You may not have but I said that the idea of "matter from nothing"
"May not" have? I definitely did
not and stated so. This is given to be doubly clear.
had to have come from 2nd, and 3rd century philosophers, because the definition of "bara" does not suggest "matter from nothing"
Which lexicons do you have in evidence of your claim that it cannot ever mean 'from nothing'? I acknowledge the multiple definitions and uses, which includes also 'from nothing', and 'from something'.
Here is a lexicon, which clearly states that 'bara' can indeed carry that definition:
"...
bârâ’ specifically means 'to create something new' and this is how the majority of the early Jewish writers took it. ...
bârâ’ is never followed by the material out of which something is made and thus implies
creatio ex-nihilo, 'creation out of nothing', or at the very least 'innovation'. ... A good example of the 'newness' with which is associated is in the phrase in Numbers 16:30, "But if the LORD
creates a
new thing..." or in the strange verse, Jeremiah 31:22, "For the LORD has
created a
new thing in the earth - A woman shall encompass a man". ..."
- Bârâ'' - Hebrew Thoughts- Language Studies - StudyLight.org
Another:
"... (a) First of all, and before any creature was, God made heaven and earth out of nothing. ..."
- Geneva Bible Translation Notes
Another:
"... These are said to be "created", that is, to be made out of nothing; for what pre-existent matter to this chaos could there be out of which they could be formed? And the apostle says, "through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear", Heb_11:3. And though this word is sometimes used, and even in this chapter, of the production of creatures out of pre-existent matter, as in Gen_1:21 yet, as Nachmanides observes, there is not in the holy language any word but this here used, by which is signified the bringing anything into being out of nothing; and many of the Jewish interpreters, as Aben Ezra, understand by creation here, a production of something into being out of nothing; and Kimchi says (e) that creation is a making some new thing, and a bringing something out of nothing: and it deserves notice, that this word is only used of God; and creation must be the work of God, for none but an almighty power could produce something out of nothing. ..."
- John Gill's Exposition of the Bible and Notations on Genesis 1:1, Bara.
Another:
"... Created - Caused existence where previously to this moment there was no being. The rabbins, who are legitimate judges in a case of verbal criticism on their own language, are unanimous in asserting that the word ברא bara expresses the commencement of the existence of a thing, or egression from nonentity to entity. It does not in its primary meaning denote the preserving or new forming things that had previously existed, as some imagine, but creation in the proper sense of the term, though it has some other acceptations in other places. The supposition that God formed all things out of a pre-existing, eternal nature, is certainly absurd, for if there had been an eternal nature besides an eternal God, there must have been two self-existing, independent, and eternal beings, which is a most palpable contradiction. ..."
- Adam Clarke's Commentary on the Bible and Notation on Genesis 1:1, Bara.
Another:
"... "... bārā', “create, give being to something new.” ... Its object may be anything: matter Gen_1:1; ... Whenever anything absolutely new - that is, not involved in anything previously extant - is called into existence, there is creation Num_16:30. ..." ..."
- Albert Barnes Notes on the Bible on Genesis 1:1, Bara.
Another:
"... created — not formed from any pre-existing materials, but made out of nothing. ..." -
Jamieson, Fausset & Brown Commentary on Genesis 1:1, Bara.
Another:
"... “In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.” - Heaven and earth have not existed from all eternity, but had a beginning; nor did they arise by emanation from an absolute substance, but were created by God. This sentence, which stands at the head of the records of revelation, is not a mere heading, nor a summary of the history of the creation, but a declaration of the primeval act of God, by which the universe was called into being. That this verse is not a heading merely, is evident from the fact that the following account of the course of the creation commences with w (and), which connects the different acts of creation with the fact expressed in Gen_1:1, as the primary foundation upon which they rest. בְּרשִׁיח (in the beginning) is used absolutely, like ἐν ἀρχῇ in Joh_1:1, and מֵרֵאשִׁיח in Isa_46:10. The following clause cannot be treated as subordinate, either by rendering it, “in the beginning when God created ..., the earth was,” etc., or “in the beginning when God created...(but the earth was then a chaos, etc.), God said, Let there be light” (Ewald and Bunsen). The first is opposed to the grammar of the language, which would require Gen_1:2 to commence with הָאָרֶץ וַתְּהִי; the second to the simplicity of style which pervades the whole chapter, and to which so involved a sentence would be intolerable, apart altogether from the fact that this construction is invented for the simple purpose of getting rid of the doctrine of a creatio ex nihilo, which is so repulsive to modern Pantheism. רֵאשִׁיח in itself is a relative notion, indicating the commencement of a series of things or events; but here the context gives it the meaning of the very first beginning, the commencement of the world, when time itself began. The statement, that in the beginning God created the heaven and the earth, not only precludes the idea of the eternity of the world a parte ante, but shows that the creation of the heaven and the earth was the actual beginning of all things. The verb בָּרָא, indeed, to judge from its use in Jos_17:15, Jos_17:18, where it occurs in the Piel (to hew out), means literally “to cut, or new,” but in Kal it always means to create, and is only applied to a divine creation, the production of that which had no existence before. It is never joined with an accusative of the material, although it does not exclude a pre-existent material unconditionally, but is used for the creation of man (Gen_1:27; Gen_5:1-2), and of everything new that God creates, whether in the kingdom of nature (Num_16:30) or of that of grace (Exo_34:10; Psa_51:10, etc.). In this verse, however, the existence of any primeval material is precluded by the object created: “the heaven and the earth.” ..."
- Keil & Delitzsch Commentary on the OT, Genesis 1:1, Bara.
Again:
"... the verb ברא (
bara') denotes creation
ex nihilo. ..."
- באר | Abarim Publications Theological Dictionary (Old Testament Hebrew)
Another (written long before 2-3rd century AD):
"... 2Ma 7:28 peto nate aspicias in caelum et terram et ad
omnia quae in eis sunt et intellegas quia ex nihilo fecit illa Deus et hominum genus ..." - 2 Maccabees 7:28 (translation into English: "Son, look upon heaven and earth, and all that is in them: and consider that God made them out of nothing")
Who has the Greek Philosophy?
"... Philo, Justin Martyr, Athenagoras from Athens, Hermogenes, Clement of Alexandria made statements that seem to indicate that they did not hold to the concept of creation ex nihilo. Philo, for instance, postulated pre-existent matter alongside God. It is fascinating how this thinking is inline with Greek philosophy (when speaking on the subject of pre-existence) ..."
- The Creator (Heb: bara)
and your 1 scripture from Hebrews even uses the word "framed", which does not mean "from nothing".
I did not merely cite "1 scripture". I cited numerous:
Gen. 1:1; Exo. 20:8-11; Job 26:7, 38:4-6; Psa. 33:6,9, 90:2; Pro. 8:23-26; Isa. 43:7, 45:18; John 1:1-3; Eph. 3:9; Col. 1:16-17; Heb 2:10, 3:4, 11:3; 1 John 1:1-3; Rev. 4:11.
Thus my question:
"What is "Earth' made of? It is made of 'earth' ...
Again, LDS have an infinite regress here, as elsewhere, for where did the 'atoms', 'molecules' come from?"
Look at Hebrews 11:3, again:
Heb 11:3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.
The word "framed" means brought to perfect, as Gen. 2:1-3 show. That word is in the context of "not made of things which do appear".
Molecules may be seen upon specialized microscopes and thus indeed do "appear" -
molecules under the microscope - Google Search
Thus God also creates a new heart, not from the old material, but by His creative word, bringing into existence that which had not existence before, except as God's word comes from the mind/heart of God.
"... for out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaketh."
In Genesis, "God said ...", and thus, "... he spake, and it was ..." (Psa. 33:9)., see also Pro. 8.