Does God grade on a curve?

By what standard will God judge us on Judgement Day?

  • perfect conformity to the 10 commandments

    Votes: 1 4.5%
  • some conformity to the 10 commandments

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • the 10 commandments are irrelevant

    Votes: 5 22.7%
  • other (please explain)

    Votes: 16 72.7%

  • Total voters
    22

JAYPT

Active Member
Nov 30, 2018
281
174
Western
✟19,563.00
Country
Canada
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Widowed
But you are saying that man initiates his own path to salvation through his own choice. What I am asking is that what makes him able to make that choice when in his natural state he is the prisoner of sin and can make no choice except to continue in his sin. He may get religion and become a professing Christian, attend church and do all the other religious stuff, but he remains a religious sinner - unconverted.

Again, I will say again, put it in bold for you, religion doesnt save, Christ does. You do not get saved by empty religion, it is not do-do Christianity. It is believing and trusting in Christ.

Anyways I am not going to debate this with you any longer, you are jumping around saying that "man initiates his own path to salvation" I never said that, I said we have a choice, either Jesus or the world. I really recommend all the warnings in scripture that tell us to turn to God and that is his will. He stands at the door and knocks, not knock it down. Yes we get the Holy Spirit upon salvation and we walk by the Spirit.
 
Upvote 0

Presbyterian Continuist

Senior Veteran
Supporter
Mar 28, 2005
21,810
10,792
76
Christchurch New Zealand
Visit site
✟827,033.00
Country
New Zealand
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Married
Oscarr, I know many individuals that never needed to be "completely broken" or similar to come to Christ. They made a choice at an early age to walk with Him. Saying this is the only way is absolutely false.
The distinction between just having religion and genuine conversion to Christ is so fine that it is almost impossible to tell them apart. "Man looks on the outward appearance, but God looks on the heart". An unconverted religious person may in all respects appear identical to a genuinely converted believer, except for the state of his heart, which only God can see. Just because you know people who have been "walking with" Christ from an early age, does not prove what I'm saying is false, because you can view them only from how they appear to you; but you would have no idea what the state of their heart is, because that is something only God can see.
 
Upvote 0

Presbyterian Continuist

Senior Veteran
Supporter
Mar 28, 2005
21,810
10,792
76
Christchurch New Zealand
Visit site
✟827,033.00
Country
New Zealand
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Married
Again, I will say again, put it in bold for you, religion doesnt save, Christ does. You do not get saved by empty religion, it is not do-do Christianity. It is believing and trusting in Christ.

Anyways I am not going to debate this with you any longer, you are jumping around saying that "man initiates his own path to salvation" I never said that, I said we have a choice, either Jesus or the world. I really recommend all the warnings in scripture that tell us to turn to God and that is his will. He stands at the door and knocks, not knock it down. Yes we get the Holy Spirit upon salvation and we walk by the Spirit.
The one thing you have not been able to grasp, which is at the basis of my questions is: Who is the one who has taken the initiative to enable a person to be saved - God or the sinner?

You seem to be saying that it is the sinner who initiates by making a choice between sin or Christ. I have been trying to get you to consider what has happened to enable the person to make the choice seeing that in his natural state it is impossible for him to have the understanding and ability to make it.

So, something has happened to open the eyes of the blind sinner to give him the understanding of the Gospel to be able to see himself as a worthless sinner before God and to know that there is the narrow gate of Christ. I believe that the Person who initiates that insight is the Holy Spirit. Then the sinner has the understanding and ability to choose to go with the gospel or against it.

This is the basis of Matthew 22:14: "For many are called, but few are chosen", and, Romans 8:30: "And having chosen them, he called them to come to him. And having called them, he gave them right standing with himself. And having given them right standing, he gave them his glory."

It is the Holy Spirit who starts everything off by calling the unconverted sinner, giving them insight into the true meaning of the gospel, his worthless and hopeless state as a sinner. The person then has the choice of resisting the call or accepting the gospel and taking himself to pleading with God to show him how to get saved. The Holy Spirit then shows him the narrow gate of Christ and gives him saving faith to go through it.

But not everyone who is called will accept the gospel. they will choose to reject Christ. This is why Jesus said, "but few are chosen", and, "The way to eternal life is narrow and few there be who find it". The reason is that the majority are rejecting the gospel and Christ and choosing to go their own way. It is only a relative few who become genuinely converted.

This means that out of all the people who attend churches, although they may be very religious in all respects, we may discover one day that it is only a relative few who turn out to be genuinely converted, while the majority may be putting on just an outward show of religion, without any change in their hearts toward Christ.
 
Upvote 0

CaspianSails

Well-Known Member
Jan 30, 2019
579
302
65
Washington DC metro area
✟27,746.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
It is an interesting juxtaposition of the absolute law and the method of judgement. There is also the warning to Christians that they will be judge by the same standard they use. Now lets be clear that is not a call to not use any standard for the purpose of not being judged by any standard. It is an interesting question but in a real sense we will be judged not for our deeds but will be judged by our position, in Christ or not.
 
Upvote 0