Is purpose/meaning in your life necessary?

OldWiseGuy said:

Prison is a "foxhole" ("There are no (or very few) atheists in foxholes").

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And there's more baloney. There are plenty of atheists in foxholes. Atheists In Foxholes - Freedom From Religion Foundation

Oscarr said:

It doesn't matter. If death is the end of everything, then anything that has been done to help others or encouraged them becomes meaningless in the grave. If death is the end of everything, how can we help or encourage anyone who is going to go to the same meaningless grave?

Look at the great work that Princess Diana did during her life? She had everything that life could wish for, and yet it all ended in a car crash in a Paris tunnel. Now, just a few years later, most of her work has been forgotten, and in a couple of generations people will be asking, "Who was that woman Diana? What did she do for the good of society?"

I have three degrees - a BA and MA in Literature and a MDiv. When I die, they might as well throw the degree documents in the fire, because they will be no no use to anyone else. I can't tell my daughter that she can have my MA and MDiv when I die, because they were for me and not her. So all that study and effort in gaining them will be for nothing - all vanity, if death is the end of everything.

King Solomon was the richest king in the world at the time he lived, and yet see what he says as an old man when he wrote the book of Ecclesiastes. He said, "All is vanity." In other words he said, "Life sucks and then we die!"

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The good that she has done lives on in many ways. Do you really think that the world has no lasting effects from her life?

OldWiseGuy said:

The atheist's devotion to evolution theory reaches the level of religious zeal, especially when the necessary element of faith is included.

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And Christianity is dangerous because it leads to all manner of atrocities in the the name of their god, including the subjugation of people, abuse and murder.

Now how about we both stop this nonsense?

But hey, if you insist, I can do this all day...

Oscarr said:

Well, believe me, the here and now will soon become the grave, and it will come quicker than what you think.

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So?

I have heard of famous performers who got Alzheimers when they got old and forgot everything they had done in their careers. They had no memory of anything they did in their lives. It was just a big blank. They would walk to their back door and not remember that they walked there. Where is the meaning in that, if death is just the end of everything? What is the here and now for someone like that?

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Like I said, I live for the here and now. The various “meanings” in my life occur as things happen. If I die tomorrow, I still have the meanings in my life today. And that’s more than enough for me.

It seems like between the two of us, you’re the conflicted one. I’m completely at peace...

Kylie said:

The good that she has done lives on in many ways. Do you really think that the world has no lasting effects from her life?

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Time will tell...

ToddNotTodd said:

And Christianity is dangerous because it leads to all manner of atrocities in the the name of their god, including the subjugation of people, abuse and murder.

Now how about we both stop this nonsense?

But hey, if you insist, I can do this all day...

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Are you telling me that people who are loving, joyful, peaceable, gentle, kind, patient, good, faithful, and self-controlled, dangerous people? Those attributes are the characteristics of genuine Christianity.

I wonder what type of professing Christians you have encountered? Certainly not genuine ones. There is a marked difference between religious people posing as Christians and real, genuine Christian believers.

Just because people do things in the name of God, it doesn't mean that they are doing it with God's permission and direction.

I guess you read the Bible sometimes... Read the bit where people come up before Jesus and say, "Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied, cast out demons and done great works in Your name?" And Jesus answered them and said, "I never knew you. Depart from Me you workers of iniquity!"

So these people were professing Christians, very religious, went to church, did all the right things, said all the right things, and used His Name for what they did, and yet Jesus totally rejected them and said that He never knew them. That means that they were never real Christians at all, put posing, putting on the Christian badge and that's all!

I guess you might have read the four gospels sometime in your life. Is there any record there that Jesus committed any of the atrocities you are mentioning? Or did He go around doing good, healing all those oppressed of the devil, as the New Testament points out?

When you come to stand up before Jesus one day, which you will, then will Jesus know you, or even want to know you? That is the question you need to consider. You may tell him that you were put off Christianity because of all the hypocrites who committed atrocities, but He may say to you, "They are not here at the moment to be judged, as they will be, but it is just you and Me here, and what about the choices you have made?"

ToddNotTodd said:

So?



Like I said, I live for the here and now. The various “meanings” in my life occur as things happen. If I die tomorrow, I still have the meanings in my life today. And that’s more than enough for me.

It seems like between the two of us, you’re the conflicted one. I’m completely at peace...

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But if death leads to absolute oblivion, you won't exist to have any awareness of any meaning that you might have had in life. There will be no longer any "you" to care about it one way or another.

Kylie said:

And there's more baloney. There are plenty of atheists in foxholes. Atheists In Foxholes - Freedom From Religion Foundation

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I had a friend of the family who was in the Western Desert in World War 2, fighting the Germans. He said there were plenty of atheists in his company of fellow soldiers. He said that when the air raids came over, or the shells started falling, they would jump into the slit trenches and pray for all their worth, "O God please protect me. I don't want to die!"

Experience wins over an argument every time.

Oscarr said:

Are you telling me that people who are loving, joyful, peaceable, gentle, kind, patient, good, faithful, and self-controlled, dangerous people? Those attributes are the characteristics of genuine Christianity.

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If I listed all the atrocities made in the name of Christianity, I’d be here for days. And there’s no need to respond with a no True Scotsman fallacy, that doesn’t work for me.

When you come to stand up before Jesus one day, which you will...

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I don’t believe this is true.

Oscarr said:

But if death leads to absolute oblivion, you won't exist to have any awareness of any meaning that you might have had in life. There will be no longer any "you" to care about it one way or another.

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So? Why does this bother you so much? Is the reason you’re a Christian have to do with this unease about death you seem to have?

I don’t have any unease about death at all. I think it’s more healthy that way.

Oscarr said:

I had a friend of the family who was in the Western Desert in World War 2, fighting the Germans. He said there were plenty of atheists in his company of fellow soldiers. He said that when the air raids came over, or the shells started falling, they would jump into the slit trenches and pray for all their worth, "O God please protect me. I don't want to die!"

Experience wins over an argument every time.

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I had a great uncle in WW2. He said there were plenty of Christians who, in the heat of battle, seeing the carnage on both sides, would renounce their faith on the grounds that a god wouldn’t let these kinds of horrors happen.

So yeah, experience wins over an argument every time.

ToddNotTodd said:

If I listed all the atrocities made in the name of Christianity, I’d be here for days. And there’s no need to respond with a no True Scotsman fallacy, that doesn’t work for me.

I don’t believe this is true.

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I explained that fully, but after reading my post, you have decided not to believe what I am saying. No problem. Your choice...

ToddNotTodd said:

So? Why does this bother you so much? Is the reason you’re a Christian have to do with this unease about death you seem to have?

I don’t have any unease about death at all. I think it’s more healthy that way.

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This is not about me at all. I have no fear of death, because I know what is going to happen after it for me.

ToddNotTodd said:

I had a great uncle in WW2. He said there were plenty of Christians who, in the heat of battle, seeing the carnage on both sides, would renounce their faith on the grounds that a god wouldn’t let these kinds of horrors happen.

So yeah, experience wins over an argument every time.

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Well, that same family friend said that the chaplain was taking a funeral for a slain soldier when an air raid came over, and while others were taking cover, he jumped into the grave with the body!

But it all depends on what they had their faith in. If they had faith in religion, or in a god of their own imagination, I can understand that they would have departed the faith, but the faith they had was not in Christ Himself but in an imaginary Christ that they made up in their own minds.

Oscarr said:

As I said in my previous post. Life goes like a puff of smoke. At my age I wonder where all the years have gone, and if death is going to be the absolute end of everything for me, I would be totally miserable and depressed at the thought of my impending death and oblivion.

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It´s great that you have your religion to prevent you from depression.
Personally, though, I can´t relate to your problem in the first place, so I have no need for your solution.

quatona said:

It´s great that you have your religion to prevent you from depression.
Personally, though, I can´t relate to your problem in the first place, so I have no need for your solution.

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Great. Your choice

Oscarr said:

Great. Your choice

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Well, taking a cure for a disease I don´t have would seem to be a stupid choice.

Oscarr said:

In two generations she will be just another name in a history book.

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True, most people's accomplishments are soon forgotten (except by family and friends). However the notable works of many are remembered; authors, statesmen, industrialists, scientists, inventors, etc. all leave a memorable legacy.

ToddNotTodd said:

And Christianity is dangerous because it leads to all manner of atrocities in the the name of their god, including the subjugation of people, abuse and murder.

Now how about we both stop this nonsense?

But hey, if you insist, I can do this all day...

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I don't think many are "led to all manner of atrocities" by Christianity today, whereas atheistic/evolutionary abortion is an atrocity on a grand scale.

ToddNotTodd said:

I had a great uncle in WW2. He said there were plenty of Christians who, in the heat of battle, seeing the carnage on both sides, would renounce their faith on the grounds that a god wouldn’t let these kinds of horrors happen.

So yeah, experience wins over an argument every time.

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Yeah, there are nothing but atheists in fox holes. If one believes a god is protecting them, one doesn't need a fox hole. OTOH, if iron chariots can defeat your god maybe a fox hole is good place for a believer to be.