When do the last days end?

Jonaitis · Apr 2, 2019

Dorothy Mae said:
The OP question is pretty interesting if you think about it. When do the last days of anything end and the first days of the new state begin? Are we in the last days or the first days?

Anyway, your reply is fine. I was just thinking.

Yeah, what is your opinion on that question you presented?

Dorothy Mae · Apr 2, 2019

LittleLambofJesus said:
Jesus only uses the word "parousia" in 1 chapter of the Gospels.....Matthew 24:

Matthew 24, Mark 13 and Luke's Temple/Jerusalem Discourses harmonized
Mount of Olives and Titus

Matthew 24:
3
He is yet sitting on the mount of the Olives, the disciples toward-came to Him according to own, saying, `Tell us, when? shall these be
and what? the sign of Thy parousiaV <3952>,
and of the full-finish<sun-teleiaV <4930> of the Age?'
27
for even as the lightning/star-flashes/astraph <796> comes-out from risings, and is appearing till of west,
thus shall be the parousia <3952> of the Son of the Man;
37
For as even the days of the Noah thus shall be the parousia <3952> of the Son of the Man
39
and not they know till came the flood and took/lifted all! away.
Thus shall be also the parousia <3952> of the Son of the Man.

Mark 13
3 And of sitting of Him into the Mount of the Olives over against the Temple,
Peter and James and John and Andrew inquired<1905> of Him according to own
4 Tell to us! when these shall be being?
and what the sign whenever may be being about<3195> these.

Luke 21:7
They inquire yet of Him saying “Teacher!
when then shall these be being?
And what the sign whenever may be being about<3195> these to becoming?
=====================================

2 Thessalonians 2:
1 - And we ask you, brethren, in regard to the parousiaV <3952> of our Lord Jesus Christ, and of our gathering together unto Him,
8 - and then shall be revealed the Lawless One, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the manifestation of His parousiaV <3952>,
2 Peter 3:4
and saying, 'Where is the promise of His parousiaV <3952>?
for since the fathers did fall asleep, all things so remain from the beginning of the creation;'
James 5
7 Be patient then brethren, till the parousiaV <3952> of the Lord;
behold the husbandman doth expect the precious fruit of the earth, being patient for it, till he may receive rain -- early and latter;
James 5
be ye patient! and stand-fast the hearts of ye,
that the parousia <3952> of the Lord has-neared/hggiken <1448> (5758);
=====================

.

Jesus didn’t speak to them in Greek. He didn’t use a Greek word at all.

Dorothy Mae · Apr 2, 2019

Jonaitis said:
Yeah, what is your opinion on that question you presented?

Good question!! Just thinking here and formulating... I think 2000 years of “last days” renders both words, last and days, meaningless. It’s like saying 10 years of last moments. In one way it’s true but it doesn’t really communicate anything and tends to communicate something untrue. The last days of a man are right before he dies. His whole life can sort of be seen as comprised of last days, but that is not what we mean by “last.”

So I think the term is now meaningless at best and communicates false thinking at worst. Jesus is not coming days from now. We do not have to ready to “flee Jerusalem” as they did.

I think that is very comforting. There will be no signs of his second coming so we needn’t look for them. I find that superior to fear.

I agree with the poster who wrote we are in the millennial kingdom.

parousia70 · Apr 2, 2019

Ronald said:
Light comes from the Lord.

I understand that. I’m asking how you calculate a month, or in this case “every month”, if as you say, time ceases to exist.
How long is a month in the eternal state?
30 eternal days?

Genesis spoke of the first days.

Agreed.
So you say the last day began... when?

Dorothy Mae · Apr 2, 2019

parousia70 said:
How do the trees there yield their fruit “every month” then, as we see them doing in Revelation 22:2??

I wonder if when Rev speaks of no need for a “sun or moon” it doesn’t mean the ceasing of solar bodies but no government same as the Matt 24 warning was not about heavenly bodies but about governmental protection. We won’t need laws and governors who give the society form and freedom. Hence the “light” is righteousness we have from Him that will enlighten all. There will be no dark deeds nor men in darkness doing them. Just a thought.

ewq1938 · Apr 2, 2019

Dorothy Mae said:
I wonder if when Rev speaks of no need for a “sun or moon”

It means it has a source of light and doesn't need the Sun. The Sun will still shine, it's just not needed by the city.

pasifika · Apr 2, 2019

claninja said:
Acts 2:16 But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel; And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:

Peter states he was living the in the last days. It appears the last days started during Peter's generation.

When do these last days end? Before the millenium, during the millenium, or after the millenium?

Hello, yes we're living in the last days as Peter mentioned..from that time to the time of the end where desolation is decreed where spoken by Prophet Daniel will be the last 7years of this world...

Happens before the Millenium as NO SINNERS lived during the 1000yrs Only the RIGHTEOUS with Their KING- His name is the WORD OF GOD..Rev 19. Only after the 1000yrs wicked will resurrected for JUDGEMENT (second resurrection)

ewq1938 · Apr 2, 2019

pasifika said:
Happens before the Millenium as NO SINNERS lived during the 1000yrs Only the RIGHTEOUS with Their KING-

The unsaved nations will be in the Millennium and will be ruled over by Christ and his immortal saints:

Rev 2:25 But that which ye have already hold fast till I come.

That is the second coming.

Rev 2:26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:

After "the end" comes, there is given power over the nations to those that are overcomers which naturally includes those who "are alive and remain" at the second coming. They will be given power over the nations.

Rev 2:27 And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father.

After the second coming and after "the end" will the overcomers be given power over the nations, ruling them with a rod of iron. That proves the rod of iron rule over the nations does not even start until Christ has returned and has given overcomers this power to rule over the nations.

pasifika · Apr 2, 2019

ewq1938 said:
The unsaved nations will be in the Millennium and will be ruled over by Christ and his immortal saints:

Rev 2:25 But that which ye have already hold fast till I come.

That is the second coming.

Rev 2:26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:

After "the end" comes, there is given power over the nations to those that are overcomers which naturally includes those who "are alive and remain" at the second coming. They will be given power over the nations.

Rev 2:27 And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father.

After the second coming and after "the end" will the overcomers be given power over the nations, ruling them with a rod of iron. That proves the rod of iron rule over the nations does not even start until Christ has returned and has given overcomers this power to rule over the nations.

Hello, when Christ comes Only those who belong to Him whethere in grave or remain will gather unto Him- This is the first resurrection of the dead in Christ and gathering of
those belong to Him who are still alive 1corins 15:52, The rest those who does not belong to Him will be destroyed just as the AntiChrist is 2Thess2:8, 2Pet 3:10,11 tells that everything and the earth laid bare when it destroy by fire. So in verse 11 of 2Pet3 He ask us this question "Since EVERYTHING will be destroyed in this way, what kind of people ought you to be? Remember this is His coming and the event that goes with it and the things that destroy...

Rev2-26 does not refer to after His coming but BEFORE, in verse 26 those who does my will to the end- indicate that you can live an overcoming life (overcome from sin) at that particular moment to the end (when He comes) the end mark by His come when He destroy all dominion in this world 1corins15:24...
Rule with rod of iron I think is rule in Righteousness...Just as Christ
Thank you

pasifika · Apr 2, 2019

pasifika said:
Hello, when Christ comes Only those who belong to Him whethere in grave or remain will gather unto Him- This is the first resurrection of the dead in Christ and gathering of
those belong to Him who are still alive 1corins 15:52, The rest those who does not belong to Him will be destroyed just as the AntiChrist is 2Thess2:8, 2Pet 3:10,11 tells that everything and the earth laid bare when it destroy by fire. So in verse 11 of 2Pet3 He ask us this question "Since EVERYTHING will be destroyed in this way, what kind of people ought you to be? Remember this is His coming and the event that goes with it and the things that destroy...

Rev2-26 does not refer to after His coming but BEFORE, in verse 26 those who does my will to the end- indicate that you can live an overcoming life (overcome from sin) at that particular moment to the end (when He comes) the end mark by His come when He destroy all dominion in this world 1corins15:24...
Rule with rod of iron I think is rule in Righteousness...Just as Christ
Thank you

One more point in Matthew 24:37-40 Jesus spoke of His coming as like the days of Noah. Only Noah and his family survive but the rest were ALL taken away..So you have two groups (1) saved (both dead in Christ and the one remains (2) taKen away to destroy. There is No saved and unsaved living side by side at that time Only the RIGHTEOUS will be with their King that will be for the Millenium

LittleLambofJesus · Apr 2, 2019

ewq1938 said: ↑Sure I agree.
Mat 24:3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Dorothy Mae said: ↑
Actually it is the end of the age, not world. The jews already knew about the end of the age and the age of the reign of the Messiah to follow. There is the sign of his coming in judgment on Jerusalem and the end of the Jewish Mosaic age. There were signs and many and all were fulfilled.

The second coming has no signs preceeding it same as the days of Noah had no signs whatsover that a flood was coming.
This is exactly what happened to those sitting there.
They fled to Panna, all the Christians in accordance with the fulfillment of thisMat 24:17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:
Mat 24:18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.
Mat 24:19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
Mat 24:20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:
Mat 24:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. They fled to Panna, all the Christians in accordance with the fulfillment of this. It saved them. It makes no sense at all to be in our future because while they could flee Jerusalem and it saved them, none of us live in Jerusalem and so we cannot flee it and where in the world would be go if the whole world is about to suffer? Fleeing makes no sense.Notice it is the sign of the son of man, not the son of man. And there was a sign. A sword hung over Jerusalem for one year, among other signs as described above.
The later verses describe the days before Jesus coming bodily as having no sign same as in the days of Noah when people were marrying and so on. Business as usual. No signs at all. The signs were for the the destruction of Jerusalem in firey judgement from which the believers needed to flee. They did.
That is what happened and will never happen again. It is over. It was for them, not for us.

LittleLambofJesus said: ↑
Jesus only uses the word "parousia" in 1 chapter of the Gospels.....Matthew 24:

Matthew 24, Mark 13 and Luke's Temple/Jerusalem Discourses harmonized
Mount of Olives and Titus

Matthew 24:
3
He is yet sitting on the mount of the Olives, the disciples toward-came to Him according to own, saying, `Tell us, when? shall these be
and what? the sign of Thy parousiaV <3952>,
and of the full-finish<sun-teleiaV <4930> of the Age?'

Dorothy Mae said:
Jesus didn’t speak to them in Greek. He didn’t use a Greek word at all.

He didn't speak to them in English either.
Your point?

ewq1938 said: ↑
Sure I agree.
Mat 24:3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Dorothy Mae said: ↑
Actually it is the end of the age, not world.

Let's look at that in the Greek:

Strong's Concordance with Hebrew and Greek Lexicon

4930. sunteleia from 4931;
entire completion, i.e. consummation (of a dispensation):--end.
G4930 συντέλεια (synteleia) occurs 6 times in 6 verses
4931. sunteleo from 4862 and 5055;
to complete entirely; generally, to execute (literally or figuratively):--end, finish, fulfil, make.
G4931 συντελέω (synteleō) occurs 7 times in 7 verse

165. aion from the same as 104; properly,
an age; by extension, perpetuity (also past); by implication, the world; specially (Jewish) a Messianic period (present or future):--age, course, eternal, (for) ever(-more), (n-)ever, (beginning of the , while the) world (began, without end). Compare 5550.
G165 αἰών (aiōn), occurs 128 times in 102 verses
==========================
Matthew 24, Mark 13 and Luke's Temple/Jerusalem Discourses harmonized

Matthew 24:3
He is yet sitting on the mount of the Olives, the disciples toward-came to Him according to own, saying, `Tell us, when? shall these be
and what? the sign of Thy parousiaV <3952>,
and of the full-finish<sun-teleiaV <4930> of the Age<165>?'

Mat 13
4 Tell us! when these shall be?
and what the sign whenever may be being about<3195> all these to be fully concluded<sun-teleo <4931>.

39 “The enemy who sowed them is the devil,
the harvest is the full end of the age, and the reapers are the angels.
40 “Therefore as the tares are gathered and burned in the fire,
so it will be at the full end of this age.
49 “So it will be at the full end of the age.
The angels will come forth, separate the wicked from among the just,

Rev 14:15 and another Messenger did come forth out of the Sanctuary crying in a great voice to Him who is sitting upon the cloud, 'Send forth Thy sickle and reap, because come to thee hath the hour of reaping, because ripe hath been the harvest of the land;' 16 and He who is sitting upon the cloud did put forth his sickle upon the land, and the land was reaped.

Mat 24:3
Now as He sat on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately, saying, “Tell us, when will these things be?
And what will be the sign of Your coming, and of the full end of the age?”
Mat 28:20
“teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you;
and lo, I am with you always, even to the full end of the age.” Amen.
Heb 9:26
He then would have had to suffer often since the foundation of the world;
but now, once at the full end of the ages, He has appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself.
===============================
.

_Dave_ · Apr 2, 2019

claninja said:
Acts 2:16 But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel; And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:

Peter states he was living the in the last days. It appears the last days started during Peter's generation.

When do these last days end? Before the millenium, during the millenium, or after the millenium?

A close examination of Acts 2:15-17 and Joel 2:28-32 shows that Joel's prophecy has a dual purpose. The first part of each is satisfied by Pentecost. The second part is yet to be finished.

It's important to not conflate last days with the Day of the Lord. According to my Bible commentaries, the last days began with Pentecost, basically referencing the Church Age. The Day of the Lord references the beginning of the tribulation, some time after the rapture, which then encompasses the Great Tribulation.

So, by inference, I believe the last days end with the rapture of the church; which is before the millennium.

parousia70 · Apr 2, 2019

_Dave_ said:
According to my Bible commentaries, the last days began with Pentecost, basically referencing the Church Age.

According to scripture, the last days were already underway during Christ's Earthly ministry, long before Pentecost, long before the Church age even began.
Hebrews 1:1-2

parousia70 · Apr 2, 2019

ewq1938 said:
The unsaved nations will be in the Millennium and will be ruled over by Christ and his immortal saints:

Rev 2:25 But that which ye have already hold fast till I come.

That is the second coming.

Rev 2:26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:

After "the end" comes, there is given power over the nations to those that are overcomers which naturally includes those who "are alive and remain" at the second coming. They will be given power over the nations.

Rev 2:27 And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father.

After the second coming and after "the end" will the overcomers be given power over the nations, ruling them with a rod of iron. That proves the rod of iron rule over the nations does not even start until Christ has returned and has given overcomers this power to rule over the nations.

How is this any different from Today?

parousia70 · Apr 2, 2019

pasifika said:
. There is No saved and unsaved living side by side at that time Only the RIGHTEOUS will be with their King that will be for the Millenium

And the people, during that time, continue to be born, require food and shelter, grow up, get married, procreate, grow old and die, right? (Isaiah 65:17-23)

LittleLambofJesus · Apr 2, 2019

_Dave_ said:
A close examination of Acts 2:15-17 and Joel 2:28-32 shows that Joel's prophecy has a dual purpose. The first part of each is satisfied by Pentecost. The second part is yet to be finished.

It's important to not conflate last days with the Day of the Lord. According to my Bible commentaries, the last days began with Pentecost, basically referencing the Church Age. The Day of the Lord references the beginning of the tribulation, some time after the rapture, which then encompasses the Great Tribulation.

So, by inference, I believe the last days end with the rapture of the church; which is before the millennium.

Hello Dave.
The last days are always just around the corner.
Our own personal last day is our death then eternal life..........Thank you Jesus

occurs 6 times in 6 verses in the NKJV.

Gen 49:1
And Jacob called his sons and said, “Gather together, that I may tell you what shall befall you in the last days:

Act 2:17
‘And it shall come to pass in the last days, says God, That I will pour out of My Spirit on all flesh;
Your sons and your daughters shall prophesy,
Your young men shall see visions, Your old men shall dream dreams.

2Ti 3:1
But know this, that in the last days perilous times will come:

Heb 1:2
has in these last days spoken to us by His Son, whom He has appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the worlds;

Jas 5:
3 Your gold and silver are corroded, and their corrosion will be a witness against you and will eat your flesh like fire. You have heaped up treasure in the last days.
8 be ye patient! and stand-fast the hearts of ye,
that the Parousia <3952> of the Lord has-neared<1448>

2Pe 3:3
knowing this first: that scoffers will come in the last days, walking according to their own lusts,
=======================
Jas 5:3
Your gold and silver are corroded, and their corrosion will be a witness against you
and will eat your flesh like fire. [Revelation 17:16 Revelation 18:12]
You have heaped up treasure in the last days.

The Great City/Harlot/Queen Revelation chapts 17-19

Revelation 17:16
16 And the ten Horns which thou saw and the Beast, These shall be hating the harlot,
and They shall be making Her desolate<2049> and naked,
and the fleshes of Her they shall be eating<5315>
and shall be burning<2618> Her in fire.

Revelation 18:
12 Cargo of gold and silver, and precious stone and pearl
and fine linen and purple, [Luke 16:19/Revelation 18:16]
and silk, and scarlet, and all thyne wood, and every vessel of ivory, and every vessel of most precious wood and brass and iron and marble 13 and cinnamon, and odours, and ointment, and frankincense, and wine and oil and fine flour and wheat and cattle and sheep and of horses and of chariots and of bodies and souls of men.
========================
https://www.preteristarchive.com/JewishWars/timeline_military.html
"..probably the greatest single slaughter in ancient history."
ROMAN SIEGE AND SACK OF JERUSALEM

Deu 28
53 “You shall eat the fruit of your own body, the flesh of your sons and your daughters whom the LORD your God has given you, in the siege and desperate straits in which your enemy shall distress you.
55 “so that he will not give any of them the flesh of his children whom he will eat, because he has nothing left in the siege and desperate straits in which your enemy shall distress you at all your gates.
57 “her placenta which comes out from between her feet and her children whom she bears; for she will eat them secretly for lack of everything in the siege and desperate straits in which your enemy shall distress you at all your gates.
..................................

parousia70 · Apr 2, 2019

_Dave_ said:
A close examination of Acts 2:15-17 and Joel 2:28-32 shows that Joel's prophecy has a dual purpose. The first part of each is satisfied by Pentecost. The second part is yet to be finished.

Only Partial Preterists believe that.

parousia70 · Apr 2, 2019

_Dave_ said:
The Day of the Lord references the beginning of the tribulation, some time after the rapture, which then encompasses the Great Tribulation.

How do you reconcile that belief with this passage?:

2 Peter 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night, in which the heavens will pass away with a great noise, and the elements will melt with fervent heat; both the earth and the works that are in it will be burned up.

Not much room there for any 3.5 or 7 year tribulation, 1000 year millennium or the like, is there?

Unless you don't take 2 Peter 3:10 Literally?

LittleLambofJesus · Apr 2, 2019

_Dave_ said:
A close examination of Acts 2:15-17 and Joel 2:28-32 shows that Joel's prophecy has a dual purpose. The first part of each is satisfied by Pentecost. The second part is yet to be finished.
.

Both the 1st part and 2nd part of Isaiah 61:2 was fulfilled in the 1st century.......including the Great City in Revelation....
Let God be true...............

"DAYS OF VENGEANCE" Isaiah 61:2 and Luke 21:22 Revelation

Isaiah 61:2
To proclaim the year of the good pleasure of Yahweh,
And the day of vengeance<5359> of our 'Elohiym, To comfort all mourners.

Luke 4:
17 the scroll of the prophet Isaiah was handed to Him. Unrolling it, He found the place where it was written:
21 and He began by saying,
“Today this Scripture is fulfilled in your hearing.”

2nd part:

Luke 21:
22 That days of vengeance these are, of the to be fulfilled all the having been written
23 “But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days!
For there will be great Distress in the land and Wrath<3709> upon this people.
=============================
1 Thessalonians 2:15
who killed both the Lord Jesus and their own prophets, and have persecuted<1559> us, and they do not please God and are contrary to all men,

The Great City/Harlot/Queen Revelation chapts 17-19

Revlelation 6:10
And they cried with a loud voice, saying, “How long, O Lord, holy and true, until You judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?”

Revelation 19:2
“For true and righteous are His judgments, because He has judged the great Harlot who corrupted the earth with Her fornication;
and He has avenged <1556> on her the blood of His servants shed by her.”

DavidPT · Apr 2, 2019

parousia70 said:
How is this any different from Today?

In what way presently is anyone having power over nations? What does that look like if this is supposed to apply to the here and now?

When do the last days end?

Soli Deo Gloria

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Livin' in yesterday's tomorrow

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I love you three.

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I love you three.

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Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!

Well-Known Member

Livin' in yesterday's tomorrow

Livin' in yesterday's tomorrow

Livin' in yesterday's tomorrow

Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!

Livin' in yesterday's tomorrow

Livin' in yesterday's tomorrow

Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!

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