What is Truth? Interpretations of The Book of Revelation.

Norman70

Active Member
Nov 8, 2018
398
222
81
St Philip
✟62,302.00
Country
Barbados
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
My wife and myself are not members of, nor do we attend, any established or denominational Church, We try to hold onto Tolstoy's premise "The Kingdom of God is Within You".
However many of my wife's family are Seventh Day Adventists and we receive a copy from them of their Quarterlies. Presently it is entitled " The Book of Revelation" and in it at the beginning they are completely honest and say their interpretation is the historicist view.
I am no theologian, but I am aware of other interpretations, such as the preterist and futurist versions?
We, my wife and myself, are not going to be persuaded that the SDA hold the truth in these matters. They may do, but we will leave it to Jesus to ultimately lead us to His Eternal Truth. Concerning The Book of Revelation, does it really matter?
 
Last edited:

rockytopva

Love to pray! :)
Site Supporter
Mar 6, 2011
20,046
7,673
.
Visit site
✟1,063,017.00
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Single
First of all...

But if ye have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth. - James 3:14

But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law. Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies.... - Galatians 5:19-21

If bible studies are awakening strife, debate, wrath, ego, and the like.... Such studies are of the flesh and not of the Spirit.

But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy. - James 3:17
 
  • Like
Reactions: Norman70
Upvote 0

LittleLambofJesus

Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!
Site Supporter
May 19, 2015
125,492
28,587
73
GOD's country of Texas
Visit site
✟1,237,240.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Libertarian
My wife and myself are not members of, nor do we attend, any established or denominational Church, We try to hold onto Tolstoy's premise "The Kingdom of God is Within You".
However many of my wife's family are Seventh Day Adventists and we receive a copy from them of their Quarterlit's. Presently it is entitled " The Book of Revelation" and in it at the beginning they are completely honest and say their interpretation is the historicist view.
I am no theologian, but I am aware of other interpretations, such as the preterist and futurist versions?
We, my wife and myself, are not going to be persuaded that the SDA hold the truth in these matters. They may do, but we will leave it to Jesus to ultimately lead us to His Eternal Truth. Concerning The Book of Revelation, does it really matter?
I am a Partial Preterist that believes much of the Olivet Discourse was fulfilled in 70ad, but the final judgement in Revelation is future.
You can peruse this site for topics on various views:

https://www.preteristarchive.com/JewishWars/timeline_military.html
"..probably the greatest single slaughter in ancient history."
ROMAN SIEGE AND SACK OF JERUSALEM


" Paul the Apostle was arrested in the Temple Court where the angry Jewish mob tried to kill him. He asked for permission to speak to the crowd from the steps leading up from the Court of the Gentiles into the barracks of the Antonia Fortress (Acts 21:31-22:29). When Paul stood before the Council the following day he once again needed to be rescued and was taken up the stairs into the barracks (Acts 22:30-23:10). The soldiers later took him secretly at night from the Antonia Fortress to Caesarea (Acts 23:23-35)."

CAST OF CHARACTERS: Roman: Emperor Nero | General Vespasian | General Titus | The Roman Army || Jewish: General / Historian Josephus | Factional Leaders in Jerusalem || Administrators of Roman Judea Targets: Jerusalem | Herod's Temple // Maps of the Roman Invasion // Theological Timeline
=====================================
This site has a 200 part series on Revelation:

Kingdom Bible Studies Table of Contents

Kindgdom Bible Studies Revelation Series Part 1
The mark of the beast. Armageddon. The Four Horsemen. The false prophet. Babylon the great. Falling stars, stinging locusts, and giant hailstones. The seven last plagues. The bottomless pit. The lake of fire. These images of terror and catastrophe from the book of Revelation have greatly influenced the thinking of millions of Christians through the ages.
Even the secular press uses images such as "Armageddon" and "four horsemen of the Apocalypse" to describe calamities in our world. Despite 1900 years of fascination with the book of Revelation, John’s letter to the seven Churches of Asia continues to be misunderstood. And badly misinterpreted!

One misconception shared by some is that the Revelation has nothing of importance to say to us. It’s considered to be merely a bizarre piece of first-century writing with no relevance for today. Another wrong idea is that the Revelation is a code book describing a specific outline of history written in advance. Countless interpreters have tried to "decode" the book from a historical perspective to find all the major world events of the past 1900 years.
Others interpret it more literally as a handbook for predicting the cataclysmic events that will bring the final wrath of God and the end of the world. The claims of Christian groups from the early church to the present — that the Revelation pinpoints the events, personalities, and time periods of "the end" — have all failed. This should be a caution to believers for using the book of Revelation as a predictive handbook.
Other people’s interpretation of the book of Revelation is based on the "Pan Theory" — it’s all going to pan out in the end! Beloved brethren, the fact is, it’s not panning out the way the end-time prognosticators are projecting!

Through the years I have ministered the Word in Bible studies, seminars, and church services of various types. When there has been a question and answer session, or when opportunity was granted for people to request teaching along a particular line, the most often requested subject has been — THE BOOK OF REVELATION!
I have met people who were babes in Christ, carnal Christians whose lives were a mess, they had incredible problems and needs, including deliverance, and instead of prayer or counsel or messages that would help them overcome and grow up in Christ, they wanted me to teach them the book of Revelation! "Yeah, brother, that’s for me, lay it on me, I want the book of Revelation!

In retrospect, in the early days of my walk in God, my desire was no different. I was young, both naturally and spiritually. I knew little about the word of God or the purposes of God, but a call was in my heart. Being unlearned and immature, my very first dream was that I wanted to be a "prophecy" teacher. I imagined that I would be able to so eloquently expound the mysteries of the book of Revelation that great crowds would flock to hear me teach.
After all, where do you start when you’re brilliant and young in the Lord! Thank God, very few of those who read these lines had to suffer through some of the things I taught out of the book of Revelation! The old adage was surely fulfilled, "Fools rush in where wise men fear to tread." Today it seems to me that the dumber a person is spiritually, the more determined they are to teach the book of Revelation!
Those who know nothing are convinced that they know everything, and the first place they head is for deep water. There are depths in God, and heights of revelation and reality far beyond anything that the carnal mind can conceive.
The reason people who are spiritually illiterate jump into it with such gusto, and people who have some idea of the majesty and meaning of its message are more hesitant, is because the book of Revelation is the most dynamic, powerful, awesome, devastating book of the Bible!
Those who have caught glimpses into the transcendent glories of its deepest mysteries often shy away from it in the light of its loftiness and eminence. What Christians are normally exposed to are the radio and television preachers, the "good ol’ boys of religion" who think they know all about it and parrot and elaborate on all the absurdities they have been taught by their teachers.

Today, many Christians are confused. They are tossed too and fro with every new book that hits the market or every new fad end-time scheme introduced by some celebrity preacher. The popularity of the Revelation today is due to man’s insatiable curiosity regarding the future, the interest in the unknown tomorrow, which characterizes the restless human soul.
To claim that in the pages of the Revelation we can see the signs of the present times and thus predict the tomorrows; to pull back the veil and claim to lay bare the future is to attract an audience, for that is the nature of man — fascination with the future! And that is the thrust of the scores of books always appearing, almost all of them claiming to be able to unravel and accurately predict the great world events about to unfold. Man reveres the past, but he is intoxicated by the heady wine of prophecy. The very claim, then, of these many books — that they can reveal to us things which are soon to come — helps to explain the popularity of those books on the Revelation.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

thecolorsblend

If God is your Father, who is your Mother?
Site Supporter
Jul 1, 2013
9,199
8,425
Gotham City, New Jersey
✟308,231.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
My wife and myself are not members of, nor do we attend, any established or denominational Church, We try to hold onto Tolstoy's premise "The Kingdom of God is Within You".
However many of my wife's family are Seventh Day Adventists and we receive a copy from them of their Quarterlies. Presently it is entitled " The Book of Revelation" and in it at the beginning they are completely honest and say their interpretation is the historicist view.
I am no theologian, but I am aware of other interpretations, such as the preterist and futurist versions?
We, my wife and myself, are not going to be persuaded that the SDA hold the truth in these matters. They may do, but we will leave it to Jesus to ultimately lead us to His Eternal Truth. Concerning The Book of Revelation, does it really matter?
All inspired texts matter. So yes, I'd say it matters a great deal how one views Revelation.

If it matters, I'm a partial-Preterist.
 
  • Winner
Reactions: Lost4words
Upvote 0

Norman70

Active Member
Nov 8, 2018
398
222
81
St Philip
✟62,302.00
Country
Barbados
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Thank you to all posters for responding, the first two, if I understand them correctly, support my wife's and myself's reluctance to attend any established Church. We try to be members of the universal church of Christ as described in the SDA Quarterly "Oneness In Christ".
The third post, accurately stating that all inspired texts matter, but avoids, I think, which interpretation matters the most, which is addressed by the other two posts. That is, no interpretation should be seen as nearer the Truth than any other. As the first poster says, if Bible study leads to argument, even strife, we are engaged in the work of the devil.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

rockytopva

Love to pray! :)
Site Supporter
Mar 6, 2011
20,046
7,673
.
Visit site
✟1,063,017.00
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Single
Thank you to all posters for responding, the first two, if I understand them correctly, support my wife's and myself's reluctance to attend any established Church. We try to be members of the universal church of Christ as described in the SDA Quarterly "Oneness In Christ".
The third post, accurately stating that all inspired texts matter, but avoids, I think, which interpretation matters the most, which is addressed by the other two posts. That is, no interpretation should be seen as nearer the Truth than any other.

The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the seven churches. Unto the angel of the church of Ephesus write; These things saith he that holdeth the seven stars in his right hand, who walketh in the midst of the seven golden candlesticks; - Rev 1:20 - Rev 2:1

I believe the church congregations are seven - Messianic, Gentile, Orthodox, Catholic, Protestant, Awakened, and Charismatic. And Christ walks in the midst of each church congregation. I prefer, too, to remain non-denominational, even though I am member of a denominational church. I will visit churches of any denomination if something good is going on.
 
Upvote 0

Norman70

Active Member
Nov 8, 2018
398
222
81
St Philip
✟62,302.00
Country
Barbados
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
@rockytopva. According to the SDA Quarterly "Oneness In Christ" they describe the universal church of Christ (church written with a lower case c) using the metaphor the Body of Christ as those few true Christians we find in any denomination, or do not even attend Church, established, institutionalised and hierarchical, written in their Quarterly with an upper case C. They state emphatically that the SDA Church is not the universal church of Christ.
However they seem to be laying the law down regarding their historicist interpretation of Revelation.
I especially like the discourse given by LittleLambofJesus in post 3, which if I have begun to follow (there's a lot to read), and seem to be ùnderstanding that there is far more to The Book of Revelation than the popularised interpretations thrown out by Çhurches (upper case C) just to accommodate and attract more membership. Post 3 is well worth a read.
Truth is forthcoming through the Revelation of Jesus, but we will not get it by attending a Church, nor by the false teaching on radio or TV.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Norman70

Active Member
Nov 8, 2018
398
222
81
St Philip
✟62,302.00
Country
Barbados
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
@rockytopva. You gave my last post a like therefore you are not thinking that I have a gloomy face!
My gloom only hits me when I contemplate my worldly existence, my physical incapacities and financial shortages. My gloom is only lifted when I think about and pray to God, when I think about and am with my wife, and when I am reading the Scriptures, and reading and posting here in CF.
 
Upvote 0

eleos1954

God is Love
Site Supporter
Nov 14, 2017
9,768
5,633
Utah
✟718,686.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
Edited Content

Below is an in depth SDA study (72 - 1/2 hour videos).... IN DEPTH and not at all boring ... goes through the entire book of revelation.

... discern them for yourself prayerfully and with His Holy Word.

In the end .... YES ... pursue the book of Revelation ... Rev 1This is the revelation of Jesus Christ ... it matters ;o)

If anyone knows of other videos that go through the complete book of revelation (ie series of videos) using other theologies I would be interested in viewing them.

Verify all teachings no matter where they come from.

God Bless.

Salvation in Symbols & Signs - YouTube

May the Lord Bless all. Amen
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

parousia70

Livin' in yesterday's tomorrow
Site Supporter
Feb 24, 2002
15,534
4,827
57
Oregon
✟797,654.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Concerning The Book of Revelation, does it really matter?

Thankfully, understanding and accepting the "Correct" eschatology is not now, never has been, and never will be a REQUIREMENT for Salvation.
 
Upvote 0

parousia70

Livin' in yesterday's tomorrow
Site Supporter
Feb 24, 2002
15,534
4,827
57
Oregon
✟797,654.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
How do you reconcile THIS:
I mean if a person isn't allowed to talk and bring up some pointed questions .... what good is that?
With THIS:?
For those who disagree with SDA teachings, I understand and that's fine, but I ask that you don't post negative opinions in response to this post.
 
Upvote 0

Lost4words

Jesus I Trust In You
Site Supporter
May 19, 2018
10,991
11,740
Neath, Wales, UK
✟1,010,108.00
Country
United Kingdom
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Single
Revelation is probably the most misinterpreted book in the Bible. I am a partial preterist. I believe that most of Revelation has been and gone. Having looked into it quite a bit, that is my belief.
 
Upvote 0

eleos1954

God is Love
Site Supporter
Nov 14, 2017
9,768
5,633
Utah
✟718,686.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
How do you reconcile THIS:

With THIS:?

I meant in the context of the "bible study" I was in ... and there's a difference in not being allowed to ask questions and giving an stated opinion about something. Opinions are not necessary based on fact or knowledge.
 
Upvote 0

parousia70

Livin' in yesterday's tomorrow
Site Supporter
Feb 24, 2002
15,534
4,827
57
Oregon
✟797,654.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
I meant in the context of the "bible study" I was in ... and there's a difference in not being allowed to ask questions and giving an stated opinion about something. Opinions are not necessary based on fact or knowledge.


Arent "pointed Questions" by default, based on previously held opinions?
And "not being allowed to talk" seems eerily similar to "you are free to disagree, just don't share an opposing opinion".
Sounds like that exactly what the folks in your bible study were telling you... "you are free to disagree, just do tell us about it".

But that's just me.

Maybe it just when other people do it, you don't like it, yet you wish to reserve the right to be the exception to your own rule?
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Norman70

Active Member
Nov 8, 2018
398
222
81
St Philip
✟62,302.00
Country
Barbados
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
@eleos1954. I enjoyed reading your testimony and found it interesting and informative. The SDA Church are certainly one of the best with their doctrines in the way they develop them on their comprehensive Bible study. It was not my intention to pass an opinion that they are at fault for following an historicist interpretation of the Book of Revelation, and I commended them for disclosing this.
However, as you say, our search for the Truth requires us to study all interpretations and then through prayer to ask God for guidance. As was indicated in post 3 here, only by this spiritual endeavour will we get closer to the Word of God, which is Jesus, and accepting that the Truth will not be revealed to us in this life.
Theology, like science and other human preoccupations are gifts from God but must be used for the good otherwise we are in the devil's hands. This point has been covered in this thread, even with a Scripture. That is, if Bible study causes strife we are on the wrong track.
 
Upvote 0

parousia70

Livin' in yesterday's tomorrow
Site Supporter
Feb 24, 2002
15,534
4,827
57
Oregon
✟797,654.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Yep ... that's you ;o)

Ok Great... then I'll take that to mean you welcome having this view challenged here after all.

I've looked at many teachings ... and still do .... but so far I have found SDA to be the most biblically supported
That is quite easily refuted.
We can know that the Seventh Day Adventists don't keep the Law of Moses by how few people they stone to death. We know they don't actually keep the Law of Moses by how many precepts depend on Temple sacrifices and such (which they also can't keep). We know they don't perform the Law of Moses by the fact that the Levitical priesthood of Aaron is extinct. And yet they swear that the Law Covenant of Moses is the way of salvation.

The Covenant of Jesus is the way of salvation, and it's high time that the SDAs join into that Kingdom. And what about that 1844 "coming of Christ" that failed to actualize in the way the SDA leaders said it would? Would you say that "1844 second coming" view was "biblically Supported" or not?
 
Upvote 0

juvenissun

... and God saw that it was good.
Apr 5, 2007
25,446
803
71
Chicago
✟121,700.00
Country
United States
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
My wife and myself are not members of, nor do we attend, any established or denominational Church, We try to hold onto Tolstoy's premise "The Kingdom of God is Within You".
However many of my wife's family are Seventh Day Adventists and we receive a copy from them of their Quarterlies. Presently it is entitled " The Book of Revelation" and in it at the beginning they are completely honest and say their interpretation is the historicist view.
I am no theologian, but I am aware of other interpretations, such as the preterist and futurist versions?
We, my wife and myself, are not going to be persuaded that the SDA hold the truth in these matters. They may do, but we will leave it to Jesus to ultimately lead us to His Eternal Truth. Concerning The Book of Revelation, does it really matter?

The Book is called the Revelation, not the Teaching.
Teaching is to feed specific information to all readers/listeners. The information is the same to everyone. If your understanding is different from the majority, then you might be wrong.
Revelation is to inspire each reader/listener. Since every person is different, so the revelation is also different to everyone. To Christians as a group, the understanding of every bit of message in the Revelation should be evaluated by statistics, but not by individual specific case. As long as we are faithful Christians, everyone's different understanding to the Revelation is appropriate and is correct. People's interpretation in the statistic norm is good, those interpretations fall in the odds are also good.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Norman70
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

eleos1954

God is Love
Site Supporter
Nov 14, 2017
9,768
5,633
Utah
✟718,686.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
Ok Great... then I'll take that to mean you welcome having this view challenged here after all.


That is quite easily refuted.
We can know that the Seventh Day Adventists don't keep the Law of Moses by how few people they stone to death. We know they don't actually keep the Law of Moses by how many precepts depend on Temple sacrifices and such (which they also can't keep). We know they don't perform the Law of Moses by the fact that the Levitical priesthood of Aaron is extinct. And yet they swear that the Law Covenant of Moses is the way of salvation.

The Covenant of Jesus is the way of salvation, and it's high time that the SDAs join into that Kingdom. And what about that 1844 "coming of Christ" that failed to actualize in the way the SDA leaders said it would? Would you say that "1844 second coming" view was "biblically Supported" or not?

"We know they don't actually keep the Law of Moses by how many precepts depend on Temple sacrifices and such (which they also can't keep)"

"And yet they swear that the Law Covenant of Moses is the way of salvation."

They don't teach these things as you have them stated. Many of your statements misrepresent their teachings.

Anyway .... the link to the videos do represent their teachings (in depth) and people can go and "take it from the horses mouth" (so to speak) rather than relying on others understanding or lack of understanding about their teachings and discern them for themselves.
 
Upvote 0