What commandments is Jesus talking about?

Shimshon · Mar 30, 2019

ace of hearts said:
Love can't be commanded nor demanded.

??

Matthew 22
36 “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?”
37 Jesus replied: “ ‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’
38 This is the first and greatest commandment.
39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’
40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”

How do you understand these verses otherwise? How is this not identifying love as a command?

Look, I believe I understand where you are coming from, but the scriptures are straight forward and state the opposite. So we have to consider why.

The obvious thing to consider would be that God has always required love and devotion throughout his word. And here we have Jesus openly referencing love as a commandment. Then there is also the book of John.

Why pick this battle? "Love is not commanded"??

If we don't love we are not of him.

Shimshon · Mar 30, 2019

Tone said:
This is all One, there is no contradiction...this is the Word from the Father.

*From the beginning

The words given Yeshua to speak from the Father were eternal life. They spoke of being risen from the dead to newness of life raising those to life who were not.

Where did the Torah do or speak of this ability and gift of God? Where does the law forgive people's sins and raise them up to new life? What words given Moshe brought about this promise?

Yeshua spoke life. He said that all who believe his words, given by the Father, will be forgiven of all the law was powerless to forgive.

Where in the law does it speak and command to receive the Spirit of God himself? Where does Torah speak of such things?

Receiving the Spirit, being forgiven of all sins, being resurrected to newness of life through the Spirit, and finally being resurrected AFTER ones own death?

Torah speaks of this where?

It doesn't. It speaks of the one who comes, sent by God, who WILL speak these words into action! Amen

Tone · Mar 30, 2019

Shimshon said:
The words given Yeshua to speak from the Father were eternal life. They spoke of being risen from the dead to newness of life raising those to life who were not.

Where did the Torah do or speak of this ability and gift of God? Where does the law forgive people's sins and raise them up to new life? What words given Moshe brought about this promise?

Yeshua spoke life. He said that all who believe his words, given by the Father, will be forgiven of all the law was powerless to forgive.

Where in the law does it speak and command to receive the Spirit of God himself? Where does Torah speak of such things?

Receiving the Spirit, being forgiven of all sins, being resurrected to newness of life through the Spirit, and finally being resurrected AFTER ones own death?

Torah speaks of this where?

It doesn't. It speaks of the one who comes, sent by God, who WILL speak these words into action! Amen

Genesis 3:15
"And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel."

For one.

Saint Steven · Mar 30, 2019

Tone said:
This is all One, there is no contradiction...this is the Word from the Father.

*From the beginning

The word "but" shows a contrast. He makes the law hearsay.

"You have heard that it was said to those of old... But I say to you..."

Shimshon · Mar 30, 2019

ace of hearts said:
I'm sorry for you.

Why are you sorry for me? I'm disappointed that you obviously didn't grasp the point of my last comment.

We agree on many points actually. I hope I haven't touched a sore spot. But I disagree with the notion that the gospel calls Jews out of Judaism, as another has said. This is classic RT rooted in the anti semitism of the church fathers who sought to eradicate Judaism from the universal church. Who when reformed faired no better through the likes of Martin Luther. And further more into Calvin.

But alas now I have opened the proverbial can O worms haven't I?

Shimshon · Mar 30, 2019

Saint Steven said:
The word "but" shows a contrast. He makes the law hearsay.

"You have heard that it was said to those of old... But I say to you..."

Not really. I see him merely clarifying intent. No change. The law was supposed to bring you to God himself to clarify all issues. And that is exactly what Jesus was doing on the mount of olives, making clear what is hidden, causing eyes that were blinded to see again. The law leads to the one who does all that. He didn't contrast the two here (law and his words) he clarified the former.

Now you want to see a contrast go to John 6. Two different breads, one brought death even if eaten, while the other life from the dead.

Matthew 13
10The disciples came to him and asked, “Why do you speak to the people in parables?”
11 He replied, “Because the knowledge of the secrets of the kingdom of heaven has been given to you, but not to them.
12 Whoever has will be given more, and they will have an abundance. Whoever does not have, even what they have will be taken from them.
13 This is why I speak to them in parables:“Though seeing, they do not see; though hearing, they do not hear or understand.
14 In them is fulfilled the prophecy of Isaiah: “ ‘You will be ever hearing but never understanding; you will be ever seeing but never perceiving.
15 For this people’s heart has become calloused; they hardly hear with their ears, and they have closed their eyes.Otherwise they might see with their eyes,hear with their ears, understand with their hearts and turn, and I would heal them.’
16 But blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear.
17 For truly I tell you, many prophets and righteous people longed to see what you see but did not see it, and to hear what you hear but did not hear it.

Eventually he commanded them to reveal his words and commands to the nations.

But Matthew 5 is not the example of Jesus giving new commandments. It was an example of Jesus displaying his "authority" to reveal the law in a way never seen before.

Matthew 7:29 NIV
29 because he taught as one who had authority, and not as their teachers of the law.

Shimshon · Mar 30, 2019

Tone said:
Genesis 3:15
"And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel."

For one.

Not even close.

You're pointing to a promise, but not the actual fruition. Torah refers to the promise, Yeshua is the fruition of that promise. You can not attain or retain the promise by observing the Torah. The Torah only speaks 'of' the promise, while Yeshua speaks the promise into reality. Something the law can never do.

Tone · Mar 30, 2019

Shimshon said:
Not even close.

You're pointing to a promise, but not the actual fruition. Torah refers to the promise, Yeshua is the fruition of that promise. You can not attain or retain the promise by observing the Torah. The Torah only speaks 'of' the promise, while Yeshua speaks the promise into reality. Something the law can never do.

Let's go back even further:

בראשית ברא אלהים את השמים ואת הארץ

Genesis 1:1 Hebrew Text Analysis

All the way to:

Revelation 22:12-16
"Behold, I am coming quickly!
I bring my reward with me
to repay everyone according to their works.
13 I am the Aleph and the Tav,
the First and the Last,
the Beginning and the Completion.”

14 Wonderfully blessed are those who wash their robes white so they can access the Tree of Life and enter the city of bliss by its open gates. 15 Those not permitted to enter are outside: the malicious hypocrites, the sexually immoral, sorcerers, murderers, idolaters, and every lover of lies.

16 “I, Jesus, sent my angel to you to give you this testimony to share with the congregations. I am the bright Morning Star, both David’s spiritual root and his descendant.”

See any contradiction?

Yeshua HaDerekh · Mar 30, 2019

Saint Steven said:
He's not behaving as if he thinks his opinion is superior.

Absolutely he did in his response to me...

AOH wrote: "Maybe you should try the recreation room forum. Great place to make posts with no meaning."

Yeshua HaDerekh · Mar 30, 2019

ace of hearts said:
That's why we preach Jesus and not Jesus and the law. Grace voids the law and the law voids grace. Without grace no one can have a relationship with God the Father. Jesus said you can only access the Father through Him.

JN 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

No one can access God the Father any other way according to Jesus. So quit trying.

See that is where you are confused. I try an follow not because I DON'T follow Yeshua it is because I DO. It is because I love God. Grace is not license to sin. If we sin, we need grace.

Yeshua HaDerekh · Mar 30, 2019

Saint Steven said:
Commands actually. See NIV below.
They are spread across the gospels. But mostly to love one another. (John 15:12, 17)

Leviticus 19:18

Yeshua HaDerekh · Mar 30, 2019

ace of hearts said:
That's pretty old. Are you Soyeong?

Why? No I am not Soyeong. We do agree on many things it would seem...

W2L · Mar 30, 2019

Jesus commandment to love is understood and practiced by following all his words.

Yeshua HaDerekh · Mar 30, 2019

Shimshon said:
??

Matthew 22
36 “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?”
37 Jesus replied: “ ‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’
38 This is the first and greatest commandment.
39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’
40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”

And both were in the Torah...
Deuteronomy 6:5 and Leviticus 19:18

Yeshua HaDerekh · Mar 30, 2019

ace of hearts said:
Yeah we have to follow the law, we can't follow the law (keep it without violation). The Jews acknowledged this in Nehemiah. The Psalms says no one does. Why do the curses of the law fall on Israel? (hint - Deut 28)

For the Christian LK 6:31 and JN 13:34 solves your problem with morals and the negative commands of the famous 10.

The physical body isn't subject to the carnal commands of performance according to Paul a Pharisee unequaled when it come to the law. Rom 8. The only way to effect the body's performance is by fear or changing the interior (the soul). Jesus said they were whited sepulchres full of dead mans bones. Mat 23:27

Jesus is my Lord and I follow Him, not Moses or the law. I'm not ruled by the law, I'm born again raised to life in Christ Jesus, not to the same thing I died to and from.

Jesus didn't re-command the law. JN 1:17, 13:34, 15:10 etc.

We are all talking past each other here. We follow because we love God and our neighbor not out of fear. We have grace now. They are written in our hearts now. We actually agree, we are just saying and looking at it differently...

Yeshua HaDerekh · Mar 30, 2019

Saint Steven said:
What commandments is Jesus talking about?
Not the Ten Commandments. Jesus CHOSE the Apostle Paul (Saul) Saying: "This man is my chosen instrument to proclaim my name to the Gentiles and their kings and to the people of Israel." - Acts 9:15

What did Jesus' primary spokesman have to say about the Ten Commandments?

Were the TCs "engraved in letters on stone"? If so, he says they were the transitory ministry that brought condemnation and death that has no glory now. The letter kills.

2 Corinthians 3:6-11
He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant—not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life. 7 Now if the ministry that brought death, which was engraved in letters on stone, came with glory, so that the Israelites could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of its glory, transitory though it was, 8 will not the ministry of the Spirit be even more glorious? 9 If the ministry that brought condemnation was glorious, how much more glorious is the ministry that brings righteousness! 10 For what was glorious has no glory now in comparison with the surpassing glory. 11 And if what was transitory came with glory, how much greater is the glory of that which lasts!

He said the law was good. It was the curse that was removed...

Yeshua HaDerekh · Mar 30, 2019

Saint Steven said:
I would say no, what would you say?
(the burden of proof is on you if you say "Yes")

Then you would be wrong.

Saint Steven · Mar 30, 2019

Shimshon said:
Not really. I see him merely clarifying intent. No change. The law was supposed to bring you to God himself to clarify all issues. And that is exactly what Jesus was doing on the mount of olives, making clear what is hidden, causing eyes that were blinded to see again. The law leads to the one who does all that. He didn't contrast the two here (law and his words) he clarified the former.

Seriously?
You say Jesus was claiming divorce, ‘Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.’, and hate your enemy, was supposed to bring you closer to God? You're joking, right?

Matthew 5:31-32
“It has been said, ‘Anyone who divorces his wife must give her a certificate of divorce.’ 32 But I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, makes her the victim of adultery, and anyone who marries a divorced woman commits adultery.

Matthew 5:38-39
“You have heard that it was said, ‘Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.’ 39 But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also.

Matthew 5:43-44
“You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ 44 But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you,

Saint Steven · Mar 30, 2019

Yeshua HaDerekh said:
Then you would be wrong.

I would say no, what would you say?
(the burden of proof is on you)

Saint Steven · Mar 30, 2019

Yeshua HaDerekh said:
Absolutely he did in his response to me...

AOH wrote: "Maybe you should try the recreation room forum. Great place to make posts with no meaning."

Seems like you had it coming.

What commandments is Jesus talking about?

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"Whenever Thou humblest me, Thou makest me great."

Men dream of truth, find it then cant live with it

Men dream of truth, find it then cant live with it

Men dream of truth, find it then cant live with it

Men dream of truth, find it then cant live with it

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Men dream of truth, find it then cant live with it

Men dream of truth, find it then cant live with it

Men dream of truth, find it then cant live with it

Men dream of truth, find it then cant live with it

You can call me Steve

You can call me Steve

You can call me Steve

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