I don't know who to listen to

JohnB445

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There are 2 Bible teachers I go to.

one is a Baptist and the other is a Pentecostal, and they both are contradicting each other.

1. The Baptist one says use the KJV, the Pentecostal says use the ESV

2. The Baptist says don't go seeking the spiritual gifts since they ceased, the Pentecostal says to seek the spiritual gifts because they are still here for today

3. The Baptist says I am eternally secure, the Pentecostal says that it is possible for me to later on reject Christ and be cut off forever.

Ok how do I know which one is lying to me? Why did God make finding truth so difficult?
 

JohnB445

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If I had to flip a coin I think I would go with the Pentecostal, because she claims she had been divinely healed and has the miracle of speaking in tongues.

But if I am deceived then I am damned, and I don't want to bear the cost.

But if the Baptist is wrong, then I am damned at the same time.

So I am confused.
 
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HTacianas

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There are 2 Bible teachers I go to.

one is a Baptist and the other is a Pentecostal, and they both are contradicting each other.

1. The Baptist one says use the KJV, the Pentecostal says use the ESV

2. The Baptist says don't go seeking the spiritual gifts since they ceased, the Pentecostal says to seek the spiritual gifts because they are still here for today

3. The Baptist says I am eternally secure, the Pentecostal says that it is possible for me to later on reject Christ and be cut off forever.

Ok how do I know which one is lying to me? Why did God make finding truth so difficult?

Honestly, I wouldn't listen to either one of them. As far as bibles go, what would either of them say of a person who uses neither, but uses the original Greek?
 
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Albion

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There are smart people in all denominations, but it is almost a certainty that the normal layman is going to get conflicting advice--all supposedly Biblical, of course--if he constantly solicits the opinions of teachers representing different denominations known to have different belief systems!
 
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Mark Quayle

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There are 2 Bible teachers I go to.

one is a Baptist and the other is a Pentecostal, and they both are contradicting each other.

1. The Baptist one says use the KJV, the Pentecostal says use the ESV

2. The Baptist says don't go seeking the spiritual gifts since they ceased, the Pentecostal says to seek the spiritual gifts because they are still here for today

3. The Baptist says I am eternally secure, the Pentecostal says that it is possible for me to later on reject Christ and be cut off forever.

Ok how do I know which one is lying to me? Why did God make finding truth so difficult?
Read the Bible. The truth is right there in front of your face, and you will spend the rest of your life getting to know it.

It is possible neither are lying --simply themselves misled. Matter of fact, nobody has all the right answers.

But FWIW there are many good translations of the Bible. Both KJV and ESV are good. But look for yourself, and when you find something, don't let that be your final decision. Read and study and Read huge portions, whole books at once.

Ask God for wisdom. He may take the rest of your life to give it to do you, but he does answer prayer.
 
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timothyu

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Why did God make finding truth so difficult?
He didn't. Man did and someone is always trying to sell you something other than the Gospel of the Kingdom. Why not start with the words of Jesus and His Kingdom in scripture and go from there.
 
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mmksparbud

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As for bible translations, don't limit yourself to just one. The object of the bible is to translate into English the original language. If you want accuracy, learn the original language! That being mostly not practical to do, use different versions to study passages. There are many versions right on the internet. Many sites that will contain several versions with commentaries from several different sources. Yes, it takes longer. But from that you can see what many think and put it together yourself to decide who is closer to the bible. The object is not how popular an interpretation is but how accurately it is translated from the original. It is not the opinion of the church that you want but what the bible has to say. Do not open those bibles without prayer.

The bible does not contradict itself. If there are passages that seem confusing, then look to the character of God for clarification. The spiritual gifts can be researched pretty clearly. Read 1 Cor. 12. The whole chapter deals with that. There are no verses in the bible that states spiritual gifts have ceased. In fact we are cautioned to use care and test the spirits as there will be many false prophets which obviously means there will be true ones. They did not say to disregard all prophets.
Tongues can be misleading---follow the bible concepts not the church or a pastor. You must study for yourself, and not expect to be told what it says.

1Co_13:8 Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.
1Co_14:5 I would that ye all spake with tongues, but rather that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.
1Co_14:6 Now, brethren, if I come unto you speaking with tongues, what shall I profit you, except I shall speak to you either by revelation, or by knowledge, or by prophesying, or by doctrine?
1Co_14:18 I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all:
1Co_14:21 In the law it is written, With men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord.
1Co_14:22 Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe.

As for salvation--yes--you can choose to walk away from God


Mat 12:43 When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest, and findeth none.
Mat 12:44 Then he saith, I will return into my house from whence I came out; and when he is come, he findeth it empty, swept, and garnished.
Mat 12:45 Then goeth he, and taketh with himself seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter in and dwell there: and the last state of that man is worse than the first. Even so shall it be also unto this wicked generation

There is a difference between stumbling and falling--and staying down. We can stumble and fall, but Jesus will catch us and we ask for forgiveness. The problem is staying down. If you remain in your sins, then you certainly can be lost.

1Pe_1:5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
1Pe_1:9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.

Rom 8:37 Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.
Rom 8:38 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
Rom 8:39 Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

2Ti 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
 
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rockytopva

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I am Pentecostal and like the KJV. But... I would not consider most Pentecostals truly Spirit filled. This is where we must learn to lean on Christ Jesus and not on man.

I am afraid there are Sadducees (note-sad-you-see) and pharisees in every denomination. And there are brothers Sandpaper and sisters Sandpaper in every church who will rub you the wrong way.
 
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Bible Highlighter

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There are 2 Bible teachers I go to.

one is a Baptist and the other is a Pentecostal, and they both are contradicting each other.

The Bible does not teach us to have a denominational label. So do not listen to either of them. Listen to God speak to you through His Word. God's Word is not taught in the wisdom of men but we are taught by the Spirit when we surrender our lives to Christ and we study His Word. In 1 Corinthians 3: Paul condemned that we should call ourselves follower of a certain believer like Paul, or Apollos, etc. This means we should not say we are of Paul or Apollos, etc. Yet, today, some folks identify with a belief that is named after a man.

You said:
1. The Baptist one says use the KJV, the Pentecostal says use the ESV

As for the KJV vs. the ESV:

Nobody claims the ESV to be the perfect Word of God. Only one translation is claimed to be perfect and that is the KJV. Scripture teaches that there is a divinely inspired Word of God for our day. See my biblical reasons in defense of the KJV being the Word of God for our day here:

Reasons why I believe the KJV is the divinely inspired perfect Word of God.

You said:
2. The Baptist says don't go seeking the spiritual gifts since they ceased, the Pentecostal says to seek the spiritual gifts because they are still here for today

I believe Cessationism is biblical. Here are my reasons with Scripture.

Cessationism: Tongues, Prophecy, and the Gift of Miracles Have Ceased.

You said:
3. The Baptist says I am eternally secure, the Pentecostal says that it is possible for me to later on reject Christ and be cut off forever.

Eternal Security is clearly one of the biggest false doctrines. You cannot get far in your New Testament without seeing warnings given to believers in regards to their right standing with God. Most verses that appear to talk about having security are attached with certain conditions (Which is viewable by simply looking at the context). Here is a post of mine that lists a long list of verses refuting Eternal Security.

The lie of eternal security refuted once and for all.

You said:
Ok how do I know which one is lying to me? Why did God make finding truth so difficult?

You test it with the Word of God. Is the belief in the Bible? Or does the Bible speak against such a belief? Truth is not difficult if you ask God to reveal the truth to you and you keep seeking with His help.
 
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Radagast

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There are 2 Bible teachers I go to.

one is a Baptist and the other is a Pentecostal, and they both are contradicting each other.

1. The Baptist one says use the KJV, the Pentecostal says use the ESV

2. The Baptist says don't go seeking the spiritual gifts since they ceased, the Pentecostal says to seek the spiritual gifts because they are still here for today

3. The Baptist says I am eternally secure, the Pentecostal says that it is possible for me to later on reject Christ and be cut off forever.

Ok how do I know which one is lying to me? Why did God make finding truth so difficult?

If you ask me, the Pentecostal is right on #1. The ESV is probably the best translation out there

But the Baptist is right on #2 and #3, I believe.

However, you should never trust random people on the Internet.
 
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paul1149

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Ok how do I know which one is lying to me? Why did God make finding truth so difficult?
Because salvation isn't merely an intellectual exercise, it's a heart relationship, and that takes lots of time to develop. Follow Jesus, then everything works out as it should. Mt 6.33 - seek the Kingdom and its righteousness, and all will be added. Don't get ahead of yourself on the details. God is not going to hang you on them if your heart is for Him. If you're looking for difference of opinion in the church, trust me, you will find what you are looking for. The faith that pleases God believes He is good (Heb 11.6). Keep yourself rooted and grounded in Him.
 
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LoveofTruth

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There are 2 Bible teachers I go to.

one is a Baptist and the other is a Pentecostal, and they both are contradicting each other.

1. The Baptist one says use the KJV, the Pentecostal says use the ESV

2. The Baptist says don't go seeking the spiritual gifts since they ceased, the Pentecostal says to seek the spiritual gifts because they are still here for today

3. The Baptist says I am eternally secure, the Pentecostal says that it is possible for me to later on reject Christ and be cut off forever.

Ok how do I know which one is lying to me? Why did God make finding truth so difficult?
The KJV is the bible you should use and the gifts are for today and have not ceased.

1 John 2:27. But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.”

2 Corinthians 13:3.,5 “Since ye seek a proof of Christ speaking in me, which to you-ward is not weak, but is mighty in you... 5. Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?”
 
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eleos1954

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There are 2 Bible teachers I go to.

one is a Baptist and the other is a Pentecostal, and they both are contradicting each other.

1. The Baptist one says use the KJV, the Pentecostal says use the ESV

2. The Baptist says don't go seeking the spiritual gifts since they ceased, the Pentecostal says to seek the spiritual gifts because they are still here for today

3. The Baptist says I am eternally secure, the Pentecostal says that it is possible for me to later on reject Christ and be cut off forever.

Ok how do I know which one is lying to me? Why did God make finding truth so difficult?

Each needs to study Gods word for themselves. The truth is in His word. It takes time, your time. God wants you (each of us) to spend time with Him and that time with Him is through studying His Holy Word and prayer. It is a lifetime commitment. It is a walk.

Light in regard to scripture as a whole is not given all at once.

Psalm 119:130

130 The unfolding of your words gives light; it gives understanding to the simple.

God didn't make it difficult ... satan distorts biblical teaching(s) and is very very deceptive about it.

The Bible is the Word of God and is the primary and authoritative means by which He reveals Himself to human beings.
 
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JAL

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There are 2 Bible teachers I go to.

one is a Baptist and the other is a Pentecostal, and they both are contradicting each other.

1. The Baptist one says use the KJV, the Pentecostal says use the ESV

2. The Baptist says don't go seeking the spiritual gifts since they ceased, the Pentecostal says to seek the spiritual gifts because they are still here for today

3. The Baptist says I am eternally secure, the Pentecostal says that it is possible for me to later on reject Christ and be cut off forever.

Ok how do I know which one is lying to me?
Intellectual honesty? . A seemingly sincere expression of uncertainty? If so, how refreshing. Unfortunately, how rare.

You DON'T know what doctrines are true, not with 100% certainty. None of us do. Most just pretend to know what they are talking about. Do you realize what this means? It means that most churches, possibly without exception, contain a LIE as one of their foundation-stones, the lie being, 'We know what we're doing. We KNOW the correct doctrines, we KNOW how to run a church, we KNOW how to build a church, we KNOW how to pray, evangelize, etc." Almost universally, the leaders preach from the pulpits exuding (a false pretense of) 100% confidence.

God seems to take religious pretense very seriously. He struck dead the two sons of Aaron for a fairly slight breach of protocol. He even slew Uzzah for touching the Ark. So if the churches are partially built on a lie, how often can we expect revival? How often can we expect the sick to be healed? How often can we expect God to repair impoverished economies, severed racial relations, and political discord?
Why did God make finding truth so difficult?
I don't think God is at fault here. Men have constructed their own religion - their own OPINIONS - and followed THAT. As a result, there is very little outpouring of the Holy Spirit, which means we lack the revelatory Light needed to reliably understand the scriptures. We just have to try to do the best we can.

I would advise you to do what I did. Since there are so many possible interpretations of a verse, direct linguistic analysis isn't your best tool. Your best tool is to look for logical contradictions in the different viewpoints. Take for example the doctrine of immutability.
(1) God is immutable (cannot change)
(2) But He became a man?
Is this a logical contradiction? That's for YOU to decide. You have to decide for yourself. You can't just take someone else's opinion at face value, unfortunately.
 
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JAL

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I believe Cessationism is biblical. Here are my reasons with Scripture.
Cessationism: Tongues, Prophecy, and the Gift of Miracles Have Ceased.
Wonderful. You've created a thread that reagards 1Corinthians as teaching cessationism whereas, in my opinion, it is, starting from chapter 2 and culiminating in chapter 14, Paul's magnum opus on the ABSOLUTE PRIMACY of universal prophethood. The whole point of this epistle, as I see it, is that mature prophethood IS THE DEFINITION OF spiritual maturity. And hence, 'Follow the way of love and eagerly desire spiritual gifts, ESPECIALLY the gift of prophecy" (14:1).

Without infallible prophetic revelation, NONE of us can be sure of having sound doctrine. We are stranded in the quagmire of our own fallible interpretations of Scripture.

Great. Wonderful. Do you realize that 100 billion people have lived and died since the world began, according to population studies? That means that if the church has incorrect doctrine - specifically an incorrect understanding of evangelism - she potentially strands billions of people in hell, instead of being instrumental in saving them.

As long as this POSSIBILITY exists, we NEED infallible doctrine. If we're not wanting the gift of prophecy, therefore, our priorities are dead wrong. Take another look at verse 14:1- because that's where you'll find Paul's priorities spelled out, I should think.
 
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