiness, faithfulness, fidelity, obedience, and devotion.
Just because a person is sealed with the Holy Spirit doesn’t mean they are saved. The Holy Spirit guides us it does not take away our free will and our ability to turn away from God.
I have addressed all of the scriptures you have provided. Will you please share your interpretation of John 15:1-10?
Too long for one post. Continued in next post.
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