President Trump Recognizes the Golan Heights as Israeli Territory

I totally agree with the President on this. Israel belongs there

I suggest that everyone go back and read the Book of Numbers in the Bible. That Book, in the final chapters, describes the boundaries of Israel ... as it was originally given by God to the Israelites. The original land of Israel was a great, diverse, and beautiful land. It was much bigger than Israel today.

The end of Chapter 33 contains God's warning to Israel about why they would lose that land that was given to them. And they did.

I am not saying that Israel should go back (be restored) to the original boundaries. History is history, what has happened ... has happened. It cannot be undone.

The real message is that God can remove any land from any people. When the land is stained with bloodshed, violence, and deceit ... God will remove it. The words are quite clear in the Book of Numbers.

Blessings!

God also said He would "restore Israel and bring them back to the Promised Land."

The UN doesn't allow countries to occupy other nations' territories, and it is the same UN who established Israel in the first place. But I guess that just all goes out the window because there's "Bible verses about it".

I personally do not see the UN as a wholesome entity. Perhaps whenever it was first formed. As for bible verses referring to Israel, yes to that because God brought forth Israel as His chosen people. He promised to gather His people from all nations and to bring them back home.

When the UN establishes Israel, they're a "vessel of God". But whenever the UN doesn't ingratiate "God's chosen people (TM)" and give them whatever they want, suddenly they're all evil.

jmldn2 said:

God also said He would "restore Israel and bring them back to the Promised Land."

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The real question is, WHAT Israel and WHAT Promised Land?

Hebrews 11:16-18 KJV
[16] But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.
[17] By faith Abraham, when he was tried, offered up Isaac: and he that had received the promises offered up his only begotten son,
[18] Of whom it was said, That in Isaac shall thy seed be called:

A better country is a promised land but it is not a piece of land in the Middle East. It's heavenly! So who will you see in promise land? They are spiritual Israel, not the physical nation of Israel making up of all Elect that their faith in Isaac be called! Selah!

So who will you see in promise land? They are spiritual Israel, not the physical nation of Israel making up of all

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As a statement of agreement, one important point when interpreting Revelation (and Scripture in general): often we think of interpreting something as literal, vs. spiritual. But that is fundamentally flawed from our limited, mortal vantage point. Just because something is spiritual, that does not make it non-literal. In fact, the physical: THAT is the parable. The spiritual: THAT is the literal.

usexpat97 said:

As a statement of agreement, one important point when interpreting Revelation (and Scripture in general): often we think of interpreting something as literal, vs. spiritual. But that is fundamentally flawed from our limited, mortal vantage point. Just because something is spiritual, that does not make it non literal. In fact, the physical: THAT is the parable. The spiritual: THAT is literal.

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You do not make any sense. Sorry. you make the same mistake as the Jews who once thought Christ was talking about a physical temple when he actually talked about the temple of the body, John 2:18-21. Spiritual discernment regardless of your "limited, mortal vantage point". It is God's spirit that reveals things to you.

TribulationSigns said:

You do not make any sense. Sorry. you make the same mistake as the Jews who once thought Christ was talking about a physical temple when he actually talked about the temple of the body, John 2:18-21. Spiritual discernment regardless of your "limited, mortal vantage point". It is God's spirit that reveals things to you.

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What was the tent tabernacle patterned after?

jmldn2 said:

God also said He would "restore Israel and bring them back to the Promised Land."

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Those promises are fulfilled in Christ, not in dirt in the Middle East. Israel was disobedient so God himself had to take on Israel and fulfill its mission.

There is only one Promised Land Christians need to be concerned about, and it is in the world to come.

Justified112 said:

"Israel" is mentioned 71 times in the NT. Nowhere is it ever spiritualized to refer to Gentile Christians and/or Old Testament saints. Being "children of Abraham" has nothing to do with who Israel is. Israel is Israel. The Church is the Church. They are radically separate in the NT. Old Testament saints are not part of the Church in the NT. Nowhere is the "body of Christ" ever called "Israel" in the Bible.

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This is just not true. We are adopted into Israel as the children of Abraham. The same covenant given to Abraham is the covenant shared with us through Christ, it is the covenant of promise received through faith alone.

FireDragon76 said:

This is just not true. We are adopted into Israel as the children of Abraham. The same covenant given to Abraham is the covenant shared with us through Christ, it is the covenant of promise received through faith alone.

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No, we are not adopted into Israel. We are grafted into Israel. Romans 8 tells us we are adopted into the family of God. Being grafted in does not make us Israelites or Israel. We are children of Abraham by faith, but "Israel" is counted through Jacob, not Abraham.

FireDragon76 said:

Those promises are fulfilled in Christ, not in dirt in the Middle East. Israel was disobedient so God himself had to take on Israel and fulfill its mission.

There is only one Promised Land Christians need to be concerned about, and it is in the world to come.

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Not true at all. God is not finished with Israel and there is prophetic future for Israel. There will be a millennial Kingdom and Jesus will reign on the throne of David from a restored national Israel on earth. God has promises not yet fulfilled. He must fulfill them to biblical Israel, or otherwise, God is not faithful to His word. If God chooses not to restore biblical Israel as He promised, then we cannot be sure he can be trusted to fulfill His promises to us. God is 100% faithful to word and we would not want that any other way.

gideon123 said:

I suggest that everyone go back and read the Book of Numbers in the Bible. That Book, in the final chapters, describes the boundaries of Israel ... as it was originally given by God to the Israelites. The original land of Israel was a great, diverse, and beautiful land. It was much bigger than Israel today.

The end of Chapter 33 contains God's warning to Israel about why they would lose that land that was given to them. And they did.

I am not saying that Israel should go back (be restored) to the original boundaries. History is history, what has happened ... has happened. It cannot be undone.

The real message is that God can remove any land from any people. When the land is stained with bloodshed, violence, and deceit ... God will remove it. The words are quite clear in the Book of Numbers.

Blessings!

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God does not break a promise.
The one who was promised te kingdom will recieve the kingdom.

Galatians 3:16 The promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed. The Scripture does not say, "and to seeds," meaning many, but "and to your seed," meaning One, who is Christ.

If you pay very close attention to scripture,you will learn when he will recieve that promise.

Revelation 20:6 Blessed and holy are those who share in the first resurrection! The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of Christ, and will reign with Him for a thousand years.

Justified112 said:

Not true at all. God is not finished with Israel and there is prophetic future for Israel. There will be a millennial Kingdom and Jesus will reign on the throne of David from a restored national Israel on earth. God has promises not yet fulfilled. He must fulfill them to biblical Israel, or otherwise, God is not faithful to His word. If God chooses not to restore biblical Israel as He promised, then we cannot be sure he can be trusted to fulfill His promises to us. God is 100% faithful to word and we would not want that any other way.

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That's interpreting faithfulness in human terms. God isn't interested in being a real-estate dealer. As Jesus told the Samaritan woman, the hour is coming when people will worship God in spirit and truth, not on on a particular mountain.

mkgal1 said:

.....and leave history out of it as well? That may be YOUR way to interpret the Bible....but without knowing the context of what was going on in the days of the Bible....I don't think that gives us the whole picture.

I think the trouble was the personal nature of your post (instead of addressing the content). LLoJ spends a lot of time comparing Scripture to Scripture - AND studying the context as well.

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Well, the context of the Scriptures leads me to understand Jesus' Olivet Discourse in a semi-preterist manner, and not the wild fancy of Dispensationalism, which is based on perpetually shifting targets (is the Vatican the Beast? Russia? Iraq? It keeps moving around. Whatever happened to the days of stoning false prophets?).

Staying away from world news is an excellent idea if you are prone to try to read the hand of God in everything that happens. Many peoples faiths have been shipwrecked by those sorts of fools errands.

FireDragon76 said:

That's interpreting faithfulness in human terms. God isn't interested in being a real-estate dealer. As Jesus told the Samaritan woman, the hour is coming when people will worship God in spirit and truth, not on on a particular mountain.

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Mark 12:1 Then Jesus began to speak to them in parables: "A man planted a vineyard. He put a wall around it, dug a wine vat, and built a watchtower. Then he rented it out to some tenants and went away on a journey.
Mark 12:2 At harvest time, he sent a servant to the tenants to collect his share of the fruit of the vineyard.
Mark 12:3 But they seized the servant, beat him, and sent him away empty-handed.
Mark 12:4 Then he sent them another servant, and they struck him over the head and treated him shamefully.
Mark 12:5 He sent still another, and this one they killed. He sent many others; some they beat and others they killed.
Mark 12:6 Finally, having one beloved son, he sent him to them. 'They will respect my son,' he said.
Mark 12:7 But the tenants said to one another, 'This is the heir. Come, let us kill him, and the inheritance will be ours.'
Mark 12:8 So they seized the son, killed him, and threw him out of the vineyard.
Mark 12:9 What then will the owner of the vineyard do? He will come and kill those tenants, and will give the vineyard to others.

Matthew 5:5 Blessed are the meek, for they will inherit the earth.