Is a 3rd future Temple needed to fulfill Bible prophecy?

keras said:

In the meantime, why don't you study and find out what the Prophetic Word actually does say about our future?
Why be shocked and disappointed because what you have been taught by your teachers, is not the truth?

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Hi keras,

Well if I`m here after April next year then you can tell me all about it.

Marilyn.

claninja said:

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Hi claninja,

Thank you for that detailed reply. I would like to reply but that will have to wait for an appropriate thread. LLofJ, has reminded us of this topic, so... on that note perhaps you would like to share your comments on the Temple in Ezekiel, 40 - 48. When do you think that will be? (or was).

Marilyn.

Marilyn C said:

on that note perhaps you would like to share your comments on the Temple in Ezekiel, 40 - 48. When do you think that will be? (or was).

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Part 1

Using the same interpretation methodology of types, antitypes, and scripture interpreting scripture, we determine what the Ezekiel temple is. Remembering Types being the immediate context, the antitype being the ultimate fulfillment in Christ.

Let's start with the "type", which is the immediate context. Ezekiel was commanded to describe this new temple to the people of Israel, so that they would be ashamed of their sin. And IF they were ashamed, then the design would be made known to them, so that they may perform it.

Ezekiel 43:10-11 As for you, son of man, describe the temple to the people of Israel, so that they may be ashamed of their iniquities. Let them measure the plan, and if they are ashamed of all they have done, then make known to them the design of the temple—its arrangement and its exits and entrances—its whole design along with all its statutes, forms, and laws. Write it down in their sight, so that they may observe its complete design and all its statutes, and may carry them out.

But national Israel never built the Ezekiel temple when they returned from exile. In fact, the temple they built was worse, aesthetically speaking, than Solomon's temple.

Ezra 3:12 But many of the older priests, Levites, and family heads who had seen the first temple wept loudly when they saw the foundation of this temple. Still, many others shouted joyfully

So why wasn't a physical Ezekiel temple (type) built upon the return of exile? I would argue, it was because national Israel never fully turned from their sin. We can see this through the OT post exilic prophets. The rules and regulations for temple worship are found in the Law of Moses. However, since the old covenant had a fault, which was the sinful nature of man, Israel could never truly turn from sin or be absolved from sin under the old covenant. And if Israel could never truly turn from sin UNDER THE OLD COVENANT, the physical Ezekiel temple would never be built.

Hebrews 7:11 Now if perfection could have been attained through the Levitical priesthood (for on this basis the people received the law), why was there still need for another priest to appear—one in the order of Melchizedek and not in the order of Aaron?

Hebrews 8:7-8 For if that first covenant had been without fault, no place would have been sought for a second. But God found fault with the people and said: “Behold, the days are coming, declares the Lord,
when I will make a new covenant

A physical Ezekiel temple (type) could only serve a purpose under the old covenant. However, the old covenant was made obsolete at the cross and fully ended in 70AD. Under the New covenant, temple rules, and regulations from the law of moses no longer served a purpose.

Hebrews 8:13 By speaking of a new covenant, He has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and aging will soon disappear

Hebrews 9:10 They consist only in food and drink and special washings—external regulations imposed until the time of reform.

And so because the old covenant ended, and was replaced by the new covenant, the promise of the Ezekiel temple is fulfilled in its "antitype" to serve its purpose under the new covenant through Christ.

IN summary The "IF clause" in Ezekiel for building the temple required Israel to be ashamed of their sin. However, UNDER THE OLD COVENANT, Israel could never be free from sin and never truly forgiven of their sin. This resulted in the "type" never being built under the OLD COVENANT.

**So lets move to the "antitype" of Ezekiel's temple, ultimate fulfillment

Remember, Ezekiel's temple could only be built if Israel was ashamed of its sin (Ezekiel 43:10-11). And the only way that Israel could truly turn from sin was through Christ, under the NEW COVENANT, NOT UNDER THE OLD COVENANT. For only through Christ could sin be put away and atoned for.

Hebrews 2:17 For this reason He had to be made like His brothers in every way, so that He might become a merciful and faithful high priest in service to God, in order to make atonement for the sins of the people.

Hebrews 9:26 . But now He has appeared once for all at the end of the ages to do away with sin by the sacrifice of Himself.

So, when Peter declared to ISRAEL that Jesus was the messiah, the cornerstone, whom they had crucified, They were cut to the heart and repented. And through Christ was their sin (and ours) truly atoned for.

Acts 2:36-40 Therefore let all Israel know with certainty that God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Christ!” When the people heard this, they were cut to the heart and asked Peter and the other apostles, “Brothers, what shall we do?” Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. This promise belongs to you and to your children and to all who are far off, to all whom the Lord our God will call to Himself.” With many other words he testified, and he urged them, “Be saved from this corrupt generation.” Those who embraced his message were baptized, and about three thousand were added to the believers that day.

So Now, we see Israel coming to Christ, ashamed of their sins, and asking for forgiveness. So why isn't a physical Ezekiel temple (type) built? Because the sacrifices, washings, and regulations are no longer required under the NEW COVENANT. They were fulfilled in Christ. So the temple that is being built is not a physical building (type) because that serves no purpose under the New covenant. What is being built is the true temple (antitype) not made by hands to fulfill its role under the new covenant.

Paul declares that the body of Christ is the temple. This temple was being built in the first century, where God would dwell in His Spirit. This is the Ezekiel temple (antitype).

Ephesians 2:22Therefore you are no longer strangers and foreigners, but fellow citizens of the saints and members of God’s household, built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus Himself as the cornerstone. In Him the whole building is fitted together and grows into a holy temple in the Lord. And in Him you too are being built together into a dwelling place for God in His Spirit.

2 Corinthians 6:16 For we are the temple of the living God. As God has said: “I will live with them
and walk among them, and I will be their God, and they will be My people.”


In part 2 I will show, using scripture to interpret, that the Ezekiel temple=the new Jerusalem = the body of Christ. to be continued...

Marilyn C said:

Hi claninja,


Thank you for that detailed reply. I would like to reply but that will have to wait for an appropriate thread. LLofJ, has reminded us of this topic, so... on that note perhaps you would like to share your comments on the Temple in Ezekiel, 40 - 48. When do you think that will be? (or was).

Marilyn.

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Part 2

Now, we can use scripture to interpret scripture to prove that the New Jerusalem is the Ezekiel temple/city.

1.) Both the New Jerusalem and the Ezekiel temple have a river flowing from it that bears fruit each month for healing.

revelation 22:1-2 Then the angel showed me a river of the water of life, as clear as crystal, flowing from the throne of God and of the Lamb down the middle of the main street of the city. On either side of the river stood a tree of life, bearing twelve kinds of fruit and yielding a fresh crop for each month. And the leaves of the tree are for the healing of the nations.

Ezekiel 47:1 Then the man brought me back to the entrance of the temple, and I saw water flowing from under the threshold of the temple toward the east (for the temple faced east). The water was coming down from under the south side of the temple, south of the altar.

Ezekiel 47:12 Along both banks of the river, fruit trees of all kinds will grow. Their leaves will not wither, and their fruit will not fail. Each month they will bear fruit, because the water from the sanctuary flows to them. Their fruit will be used for food and their leaves for healing.

2.) Both the New Jerusalem and the City in Ezekiel have 12 gates with 12 tribes of Israel inscribed on them
Revelation 21:12 The city had a great and high wall with twelve gates inscribed with the names of the twelve tribes of Israel

Ezekiel 38:30-34 Beginning on the north side, which measures 4,500 cubits long, the gates of the city will be named after the tribes of Israel. On the north side there will be three gates: the gate of Reuben, the gate of Judah, and the gate of Levi. On the east side, which will be 4,500 cubits long, there will be three gates: the gate of Joseph, the gate of Benjamin, and the gate of Dan. On the south side, which will be 4,500 cubits long, there will be three gates: the gate of Simeon, the gate of Issachar, and the gate of Zebulun. And on the west side, which will be 4,500 cubits long, there will be three gates: the gate of Gad, the gate of Asher, and the gate of Naphtali.


3.) Both the New Jerusalem and the Ezekiel temple are where God dwells.
Revelation 21:3 And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying: “Behold, the dwelling place of God is with man, and He will live with them.

Ezekiel 43:7 7and He said to me, “Son of man, this is the place of My throne and the place for the soles of My feet, where I will dwell among the Israelites forever

**Now we can use scripture to show that the New Jerusalem is the body of Christ.

1.) Both the New Jerusalem and the body of Christ are where God dwells
revelation 21:3 And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying: “Behold, the dwelling place of God is with man, and He will live with them.

Ephesians 2:22 And in Him you too are being built together into a dwelling place for God in His Spirit.
2 Corinthians 6:16 What agreement can exist between the temple of God and idols? For we are the temple of the living God. As God has said: “I will live with them and walk among them, and I will be their God, and they will be My people.”

2.) Both the New Jerusalem and the body of Christ are the bride/wife of Christ.
revelation 21:9 Then one of the seven angels with the seven bowls full of the seven last plagues came and said to me, “Come, I will show you the bride, the wife of the Lamb.”

Ephesians 5:31-32 For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh.”b This mystery is profound, but I am speaking about Christ and the church

3.) Both the New Jerusalem and the body of Christ are built on the foundation of the apostles
Revelation 21:14 The wall of the city had twelve foundations bearing the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.

Ephesians 2:20 on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus Himself as the cornerstone

*** In summary, Therefore, if The Ezekiel temple/city = the New Jerusalem, and The body of Christ = the New Jerusalem, then the Ezekiel temple/city = the body of Christ.


** My interpretation as a preterist.

The place of God's throne is heaven and where he rests his feet is earth. Thus I believe, because of the resurrection, through Jesus Christ, that God forever dwells with us (the body of Christ; his temple) whether we are on earth in the flesh (his footstool) or in heaven in the resurrected body (his throne)

Ezekiel 43:7 and He said to me, “Son of man, this is the place of My throne and the place for the soles of My feet, where I will dwell among the Israelites forever

Acts 7:49
Heaven is My throne and the earth is My footstool. What kind of house will you build for Me, says the Lord,

claninja said:

*** In summary, Therefore, if The Ezekiel temple/city = the New Jerusalem, and The body of Christ = the New Jerusalem, then the Ezekiel temple/city = the body of Christ.

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As a preterist that is the best you can come up with.
However, it just doesn't tell the full story, as the Ezekiel prophecy about the new Temple is plainly a physical building, that people will go to; to worship God.
It is correct that we Christians are at present, the body of Christ and symbolic of the Temple. But that does not preclude a new Temple in the future and scriptures like Revelation 11:1, 2 Thess 2:4, Isaiah 56:6-7, Zechariah 14:20-21, + make it clear there must be one.

Also, you are stuck on Israel being those people who call themselves the State of Israel; the Jews.
That this is wrong, can be easily seen by their beliefs and behavior. We Christians are the Israel of God, the Overcomers for Him and the Victorious ones, as seen in each of the 7 Church's of Revelation 2 & 3.

keras said:

As a preterist that is the best you can come up with.

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Thank you

keras said:

However, it just doesn't tell the full story,

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My point wasn't to address the full story of God's work.

keras said:

as the Ezekiel prophecy about the new Temple is plainly a physical building, that people will go to; to worship God.

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All we have to do is compare scripture with scripture to show that your interpretation is wrong. see post #484.

Revelation reveals that the new Jerusalem is the Ezekiel temple/city where God dwells with his people. Both the Ezekiel temple/city and the new Jerusalem 1.) are where God dwells, 2.) have a river flowing from the temple 3.) have fruit on either side of the river that grows each month for healing and 4.) 12 gates with 12 names of the 12 tribes of Israel.

Thus the true spiritual reality (antitype) of the Ezekiel temple/city is revealed.

The type (physical temple building) with all of its ordinances will never be built and used to worship the one true God in the future because the Old covenant is over and because national Israel could never put away their sin under the old covenant. There are no rules for temple building worship and literal sacrifices and washings under the new covenant.

It appears you believe the old covenant will be reinstated if you believe there will be a future temple building with sacrifices and washings and regulations.

your going to have to address specific points I made and scripture used instead of making a generic statement.

keras said:

and scriptures like Revelation 11:1, 2 Thess 2:4, Isaiah 56:6-7, Zechariah 14:20-21, + make it clear there must be one.

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I disagree with your interpretations. I will go into detail of why I disagree after you address which specific points and scriptures used in post #483 and #484 you disagree with.

keras said:

Also, you are stuck on Israel being those people who call themselves the State of Israel; the Jews.
That this is wrong, can be easily seen by their beliefs and behavior.

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I believe in a 1 peoples of God: those of faith and obedience. No where did I mention that the modern state of Israel is true Israel. Not sure where you are getting this from.

keras said:

We Christians are the Israel of God, the Overcomers for Him and the Victorious ones, as seen in each of the 7 Church's of Revelation 2 & 3.

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I agree.

claninja said:

The type (physical temple building) with all of its ordinances will never be built and used to worship the one true God in the future because the Old covenant is over and because national Israel could never put away their sin under the old covenant. There are no rules for temple building worship and literal sacrifices and washings under the new covenant.

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These details are well covered in Ezekiel 40-48
Paul tells us that what happened to ancient Israel was symbolic and were recorded for our information, now in the end times. 1 Corinthians 10:11
Remember: God does not change; He wanted a Temple twice before and the prophesies are clear - there will be another, soon and for all of the Millennium.
Revelation 21:22 says that in Eternity, there will not be a Temple after the Millennium, so in saying that, it shows there WAS a Temple before then.

Vehement denial of Bible truths, as you do, is not a good look. If you disagree with what is Written, for whatever reason, then opinion, speculation, and guesswork, just don't cut it.

keras said:

God does not change; He wanted a Temple twice before and the prophesies are clear

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Did God want the temples - or did men believe that God needed one? God seems to have preferred moving about with His people. ISTM it was what humanity was used to - and God obliged.

claninja said:

The type (physical temple building) with all of its ordinances will never be built and used to worship the one true God in the future because the Old covenant is over and because national Israel could never put away their sin under the old covenant. There are no rules for temple building worship and literal sacrifices and washings under the new covenant.

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QFE. This is an important point (and I wanted to make sure it wasn't missed).

keras said:

These details are well covered in Ezekiel 40-48

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And several details of Ezekiel 40-48 match with the New Jerusalem of revelation. This would be called using scripture to interpret scripture.

Revelation reveals that the new Jerusalem is the Ezekiel temple/city where God dwells with his people. Both the Ezekiel temple/city and the new Jerusalem 1.) are where God dwells, 2.) have a river flowing from the temple 3.) have fruit on either side of the river that grows each month for healing and 4.) 12 gates with 12 names of the 12 tribes of Israel.

keras said:

Paul tells us that what happened to ancient Israel was symbolic and were recorded for our information, now in the end times. 1 Corinthians 10:11

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I agree. Paul also says the natural man does not accept the spiritually discerned things.

1 Corinthians 2:14 The natural man does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God. For they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned.

When the natural man reads the old covenant, a veil remains over his mind, not being able to understand the spiritual truth that points to Christ.

2 Corinthians 3:14 But their minds were closed. For to this day the same veil remains at the reading of the old covenant

The natural man in Paul's time rejected Jesus and the kingdom He preached because they could not understand the spiritual truths of the OT scripture.

Matthew 13:11,13 He replied, “The knowledge of the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven has been given to you, but not to them. This is why I speak to them in parables: ‘Though seeing, they do not see; though hearing, they do not hear or understand.’

Notice, Nicodemus, a Pharisee, a leader of the Jews, could not understand Jesus.
John 3:3-4 Jesus replied, “Truly, truly, I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again.”a “How can a man be born when he is old?” Nicodemus asked. “Can he enter his mother’s womb a second time to be born?”

Jesus using the type (birth) to display the greater spiritual truth of being spiritually raised from being dead in sin (antitype)

God speaking through Ezekiel using the type (literal temple building) to display the greater spiritual truth of the body of Christ (antitype)

keras said:

Remember: God does not change;

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I agree

keras said:

He wanted a Temple twice before

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What was the purpose of the temple?

keras said:

and the prophesies are clear -

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If we read the scriptures as nicodemus did then we won't see the spiritual truth.

keras said:

Vehement denial of Bible truths, as you do, is not a good look.

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Let's stick to objective statements, as I could say the same about you. Our difference is in our interpretations.

keras said:

If you disagree with what is Written, for whatever reason, then opinion, speculation, and guesswork, just don't cut it.

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nothing I said was speculation. I used scripture with each point. So let's test your interpretation Keras.

You said there is a temple during the millennium, but not after the millennium:

keras said:

Revelation 21:22 says that in Eternity, there will not be a Temple after the Millennium, so in saying that, it shows there WAS a Temple before then.

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However, your statement contradicts Ezekiel 43. For God says that this temple (Ezekiel temple) is where His feet rest and his throne is and it is where he dwells Israel FOREVER.

How can this earthly temple building, no longer exist AFTER the millennium if GOD says it's where he dwells with Israel forever?

Ezekiel 43:6-7 While the man was standing beside me, I heard someone speaking to me from inside the temple. and He said to me, “Son of man, this is the place of My throne and the place for the soles of My feet, where I will dwell among the Israelites forever. The house of Israel will never again defile My holy name—neither they nor their kings—by their prostitution and by the funeral offeringsb for their kings at their deaths.

claninja said:

How can this earthly temple building, no longer exist AFTER the millennium if GOD says it's where he dwells with Israel forever?

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God will dwell with mankind after the Millennium, for Eternity; in the New Jerusalem. Revelation 21:1-7

Will there be sacrifices in the new Temple?
When the Lord’s righteous people, all born again Christians, go to live in all of the Holy Land, soon after it is cleared and cleansed by the Lord’s Day of wrath against the nations, Ezekiel 34:11-31, they will build a new Temple in Jerusalem. Many Old Testament prophesies attest to this, how it will be built by men from far away, Zechariah 6:15, and it will be greater than the former ones. Haggai 2:9

The New Testament too, makes it clear there will be a Temple, 2 Thess. 2:4, Rev. 11:1-2, that will exist until the end of the Millennium, when God Himself will be the Temple. Revelation 21:22

We are told that during this age of Church dispensation, Christ is our high priest and we are the spiritual Temple, 2 Cor. 6:16 and no sacrifices are required. Hosea 9:4

Hebrews 9 & 10:1-21 is the scriptures that clearly tell us that Jesus made the once and forever sacrifice for the expiation of our sins. Now there is no Temple and Christians are His ‘body’ on earth. This is just for the time from the early church until the new Temple is built, when there will again be offerings and thanksgiving gifts made by the Lord’s holy people. Daniel 12:1, Isaiah 56:6-7, Revelation 7:9-14

Daniel 7:25 and Daniel 9:26-27 tells us how, in the last days, an invading leader will make a peace treaty with the holy people, but will break it and put a stop to the sacrifices and offerings. Obviously there will be sacrifices and offerings taking place, for him to stop them.

This is confirmed by the prophesies detailing how it will be during the period the righteous people of God will be living the Land before the Return of Jesus:

Psalm 51:18-19 Now Lord, show Your favour to Zion and rebuild Jerusalem. Then You will delight in the appointed sacrifices, young bulls will be offered in Your altar.

Jeremiah 17:24-26 Now, if you obey the Lord’s Commandments, then a ruler will again occupy David’s throne and Jerusalem will be inhabited forever. Then people will come bringing whole offerings, sacrifices as thank offerings to the Lord’s House.

Jeremiah 33:14-18 The days are coming when I shall bless Judah and Israel…….there will always be a Levitical Priest to burn the grain and other offerings every day.

Ezekiel 45:13-25 The details of and the dates for making all the sacrifices and offerings on the Altar of the Temple.

Zechariah 14:21…all who come to make sacrifice will use the holy pots in Jerusalem to boil the flesh of the sacrifice……

Isaiah 60:6-7 Livestock in droves will be in the Land to serve your needs, as acceptable offerings on My Altar and I will adorn My glorious Temple.

The context of these scriptures proves that all this will be for the last days’ period before the Return of Jesus. What will happen during the Millennium isn’t told to us, although there will be priest’s then. Revelation 20:6 But we know there will be no Temple in Eternity. Revelation 21:22

claninja said:

Part 1

Ezekiel was commanded to describe this new temple to the people of Israel, so that they would be ashamed of their sin. And IF they were ashamed, then the design would be made known to them, so that they may perform it.

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Hi Claninja,

So are you telling me that God set Israel up to fail? God is omniscient, as we both know and He knew that Israel would NEVER be able to obey Him, (just as we couldn`t also with out the Lord)?

And are you also saying God got Ezekiel to write those 9 chapters with such detail, knowing that Israel would not be able to fulfil it?

Sounds like a set up to me, and God does not do that. We, believers in the Body of Christ would not be able to obey the Lord without His Holy Spirit. Israel also was not able to obey God, but will when He gives them His Holy Spirit.

The `if` is to show that God gives them the opportunity, (yet knowing they wouldn`t be able to). It all reveals that ONLY through the Lord Jesus will ALL of the purposes of God be accomplished.

By you saying that Israel didn`t build that temple, just shows that you think man has the ability to obey God, (without the Holy Spirit).

Marilyn.

keras said:

God will dwell with mankind after the Millennium, for Eternity; in the New Jerusalem. Revelation 21:1-7

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Correct, in the new Jerusalem, God will Dwell with us forever. But this doesn't address the contradiction you are creating. You appear to believe the Ezekiel temple is different than the new Jerusalem. And because of that belief you are creating a contradiction. For God stated THIS (the Ezekiel temple) is where I will dwell with Israel FOREVER.

***So I'll ask again, if there is no Ezekiel temple AFTER the millennium how an God dwell in the Ezekiel temple with Israel Forever?

Ezekiel 43:6-7 While the man was standing beside me, I heard someone speaking to me from inside the temple, and He said to me, “Son of man, this is the place of My throne and the place for the soles of My feet, where I will dwell among the Israelites forever.

I'll give you a hint on how you can reconcile the contradiction: use scripture to interpret scripture:
Revelation reveals that the new Jerusalem is the Ezekiel temple/city where God dwells with his people. Both the Ezekiel temple/city and the new Jerusalem 1.) are where God dwells, 2.) have a river flowing from the temple 3.) have fruit on either side of the river that grows each month for healing and 4.) 12 gates with 12 names of the 12 tribes of Israel.

keras said:

When the Lord’s righteous people, all born again Christians, go to live in all of the Holy Land, soon after it is cleared and cleansed by the Lord’s Day of wrath against the nations, Ezekiel 34:11-31,

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Jesus is the shepherd
John 10:14-16 I am the good shepherd. I know My sheep and My sheep know Me, just as the Father knows Me and I know the Father. And I lay down My life for the sheep. I have other sheep that are not of this fold. I must bring them in as well, and they will listen to My voice. Then there will be one flock and one shepherd.

Jesus is one who searches out for his lost flock
Matthew 15:24 He answered, “I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.”
Luke 15:3-4 Then Jesus told them this parable: “What man among you, if he has a hundred sheep and loses one of them, does not leave the ninety-nine in the pasture and go after the one that is lost, until he finds it?

Ezekiel 34:11-12 For this is what the Lord GOD says: ‘Behold, I Myself will search for My flock and seek them out. As a shepherd looks for his scattered sheep when he is among the flock, so I will look for My flock.

keras said:

Old Testament prophesies attest to this, how it will be built by men from far away, Zechariah 6:15,

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It is Jesus who builds the temple

Zechariah 6:12-13 And say to him, ‘Thus says the Lord of hosts, “Behold, the man whose name is the Branch: for he shall branch out from his place, and he shall build the temple of the Lord. It is he who shall build the temple of the Lord and shall bear royal honor, and shall sit and rule on his throne. And there shall be a priest on his throne, and the counsel of peace shall be between them both.”

John 2:19 Jesus answered them, “Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.”

It is Jesus who was resurrected to fulfill the oath made to David.

Acts 2:30-31 Being therefore a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him that he would set one of his descendants on his throne, he foresaw and spoke about the resurrection of the Christ,

It is Jesus who is king, otherwise he could not have fulfilled this verse:
John 12:13 They took palm branches and went out to meet Him, shouting: “Hosanna!”
“Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord!” “Blessed is the King of Israel!”

It is Jesus who the first century church stated was king
Acts 17:7 and Jason has welcomed them into his home. They are all defying Caesar’s decrees, saying there is another king, named Jesus!”

It is Jesus who is the ruler of the kings of the earth
Revelation 1:5 and from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler of the kings of the earth.

It is Jesus who is the high priest that intercedes for us.
Hebrews 7:21,26 but Jesus became a priest with an oath by the One who said to Him: Such a high priest truly befits us—One who is holy, innocent, undefiled, set apart from sinners, and exalted above the heavens.

Thus it is Jesus who has already fulfilled and is now presently both our king and high priest. He is the priest that sits on the throne.
Zechariah 6:12-13 And say to him, ‘Thus says the Lord of hosts, “Behold, the man whose name is the Branch: for he shall branch out from his place, and he shall build the temple of the Lord. It is he who shall build the temple of the Lord and shall bear royal honor, and shall sit and rule on his throne. And there shall be a priest on his throne, and the counsel of peace shall be between them both.”

It is the body of Christ that consists of those "far away" that build the temple of the Lord
Zechariah 6:15 Even those far away will come and build the temple of the LORD, and you will know that the LORD of Hosts has sent Me to you.

Ephesians 2:19-22 Therefore you are no longer strangers and foreigners, but fellow citizens of the saints and members of God’s household, built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus Himself as the cornerstone. In Him the whole building is fitted together and grows into a holy temple in the Lord. And in Him you too are being built together into a dwelling place for God in His Spirit.

keras said:

and it will be greater than the former ones. Haggai 2:9

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The glory of the temple was greater because Jesus, God in the flesh, was in the temple:
Matthew 12:6 But I tell you that something greater than the temple is here.

keras said:

The New Testament too, makes it clear there will be a Temple, 2 Thess. 2:4, Rev. 11:1-2, that will exist until the end of the Millennium, when God Himself will be the Temple. Revelation 21:22

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Context Keras. There was a temple building standing in the 1st century.

keras said:

We are told that during this age of Church dispensation, Christ is our high priest and we are the spiritual Temple, 2 Cor. 6:16 and no sacrifices are required.

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Why are sacrifices taken away? Because Jesus fulfilled them

Hebrews 10:8-10 When he said above, “You have neither desired nor taken pleasure in sacrifices and offerings and burnt offerings and sin offerings” (these are offered according to the law), 9then he added, “Behold, I have come to do your will.” He does away with the first in order to establish the second. And by that will we have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

If sin offerings are reinstated, there is no longer forgiveness of sins.
Hebrews 10:18 Where there is forgiveness of these, there is no longer any offering for sin.

keras said:

This is just for the time from the early church until the new Temple is built, when there will again be offerings and thanksgiving gifts made by the Lord’s holy people.

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I disagree on your interpretation, which seems to veiled. Christ fulfilled the sacrifices, regulations, and ordinances of the old covenant.

keras said:

Psalm 51:18-19 Now Lord, show Your favour to Zion and rebuild Jerusalem. Then You will delight in the appointed sacrifices, young bulls will be offered in Your altar.

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Keras context is very important. Psalm 51 is believed to have been written around the time David sinned with Bathsheba (2 Samuel 11-12)

psalm 51:1-2 To the choirmaster. A Psalm of David, when Nathan the prophet went to him, after he had gone in to Bathsheba. Have mercy on me,a O God, ccording to your steadfast love;
according to your abundant mercy blot out my transgressions. Wash me thoroughly from my iniquity,
and cleanse me from my sin!

At the end of the psalm David wants build the walls of Jerusalem and offer sacrifices

Psalm 51:18-19 Do good to Zion in your good pleasure; build up the walls of Jerusalem; then will you delight in right sacrifices,in burnt offerings and whole burnt offerings;then bulls will be offered on your altar.

This is because of the war with the ammonites

2 Samuel 12:31 And he brought out the people who were in it and set them to labor with saws and iron picks and iron axes and made them toil ate the brick kilns. And thus he did to all the cities of the Ammonites. Then David and all the people returned to Jerusalem.

keras said:

Jeremiah 17:24-26 Now, if you obey the Lord’s Commandments, then a ruler will again occupy David’s throne and Jerusalem will be inhabited forever. Then people will come bringing whole offerings, sacrifices as thank offerings to the Lord’s House.

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Context: Old covenant.
IF clause present.

If they obey the Lord's commands princes and kings will occupy david's throne. Did Israel fully obey God under the Old covenant?

keras said:

Jeremiah 33:14-18 The days are coming when I shall bless Judah and Israel…….there will always be a Levitical Priest to burn the grain and other offerings every day.

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Jesus fulfilled this.

keras said:

Ezekiel 45:13-25 The details of and the dates for making all the sacrifices and offerings on the Altar of the Temple.

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Context: old covenant
IF clause present

If they were ashamed of their sins they would carry out the plans of the physical Ezekiel temple under the old covenant. A physical Ezekiel temple building was never built. The old covenant ended. Thus the Ezekiel temple fulfilled in the promise of the new covenant is the body of Christ.

keras said:

Zechariah 14:21…all who come to make sacrifice will use the holy pots in Jerusalem to boil the flesh of the sacrifice……

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The old covenant no longer exists.

Under the new covenant, sacrifices have been fulfilled in Christ. Look to the spiritual meaning of sacrifices.

keras said:

The context of these scriptures proves that all this will be for the last days’

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The last days occurred during the disciples generation

Acts 2:16-17 But this is what was uttered through the prophet Joel:“‘And in the last days it shall be, God declares,

1 Corinthians 10:11 these things happened to them as an example, but they were written down for our instruction, on whom the end of the ages has come.

1 Peter 4:7 The end of all things is at hand

Hebrews 9:26 But now He has appeared once for all at the end of the ages to do away with sin by the sacrifice of Himself.

1 John 2:18 Children, it is the last hour; and just as you have heard that the antichrist is coming, so now many antichrists have appeared. This is how we know it is the last hour.

Marilyn C said:

So are you telling me that God set Israel up to fail?

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Nope, never said that. I believe God set up Israel to succeed through Christ.

Romans 9:6 It is not as though God’s word has failed. For not all who are descended from Israel are Israel.

Marilyn C said:

God is omniscient, as we both know and He knew that Israel would NEVER be able to obey Him, (just as we couldn`t also with out the Lord)?

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I agree, without Christ, Israel could never have been atoned for or brought back to God.

Marilyn C said:

And are you also saying God got Ezekiel to write those 9 chapters with such detail, knowing that Israel would not be able to fulfil it?

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I'm saying all those chapters pointed to Christ and his Body. Just as all the chapters of the old covenant point to Christ and his body.

Marilyn C said:

Sounds like a set up to me, and God does not do that. We, believers in the Body of Christ would not be able to obey the Lord without His Holy Spirit. Israel also was not able to obey God, but will when He gives them His Holy Spirit.

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God ordains everything for his glory.

Romans 9:19-21 One of you will say to me, “Then why does God still find fault? For who can resist His will?”But who are you, O man, to talk back to God? Shall what is formed say to Him who formed it, “Why have you made me like this?”g Does not the potter have the right to make from the same lump of clay one vessel for special occasions and another for common use?

Marilyn C said:

The `if` is to show that God gives them the opportunity, (yet knowing they wouldn`t be able to). It all reveals that ONLY through the Lord Jesus will ALL of the purposes of God be accomplished.

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I agree, the If does give them the opportunity, just as the "if you obey" the old covenant gave them the opportunity to forever live in the promise land being blessed.

Did national Israel fully come to God with forgiven sins under the old covenant?

Marilyn C said:

By you saying that Israel didn`t build that temple, just shows that you think man has the ability to obey God, (without the Holy Spirit).

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That logical conclusion makes no sense.

God gave Israel the old covenant and if they didn't obey, they would be destroyed and scattered. Israel was scattered by Assyria, Judah was scattered by Babylon. Did God set Israel up, considering he knew the outcome?

God put the tree of knowledge of good and evil and told adam and even "if" they ate from the tree they would die. Did God set up Adam and eve, considering he knew the outcome?

You can use this same logic with the Ezekiel temple. If, under the old covenant, Israel was ashamed of their sins, they were to carry out the plans of the Ezekiel temple. Israel never built the Ezekiel temple under the old covenant because the old covenant could not take away their iniquity, just as Israel could never fully obey the old covenant and was scattered by Assyria and Babylon.

The only way Israel could truly repent of their sins was through Christ. And Christ made the old covenant obsolete through his death, resurrection, and ascension. A temple building is not part of the new covenant, thus the promise of the Ezekiel temple is fulfilled in the body of Christ, which paul calls the true temple repeatedly.

We can confirm this interpretation using scripture to interpret scripture. For revelation reveals the new Jerusalem is the Ezekiel temple/city

Revelation reveals that the new Jerusalem is the Ezekiel temple/city where God dwells with his people. Both the Ezekiel temple/city and the new Jerusalem 1.) are where God dwells, 2.) have a river flowing from the temple 3.) have fruit on either side of the river that grows each month for healing and 4.) 12 gates with 12 names of the 12 tribes of Israel.

claninja said:

It is Jesus who builds the temple

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I notice how you conveniently omit verse 15; that says: Men for far away will come and build the Temple.
Saying that Jesus builds it, is the same as saying that Nero built the Colosseum, or the White House was built by George Washington.

Claninja, it seems that no amount of Bible truths will convince you that God has a future for us today.
But let me assure other viewers of this thread, that we do have a future, God does have a Plan for the end times that will see the ungodly peoples gone and all of His faithful, born again Christian people Blessed and prosperous in His holy Land. Ezekiel 34:11-16, Isaiah 35:1-10, Romans 9:24-26, Revelation 7:1-14, +

claninja said:

.....

We can confirm this interpretation using scripture to interpret scripture. For revelation reveals the new Jerusalem is the Ezekiel temple/city

Revelation reveals that the new Jerusalem is the Ezekiel temple/city where God dwells with his people. Both the Ezekiel temple/city and the new Jerusalem 1.) are where God dwells, 2.) have a river flowing from the temple 3.) have fruit on either side of the river that grows each month for healing and 4.) 12 gates with 12 names of the 12 tribes of Israel.

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Hi claninja,

I can see your reasoning, not that I agree. There is so much detail in Ezekiel`s temple that belongs to the earth - the memorial sacrifices, the prince, (David) giving some of his inheritance to his sons, teaching the people the difference between holy and unholy, and the priests not to eat anything torn by wild animals, etc etc.

As to the temple in the New Jerusalem, there is not one, for the Lord, by His Holy Spirit is there for people to worship Him. (Rev. 21: 22)

And who are those kings and the nations on the earth at the time of the New Jerusalem?

Marilyn.

keras said:

I notice how you conveniently omit verse 15; that says: Men for far away will come and build the Temple.

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Incorrect, I did include verse 15. Did you actually read my post?

keras said:

Claninja, it seems that no amount of Bible truths will convince you that God has a future for us today.

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You believe the body of Christ goes to live in the earthly land of Israel. I believe the body of Christ goes to heaven at the resurrection.

So it would be false to say that I need to be convinced that God does have a future for us. We both believe God has a future for us, we just disagree on what that is.

keras said:

But let me assure other viewers of this thread, that we do have a future,

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Not sure why you need to reassure the viewers of that since we both believe God has a future for us. That's not were discussing. So let's get back to the question you seem keep avoiding or unable to answer, in order to reassure the viewers that your interpretation is incorrect.

You appear to believe the Ezekiel temple is different than the new Jerusalem. And because of that belief you are creating a contradiction. For God stated THIS (the Ezekiel temple) is where I will dwell with Israel FOREVER.

***So I'll ask again, if there is no Ezekiel temple AFTER the millennium how an God dwell in the Ezekiel temple with Israel Forever?

Ezekiel 43:6-7 While the man was standing beside me, I heard someone speaking to me from inside the temple, and He said to me, “Son of man, this is the place of My throne and the place for the soles of My feet, where I will dwell among the Israelites forever.

keras said:

God's Plan from the beginning is to have a people in His holy Land

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God's plan from the beginning was for His Son (Ben) to be given as a grain sacrifice so that Heaven and Earth could become one. We are told from the beginning the Father and the Son are One. Deu6:4
The LORD our God, the LORD is One.

claninja said:

Incorrect, I did include verse 15. Did you actually read my post?

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Yes, but you make out those people who come from far away, to be the spiritual Temple.
This is right for the present time, but not for what will happen soon. There HAS to be a Temple for the Anti-Christ to sit in. 2 Thessalonians 2:4

claninja said:

You appear to believe the Ezekiel temple is different than the new Jerusalem. And because of that belief you are creating a contradiction. For God stated THIS (the Ezekiel temple) is where I will dwell with Israel FOREVER.

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It will be forever, after the end of the Millennium. This does not preclude a short time; 1260 days, when God will leave it and the Anti-Christ will have control. As we are clearly told by Daniel 9:27, by Paul and other prophesies.
The New Jerusalem won't have a Temple, however it will have a place for the Throne of God and the Lamb. Revelation 22:1