Is it wrong that I keep Shabbat and do not "go to church" on Sunday?

Saint Steven · Feb 24, 2019

ace of hearts said:
Yes the whole book is about the law.

Yes, but the book of Galatians is not speaking to Jews.

Galatians 2:12
For before certain men came from James, he used to eat with the Gentiles. But when they arrived, he began to draw back and separate himself from the Gentiles because he was afraid of those who belonged to the circumcision group.

Titus 1:10
For there are many rebellious people, full of meaningless talk and deception, especially those of the circumcision group.

Galatians 2:4-5
This matter arose because some false believers had infiltrated our ranks to spy on the freedom we have in Christ Jesus and to make us slaves. 5 We did not give in to them for a moment, so that the truth of the gospel might be preserved for you.

Tone · Feb 24, 2019

Saint Steven said:
What do you make of this? (the words of the Apostle Peter)

Acts 15:10-11
Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of Gentiles a yoke that neither we nor our ancestors have been able to bear? 11 No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are.”

“It is my judgment, therefore, that we should not make it difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to God.20 Instead we should write to them, telling them to abstain from food polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from the meat of strangled animals and from blood. For the law of Moses has been preached in every city from the earliest times and is read in the synagogues on every Sabbath.”
Acts 15:19-21

Sounds reasonable. They were attending the synagogue where they were hearing Moses preached, so it was enough for them as they were just coming to Messiah. Some people were pushing Judaism, with all it's rabbinical traditions, on them. That short list that was compiled seems like it would be very burdensome for most Christians today...no more rare steaks for one.

Tone · Feb 24, 2019

Saint Steven said:
This is where definitions become critical.

Look how the term "God’s law" is used in these scriptures below.
The Apostle Paul differentiates between "the law" and "God’s law".
Not the same thing. Especially in the 1Cor. reference below.
And in the Rom. references we see the same Apostle that bashes "the law" speak positively of "God’s law". Especially in Rom,7:22.

Romans 8:7
The mind governed by the flesh is hostile to God; it does not submit to God’s law, nor can it do so.

Romans 7:22
For in my inner being I delight in God’s law;

1 Corinthians 9:20-22
To the Jews I became like a Jew, to win the Jews. To those under the law I became like one under the law (though I myself am not under the law), so as to win those under the law. 21 To those not having the law I became like one not having the law (though I am not free from God’s law but am under Christ’s law), so as to win those not having the law. 22 To the weak I became weak, to win the weak. I have become all things to all people so that by all possible means I might save some.

Matthew 4:1-11
I understand the distinction to be between the law of sin and death and Torah.

In the beginning, when Adam and Eve partook of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, the law of sin and death reared its ugly head. This is that beast, which our Messiah defeated...by beheading it with the Word of His Mouth (Torah).

Then Yahshua was led by the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted

Remember, "Again it is written"?

Tone · Feb 24, 2019

Romans 8:3
"For because The Written Law was weak through the sickliness of the flesh, God sent his Son in the form of sinful flesh, because of sin, to condemn sin in his flesh"

It was weak because of the flesh, but it is now strong through His Spirit within us.

Romans 3:31
"Do we then overthrow the law by this faith? By no means! On the contrary, we uphold the law."

Tone · Feb 24, 2019

ace of hearts said:
No sir.

Genesis 2:2–2:3
2"And on the seventh day Elohim finished the work that he had done, and he rested on the seventh day from all the work that he had done. 3So Elohim blessed the seventh day and hallowed it, because on it Elohim rested from all the work that he had done in creation."

Oh, I see, you're saying the seventh day is not the Sabbath?

Tone · Feb 24, 2019

Exodus 20:11

"For in six days Yahuah made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day. Therefore Yahuah blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy."

The Sabbath points directly back to the true Creator...remember?

Saint Steven · Feb 25, 2019

Tone said:
Sounds reasonable. They were attending the synagogue where they were hearing Moses preached

Gentiles were not allowed in the synagogues unless they had converted to Judaism. It was not a place for believers in Jesus. (Jn.9:22,12:42,16:2) And Jews weren't even permitted to associate with gentiles. Peter said this when he entered the house of Cornelius.

Acts 10:27-28
While talking with him, Peter went inside and found a large gathering of people. 28 He said to them: “You are well aware that it is against our law for a Jew to associate with or visit a Gentile. But God has shown me that I should not call anyone impure or unclean.

Saint Steven · Feb 25, 2019

Tone said:
Matthew 4:1-11
I understand the distinction to be between the law of sin and death and Torah.

In the beginning, when Adam and Eve partook of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, the law of sin and death reared its ugly head. This is that beast, which our Messiah defeated...by beheading it with the Word of His Mouth (Torah).

Then Yahshua was led by the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted

Remember, "Again it is written"?

The Apostle Paul differentiates between "the law" and "God’s law". Not the same thing.

Three laws listed here, all different.
1) the law (which Paul was not under)
2) God’s law (which Paul was "not free from")
3) Christ’s law (which Paul was under)

1 Corinthians 9:20-22
To the Jews I became like a Jew, to win the Jews. To those under the law I became like one under the law (though I myself am not under the law), so as to win those under the law. 21 To those not having the law I became like one not having the law (though I am not free from God’s law but am under Christ’s law), so as to win those not having the law. 22 To the weak I became weak, to win the weak. I have become all things to all people so that by all possible means I might save some.

Tone · Feb 25, 2019

Saint Steven said:
Gentiles were not allowed in the synagogues unless they had converted to Judaism. It was not a place for believers in Jesus. (Jn.9:22,12:42,16:2) And Jews weren't even permitted to associate with gentiles. Peter said this when he entered the house of Cornelius.

Acts 10:27-28
While talking with him, Peter went inside and found a large gathering of people. 28 He said to them: “You are well aware that it is against our law for a Jew to associate with or visit a Gentile. But God has shown me that I should not call anyone impure or unclean.

Ephesians 2:14
"For he is our peace who made the two one, and he destroyed the wall that was standing in the middle."

Yeah, the Good News is, in Messiah, that division is gone, which is why we get to walk as He walked!

Yeshua HaDerekh · Feb 25, 2019

Saint Steven said:
Gentiles were not allowed in the synagogues unless they had converted to Judaism. It was not a place for believers in Jesus. (Jn.9:22,12:42,16:2) And Jews weren't even permitted to associate with gentiles. Peter said this when he entered the house of Cornelius.

Acts 10:27-28
While talking with him, Peter went inside and found a large gathering of people. 28 He said to them: “You are well aware that it is against our law for a Jew to associate with or visit a Gentile. But God has shown me that I should not call anyone impure or unclean.

That is not quite true. For gentiles yes. However, early, early Christians would have been in the synagogues if they were "Ger Toshav", not quite full converts to Judaism but following the Laws given by James (Noahide laws). While there, they would have heard Torah every Shabbat.

Saint Steven · Feb 25, 2019

Tone said:
Yeah, the Good News is, in Messiah, that division is gone, which is why we get to walk as He walked!

Yes. Please do.

John 14:12
Very truly I tell you, whoever believes in me will do the works I have been doing, and they will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father.

Matthew 10:8
Heal the sick, raise the dead, cleanse those who have leprosy, drive out demons. Freely you have received; freely give.

Tone · Feb 25, 2019

Saint Steven said:
The Apostle Paul differentiates between "the law" and "God’s law". Not the same thing.

Three laws listed here, all different.
1) the law (which Paul was not under)
2) God’s law (which Paul was "not free from")
3) Christ’s law (which Paul was under)

1 Corinthians 9:20-22
To the Jews I became like a Jew, to win the Jews. To those under the law I became like one under the law (though I myself am not under the law), so as to win those under the law. 21 To those not having the law I became like one not having the law (though I am not free from God’s law but am under Christ’s law), so as to win those not having the law. 22 To the weak I became weak, to win the weak. I have become all things to all people so that by all possible means I might save some.

Romans 6:16
"Don't you know that when you offer yourselves to someone as obedient slaves, you are slaves of the one you obey--whether you are slaves to sin, which leads to death, or to obedience, which leads to righteousness?"

To be under the law, simply means you are disobedient.

When you are walking in obedience you are, essentially above the law.

In Messiah, we are obedient to the Law, though, as you pointed out, we are still battling with the flesh.

But, that is why we must continually repent for being disobedient (under the law) and strive to follow our Master.

This we do, by the power of His Spirit within us.

Saint Steven · Feb 25, 2019

Yeshua HaDerekh said:
That is not quite true. For gentiles yes. However, early, early Christians would have been in the synagogues if they were "Ger Toshav", not quite full converts to Judaism but following the Laws given by James (Noahide laws). While there, they would have heard Torah every Shabbat.

Anyone who openly acknowledged Christ in a synagogue was risking their life.
Jesus said this to his Jewish followers.

John 16:2
They will put you out of the synagogue; in fact, the time is coming when anyone who kills you will think they are offering a service to God.

Yeshua HaDerekh · Feb 25, 2019

Saint Steven said:
Anyone who openly acknowledged Christ in a synagogue was risking their life.
Jesus said this to his Jewish followers.

John 16:2
They will put you out of the synagogue; in fact, the time is coming when anyone who kills you will think they are offering a service to God.

Understand that. These very early Christians were however even allowed in the Temple.

BobRyan · Feb 25, 2019

Saint Steven said:
Anyone who openly acknowledged Christ in a synagogue was risking their life.
Jesus said this to his Jewish followers.

John 16:2
They will put you out of the synagogue; in fact, the time is coming when anyone who kills you will think they are offering a service to God.

Not true in Acts 13 - "they asked that the Gospel be preached again to them the next Sabbath".

Also in Acts 17 - 3 Sabbaths in a row -- Gospel preaching in the Synagogue. Not just "A believer sitting in the Synagogue" but actual preaching.

And of course in Acts 18:4 "every Sabbath" there was gospel preaching.

Saint Steven · Feb 25, 2019

Tone said:
To be under the law, simply means you are disobedient.

When you are walking in obedience you are, essentially above the law.

If that is what "under" means (I disagree) then why would the Apostle Paul say he is "under" Christ's law?

Furthermore, why would the Apostle say this? (see below) Who would "want" to be under the "condemnation" of the law?

Galatians 4:21
Tell me, you who want to be under the law, are you not aware of what the law says?

Yeshua HaDerekh · Feb 25, 2019

BobRyan said:
Not true in Acts 13 - "they asked that the Gospel be preached again to them the next Sabbath".

Also in Acts 17 - 3 Sabbaths in a row -- Gospel preaching in the Synagogue. Not just "A believer sitting in the Synagogue" but actual preaching.

And of course in Acts 18:4 "every Sabbath" there was gospel preaching.

James was in the Temple and synagogues all the time

Saint Steven · Feb 25, 2019

Yeshua HaDerekh said:
Understand that. These very early Christians were however even allowed in the Temple.

What about this?

Acts 21:27-29
When the seven days were nearly over, some Jews from the province of Asia saw Paul at the temple. They stirred up the whole crowd and seized him, 28 shouting, “Fellow Israelites, help us! This is the man who teaches everyone everywhere against our people and our law and this place. And besides, he has brought Greeks into the temple and defiled this holy place.” 29 (They had previously seen Trophimus the Ephesian in the city with Paul and assumed that Paul had brought him into the temple.)

Saint Steven · Feb 25, 2019

Yeshua HaDerekh said:
James was in the Temple and synagogues all the time

Do you remember why Saul went to Damascus?

ace of hearts · Feb 25, 2019

Tone said:
Romans 8:3
"For because The Written Law was weak through the sickliness of the flesh, God sent his Son in the form of sinful flesh, because of sin, to condemn sin in his flesh"

It was weak because of the flesh, but it is now strong through His Spirit within us.

Romans 3:31
"Do we then overthrow the law by this faith? By no means! On the contrary, we uphold the law."

What does the last phrase of Rom 3:31 mean to you?

Is it wrong that I keep Shabbat and do not "go to church" on Sunday?

You can call me Steve

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"Whenever Thou humblest me, Thou makest me great."

"Whenever Thou humblest me, Thou makest me great."

"Whenever Thou humblest me, Thou makest me great."

You can call me Steve

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"Whenever Thou humblest me, Thou makest me great."

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You can call me Steve

"Whenever Thou humblest me, Thou makest me great."

You can call me Steve

Men dream of truth, find it then cant live with it

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You can call me Steve

Men dream of truth, find it then cant live with it

You can call me Steve

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