This appears to be a rather confusing matter. I formerly was of the view that the Church believed and taught what is stated in the famous Cantate Domino Papal Bull, namely, that if one is excommunicated, that unless he/she is reconciled with Holy Mother Church prior to death, that he/she is lost and will not go to Heaven. (I am referring only to Catholics here) However, when I saw the former Gov. Cuomo give that interview on television decades ago, probably on ABC's Nightline, wherein he stated that the Church could excommunicate him over the abortion issue, but that only God could judge his immortal soul, then I began to wonder. I have since then read and heard things which make me think that perhaps Gov. Cuomo was right. Maybe the modern Church no longer believes and teaches what was decreed in Cantate Domino? Maybe the modern Church now teaches and believes that God is the ultimate judge of who will and who will not go to Heaven and not an anathema/excommunication decree?
Though this non-Catholic is very knowledgeable about Catholic history and doctrine, this is one area wherein I admit that there seems to be some confusion as to what the modern Church does teach and believe. Has Cantate Domino effectively been thrown into the trash bin of history, in it's entirety? We know that the doctrine of "invincible ignorance" has supposedly given us non-Catholic Christians a pass and a way around a literal interpretation of Cantate Domino. However, what about those who are born and raised as Catholics and get excommunicated? Must they reconcile with Mother Church prior to death or automatically get sent to Hell? Then again, is it as the first Gov. Cuomo stated, that only God can judge an immortal soul, thus implying that someone who is excommunicated and does not reconcile with Mother Church prior to death, still has a chance at salvation?
The Dysfunctional Deception of Catholic Pacifism
Hello Basil,
I see it as the big Catholic dysfunctional, pacifist Deception. Here is an example: From behind the protection of Swiss Guard snipers, a pacifist Pope stated, “Violence is Never the Answer!” But, of course, when it comes to Pope’s protecting themselves, armed security is always the only answer. It is Catholic pacifist leaders who destroyed the Christ willed, protect My Flock, tool of Catholic Anathema. They did so in the past fifty years or so. It is highly likely pacifist Popes still have an auto-Anathema against anyone who harms a Pope. Pacifist Popes have just eliminated using the Christ given 'sword of Christ's mouth', anathema, to protect Christ’s Flock.
Here is my story of dealing with Catholic Pacifism.
When I was young, the Vietnam War was on. In homilies, my priests vehemently condemned killing in war. The draft was on. I wanted to protect my country, but more so, I want to love and remain faithful to Jesus with all my heart, mind, strength and soul. I was in a spiritual pressure cooker. In the confessional, I asked my priest about Jesus’ Will on when to kill to protect the innocent. He made me out as a coward. He said I had to serve my country, but when I got back, come to the Church, and she will help me with all the evil I had done. Yes, Right, not so much help to me.
I ran from the confessional, fell to my knees before Jesus on the Cross. With tears streaming down my face I prayed to my heavenly Father, “I am ready and willing to stand by idle with my weapon at my side, while my own mother is raped, beaten and murdered in front of me. Or I am ready to travel tens of thousands of miles away, and fight to my death, protecting a strangers mother from persecution. But, Heavenly Father, Please, I Beg of You, tell me Your Will on when, or when not, to kill to protect the innocent and I will do it. I can bear the weight of this question no longer.
I could not find any Catholic books on Jesus will on when to kill, to help me. A fellow Catholic told me that the Catholic Church had a ‘Just War Theory’. I was elated. I anxiously asked him, ‘So in which wars did Jesus Will us to kill to protect the innocent? The Catholic screamed back, ‘Jesus is a Pacifist!’ ‘Just War theory is only what the Church Teaches, not what Jesus teaches!’ ‘How can the Catholic Church teach a ‘Just War Theory’, which they themselves believe is in direct opposition to the teachings of my Lord Jesus Christ?’, I asked. The Catholic just stomped away with a full head of steam (anger).
From Constantine (300 A.D.), through to 1870, Papal States existed. Toward the end, Popes owned, and ruled over, up to two thirds of Italy, castles and all. Popes had a papal army, along with paying, and promising salvation, to other armies to come help fight and protect all the wealth given to Jesus, by the faithful, so it could be protected and used to help the poor. A fellow Catholic told me all these Popes from Constantine till present, were all evil (many of these Popes were canonized saints) and that the Church did not have a good Pope until St. John Paul II in 1978. I responded, Well what about pacifist Pope John Paul II having Swiss Guard snipers? I know that there were at least two kills, by Papal protective forces, during Pope John Paul II’s papacy, even though they were collateral damage kills. Wow, You would have thought I desecrated the Holy Grail. The fellow Catholic went on about how Pope John Paul II actually hated having armed militia to protect himself.
A fellow Catholic told me, ‘If a person wanted to go to heaven, they certainly would not join the Vatican Swiss Guard!’ Another fellow Catholic told me that being a Swiss Guard was a damned if you do, damned if you don’t, occupation; meaning, to not protect a Pope will damn you, killing to protect the Pope, will damn you. If the Pope believes in pacifism, why don't we just allow him to, Not have, Swiss Guards and Italian police?, I asked. The Vatican having sovereign nation status, will have the backing of the UN, and powerful UN sanctions against any foreign militia who violate a Pope’s wishes to have a pacifist Vatican. Our early Apostles chose martyrdom to remain faithful to Jesus. The fellow Catholic responded, Our Pope is too valuable for us to not protect his life. I responded, the greater the sacrifice, the greater the gift and the glory, to our Lord, through martyrdom. I am just saying, a Pope should be free to offer his life to Jesus in martyrdom, through pacifism, if he chooses to do so. They did not like me very much for my comments.
With the Catholic Church, being fully incapable of teaching me Jesus’ Will on when to kill, for the protection of the innocent, I started prayerfully searching the scriptures to understand Jesus’ Will on when to kill. And I mean many thousands of hours in prayer, contemplation and bible search. I could feel the ‘cut off’ verses calling out to me, through the Power of the Holy Spirit. I showed my priest how Jesus wills His Church to call upon Him to bind certain evildoers to their sins, which thus cuts them off from the life of the body of the Church, to protect the Body of His Church from being pulled into hell. ‘The Church does not have the power to damn anyone to hell’ he exclaimed. Years passed. Then I read about Catholic Church Anathema. I went back to ask my priest about anathema. He was pretty irritated. No confirmation from him.
I had a guy, claiming to be a priest, demand that I stop talking about Catholic Church Anathema online. When I kept talking about anathema, the guy PM me with his anathematization upon me. Needless to say, our present, pacifist thinking, Catholic Church mentality, really, really, really does not want people to know about Catholic Church Anathema. You can tell by many of the posts on this thread as well.
Anathema, the sword of our Lord, which is Jesus’ lips binding sinners to their sins, upon the verbal request of Apostolic Successors, is the most Powerful and most deadly, weapon in existence. Anathema, barring one person from eternal life, is more loss of life (eternal life), than the, combined years of physical life lost, from all the wars in human history. You can tell how much Jesus loves His Church, by the tremendous firepower He left behind, on the tongues of Apostolic Successors, Commanding them to use this weapon to protect His Bride, the Church, the Catholic Church, on earth. Church leaders simply have to get past their emotional dysfunctional pacifist baggage and pull out the ‘Sword of our Lord’, and start protecting Jesus’ Flock, as Jesus Wills them to do!
Protect the Flock! Do not let Satan pull the whole Body of Jesus’ Church into hell by her evil limbs! Cut off the wicked and hurl them into hell, for the protection of the Body of Christ’s Bride, the Church, the Catholic Church, and pull her Body back from the edge of the abyss, and back to safety! Lock n’ Load, Using Catholic Church Anathema, Stand, Protect and Defend, Christ’s Bride, the Church, the Catholic Church, on earth! Which is actually what happens at Armageddon, when Jesus dispatches His angels to bundle the wicked up for burning, in preparation for His Second Coming.
Matthew 13:36
The harvest is the end of the age, and the harvesters are angels. Just as weeds are collected and burned (up) with fire, so will it be at the end of the age. The Son of Man will send his angels, and they will collect out of his kingdom all who cause others to sin and all evildoers. They will throw them into the fiery furnace, where there will be wailing and grinding of teeth. Then the righteous will shine like the sun in the kingdom of their Father."
Matthew 13:47
Again, the kingdom of heaven is like a net thrown into the sea, which collects fish of every kind. When it is full they haul it ashore and sit down to put what is good into buckets. What is bad they throw away. Thus it will be at the end of the age. The angels will go out and separate the wicked from the righteous and throw them into the fiery furnace, where there will be wailing and grinding of teeth.
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