CAN WE BE SAVED WHILE CONTINUING IN KNOWN UNREPENTANT SIN? WHAT IS SIN? WHAT IS RIGHTEOUSNESS?

mark kennedy · Mar 1, 2019

klutedavid said:
Romans 7:6
But now we have been released from the Law, having died to that by which we were bound, so that we serve in newness of the Spirit and not in oldness of the letter.

Thats a key concept, the letter vs. spirit.

LittleLambofJesus · Mar 1, 2019

LoveGodsWord said:
Back to the OP...
With the first question already answered,
3. What is repentance?
4. What do we repent from?
5. Can we be saved while continuing in known unrepentant sin?
God bless

We can use the example of what happened to the 1st century Jews in 70ad when they didn't repent.........

JLB777 said:
He saves us from God’s wrath.
Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him. Romans 5:9
But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him. Romans 5:8-10
Therefore the same definition applies:
Saved -

The eternal preservation of our entire being, spirit, soul, and body, from all enemies, including death.

The saving, delivering and rescuing of our entire being from the wrath of God, which is the second death, the lake of fire.

JLB

Good post......
The 1st centuries Jews thought that Jesus came to save them from the Romans little knowing that He came to save them from the corrupt murderous Judean rulers and now no longer needing a Temple/Sanctuary....IMHO

Is the "GEHENNA" of Matt 23:33 the "LAKE OF FIRE" in Revelation? Poll thread

Daniel 12:1
"And in that time/season Michael shall stand-up, the great chief prince, the one standing over sons of thy people. And a time of distress<06869>, which not occurred since to become of a nation until that time.
And in that time, thy people shall escape<04422>, every of the one being found written in scroll. [Luke 21:23-36]

Mark 1:15
And saying, "Has been filled the Time, and has-neared the Kingdom of the GOD.
Be ye reforming/repenting<3340>! and be ye believing! in the Good-Message.

Mat 3:7
But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to his baptism, he said to them,
“Brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the being about wrath?
Mat 12:34
“Brood of vipers! How can you, being evil, speak good things?
For out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks.
Mat 23:33
“Serpents, brood of vipers!
How can you escape the condemnation of the gehenna?

Luke 21:23
“But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days!
For there will be great distress<318> in the land and wrath upon this people.
36 “Yet be being vigilant/watching in every season, beseeching that ye should be being strong<2729> to be escaping<1628> all these, the being about to be becoming,
and to stand before the Son of the Man. [Daniel 12:1]

1 Thessalonians 5:3
For when they say, “Peace and safety!” then sudden destruction comes upon them,
as labor pains upon a pregnant woman. And they shall not escape<1628>.

James 5:6
Ye condemn, ye Murder<5407> the Righteous-One, not He is resisting to Ye.

Revelation 9:21
And not they repent/reform<3340> out of their Murders<5408>, nor out from their sorceries,...........
Revelation 16:11
And they blaspheme the GOD of the heaven out of the miseries of them, and out of the sores of them.
And not they repent/reform<3340>out of the works of them.

https://www.preteristarchive.com/JewishWars/timeline_military.html
"..probably the greatest single slaughter in ancient history."
ROMAN SIEGE AND SACK OF JERUSALEM

...................................

timothyu · Mar 1, 2019

LittleLambofJesus said:
The 1st centuries Jews thought that Jesus came to save them from the Romans little knowing that He came to save them from the corrupt murderous Judean rulers and now no longer needing a Temple/Sanctuary....IMHO

How about He came to save mankind from ourselves, presenting us the alternative Kingdom of selflessness to this world we have made built upon selfishness, self serving ways that seek gain at the expense of others? Offering us a change of attitude and equivalent reward.

LittleLambofJesus · Mar 1, 2019

timothyu said:
How about He came to save mankind from ourselves, presenting us the alternative Kingdom of selflessness to this world we have made built upon selfishness, self serving ways that seek gain at the expense of others? Offering us a change of attitude and equivalent reward.

Great post.
Jesus used the self righteous and corrupt greedy Judean rulers as an example in the parable of the Rich man and Lazarus.

Lazarus and the Rich Man - Here a little, there a little - Commentary

Let's start by getting some background information on the situation in which Yeshua told this parable. Luke tells us that all the tax collectors and sinners were coming to the Messiah to hear what he had to say (Luke 15:1). This made the Pharisees and scribes jealous and they complained, vehemently criticizing Yeshua for receiving sinners and eating with them (Luke 15:2). They were likely envious of his growing fame, afraid that his popularity would diminish their own authority and prestige.

Afterward, speaking primarily to his disciples but with the Pharisees (and probably the crowd) still listening in, Yeshua related the parable of the unjust steward (Luke 16:1-13). The Pharisees, who were "lovers of money" (Luke 16:14), realized that the Messiah was alluding to them with this parable and took offense. They scoffed at Yeshua. The final part of his response to the derision of the Pharisees and scribes was the parable of Lazarus and the rich man.

We'll now examine this parable in detail to grasp exactly what the Messiah was teaching about the kingdom of Go

Luke 16:
19‘And — a certain man was rich, and was clothed in purple and fine linen, making merry sumptuously every day, 20and there was a certain poor man, by name Lazarus, who was laid at his porch, full of sores, 21and desiring to be filled from the crumbs that are falling from the table of the rich man; yea, also the dogs, coming, were licking his sores. 22‘And it came to pass, that the poor man died, and that he was carried away by the messengers to the bosom of Abraham — and the rich man also died, and was buried; 23and in the hades having lifted up his eyes, being in torments, he doth see Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom, 24and having cried, he said, Father Abraham, deal kindly with me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and may cool my tongue, because I am distressed in this flame.

Yielding himself to his destiny, the rich man asks one more thing of his forefather Abraham. He pleads with him to send someone to warn his brothers, so that they may escape "this place of torment" (basanou), the testing and punishment that he was undergoing.

The fact that the rich man has five brothers is a vital clue to his true symbolic identity. Judah, the progenitor of the Jews, was the son of Jacob through Leah (Gen. 29:35). He had five full-blooded brothers: Reuben, Simeon, Levi, Issachar, and Zebulun (Gen. 35:23).

While the significance of this seemingly pointless detail has been neglected by scholars throughout the centuries, you can be certain that it did not escape the notice of the Pharisees and scribes to which Yeshua was speaking. They thoroughly knew their history and were extremely proud of their heritage. Yeshua wanted those self-righteous Pharisees to know exactly who he was referring to with this parable. This detail cements the identity of the rich man as the House of Judah, the Jews!............................

klutedavid · Mar 1, 2019

mark kennedy said:
Thats a key concept, the letter vs. spirit.

Yes Sir, the fine print tells us not the letter but the 'newness of the Spirit'. Not the old written law; we walk in the Holy Spirit under grace, under the law of Christ.

A new creation, a new commandment (love), all things are new in Christ.

LoveGodsWord · Mar 2, 2019

Ok guys getting back to the OP...

With the first question already answered,

1. What is sin?,

Does anyone else wish to have a go at answering the other questions in the OP here?

2. What is rightouesness?

3. What is repentance?

4. What do we repent from?

5. Can we be saved while continuing in known unrepentant sin?

God bless

LoveGodsWord · Mar 2, 2019

klutedavid said:
Yes Sir, the fine print tells us not the letter but the 'newness of the Spirit'. Not the old written law; we walk in the Holy Spirit under grace, under the law of Christ. A new creation, a new commandment (love), all things are new in Christ.

Can you separate the Spirit from the letter when the Spirit works through the letter in all those who BELIEVE it?

ladodgers6 · Mar 2, 2019

LoveGodsWord said:
Hi all, this is just a simple discussion where we can all share God's WORD together in a friendly manner.

The questions being posted for discussion here are;

1. What is sin?

Disobeying God and his Commandments

2. What is rightouesness?

Obeying God with Perfect Obedience without a single blemish of sin.

3. What is repentance?

Turing from sin to God

4. What do we repent from?

Sin, breaking God's commandments.

5. Can we be saved while continuing in known unrepentant sin?

Yes, we ask and pray to God for repentance as Paul did in

Romans 7: 14 We know that the law is spiritual; but I am unspiritual, sold as a slave to sin. 15 I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. 16 And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. 17 As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. 18 For I know that good itself does not dwell in me, that is, in my sinful nature. c For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out.19 For I do not do the good I want to do, but the evil I do not want to do—this I keep on doing. 20 Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.

We continue to practice good works, but always knowing that not even our evangelical obedience does not save us. The only works that save us is Christ's! And if we do not give up in doing good, we will reap a full harvest in due time. Placing Christ at the center of our lives, as the only way to Salvation is what saves; namely who he is and what he has done for the ungodly!

I hope this helps???

LoveGodsWord · Mar 3, 2019

ladodgers6 said:
Disobeying God and his Commandments
Obeying God with Perfect Obedience without a single blemish of sin.
Turing from sin to God
Sin, breaking God's commandments.
Yes, we ask and pray to God for repentance as Paul did in

Romans 7: 14 We know that the law is spiritual; but I am unspiritual, sold as a slave to sin. 15 I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. 16 And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. 17 As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. 18 For I know that good itself does not dwell in me, that is, in my sinful nature. c For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out.19 For I do not do the good I want to do, but the evil I do not want to do—this I keep on doing. 20 Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.

We continue to practice good works, but always knowing that not even our evangelical obedience does not save us. The only works that save us is Christ's! And if we do not give up in doing good, we will reap a full harvest in due time. Placing Christ at the center of our lives, as the only way to Salvation is what saves; namely who he is and what he has done for the ungodly!

I hope this helps???

Hi brother ladodgers6, nice to see you and thanks for sharing your thoughts here. I liked most of your answers here brother. Although in regards to

5. Can we be saved while continuing in known unrepentant sin?

How do you read these scriptures and how do you reconcile your answer in Q5 to what God's WORD says; HEBREWS 10:26-27; HEBREWS 6:4-8; JOHN 2:3-4; 1 JOHN 3:3-10; REVELATION 14:12; REVELATION 22:14; ROMANS 3:31; ROMANS 13:8-10; 1 CORINTHIANS 6:9-10; GALATIANS 5:19-21; EPHESIANS 5:6; COLOSSIANS 3:6; REVELATION 21:7-8

Look foward to your reply brother, thanks for sharing your thoughts

God bless.

psalm911 · Mar 3, 2019

LoveGodsWord said:
Hi all, this is just a simple discussion where we can all share God's WORD together in a friendly manner.

The questions being posted for discussion here are;

1. What is sin?

2. What is rightouesness?

3. What is repentance?

4. What do we repent from?

5. Can we be saved while continuing in known unrepentant sin?

Our opinions matter little so please provide scriptures to support your views. Look forward to hearing from you all.

I will link the questions above to the answers as we move through this thread for anyone interested in reading the answers to these questions above at a latter date.

For now what is your view on the above questions (scripture please)?

God bless.

Sin is the transgression of God's commandment. Righteousness is the doing of God's commandment: the work of God.

LoveGodsWord · Mar 3, 2019

psalm911 said:
Sin is the transgression of God's commandment. Righteousness is the doing of God's commandment: the work of God.

Very simple and well said brother psalm911, did you want to share any thoughts on the other questions? Thanks for sharing.

God bless.

ladodgers6 · Mar 3, 2019

LoveGodsWord said:
Hi brother ladodgers6, nice to see you and thanks for sharing your thoughts here. I liked most of your answers here brother. Although in regards to

5. Can we be saved while continuing in known unrepentant sin?

How do you read these scriptures and how do you reconcile your answer in Q5 to what God's WORD says; HEBREWS 10:26-27; HEBREWS 6:4-8; JOHN 2:3-4; 1 JOHN 3:3-10; REVELATION 14:12; REVELATION 22:14; ROMANS 3:31; ROMANS 13:8-10; 1 CORINTHIANS 6:9-10; GALATIANS 5:19-21; EPHESIANS 5:6; COLOSSIANS 3:6; REVELATION 21:7-8

Look foward to your reply brother, thanks for sharing your thoughts

God bless.

Thanks for being kind and respectful. I will read those passages and give my feedback. I have a question for you to ponder upon, and hope you will address it.

Say you have a friend, family member, church member, who struggle with sin. They want to stop doing it, but cannot. They hate that they do it, but continue to do it. And all these are believers. Are they saved?

One thing I think people get confused about is the distinction between Justification & Sanctification.

Justification is a ONE time act of God declaring the ungodly righteous through faith Alone in Christ Alone.

And,

Sanctification being a life long process of the believer. Like Paul says in Galatians 6:9 Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up. 10 Therefore, as we have opportunity, let us do good to all people, especially to those who belong to the family of believers.

And remembering that good works or even our repentance does not save us! Only One person and his works has saves us apart from any works.

Romans 3: 28 For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the law.

Romans 4:4 Now to the one who works, his wages are not counted as a gift but as his due. 5 And to the one who does not work but believes in him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is counted as righteousness, 6 just as David also speaks of the blessing of the one to whom God counts righteousness apart from works:

I am denying the good works of the believer? Certainly not! As Paul says in Romans 6:1 What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin that grace may abound? 2 By no means! How can we who died to sin still live in it? 3 Do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? 4 We were buried therefore with him by baptism into death, in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, we too might walk in newness of life.

So we live to God! Because he saved us through His only begotten son who was sent to rescue His people from their sins! This is the good news for the ungodly! Not more laws to keep to be saved!

I hope this helps???

And its a pleasure to discuss God's word with you!

ViaCrucis · Mar 3, 2019

LoveGodsWord said:
Can you separate the Spirit from the letter when the Spirit works through the letter in all those who BELIEVE it?

The law brings death, but the grace of God gives life. So all who seek to be righteous by the law shall perish by the word of the law which condemns them in their sin.

-CryptoLutheran

psalm911 · Mar 3, 2019

LoveGodsWord said:
Very simple and well said brother psalm911, did you want to share any thoughts on the other questions? Thanks for sharing.

God bless.

I would love to share my thoughts.

3. What is repentance?

Repentance means turning, repent means turn

4. What do we repent from?

Believers are to repent from darkness, which is referring to the body of death, which is the old man: Satan.

And be baptized into the Light, which is referring to the body of life, which is the new man: Jesus Christ.

5. Can we be saved while continuing in known unrepentant sin?

God gives the holy Spirit to those who keep his commandments from the mouth of Jesus Christ: and by the Spirit of God we are saved from death and will be raised up into everlasting life on the last day.

LoveGodsWord · Mar 3, 2019

Hi brother ladodgers6, nice to see you again.

ladodgers6 said:
Thanks for being kind and respectful. I will read those passages and give my feedback. I have a question for you to ponder upon, and hope you will address it.

Likewise brother always nice to have a friendly discussion of God's WORD and to share God's WORD with each other. I will add some comments for your consideration below and supporting scripture as a guide for your question. Ultimately though I believe you agree God's WORD alone should be the basis of our truth and as Spiritual things are spiritually discerned we both must seek and ask JESUS to be our guide and teacher. Claiming the promises of God's WORD *JOHN 14:26; JOHN 16:13; JOHN 8:31-36; JOHN 7:17; HEBREWS 8:11.

ladodgers6 said:
Say you have a friend, family member, church member, who struggle with sin. They want to stop doing it, but cannot. They hate that they do it, but continue to do it. And all these are believers. Are they saved?

Good question brother. God's WORD teaches that the HOLY Spirit will convict the world of sin and of rightouesness and of the judgment to come *JOHN 16:8. It is God's ETERNAL LAW (10 commandments) that give us the KNOWLEDGE of what SIN is when broken *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7

As Christians we all struggle with temptation to sin because we all have a sinful nature to deal with *ROMANS 7. Without JESUS all we can do is sin because we are sinners but many do not know this *MATTHEW 9:12-13.

When we become a Christian it is not God's will that we continue in SIN *1 JOHN 2:1. In fact JOHN goes on to say that those who CONTINUE in KNOWN UNREPENTANT SIN do not KNOW God *1 JOHN 2:3-4. If anyman does accasionally sin we have an advocate with the father *1 JOHN 2:1 and if we confess our sins he is faithful and just to forgive us for our sins and to cleanse us from them *1 JOHN 1:9.

The GOOD NEWS of the GOSPEL is that we not only have a Savior that died on the cross to save us from the penalty of SIN *ROMANS 6:23 but he also wants to save us from the POWER of sin (our sinful nature). This is the NEW COVENANT promise to all those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD *HEBREWS 8:10-12.

JESUS came to magnify the LAW from the INSIDE OUT quoting MATTHEW 5:17-32 (thoughts and feelings) in fulfillment of *ISAIAH 42:21. This is to show that unless our RIGHTOUESNESS EXCEEDS the RIGHTOUESNESS of the Scribes and Pharisees we can in no way enter into the KINGDOM of HEAVEN (we cannot keep God's LAW in our own strength). Jesus is saying the problem runs deeper then outward observance to the 10 Commandments. EVIL begins in the HEART. BREAKING GOD's 10 COMMANDMENTS from the heart defile a man *MATTHEW 15:18-19. JESUS is saying we can be outwardly perfect and blameless like the Scribes and Pharisee but inwardly like dead mans bones *MATTHEW 23:27-28. JESUS magnified the LAW to the INSIDE OUT. To show us that we are all sinners in need of a Saviour and that sin originates in the HEART (thoughts and feelings). That is why we have the NEW COVENANT promise and need to be BORN AGAIN by Faith in God's WORD for salvation to be free from SIN (breaking any one of God's 10 commandments) *HEBREWS 8:10-12; 1 JOHN 3:3-10.

If we are not BORN AGAIN into the NEW COVENANT promise and continue in it we will not enter the kingdom of Heaven *1 JOHN 2:3-4; 1 JOHN 2:3-4. ALL those who KNOWINGLY break any one of God's 10 commandments stand guilty before God of sin *JAMES 2:10-11. All those who KNOWINGLY CONTINUE in UNREPENTANT SIN will not enter into God's KINGDOM *HEBREWS 10:26-27 because they reject the gift of God's dear son *ROMANS 6:23.

RIGHTESOUSNESS comes from LOVE because LOVE is the fulfilling of God's LAW and the very expression of what LOVE is *ROMANS 13:8-10. He that does not LOVE does not KNOW GOD for GOD IS LOVE * 1 JOHN 4:8. All those who are BORN AGAIN have a NEW HEART TO LOVE and FOLLOW GOD *1 JOHN 4:7. This is the NEW COVENANT promise *HEBREWS 8:10-12. Those who are BORN AGAIN do not practice SIN (breaking God's Commandments) *1 JOHN 3:4-9.

This is why JOHN finishes on this subject by saying; For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous *1 JOHN 5:3 and is why JESUS says IF you LOVE me KEEP my commandments *JOHN 14:15. UNLESS we are BORN AGAIN under the NEW COVENANT to LOVE we will not enter the KINGDOM of HEAVEN *JOHN 3:3-7. We need to be changed from the INSIDE OUT.

While we have today we can turn to God with all of our heart and seek him and by FAITH alone take hold of his promises of salvation. As to your friend. If he has confessed his sins and BELIEVES God's WORD then he is right with God. If your friend is CONTINUING in KNOWN UNREPENTANT sin he needs to be BORN again to LOVE by seeking JESUS through his WORD and BELIEVING his WORD lay hold of the promises of God to save him from his SINS *1 JOHN 1:9; JOHN 3:3-7; 1 JOHN 3:3-10; HEBREWS 8:10-12; ROMANS 13:8-10; ROMANS 3:31; ROMANS 8:1-4; GALATIANS 5:1; 1 JOHN 2:1-4.

ladodgers6 said:
One thing I think people get confused about is the distinction between Justification & Sanctification. Justification is a ONE time act of God declaring the ungodly righteous through faith Alone in Christ Alone.
And, Sanctification being a life long process of the believer. Like Paul says in Galatians 6:9 Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up. 10 Therefore, as we have opportunity, let us do good to all people, especially to those who belong to the family of believers.

Indeed brother. What works simply for me is that I think of justification as being God's FORGIVENESS NOW *JOHN 3:16. If we have sinned at any stage of our Christian walk with God and ask God's FORGIVENESS we are FORGIVEN by the blood of JESUS as we have faith in his word *1 JOHN 1:9; 1 JOHN 2:1, while Sanctification is a work of a lifetime as we continue BELIEVING and FOLLOWING God's WORD we grow in God's GRACE to be more like him who calls us in LOVE to love another *JOHN 8:31-36; 1 PETER 1:15-16.

ladodgers6 said:
And remembering that good works or even our repentance does not save us! Only One person and his works has saves us apart from any works. Romans 3: 28 For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the law. Romans 4:4 Now to the one who works, his wages are not counted as a gift but as his due. 5 And to the one who does not work but believes in him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is counted as righteousness, 6 just as David also speaks of the blessing of the one to whom God counts righteousness apart from works: I am denying the good works of the believer? Certainly not! As Paul says in Romans 6:1 What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin that grace may abound? 2 By no means! How can we who died to sin still live in it? 3 Do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? 4 We were buried therefore with him by baptism into death, in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, we too might walk in newness of life. So we live to God! Because he saved us through His only begotten son who was sent to rescue His people from their sins! This is the good news for the ungodly! Not more laws to keep to be saved!

Indeed no one is saved by the works of the law. OBEDIENCE to God's LAW is not how we are saved it is the FRUIT of God's work in us to LOVE as we BELIEVE and FOLLOW his WORD *ROMANS 13:8-10. If our faith has no fruit it is dead *JAMES 2:18-20; 26 and our tree will be cast down and thrown into the fire *MATTHEW 3:10; 7:19-20; 13:49-50. We are saved by GRACE through faith and not of ourselves it is a gift of God *EPHESIANS 2:8.

ladodgers6 said:
And its a pleasure to discuss God's word with you!

Likewise brother. Hope this helps to answer your question.

God bless

ladodgers6 · Mar 3, 2019

LoveGodsWord said:
Hi brother ladodgers6, nice to see you again.

Likewise brother always nice to have a friendly discussion of God's WORD and to share God's WORD with each other. I will add some comments for your consideration below and supporting scripture as a guide for your question. Ultimately though I believe you agree God's WORD alone should be the basis of our truth and as Spiritual things are spiritually discerned we both must seek and ask JESUS to be our guide and teacher. Claiming the promises of God's WORD *JOHN 14:26; JOHN 16:13; JOHN 8:31-36; JOHN 7:17; HEBREWS 8:11.

Good question brother. God's WORD teaches that the HOLY Spirit will convict the world of sin and of rightouesness and of the judgment to come *JOHN 16:8. It is God's ETERNAL LAW (10 commandments) that give us the KNOWLEDGE of what SIN is when broken *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7

As Christians we all struggle with temptation to sin because we all have a sinful nature to deal with *ROMANS 7. Without JESUS all we can do is sin because we are sinners but many do not know this *MATTHEW 9:12-13.

When we become a Christian it is not God's will that we continue in SIN *1 JOHN 2:1. In fact JOHN goes on to say that those who CONTINUE in KNOWN UNREPENTANT SIN do not KNOW God *1 JOHN 2:3-4. If anyman does accasionally sin we have an advocate with the father *1 JOHN 2:1 and if we confess our sins he is faithful and just to forgive us for our sins and to cleanse us from them *1 JOHN 1:9.

The GOOD NEWS of the GOSPEL is that we not only have a Savior that died on the cross to save us from the penalty of SIN *ROMANS 6:23 but he also wants to save us from the POWER of sin (our sinful nature). This is the NEW COVENANT promise to all those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD *HEBREWS 8:10-12.

JESUS came to magnify the LAW from the INSIDE OUT quoting MATTHEW 5:17-32 (thoughts and feelings) in fulfillment of *ISAIAH 42:21. This is to show that unless our RIGHTOUESNESS EXCEEDS the RIGHTOUESNESS of the Scribes and Pharisees we can in no way enter into the KINGDOM of HEAVEN (we cannot keep God's LAW in our own strength). Jesus is saying the problem runs deeper then outward observance to the 10 Commandments. EVIL begins in the HEART. BREAKING GOD's 10 COMMANDMENTS from the heart defile a man *MATTHEW 15:18-19. JESUS is saying we can be outwardly perfect and blameless like the Scribes and Pharisee but inwardly like dead mans bones *MATTHEW 23:27-28. JESUS magnified the LAW to the INSIDE OUT. To show us that we are all sinners in need of a Saviour and that sin originates in the HEART (thoughts and feelings). That is why we have the NEW COVENANT promise and need to be BORN AGAIN by Faith in God's WORD for salvation to be free from SIN (breaking any one of God's 10 commandments) *HEBREWS 8:10-12; 1 JOHN 3:3-10.

If we are not BORN AGAIN into the NEW COVENANT promise and continue in it we will not enter the kingdom of Heaven *1 JOHN 2:3-4; 1 JOHN 2:3-4. ALL those who KNOWINGLY break any one of God's 10 commandments stand guilty before God of sin *JAMES 2:10-11. All those who KNOWINGLY CONTINUE in UNREPENTANT SIN will not enter into God's KINGDOM *HEBREWS 10:26-27 because they reject the gift of God's dear son *ROMANS 6:23.

RIGHTESOUSNESS comes from LOVE because LOVE is the fulfilling of God's LAW and the very expression of what LOVE is *ROMANS 13:8-10. He that does not LOVE does not KNOW GOD for GOD IS LOVE * 1 JOHN 4:8. All those who are BORN AGAIN have a NEW HEART TO LOVE and FOLLOW GOD *1 JOHN 4:7. This is the NEW COVENANT promise *HEBREWS 8:10-12. Those who are BORN AGAIN do not practice SIN (breaking God's Commandments) *1 JOHN 3:4-9.

This is why JOHN finishes on this subject by saying; For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous *1 JOHN 5:3 and is why JESUS says IF you LOVE me KEEP my commandments *JOHN 14:15. UNLESS we are BORN AGAIN under the NEW COVENANT to LOVE we will not enter the KINGDOM of HEAVEN *JOHN 3:3-7. We need to be changed from the INSIDE OUT.

While we have today we can turn to God with all of our heart and seek him and by FAITH alone take hold of his promises of salvation. As to your friend. If he has confessed his sins and BELIEVES God's WORD then he is right with God. If your friend is CONTINUING in KNOWN UNREPENTANT sin he needs to be BORN again to LOVE by seeking JESUS through his WORD and BELIEVING his WORD lay hold of the promises of God to save him from his SINS *1 JOHN 1:9; JOHN 3:3-7; 1 JOHN 3:3-10; HEBREWS 8:10-12; ROMANS 13:8-10; ROMANS 3:31; ROMANS 8:1-4; GALATIANS 5:1; 1 JOHN 2:1-4.

Indeed brother. What works simply for me is that I think of justification as being God's FORGIVENESS NOW *JOHN 3:16. If we have sinned at any stage of our Christian walk with God and ask God's FORGIVENESS we are FORGIVEN by the blood of JESUS as we have faith in his word *1 JOHN 1:9; 1 JOHN 2:1, while Sanctification is a work of a lifetime as we continue BELIEVING and FOLLOWING God's WORD we grow in God's GRACE to be more like him who calls us in LOVE to love another *JOHN 8:31-36; 1 PETER 1:15-16.

Indeed no one is saved by the works of the law. OBEDIENCE to God's LAW is not how we are saved it is the FRUIT of God's work in us to LOVE as we BELIEVE and FOLLOW his WORD *ROMANS 13:8-10. If our faith has no fruit it is dead *JAMES 2:18-20; 26 and our tree will be cast down and thrown into the fire *MATTHEW 3:10; 7:19-20; 13:49-50. We are saved by GRACE through faith and not of ourselves it is a gift of God *EPHESIANS 2:8.

Likewise brother. Hope this helps to answer your question.

God bless

Thanks for sharing, I agree with most of what you wrote here. I will add the following: Fruits, works of the believer is not the cause or even the ground of our Redemption. We cannot find peace with God through our evangelical obedience. This is RCC teaching, not is not Biblical. And is often distorted and confused by people. These works are NOT the solid rock to which the ungodly believers can stand firm. Because we are unprofitable servants.

The fruits, works of the believer is the result of our Justification in Christ through Faith Alone! Not the cause, which people get wrong, even believers. And when we replace Christ with what we need to do, then we have another gospel; which is no gospel at all. Our works as believers flow from our Justification from another; namely Christ Jesus! Our Redemption and Salvation lies outside of us, in the person of Christ Jesus through His Active & Passive Obedience to God's Law for us!

We are free in Christ! Romans 10:1 Brothers, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for them is that they may be saved. 2 For I bear them witness that they have a zeal for God, but not according to knowledge. 3 For, being ignorant of the righteousness of God, and seeking to establish their own, they did not submit to God’s righteousness. 4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.

The heresies that has plagued Christendom for centuries, has been Legalism and antinomanism. We as believers need to be aware of them, so know when false teachers come along.

As believers we must do good works, because we are freed from sin & death, and bought to life and righteousness, because of the ONE ACT of Obedience, by the Last Adam.

Also Paul anticipates the question, when he is preaching Gospel of Christ to the ungodly. "Shall we continue to sin?" Because of the 'FREE GIFT' of God given to the ungodly, not the godly, or righteous! How marvelous and glorious is this good news??? How rich and deep is God's Grace and Mercy???

Now go live to God, who has freed you from the bondage of condemnation & death!!!

Amen!!!

Thanks for listening, brother.

hedrick · Mar 3, 2019

I would be very surprised if there is anyone who isn't committing some sin repeatedly. The only way to avoid it is to restrict the kinds of sins you look at. In most cases people only look at a couple of sexual sins, and ignore all kind of other things, such as walking past on the other side of the road while others are suffering.

I would be shocked if most Christians aren't failing to meet even what they understand of God's standards, much less the things they're overlooking.

If you really look at Jesus' standards for behavior, I think you'll find that everyone is falling short, and in most cases they likely simply don't look at certain types of actions that are contrary to Jesus' teachings.

I understand the concern behind the OP. People feel that there's got to be a limit, or anyone can think they're saved when they're not serious about following Jesus. But this leads to a kind of Pharisaical pride. You're heard it here often enough: most people in the church aren't *really* saved. As if we could know what's going on between them and God.

I don't think this is a mindset that Jesus would encourage. Indeed his teaching about judgement suggests that perhaps the question posed in the OP is one that shouldn't even be asked.

hedrick · Mar 3, 2019

One problem in discussions like this is that most Christians seem to think of sin as violations of purity. That's really the Pharisee's idea, not Jesus'. If you look at Jesus' teachings, you'll see some interesting omissions:
* He doesn't use the terms pure or holy about his followers. Sure, there's the Holy Spirit, the holy city, and the holy angels. But not holy followers.
* He doesn't speak much about people's sins, except forgiving them.

The Pharisees' ideal was holiness. Jesus' was obedience. There's a difference. Holiness tends to lead to legalism, to trying to set boundaries around the holy. It also leads people to overmuch concern about their own moral purity and accomplishments. Obedience causes us to focus on Jesus, and on others.

Look through Jesus' teachings and parables about judgement. He speaks of people accepting or rejecting his message, and about people who help others or abuse them. But sins against purity aren't his thing.

LoveGodsWord · Mar 3, 2019

Thanks brother ladodgers6, for sharing your thoughts. Some comments for your consideration below.

ladodgers6 said:
I will add the following: Fruits, works of the believer is not the cause or even the ground of our Redemption. We cannot find peace with God through our evangelical obedience. This is RCC teaching, not is not Biblical. And is often distorted and confused by people. These works are NOT the solid rock to which the ungodly believers can stand firm. Because we are unprofitable servants. The fruits, works of the believer is the result of our Justification in Christ through Faith Alone! Not the cause, which people get wrong, even believers. And when we replace Christ with what we need to do, then we have another gospel; which is no gospel at all. Our works as believers flow from our Justification from another; namely Christ Jesus! Our Redemption and Salvation lies outside of us, in the person of Christ Jesus through His Active & Passive Obedience to God's Law for us!

Indeed. No one said we are saved by the works of the law they are the fruit however of genuine faith. As stated earlier and shown through the scriptures, no one is saved by the works of the law. OBEDIENCE to God's LAW is not how we are saved it is the FRUIT of God's work in us by LOVE as we BELIEVE and FOLLOW his WORD *ROMANS 13:8-10. We are saved by GRACE through faith and not of ourselves it is a gift of God *EPHESIANS 2:8.

According to God's WORD in the NEW COVENANT God's ETERNAL LAW (10 commandments) is the KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL; SIN and RIGHTEOUSNES *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4; PSALMS 119:172.

According to God's WORD all those who CONTINUE in KNOWN UNREPENTANT SIN will not enter into the KINGDOM of HEAVEN *HEBREWS 10:26-27 because they reject the gift of God's dear son *ROMANS 6:23. OBEDIENCE to God's LAW is not how we are saved it is the FRUIT of God's work in us as we BELIEVE and FOLLOW his WORD through love. If our faith has no fruit it is dead *JAMES 2:18-20; 26 and our tree will be cast down and thrown into the fire *MATTHEW 3:10; 7:19-20; 13:49-50.

If our faith has no fruit it is not saving faith but is the faith of devils *JAMES 2:18-20; 26 and if there is no fruit then one is still in their sins and do not KNOW GOD and need to be Born again *1 JOHN 2:1-4; 1 JOHN 3:3-10.

ladodgers6 said:
We are free in Christ! Romans 10:1 Brothers, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for them is that they may be saved. 2 For I bear them witness that they have a zeal for God, but not according to knowledge. 3 For, being ignorant of the righteousness of God, and seeking to establish their own, they did not submit to God’s righteousness. 4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes. The heresies that has plagued Christendom for centuries, has been Legalism and antinomanism. We as believers need to be aware of them, so know when false teachers come along. As believers we must do good works, because we are freed from sin & death, and bought to life and righteousness, because of the ONE ACT of Obedience, by the Last Adam. Also Paul anticipates the question, when he is preaching Gospel of Christ to the ungodly. "Shall we continue to sin?" Because of the 'FREE GIFT' of God given to the ungodly, not the godly, or righteous! How marvelous and glorious is this good news??? How rich and deep is God's Grace and Mercy??? Now go live to God, who has freed you from the bondage of condemnation & death!!!Amen!!!

The role of God's ETERNAL LAW (10 commandments) in the OLD and NEW COVENANTS is to give us the KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL; SIN and RIGHTEOUSNESS *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4; PSALMS 119:172. It does not make us perfect and never has had that role. Its role is to show us that we are all sinners in need of a Saviour to save us from our sinful nature *MATTHEW 9:12-13; ROMANS 7; JOHN 8:31-36. It leads us to Christ that we might be FORGIVEN through faith *GALATIANS 3:22-25 were we can become free to LOVE and walk in God's SPIRIT *GALATIANS 5:16. Christ is the end of the law because that is where the law leads us as sinner, to JESUS and the foot of the cross where we can be forgiven through faith and made free to love which is the NEW COVENANT promise *ROMANS 8:1-4; HEBREWS 8:10-12.

ladodgers6 said:
Thanks for listening, brother.

Pleasure brother, likewise and thanks for sharing your thoughts.

God bless.

ladodgers6 · Mar 3, 2019

hedrick said:
I would be very surprised if there is anyone who isn't committing some sin repeatedly. The only way to avoid it is to restrict the kinds of sins you look at. In most cases people only look at a couple of sexual sins, and ignore all kind of other things, such as walking past on the other side of the road while others are suffering.

I would be shocked if most Christians aren't failing to meet even what they understand of God's standards, much less the things they're overlooking.

If you really look at Jesus' standards for behavior, I think you'll find that everyone is falling short, and in most cases they likely simply don't look at certain types of actions that are contrary to Jesus' teachings.

I understand the concern behind the OP. People feel that there's got to be a limit, or anyone can think they're saved when they're not serious about following Jesus. But this leads to a kind of Pharisaical pride. You're heard it here often enough: most people in the church aren't *really* saved. As if we could know what's going on between them and God.

I don't think this is a mindset that Jesus would encourage. Indeed his teaching about judgement suggests that perhaps the question posed in the OP is one that shouldn't even be asked.

Well said Hedrick. Forgetting how sinners are saved, and who saves sinners leads to all types of heresies like legalism on one hand and antinomanism on the other.

Am I denying repentance of the believing sinner? God forbid! We need to walk in holiness everyday. Knowing and trusting that the only thing that save us; is Christ and his Perfect obedience. Once this is blurred, distort, or even replaced. We lose everything!

CAN WE BE SAVED WHILE CONTINUING IN KNOWN UNREPENTANT SIN? WHAT IS SIN? WHAT IS RIGHTEOUSNESS?

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