Is a 3rd future Temple needed to fulfill Bible prophecy?

Marilyn C · Feb 15, 2019

BABerean2 said:
He was already both Lord(Ruler) and Christ(Messiah) on the Day of Pentecost, based on Peter's words below.

Act 2:36 "Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly that God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Christ."

Paul reveals below that the victory was at the cross.

Col 2:15 Having disarmed principalities and powers, He made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them in it.

.

Hi BABerean,

Yes, He is Lord & Christ. We both agree. However the Lord is not operating on David`s throne at the moment, that is in the millennium. Also principalities and powers have yet to be dislodged from their position they usurped.

There are rulership positions that the Old Testament prophets spoke of in the heavenly places that yet need restoring to their rightful ruler.

Marilyn.

BABerean2 · Feb 15, 2019

Marilyn C said:
There are rulership positions that the Old Testament prophets spoke of in the heavenly places that yet need restoring to their rightful ruler.

They are now ruling and reigning in heaven with Christ, alongside the Apostles of Christ.

.

claninja · Feb 15, 2019

Marilyn C said:
So we see that Jesus is at the Father`s right hand until His enemies are His footstool, then the Father say for His son to rule over His enemies, (until they are under His feet, control)

Hi Marilyn,

Yes, we absolute agree, Jesus is IN HEAVEN UNTIL his enemies are made a footstool. And if he is in heaven UNTIL his enemies are made a footstool, that means his is reigning. For not only does he sit at the right hand UNTIL his enemies are made a footstool, he also reigns UNTIL his enemies are made a footstool.

1 Corinthians 15:23 He must reign UNTIL He has put all His enemies under His feet

Saying that 1 Corinthians 15:23 occurs when Jesus returns from heaven creates a logical contradiction. For how can Christ be in heaven UNTIL his enemies are made a footstool and yet be reigning physically on a physical throne on earth UNTIL his enemies are made a footstool.

Marilyn C said:
Elijah prepared the way for Israel, however it was not the beginning of restitution that the Old testament prophets spoke of.

I disagree, as scripture states otherwise.

Matthew 17:11-12 Jesus replied, “Elijah does indeed come, and he will restore all things. But I tell you that Elijah has already come, and they did not recognize him, but have done to him whatever they wished. In the same way, the Son of Man will suffer at their hands.”

Marilyn C said:
The Lord is at the Father`s right hand (interceding) but one day He will have His `own throne`(Rev. 3: 21) (under the Father) where He will begin to rule over His enemies.

Marilyn C said:
Where is that throne?

According to Peter the resurrection of Jesus fulfilled God putting a descendent on David's throne.

Acts 2:30-31 But he was a prophet and knew that God had promised him on oath that He would place one of his descendants on his throne. Foreseeing this, David spoke about the resurrection of the Christ,

Marilyn C said:
And has there been rulership there before?

Jesus was king when he came in the flesh. For if he wasn't, he could not have fulfilled this prophecy:
John 12:14-15 Finding a young donkey, Jesus sat on it, as it is written: “Do not be afraid, O daughter of Zion. See, your King is coming, seated on the colt of a donkey.”

Jesus, is also already the ruler of the kings of the earth.
Revelation 1:5 and from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler of the kings of the earth.

Marilyn C · Feb 15, 2019

BABerean2 said:
They are now ruling and reigning in heaven with Christ, alongside the Apostles of Christ.

.

Hi BABerean,

And where does it say that. please?

Marilyn.

Marilyn C · Feb 15, 2019

claninja said:
Hi Marilyn,

Yes, we absolute agree, Jesus is IN HEAVEN UNTIL his enemies are made a footstool. And if he is in heaven UNTIL his enemies are made a footstool, that means his is reigning. For not only does he sit at the right hand UNTIL his enemies are made a footstool, he also reigns UNTIL his enemies are made a footstool.

1 Corinthians 15:23 He must reign UNTIL He has put all His enemies under His feet

Saying that 1 Corinthians 15:23 occurs when Jesus returns from heaven creates a logical contradiction. For how can Christ be in heaven UNTIL his enemies are made a footstool and yet be reigning physically on a physical throne on earth UNTIL his enemies are made a footstool.

I disagree, as scripture states otherwise.

Matthew 17:11-12 Jesus replied, “Elijah does indeed come, and he will restore all things. But I tell you that Elijah has already come, and they did not recognize him, but have done to him whatever they wished. In the same way, the Son of Man will suffer at their hands.”

According to Peter the resurrection of Jesus fulfilled God putting a descendent on David's throne.

Acts 2:30-31 But he was a prophet and knew that God had promised him on oath that He would place one of his descendants on his throne. Foreseeing this, David spoke about the resurrection of the Christ,

Jesus was king when he came in the flesh. For if he wasn't, he could not have fulfilled this prophecy:
John 12:14-15 Finding a young donkey, Jesus sat on it, as it is written: “Do not be afraid, O daughter of Zion. See, your King is coming, seated on the colt of a donkey.”

Jesus, is also already the ruler of the kings of the earth.
Revelation 1:5 and from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler of the kings of the earth.

Hi claninja,

Where does it say that Christ is actively ruling from heaven now. I read that Christ is the high priest in the heavenly sanctuary interceding there. (Heb. 8: 1 & 2) Then I read in the Psalms, as I quoted before that God the Father says to His son to wait at His right hand UNTIL He, (the Father) has placed His enemies under Christ`s feet. Then and only then will Christ operate in His Kingship.

Yes He is King of Glory, King of Heaven, King of the Ages, King of Israel, King of the nations...however he is not at the moment in His glorified body operating in His kingship. If you believe He is, can you show me where, please?

Christ does NOT actively reign UNTIL the Father has placed His enemies under His feet. (Ps. 110: 1 & 2) In Rev. 11: 17 we see that the 24 elders are worshipping the Lord saying, `you have taken your great power and reigned.`

I do not believe that the Lord will be physically ruling on earth, for that would have 2 kings ruling Israel on the earth - David (Ez. 37: 25 & Jer. 30: 9)and Christ. The Lord always rules from His own throne in the third heaven. He rules over Israel, as promised in the millennium, but not from the earth.

Marilyn.

mkgal1 · Feb 15, 2019

Marilyn C said:
Hi claninja,

Where does it say that Christ is actively ruling from heaven now.

Hi Marilyn :wave:

Are you reading the posts that you're quoting? Because the answer - along with the reasoning behind it - is within what you quoted.

MK

BABerean2 · Feb 15, 2019

Marilyn C said:
Hi BABerean,

And where does it say that. please?

Marilyn.

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

Joh 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

They have already been passed from death to life, through faith in Christ.
This is the "first resurrection", which is a spiritual resurrection of the dead.

The timing of the bodily resurrection of the dead is found in Revelation 11:18, and is described in John 5:27-30.

The Book of Revelation is not in chronological order.

.

mkgal1 · Feb 15, 2019

Marilyn C said:
I do not believe that the Lord will be physically ruling on earth

I don't believe that's what's been the topic of this discussion.

The phrase that was quoted was, "ruler of the kings of the earth."

Marilyn C said:
The Lord always rules from His own throne in the third heaven. He rules over Israel, as promised in the millennium, but not from the earth.

This just seems to be going off extrabiblical understanding - and not from Scripture itself.

It seems so far from what I see in Scripture I can't even figure out where to begin. It also seems to be limiting God. He is spirit - God isn't limited to a place (like the ancient pagan gods were).

Marilyn C · Feb 15, 2019

BABerean2 said:
Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

Joh 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

They have already been passed from death to life, through faith in Christ.
This is the "first resurrection", which is a spiritual resurrection of the dead.

The timing of the bodily resurrection of the dead is found in Revelation 11:18, and is described in John 5:27-30.

The Book of Revelation is not in chronological order.

.

Hi BABerean, I agree that parts of Revelation overlap, so it is not all in chronological order. Now notice those people ruling with the Lord are those that didn`t worship the beast or take his mark. That is in the trib, so it is NOT NOW as you said.

Marilyn.

Marilyn C · Feb 15, 2019

mkgal1 said:
I don't believe that's what's been the topic of this discussion.

The phrase that was quoted was, "ruler of the kings of the earth."

This just seems to be going off extrabiblical understanding - and not from Scripture itself.

It seems so far from what I see in Scripture I can't even figure out where to begin. It also seems to be limiting God. He is spirit - God isn't limited to a place (like the ancient pagan gods were).

Hi mkgal,

Yes we are going off topic. May have to start a new thread.

Now I said `the Lord rules from the third heaven.` (Rev. 3: 21) The Lord (Jesus) is in His glorified body and not a spirit floating around. The disciples saw Him and we shall see Him also.

Marilyn.

Marilyn C · Feb 15, 2019

mkgal1 said:
Hi Marilyn

Are you reading the posts that you're quoting? Because the answer - along with the reasoning behind it - is within what you quoted.

MK

Hi MK,

Yes the Lord has titles as King but He is NOT operating as king on the earth yet. He is operating in His High Priestly role interceding for the Body.

`We have such a high priest, who is seated at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens, a minister of the sanctuary and of the true tabernacle which the Lord erected and not man.` (Heb. 8: 1 & 2)
`..since he ever lives to make intercession for them...` (Heb. 7: 25)

Marilyn.

mkgal1 · Feb 15, 2019

Marilyn C said:
Now I said `the Lord rules from the third heaven.` (Rev. 3: 21) The Lord (Jesus) is in His glorified body and not a spirit floating around. The disciples saw Him and we shall see Him also.

You seem to be dividing the Trinity in a way that's beyond my Scriptural understanding.

This idea is new to me - the idea that Jesus is NOT Spirit and is - currently - in the same glorified body the disciples saw.

mkgal1 · Feb 15, 2019

Marilyn C said:
Now I said `the Lord rules from the third heaven.` (Rev. 3: 21)

This is what Revelation 3:21 states (nothing about "third heaven"). Also.....even though I'm new to studying Revelation, I understand it's ONE revelation - not many - and John says that these events "must soon take place":

21 Those who are victorious will sit with me on my throne, just as I was victorious and sat with my Father on his throne.

The churches in Revelation 3 were first century churches. The world no longer looks like this:

Marilyn C · Feb 15, 2019

mkgal1 said:
You seem to be dividing the Trinity in a way that's beyond my Scriptural understanding.

This idea is new to me - the idea that Jesus is NOT Spirit and is - currently - in the same glorified body the disciples saw.

Hi mkgal,

`This same Jesus who was taken up from you into heaven, will so come in like manner as you saw him go into heaven` (Acts 1: 11)

The Lord Jesus Christ has a glorified body, (as we will also) and he is also part of the Trinity by His spirit. Great is the mystery of Godliness.

Marilyn.

Marilyn C · Feb 15, 2019

mkgal1 said:
This is what Revelation 3:21 states (nothing about "third heaven"). Also.....even though I'm new to studying Revelation, I understand it's ONE revelation - not many - and John says that these events "must soon take place". :

21 Those who are victorious will sit with me on my throne, just as I was victorious and sat with my Father on his throne.

Hi mkgal,

Revelation (unveiling) is the unveiling of Jesus as He is known in the heavenly realms. There are 4 visions of the Lord and what He is doing.

The Lord Jesus is given a throne far above all, and will also rule in every realm of God`s great kingdom. (Eph. 1: 21 Eph. 1: 10)

Marilyn.

BABerean2 · Feb 15, 2019

Marilyn C said:
Hi BABerean, I agree that parts of Revelation overlap, so it is not all in chronological order. Now notice those people ruling with the Lord are those that didn`t worship the beast or take his mark. That is in the trib, so it is NOT NOW as you said.

Marilyn.

Does Revelation chapter 20 contain the word "tribulation"?

Rev_1:9 I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.

.

Marilyn C · Feb 15, 2019

BABerean2 said:
Does Revelation chapter 20 contain the word "tribulation"?

Rev_1:9 I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.

.

Hi BABerean,

The `beast`s` rule is for 42 months, (called the great tribulation) so that does not include when John was going through trials.

Marilyn.

BABerean2 · Feb 16, 2019

Marilyn C said:
Hi BABerean,

The `beast`s` rule is for 42 months, (called the great tribulation) so that does not include when John was going through trials.

Marilyn.

Please confirm what you have said above with scripture.
Otherwise, it is only your opinion.
.

mkgal1 · Feb 16, 2019

Marilyn C said:
Hi mkgal,

`This same Jesus who was taken up from you into heaven, will so come in like manner as you saw him go into heaven` (Acts 1: 11)

The Lord Jesus Christ has a glorified body, (as we will also) and he is also part of the Trinity by His spirit. Great is the mystery of Godliness.

Marilyn.

I believe the point is about the HOW.....the method. He was taken in the clouds (which, in ancient Jewish literature, reflects power and glory).

Acts 1:9-11 ~After saying this, He was taken up into a cloud while they were watching, and they could no longer see him. 10 As they strained to see him rising into heaven, two white-robed men suddenly stood among them. 11 “Men of Galilee,” they said, “why are you standing here staring into heaven? Jesus has been taken from you into heaven, but someday He will return from heaven in the same way you saw him go!”

Luke 21:27 ~ At that time they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.

Matthew 26:64
"You have said it yourself," Jesus answered. "But I say to all of you, from now on you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven."

Daniel 7:13
In my vision in the night I continued to watch, and I saw One like a Son of Man coming with the clouds of heaven. He approached the Ancient of Days and was led into His presence.

mkgal1 · Feb 16, 2019

Marilyn C said:
The Lord Jesus is given a throne far above all, and will also rule in every realm of God`s great kingdom. (Eph. 1: 21 Eph. 1: 10)

Yes.....He does (active present tense).

The full text of the passages you cited:

Ephesians 1:7-22 ~
7In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of our trespasses, according to the riches of His grace, 8that He lavished on us with all wisdom and understanding. 9And He has made known to us the mystery of His will according to His good pleasure, which He purposed in Christ 10as a plan for the fullness of time, to bring all things in heaven and on earth together in Christ.

11 In Him we were also chosen as God’s own, having been predestined according to the plan of Him who works out everything by the counsel of His will, 12 in order that we, who were the first to hope in Christ, would be for the praise of His glory.

13And in Him, having heard and believed the word of truth—the gospel of your salvation—you were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, 14who is the pledge of our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God’s possession, to the praise of His glory.

Spiritual Wisdom

15For this reason, ever since I heard about your faith in the Lord Jesus and your love for all the saints, 16I have not stopped giving thanks for you, remembering you in my prayers 17and asking that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the glorious Father, may give you a spirit of wisdom and revelation in your knowledge of Him.

18I ask that the eyes of your heart may be enlightened, so that you may know the hope of His calling, the riches of His glorious inheritance in the saints, 19and the surpassing greatness of His power to us who believe. He displayed this power in the working of His mighty strength, 20which He exerted in Christ when He raised Him from the dead and seated Him at His right hand in the heavenly realms, 21far above all rule and authority, power and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this age, but also in the one to come.

22 And God put everything under His feet and made Him head over everything for the church, 23 which is His body, the fullness of Him who fills all in all.

Is a 3rd future Temple needed to fulfill Bible prophecy?

Is a future Temple in Jerusalem needed to fulfill Bible prophecy?

No. We are now the Temple/Sanctuary of God: 1 Corinthians 3:16

Yes. It is needed for the future "Man of Sin" to sit in: 2 Thess 2:4

Other

Pre-tribulation.

Newbie

Well-Known Member

Pre-tribulation.

Pre-tribulation.

His perfect way sets me free. 2 Samuel 22:33

Newbie

His perfect way sets me free. 2 Samuel 22:33

Pre-tribulation.

Pre-tribulation.

Pre-tribulation.

His perfect way sets me free. 2 Samuel 22:33

His perfect way sets me free. 2 Samuel 22:33

Pre-tribulation.

Pre-tribulation.

Newbie

Pre-tribulation.

Newbie

His perfect way sets me free. 2 Samuel 22:33

His perfect way sets me free. 2 Samuel 22:33

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