Cohen Begins Testifying to Congress Wed. Morning at 10

Allandavid said:

Probably not.....seeing as he was in VIETNAM....

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Sorry...the President of North Korea in Vietnam...better? Long day.

Apologetic_Warrior said:

Sorry...the President of North Korea in Vietnam...better? Long day.

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Yeah...sure...

Allandavid said:

Probably not.....seeing as he was in VIETNAM....

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Better late than never, I guess. #bonespurs

Apologetic_Warrior said:

Racial opportunism huh? Here's an example, from the hearing today (yesterday)...

A Black woman as a "prop" really? That is a disgusting racist suggestion. Would this be an example of racial opportunism of which you speak or no?

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She was a prop. Pointing out what is racially insensitive, if not racist, is not the racist action. Everyone I know was outraged.

Apologetic_Warrior said:

If you do not mind, explain why that argument is ludicrous. The reason I ask is because a racist harbors hatred for an entire race of people, and that being the case, they do not associate with or have friends of the races(s) they harbor hatred for. I understand there are deceptive people desiring to create false images of themselves for whatever purposes, and pretenders, but they also have to be convincing to the other person. I think it is the exception rather than the norm. I have known a couple of racists in my time, and they were not shy about letting you know where they stand. From the video clip, the chairman identifies himself as a friend. And believe it or not, White folks are not the only race capable of racism.

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See Strom Thurmond.

Apologetic_Warrior said:

According to Cohen, the President is a racist, conman, and cheat. The biggest irony here is that most lawyers are conmen and cheats, in other words, he has no room to speak, no higher moral ground. But he is doing time in prison and saying whatever might help to reduce his sentence for political purposes, because like all cheaters, he's looking out for number one. That's my opinion based on learning from past legal history and other sources and considerations. I hope it's okay to have opinions around here, Cohen expressed his (which changed due to circumstance btw), and I expressed mine.

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I’ll stipulate that both Trump and Cohen are liars. Now, what about the criminal behavior of Mr. Trump.

Apologetic_Warrior said:

Neither of us are in the know either way, but I do know deals are made every day for information, whether it is true or not is another matter, and there is something to perhaps be gained by Democrats from this, and there is much corruption in the legal system, and no I do not care to spend time fetching information. This will roll over like water on a duck's back. Our President does not have a racist bone in his body, Margaret Sanger on the other hand is quite a different story.

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Again, what about Me. Trumps illegal activity? People get away with bank fraud by overstating their assets. But those that get caught go to prison.

iluvatar5150 said:

lol okay. I'm sure that birther thing had nothing to do with race.

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I’m with Warrior on this one. In order be a racist one has to have a belief in something outside oneself.

Apologetic_Warrior said:

If you do not mind, explain why that argument is ludicrous. The reason I ask is because a racist harbors hatred for an entire race of people, and that being the case, they do not associate with or have friends of the races(s) they harbor hatred for. I understand there are deceptive people desiring to create false images of themselves for whatever purposes, and pretenders, but they also have to be convincing to the other person. I think it is the exception rather than the norm. I have known a couple of racists in my time, and they were not shy about letting you know where they stand. From the video clip, the chairman identifies himself as a friend. And believe it or not, White folks are not the only race capable of racism.

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Racism is way more complicated than that and people can be (and often are) very inconsistent in their application of racism, for example, by treating their friends as acceptable exceptions.

Apologetic_Warrior said:

Sorry, but I watch Fox on Youtube and missed the tizzy, however I stumbled onto these...

But then I will be reminded of the Reason Cohen is going to jail....however Cohen is but one source (per the above), and not a reliable one at that. Interesting how Cohen would put himself in jeopardy of further legal trouble, but congressman Jim Jordon brought to attention and provided a bit of insight into that one.

Meanwhile I wonder if anyone noticed the President in North Korea....what a day....what a day.

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You seem to have forgotten that Cohen prsented specific verifiable information. This situation is typical of investigation of organized crime. Gotta get the lower level criminals and work your way up.

With all due respect, the focus on racism distracts from addressing Trumps criminal activity. Being a racist and generally being a liar and scumbag are not prosecutable crimes.

Apologetic_Warrior said:

A Black woman as a "prop" really? That is a disgusting racist suggestion. Would this be an example of racial opportunism of which you speak or no?

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Well, if she wasn't a prop, what was she?

camille70 said:

See Strom Thurmond.

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Ah yes, the man who'd sleep with a black woman but would refuse to go to school with her.

Apologetic_Warrior said:

Sorry...the President of North Korea in Vietnam...better? Long day.

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....as it turns out, it wasn't a long day for Trump. By lunch time on Thursday, the summit was terminated, disappointing many in the region who were placing their hopes in the proclaimed negotiating skill of Donald J Trump.

Cohen was absolutely right on this point: Trump is a con man.

Apologetic_Warrior said:

It's interesting you should attack how serious I take the issue, when your comment started with a "lol". Fairness or lack of it in politics, or a requirement of equal criticism at all times does not amount to racism. I do not care if you take me seriously though, I do not need your approval to know myself, to know the attitudes of my heart which you have no right to judge or make claims to knowledge of.

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There's no victim card to play here. He was clearly talking SPECIFIcALLY about the birther claims but you are addressing his policies.

Those are not the same thing. You may feel you have an escape hatch now but really you didn't address the argument put forward

I think the most significant part was Cohen's warning for anyone and everyone putting their faith in and defending Trump, to look where it got him. His job was to shield Trump from legal troubles. To defend his character at all costs and because of that undying loyalty, he's going to prison. Even if he's not the most trustworthy guy in the world, it is undeniable that is going to prison directly as a result of his work covering for Donald Trump.

Anna Scott said:

I was disappointed by how few questions were asked. Some used their time giving their opinions about Cohen and his credibility, instead of asking questions. Squandered opportunity to get to the truth.

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Didnt surprise me at all. If someone is saying bad things about your parties president, they are going to attack the witnesses credibility. These are mostly lawyers and they would do the same in a court room.

If roles were reversed, i have no doubt, the democrats would attack credibility as well.

FenderTL5 said:

Ah yes, the man who'd sleep with a black woman but would refuse to go to school with her.

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If you think the school segregation is the be all and end all of civil rights, sure. The freedom of choice plan was only one aspect of his crusade against civil rights. The point stands, a black friend or employee means nothing.

You won't believe how many times I've heard the comment "You're not like other black people". Sometimes coupled with the question if I'm "mixed with something" or from someplace else. It's delivered as a compliment. Trust me, it's not. It means you've been impressed or have noticed a trait or behavior you see as positive, but can't perform the mental gymnastics of associating something positive or good with a black person. Its similar to the surprise some white people have when they hear a black person speak and declare "oh they are so articulate!". It's said as a compliment but not always received that way. A black person speaking well isn't an anomaly.

A coworker once came to me in tears. She had been wanting to get promoted at work, and been trying for a long time. She had made this known, asked what she needed to do etc. At one point another coworker (Asian. Sweet girl and well intentioned but her English wasn't all that great and this didn't go over well. We were the only non white employees at this location, and we hadn't been hired there, we were transfers from different stores. It was a white, affluent area.) used me as an example of the type of black person white people "like" and are "comfortable with". She had told her she didn't think she would get promoted. Sadly she wasn't wrong about some of the attitudes about the people with whom we were working. She didn't let this deter her and she went on to get the promotions she worked for, but this was painful for her.

When you aren't on the receiving end of comments and actions, it's easy to be dismissive of them. Ms. Patton being put on display triggered a lot of people. I've seen several comment about putting her on display like a slave on an auction block. I think that is an over reach, but this is a bigger deal than you might think it is.

So, be mindful. I understand the drive to dismiss this, but that is another indicator of racial insensitivity and misunderstanding. It is painful for others whether you realize it or not.

Apologetic_Warrior said:

If you do not mind, explain why that argument is ludicrous. The reason I ask is because a racist harbors hatred for an entire race of people, and that being the case, they do not associate with or have friends of the races(s) they harbor hatred for. I understand there are deceptive people desiring to create false images of themselves for whatever purposes, and pretenders, but they also have to be convincing to the other person. I think it is the exception rather than the norm. I have known a couple of racists in my time, and they were not shy about letting you know where they stand. From the video clip, the chairman identifies himself as a friend. And believe it or not, White folks are not the only race capable of racism.

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I find it odd so many people have apparently not heard one of the most prevalent racist tropes that exist. I first heard of this in basic training 30 years ago.


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