If a local law contradicts the Bible, what should we obey?

Does local laws have authority over the word of God?

  • Yes. God established the authoirty. We must obey regardless of what scripture says.

  • No. God commands are supreme.We are to obey local laws only if they dont contradict God.

  • It depends.

  • I don't know.


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SkyWriting

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Yes. Local law, state law, federal law, if any of them violate God's law then we cannot comply with them. The Early Church had a lot of martyrs because they refused to obey certain Roman laws.

That sounds correct. But Jesus taught otherwise and backed his opinion with His own life.

Matthew 26
47While he was still speaking, Judas came, one of the twelve, and with him a great crowd with swords and clubs, from the chief priests and the elders of the people. 48Now the betrayer had given them a sign, saying, “The one I will kiss is the man; seize him.” 49And he came up to Jesus at once and said, “Greetings, Rabbi!” And he kissed him. 50Jesus said to him, “Friend, do what you came to do.”f Then they came up and laid hands on Jesus and seized him. 51And behold, one of those who were with Jesus stretched out his hand and drew his sword and struck the servantg of the high priest and cut off his ear. 52Then Jesus said to him, “Put your sword back into its place. For all who take the sword will perish by the sword.53Do you think that I cannot appeal to my Father, and he will at once send me more than twelve legions of angels? 54But how then should the Scriptures be fulfilled, that it must be so?” 55At that hour Jesus said to the crowds, “Have you come out as against a robber, with swords and clubs to capture me? Day after day I sat in the temple teaching, and you did not seize me. 56But all this has taken place that the Scriptures of the prophets might be fulfilled.” Then all the disciples left him and fled.

The Jews were seeking a Messiah that would dominate over the local government.
 
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SkyWriting

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But the new testament is filled with warnings about obeying the secular law if that law requires you to transgress the laws of God.

That sounds right, but nobody has found one yet.

69Now Peter was sitting outside in the courtyard. And a servant girl came up to him and said, “You also were with Jesus the Galilean.” 70But he denied it before them all, saying, “I do not know what you mean.” 71And when he went out to the entrance, another servant girl saw him, and she said to the bystanders, “This man was with Jesus of Nazareth.” 72And again he denied it with an oath: “I do not know the man.” 73After a little while the bystanders came up and said to Peter, “Certainly you too are one of them, for your accent betrays you.” 74Then he began to invoke a curse on himself and to swear, “I do not know the man.” And immediately the rooster crowed. 75And Peter remembered the saying of Jesus, “Before the rooster crows, you will deny me three times.” And he went out and wept bitterly.

Depending on who one is talking to:
-Harboring a fugitive
-Accessory after the fact
-impeding an investigation or legal process
 
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SkyWriting

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Can anyone please tell me if I am wrong on this. But my position is that we are commanded to obey local laws, however, if local authorities command us to disobey God, “We must obey God rather than human beings!"

"Human beings" in this context is the church council and religious leadership rulers. And I agree that religious rulers should be ignored.

Acts 5
17 But the high priest rose up, and all who were with him (that is, the party of the Sadducees)...
 
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SkyWriting

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He told me specifically that "local laws have authority over scripture".

Jesus stated His opinion that local law was His Fathers will on earth. This surprised me as well. Here Jesus refuses to speak out against local law.

They made her stand before them 4and said, “Teacher, this woman was caught in the act of adultery. 5In the Law Moses commanded us to stone such a woman. So what do You say?”

6They said this to test Him, in order to have a basis for accusing Him. But Jesus bent down and began to write on the ground with His finger.

7When they continued to question Him, He straightened up and said to them, “Let him who is without sin among you be the first to cast a stone at her.” 8And again He bent down and wrote on the ground.

9When they heard this,a they began to go away one by one, beginning with the older ones, until only Jesus was left, with the woman standing there.10Then Jesus straightened upb and asked her, “Woman, where are your accusers?c Has no one condemned you?”

11“No one, Lord,” she answered.

“Then neither do I condemn you,” Jesus declared. “Now go and sin no more.”
 
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SkyWriting

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Yes. Local law, state law, federal law, if any of them violate God's law then we cannot comply with them. The Early Church had a lot of martyrs because they refused to obey certain Roman laws.

During Prohibition, an exemption was made for consumption for religious purposes. That was good news for my Church, who otherwise would've been forced to disobey the law in order to celebrate Mass.

Even though scripture says to obey authorities? I'd just arrest the whole group.
Jesus died defending local law.
 
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thecolorsblend

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That sounds correct. But Jesus taught otherwise and backed his opinion with His own life.

Matthew 26
47While he was still speaking, Judas came, one of the twelve, and with him a great crowd with swords and clubs, from the chief priests and the elders of the people. 48Now the betrayer had given them a sign, saying, “The one I will kiss is the man; seize him.” 49And he came up to Jesus at once and said, “Greetings, Rabbi!” And he kissed him. 50Jesus said to him, “Friend, do what you came to do.”f Then they came up and laid hands on Jesus and seized him. 51And behold, one of those who were with Jesus stretched out his hand and drew his sword and struck the servantg of the high priest and cut off his ear. 52Then Jesus said to him, “Put your sword back into its place. For all who take the sword will perish by the sword.53Do you think that I cannot appeal to my Father, and he will at once send me more than twelve legions of angels? 54But how then should the Scriptures be fulfilled, that it must be so?” 55At that hour Jesus said to the crowds, “Have you come out as against a robber, with swords and clubs to capture me? Day after day I sat in the temple teaching, and you did not seize me. 56But all this has taken place that the Scriptures of the prophets might be fulfilled.” Then all the disciples left him and fled.

The Jews were seeking a Messiah that would dominate over the local government.
So you believe that the martyrs of the first century were wrong in disobeying Rome, is that correct?
 
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SkyWriting

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So you believe that the martyrs of the first century were wrong in disobeying Rome, is that correct?
Sorry. Perhaps their heart was in the right place. I am incompetent to judge others intentions.

1 Samuel 16:7
For the Lord sees not as man sees: man looks on the outward appearance, but the Lord looks on the heart.”
 
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SkyWriting

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Well. the laws in question doesn't necessarily have to be a U.S. law. Take countries like China, North Korea, and Saudi Arabia where worshiping God and sharing the Gospel may be forbidden.
Obey local laws! This is advice that will allow you to live in other countries. Other advice in this thread will have you dead or in jail, if your lucky.

Romans 13:1-7
Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. .....Therefore one must be in subjection, not only to avoid God's wrath but also for the sake of conscience.
 
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SkyWriting

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This question is a response to a discussion I was having with a friend. The friend truly believes that all government authorities are established by God and therefore ought to be obeyed. This I agree with because it is found repeatedly in scripture. Romans 13 is clearly one of them. However, this friend went on to say that because God established all authorities, we are commanded by God to obey these authorities even if the laws contradict the word of God. He told me specifically that "local laws have authority over scripture". Can anyone please tell me if I am wrong on this. But my position is that we are commanded to obey local laws, however, if local authorities command us to disobey God, “We must obey God rather than human beings!" Acts 5:29. What do you think?

Do exactly as scripture requires!

Titus 3:1
Remind them to be submissive to rulers and authorities, to be obedient...
 
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thecolorsblend

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Sorry. Perhaps their heart was in the right place. I am incompetent to judge others intentions.

1 Samuel 16:7
For the Lord sees not as man sees: man looks on the outward appearance, but the Lord looks on the heart.”
You've spent most of your participation in this thread judging the intentions of others.

So again, were the first and second century martyrs wrong to disobey Rome? Or were they right?
 
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SkyWriting

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So again, were the first and second century martyrs wrong to disobey Rome? Or were they right?

That all depends.

James 4:17
So whoever knows the right thing to do and fails to do it, for him it is sin.

(Hint: Not for everyone else)
 
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SkyWriting

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But the new testament is filled with warnings about obeying the secular law if that law requires you to transgress the laws of God. Worshipping the image of the beast is perhaps the best example.

"Filled with" implies more than zero.

0.
1.
2.
3.

I found no reference to local government law requiring anything about a beast.
 
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thecolorsblend

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That all depends.

James 4:17
So whoever knows the right thing to do and fails to do it, for him it is sin.

(Hint: Not for everyone else)
Spare me the context-free, drive-by scripture quote.

If you have something to say then say it outright. Don't leave it to somebody else's inference.
 
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(° ͡ ͜ ͡ʖ ͡ °) (ᵔᴥᵔʋ)

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"Human beings" in this context is the church council and religious leadership rulers. And I agree that religious rulers should be ignored.

Acts 5
17 But the high priest rose up, and all who were with him (that is, the party of the Sadducees)...
So just to be clear, you are saying that the only authority that we are not to obey is church leadership and that all other authorities ought to be obeyed? Are non-Christian authorities the only authorities not established by the will of God?
 
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That all depends.

James 4:17
So whoever knows the right thing to do and fails to do it, for him it is sin.

(Hint: Not for everyone else)
So in regards to obeying local laws "that all depends"? Depends on what?
 
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(° ͡ ͜ ͡ʖ ͡ °) (ᵔᴥᵔʋ)

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"Filled with" implies more than zero.

0.
1.
2.
3.

I found no reference to local government law requiring anything about a beast.
Revelation has a clear warning that if you take the mark:
"they, too, will drink the wine of God’s fury, which has been poured full strength into the cup of his wrath. They will be tormented with burning sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and of the Lamb."
Revelation 14:10
 
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SkyWriting

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Revelation has a clear warning that if you take the mark:
"they, too, will drink the wine of God’s fury, which has been poured full strength into the cup of his wrath. They will be tormented with burning sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and of the Lamb."
Revelation 14:10

I checked your claims. But no mention of government or local authority.
Revelation 14 NASB

6And I saw another angel flying in midheaven, having an eternal gospel to preach to those who live on the earth, and to every nation and tribe and tongue and people; 7and he said with a loud voice, “Fear God, and give Him glory, because the hour of His judgment has come; worship Him who made the heaven and the earth and sea and springs of waters.”
8And another angel, a second one, followed, saying, “Fallen, fallen is Babylon the great, she who has made all the nations drink of the wine of the passion of her immorality.”

Doom for Worshipers of the Beast

9Then another angel, a third one, followed them, saying with a loud voice, “If anyone worships the beast and his image, and receives a mark on his forehead or on his hand, 10he also will drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is mixed in full strength in the cup of His anger; and he will be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb. 11“And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever; they have no rest day and night, those who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name.” 12Here is the perseverance of the saints who keep the commandments of God and their faith in Jesus.
13And I heard a voice from heaven, saying, “Write, ‘Blessed are the dead who die in the Lord from now on!’” “Yes,” says the Spirit, “so that they may rest from their labors, for their deeds follow with them.”

The Reapers
14Then I looked, and behold, a white cloud, and sitting on the cloud was one like a son of man, having a golden crown on His head and a sharp sickle in His hand. 15And another angel came out of the temple, crying out with a loud voice to Him who sat on the cloud, “Put in your sickle and reap, for the hour to reap has come, because the harvest of the earth is ripe.” 16Then He who sat on the cloud swung His sickle over the earth, and the earth was reaped.
17And another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven, and he also had a sharp sickle. 18Then another angel, the one who has power over fire, came out from the altar; and he called with a loud voice to him who had the sharp sickle, saying, “Put in your sharp sickle and gather the clusters from the vine of the earth, because her grapes are ripe.” 19So the angel swung his sickle to the earth and gathered the clusters from the vine of the earth, and threw them into the great wine press of the wrath of God. 20And the wine press was trodden outside the city, and blood came out from the wine press, up to the horses’ bridles, for a distance of two hundred miles.
 
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