Who Here Believes Born Again Christians...

Kenyon Ledford said:

are going to hell by not following certain verses in the bible?

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I'm not responsible for making that decision. That's His job. What I think is irrelevant.

BNR32FAN said:

There’s two way a person can look at eternal security. I think perhaps we are looking at it from different perspectives. One way of looking at eternal security is by seeing those who are written in the book of life and another way is to see those who are on the path to being written in the book of life but stray off the path and never repent. The book of life was written according to God’s foreknowledge before creation. It will not be edited. In that aspect those who are written in the book of life are eternally saved. God has foreseen that they will not stray from the path and they will endure to the end. But what has God foreseen? He has already seen the choices we have made, are currently making, and will make in the future. Because we have free will we ultimately decide what God had already foreseen by the choices we make. We are in control of our destiny and fate. We have at any given moment the ability to become children of God or sons of disobedience. In this aspect a person who is on the path to salvation can stray from that path and lose the salvation he would’ve received had he stayed on the path. Hence they were saved but lost their salvation.

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Chapter and verse please.

Kenyon Ledford said:

Do raccoons go to heaven?

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Monk Brendan said:

Baalam's ass spoke in a new language, too, and she was the same ass afterwards as before.

"Accepting Jesus into your heart" is a work that YOU do, and we are not saved by our own works.

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Accepting someone into your heart is a figure of speech that means to love someone. Just because we are not justified by works doesn’t mean works are not necessary for salvation. I don’t think loving someone even applies to works.

Monk Brendan said:

Where did I said they did?

Quote my exact words, please.

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My apologies and don't assume things please. You seem level headed... we don't need to reach a place where we cannot converse. As for the comment, the side discussion I was having, the one you chimed in on, was about Jews in Judea, not what language was spoken by everyone else in the area. The Jews primary language was Aramaic and there are not many scholars left who don't agree. Even the discovery of the DSS kinda of puts an end to this. Most of them were in Hebrew, the next higher amount were Aramaic, and there were also "some" Greek and Arabic texts found.

The point and side discussion was Jews in Judea. And I think we best let the topic return to the OP's intent.

Be blessed.
Ken

BNR32FAN said:

Accepting someone into your heart is a figure of speech that means to love someone. Just because we are not justified by works doesn’t mean works are not necessary for salvation. I don’t think loving someone even applies to works.

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I like what you said but would submit this for consideration. John wrote, "this is the love of God, that we obey His commandments." And Yeshua himself said, "if you love me, keep my commandments." In that culture, love brought with it action. It wasn't that somebody didn't or wouldn't say, "I love you," but they would be more apt to SHOW their love. The Hallmark company and the 1960's turned love into a purely emotional western idea.... for one living in an ancient near east culture, love was shown by actions.

So when it comes to salvation... we are "saved" if you will, when we turn to God with out heart and submit to Him as Lord. But if that heart change, that new love is genuine, it will bring with it a desire to walk according to His will as He is Lord. Anything less leaves us as Lord... calling our own shots.

Unnamed Guy said:

Chapter and verse please.

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For what the book of life being written before creation?

“"The beast that you saw was, and is not, and is about to come up out of the abyss and go to destruction. And those who dwell on the earth, whose name has not been written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, will wonder when they see the beast, that he was and is not and will come.”
‭‭REVELATION‬ ‭17:8‬ ‭NASB

If the book of life was written before creation then it was written according to God’s foreknowledge of who would overcome and endure to the end. According to John 3:16-18

“"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life. For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world might be saved through Him. He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.”
‭‭JOHN‬ ‭3:16-18‬ ‭NASB‬‬

If you believe God chose who would be saved and who would burn in the lake of fire that contradicts John 3:16-17 that He loved the world and sent His Son so that the world may be saved. Not to mention 1 Timothy 2:3-4 and 2 Peter 3:9. And why would the people be judged according to verse 18 for whether they believe or not if God has made them incapable of believing? That would be unjust and God is not unjust.

“And I, if I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all men to Myself."”
‭‭JOHN‬ ‭12:32‬ ‭NASB‬‬

God will call on everyone to repent and be saved it’s up to us whether or not we will accept His calling.

Ken Rank said:

I like what you said but would submit this for consideration. John wrote, "this is the love of God, that we obey His commandments." And Yeshua himself said, "if you love me, keep my commandments." In that culture, love brought with it action. It wasn't that somebody didn't or wouldn't say, "I love you," but they would be more apt to SHOW their love. The Hallmark company and the 1960's turned love into a purely emotional western idea.... for one living in an ancient near east culture, love was shown by actions.

So when it comes to salvation... we are "saved" if you will, when we turn to God with out heart and submit to Him as Lord. But if that heart change, that new love is genuine, it will bring with it a desire to walk according to His will as He is Lord. Anything less leaves us as Lord... calling our own shots.

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I agree a genuine love will impel devotion which is what I believe the very definition of faith is.

BNR32FAN said:

I agree a genuine love will impel devotion which is what I believe the very definition of faith is.

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Me to. We hear God and we do whatever He says. That's why the great faith chapter (Hebrews 11) has only examples of people who heard something from God and then acted on what they heard. Hearing isn't faith, nor is doing... but when we hear and do, that is faith.

SeventhFisherofMen said:

Funny, Christ Himself spoke in parables having to do with every day life to communicate to His believers, ie: us.

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This is true, but I think there are far better examples in everyday life. Like a tattoo, or a scar. Once it's on, it's on. It doesn't wash away and doesn't have to be redone. Yes, tattoos can sometimes be removed, but it is a deliberate process, you can't just lose your tattoo.

Kenyon Ledford said:

Yes, THANK YOU! Exactly.

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Isaiah 54:9 For this is as the waters of Noah to me: for as I have sworn that the waters of Noah should no more go over the earth; so have I sworn that I would not be wroth with you, nor rebuke you.
That's an old Covenant prophecy that has been fulfilled in the New Covenant.
Do I believe my salvation is secure, yes. Do I believe I could lose my salvation, yes, but I would have to really be trying hard for that to happen.

Monk Brendan said:

Baalam's ass spoke in a new language, too, and she was the same ass afterwards as before.

"Accepting Jesus into your heart" is a work that YOU do, and we are not saved by our own works.

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It's not a work to ask for a free Gift and receive it. It's called faith and obedience.

Jonathan Mathews said:

It's not a work to ask for a free Gift and receive it. It's called faith and obedience.

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In other words, if you do something, it's not a work.

Do I understand you properly?

BNR32FAN said:

What is your interpretation of John 15:1-10?

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15 I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
Jesus is the way the truth and the life and in this case, the vine.

2 Every branch in me that beareth not fruit, he taketh it away: and every [branch] that beareth fruit, he cleanseth it, that it may bear more fruit.
Every stim branching from the vine that doesn't bear fruit is not truly of the vine and will be cut off. Every branch that does bear fruit he will prune and bless amd by his grace will grow in fruits of the spirit.

3 Already ye are clean because of the word which I have spoken unto you.
They are already saved, they only await the bearing of fruits.

4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; so neither can ye, except ye abide in me.
It is the spirit by which we bear fruit, not of ourselves. This is why we do not boast of works.

5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same beareth much fruit: for apart from me ye can do nothing.
Without the Lord in our lives there is no fruit.


6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and they gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.
If you do not recieve the Lord as savior you are cast out and judged.

7 If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ask whatsoever ye will, and it shall be done unto you.
Your prayers are heard and answered according to his will.

8 Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; and [so] shall ye be my disciples.

9 Even as the Father hath loved me, I also have loved you: abide ye in my love.

10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love;
These are NOT the ordinances of the Mosiac Law but the commandments given by the Lord Jesus. Primarily this being accepting him as Lord and Savior, forgiving others, Adhering to the things of the spirit rather than the flesh.