BREAKING: Vatican defrocks former US cardinal McCarrick over sex abuse

Gnarwhal

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ROME (AP) — The Vatican says Pope Francis has defrocked former U.S. Cardinal Theodore McCarrick after Vatican officials found him guilty of soliciting for sex while hearing Confession.​

Vatican defrocks former US cardinal McCarrick over sex abuse
 

Par5

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straykat

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Defrocked not excommunicated...

Technically, excommunication is for heretics (bad doctrine specifically).. and they can't be saved until they repent and submit to correct doctrine. Afaik, he didn't do any of this. He's just a fallen person like all of us, and can be forgiven.. but shouldn't be in leadership either.
 
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Markie Boy

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Romans 13:3

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Well, I will take a slightly different path. I say wonderful; it is movement that clearly says that McCarrick is the wrong kind of priest. Could/should there be more bold steps, sure, of course. But at least this is something tangible. I still believe the Church has a significant problem due to the influence of a significant minority of practicing homosexual priests. But, the fact that someone like me knows it significantly diminishes the power they have over us all.
 
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Markie Boy

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Not to debate - but a look at the numbers from Vigano do not suggest this is a significant minority - it's a big problem.

If there is one bad guy and 20 good guys it's a short battle - when it's 50/50 it's a different story. We don't seem to have a short battle on our hands.
 
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Not to debate - but a look at the numbers from Vigano do not suggest this is a significant minority - it's a big problem.

If there is one bad guy and 20 good guys it's a short battle - when it's 50/50 it's a different story. We don't seem to have a short battle on our hands.

Fair point
 
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Stabat Mater dolorosa

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Technically, excommunication is for heretics (bad doctrine specifically).. and they can't be saved until they repent and submit to correct doctrine. Afaik, he didn't do any of this. He's just a fallen person like all of us, and can be forgiven.. but shouldn't be in leadership either.

If he does not repent, then he should be excommunicated in public.
If the church did this, then everyone would see how seriously the church consider such offenses.

An public apology should be required for him to stay within the roman catholic communion.
I believe like Markie Boy that this is a very widespread problem in the church.

Mighty people wants this to be tossed back into the darker corners of the Vatican again.
Silence and ignorance is the preferred way of handling this in the eyes of many clerics.
 
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Michie

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It is not known yet whether McCarrick will leave the Kansas friary where has been living a life of prayer and penance. Though he is reported to have some financial means at his disposal, and is entitled civilly to a Church pension, it is not yet known what options are available to him.
 
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Markie Boy

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If he does not repent, then he should be excommunicated in public.
If the church did this, then everyone would see how seriously the church consider such offenses.

An public apology should be required for him to stay within the roman catholic communion.
I believe like Markie Boy that this is a very widespread problem in the church.

Mighty people wants this to be tossed back into the darker corners of the Vatican again.
Silence and ignorance is the preferred way of handling this in the eyes of many clerics.

Glad to see you hanging around Stabat.
 
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Markie Boy

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It is not known yet whether McCarrick will leave the Kansas friary where has been living a life of prayer and penance. Though he is reported to have some financial means at his disposal, and is entitled civilly to a Church pension, it is not yet known what options are available to him.

He is entitled to an orange jump suit, and all his victims are entitled to whatever money he has.

When the Church is willing to give money to known criminals - I am no longer willing to give money to the Church. Nobody should give them a dime until they clean up.
 
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paul1149

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I don't know the limits of what McCarrick deserves, but all else being equal, this seems like a good first step, though long overdue. Presumably he still is liable to prosecution, as many sex crimes have no statute of limitations. So I doubt he's out of the woods yet.

But McCarrick is only one perpetrator, though perhaps the highest up. The problem the RCC has at this point is lack of confidence due to its endemic cover-up of this massive problem for several decades, even after the partial revelations of twenty years ago should have given profound warning. This lack of confidence will, in my view, lead to: people walking away, a decline in contributions, schools closing because of reticence to send children there and a lack of funding, and a great lessening of the moral authority of the RCC's voice in the public square. Simply put, it's an utter disaster, and what happens to one guy, McCarrick, while symbolic and important, at best can only be a start to what must be a complete systemic repentance, house cleaning, and renewal.

Francis certainly has shown he's willing to shake things up, but many are convinced most of it hasn't been for the good. On this issue, the issue that will define his tenure, he has move glacially and has exhibited a troubling degree of denial and even blameshifting to the ones prophetically calling out the sin. The real issue is whether the RCC will exercise the quality of leadership required to root out the evil and turn this around for the good. How this move with McCarrick fits in I guess we soon will see.
 
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Markie Boy

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I don't know the limits of what McCarrick deserves, but all else being equal, this seems like a good first step, though long overdue. Presumably he still is liable to prosecution, as many sex crimes have no statute of limitations. So I doubt he's out of the woods yet.

But McCarrick is only one perpetrator, though perhaps the highest up. The problem the RCC has at this point is lack of confidence due to its endemic cover-up of this massive problem for several decades, even after the partial revelations of twenty years ago should have given profound warning. This lack of confidence will, in my view, lead to: people walking away, a decline in contributions, schools closing because of reticence to send children there and a lack of funding, and a great lessening of the moral authority of the RCC's voice in the public square. Simply put, it's an utter disaster, and what happens to one guy, McCarrick, while symbolic and important, at best can only be a start to what must be a complete systemic repentance, house cleaning, and renewal.

Francis certainly has shown he's willing to shake things up, but many are convinced most of it hasn't been for the good. On this issue, the issue that will define his tenure, he has move glacially and has exhibited a troubling degree of denial and even blameshifting to the ones prophetically calling out the sin. The real issue is whether the RCC will exercise the quality of leadership required to root out the evil and turn this around for the good. How this move with McCarrick fits in I guess we soon will see.

You are correct - the RCC has lost so much ability to influence and teach. Until the clean up they are like a rowboat without oars.
 
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