What is the significance of infant baptism?

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ExTiff

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Psalm 51:5
Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity, and in sin did my mother conceive me.

Was this person born under the Old covenant or the New? Did he have believing parent(s)?

The wicked are estranged from the womb; they go astray from birth, speaking lies.

Who are you to imply that those declared "Holy" in sacred scripture, 1 Cor.7:14, are already 'wicked'? Acts.10:15. By your own admission they can neither believe nor doubt, let alone sin. I don't disagree that we all go astray from the womb, holy or not but that is not the issue for you it seems.

Surely there is not a righteous man on earth who does good and never sins.

What about Jesus then, and the 'Holy' infants born to those who believe in Him?

Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned—

I don't know a single person who has not sinned, neither do you, so apart from Jesus Christ all have sinned, so no argument there!

For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,

No argument here either, but it does not change the scriptural FACT that the infants of believers are 'Holy'. 1 Cor.7:14.
 
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BABerean2

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Further more: God clearly states in OT scripture that the Abrahamic covenant and also the Old covenant Moses added to the everlasting one with Abraham, is a spiritual one, involving 'circumcision of the heart', not merely a physical mutilation.

You are ignoring the fact that the Sinai Covenant was a conditional "if" "then" covenant.

The penalty for picking up sticks on the Sabbath day was stoning.


Exo_19:5 Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine:


Jesus Christ was the only one to ever keep the Sinai Covenant perfectly.

.
 
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BABerean2

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Who are you to imply that those declared "Holy" in sacred scripture, 1 Cor.7:14, are already 'wicked'?

What does Paul mean in the beginning of verse 12 below?

1Co 7:12 But to the rest I, not the Lord, say: If any brother has a wife who does not believe, and she is willing to live with him, let him not divorce her.
1Co 7:13 And a woman who has a husband who does not believe, if he is willing to live with her, let her not divorce him.
1Co 7:14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband; otherwise your children would be unclean, but now they are holy.
1Co 7:15 But if the unbeliever departs, let him depart; a brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases. But God has called us to peace.
1Co 7:16 For how do you know, O wife, whether you will save your husband? Or how do you know, O husband, whether you will save your wife?

Why are you still attempting to ignore verse 16?

.
 
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ExTiff

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The Bible NO WHERE states that we are saved because our parents are saved. There is not even a suggestion of such a thing. The Bible does not promise household salvation.


I have not suggested that infants are "saved because their parents are saved". Read what I have actually written please, and don't attribute to me what I have not said.

God has a covenant with believers concerning the salvation of their infants. God has a covenant with the infants of believing parent(s). Just as God had a covenant with Abraham, (who was also a gospel believer), concerning Isaac, who was not only unborn at the time but actually not yet conceived, and his mother, at the time the covenant was announced, considered herself barren, and laughed.

As you seem to be doing in the face of God's Promises.
 
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ExTiff

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You are ignoring the fact that the Sinai Covenant was a conditional "if" "then" covenant.

The penalty for picking up sticks on the Sabbath day was stoning.


Exo_19:5 Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine:


Jesus Christ was the only one to ever keep the Sinai Covenant perfectly.

.

The covenant is not the law. Obedience to God is a matter of the heart in both old and new testaments. Read them and learn.
.
 
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BABerean2

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I have not suggested that infants are "saved because their parents are saved". Read what I have actually written please, and don't attribute to me what I have not said.

God has a covenant with believers concerning the salvation of their infants. God has a covenant with the infants of believing parent(s). Just as God had a covenant with Abraham, (who was also a gospel believer), concerning Isaac, who was not only unborn at the time but actually not yet conceived, and his mother, at the time the covenant was announced, considered herself barren, and laughed.

As you seem to be doing in the face of God's Promises.

Do you believe all of the descendants of Isaac inherited eternal life, because they were the seed of Abraham?

Num_16:32 And the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed them up, and their houses, and all the men that appertained unto Korah, and all their goods.

.
 
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ExTiff

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What does Paul mean in the beginning of verse 12 below?

1Co 7:12 But to the rest I, not the Lord, say: If any brother has a wife who does not believe, and she is willing to live with him, let him not divorce her.
1Co 7:13 And a woman who has a husband who does not believe, if he is willing to live with her, let her not divorce him.
1Co 7:14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband; otherwise your children would be unclean, but now they are holy.
1Co 7:15 But if the unbeliever departs, let him depart; a brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases. But God has called us to peace.
1Co 7:16 For how do you know, O wife, whether you will save your husband? Or how do you know, O husband, whether you will save your wife?

Why are you still attempting to ignore verse 16?

.

You should be asking yourself "Why then does the Apostle Paul say: The infants of a believing wife or husband are "Holy", whereas the infants of unbelievers are "Unclean"? By what reasoning does Paul reach this conclusion?

We know! You don't!
.
 
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ExTiff

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Do you believe all of the descendants of Isaac inherited eternal life, because they were the seed of Abraham?

Num_16:32 And the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed them up, and their houses, and all the men that appertained unto Korah, and all their goods.

.

Only if they had faith could they inherit eternal life, just like everyone else. God swore that the persons you mentioned would never enter His rest. Heb.3:8-12.

Q. An unbleiving heart in what?
A. God's Promises, what else!
.
 
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BABerean2

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"Why then does the Apostle Paul say: The infants of a believing wife or husband are "Holy", whereas the infants of unbelievers are "Unclean"? By what reasoning does Paul reach this conclusion?

1Co 7:16 For how do you know, O wife, whether you will save your husband? Or how do you know, O husband, whether you will save your wife?

.
 
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ExTiff

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1Co 7:16 For how do you know, O wife, whether you will save your husband? Or how do you know, O husband, whether you will save your wife?

.

What are you blathering about? It is children of a believer being 'Holy' we are concerned with, and why that may be so. What is your theory concerning whence their 'Holiness' comes? One thing is for sure! It exists by Apostolic pronouncement.

You are getting desperate to prove yourself right about something, it seems, but I'm not yet sure what it might be.

"But if the unbelieving partner separates, let it be so. In such cases the brother or sister is not enslaved. God has called you to peace. For how do you know, wife, whether you will save your husband? Or how do you know, husband, whether you will save your wife"?

But if the husband or wife who isn't a Christian is eager to leave, it is permitted. In such cases the Christian husband or wife should not insist that the other stay, for God wants his children to live in peace and harmony. For, after all, there is no promise to a believing wife concerning her husband's salvation, if she stays; and no promise to believing husbands concerning their wife's salvation.

There is however a promise sworn by God to believing parents, that their children are His children and will be circumcised of heart, eventually, if they do so allow and do not stubbornly refuse.
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Major1

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You are ignoring the fact that the Sinai Covenant was a conditional "if" "then" covenant.

The penalty for picking up sticks on the Sabbath day was stoning.


Exo_19:5 Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine:


Jesus Christ was the only one to ever keep the Sinai Covenant perfectly.

.

YES. It was "Conditional". IF they would God would.
 
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Major1

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I have not suggested that infants are "saved because their parents are saved". Read what I have actually written please, and don't attribute to me what I have not said.

God has a covenant with believers concerning the salvation of their infants. God has a covenant with the infants of believing parent(s). Just as God had a covenant with Abraham, (who was also a gospel believer), concerning Isaac, who was not only unborn at the time but actually not yet conceived, and his mother, at the time the covenant was announced, considered herself barren, and laughed.

As you seem to be doing in the face of God's Promises.

Comment #246 you said...……………

"If one or both of your parents / grandparents, were believing God's Promise of Salvation, then so were you."

I am done! I can not deal with such obvious manipulations of Scripture to suit a such a false teaching and then "FORGET" what you actually did say when you are caught in your own words.

No need to report my postings again, I am done with this thread.
 
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ExTiff

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Comment #246 you said...……………

"If one or both of your parents / grandparents, were believing God's Promise of Salvation, then so were you."

I am done! I can not deal with such obvious manipulations of Scripture to suit a such a false teaching and then "FORGET" what you actually did say when you are caught in your own words.

No need to report my postings again, I am done with this thread.

What mendatious nonsense is this! You not only have a talent for misquoting me, you also have missed out the rather sarcastic reposte I was answering, so as to make it look as though I am saying your belief resulted from your grandparent(s) belief.

You snydily said: "I am sure that you are much "Holier" than me, and have always been so, (since you were baptized into the covenant as an infant...)"

I replied, and intended you to understand: "If one or both of your parents / grandparents, were believing God's Promise of Salvation, then so were you." :- ( Baptised into the covenant ), (even though you may not have been 'sprinkled' physically or properly done).

Now I know what Jesus was up against. Luke 11:54.

I'm done with this too. Prov.26:4-5. Either way is futile. There is no point in going on with it, my patience is not inexhaustable.
.
 
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BABerean2

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Very poorly but my heart is in it, and that is what matters to God. How about you?
.

No. What matters to God is perfection.

I have one who kept the covenant perfectly for me, and was also circumcised for me on the 8th day of life.

However, I do understand that the New Covenant is a higher standard of conduct than the Old Covenant.

I also have the master teacher inside of me, based on the verses below.


Eph 1:13 In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise,

1Jn 2:27 But the anointing which you have received from Him abides in you, and you do not need that anyone teach you; but as the same anointing teaches you concerning all things, and is true, and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you will abide in Him.


This text reveals the fulfillment of Hebrews 8:11.

.
 
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ExTiff

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No. What matters to God is perfection.

I have one who kept the covenant perfectly for me, and was also circumcised for me on the 8th day of life.

However, I do understand that the New Covenant is a higher standard of conduct than the Old Covenant.

I also have the master teacher inside of me, based on the verses below.


Eph 1:13 In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise,

1Jn 2:27 But the anointing which you have received from Him abides in you, and you do not need that anyone teach you; but as the same anointing teaches you concerning all things, and is true, and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you will abide in Him.


This text reveals the fulfillment of Hebrews 8:11.

.

I will reword my question then, if it helps. I admit that when it comes to the fine detail I am probably a poor covenant keeper, but then again so was St Paul by his own admission. Our 'hearts' were in it though and that is what counts with God. When God speaks of the uncircumcised of heart he is referring to rebbles, renegades, and 'hardened hearts, as in the day of provocation in the widerness'.

Now I have said my piece, how well have you kept covenant with God? I already know God has unfailingly kept His covenant with you, assuming He has one. God has never broken His Word.

So how are ya doin'? Have you had an encounter with the living God yet, or are you still rhummaging through scripture hoping to find one there?
.
.
 
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Major1

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What mendatious nonsense is this! You not only have a talent for misquoting me, you also have missed out the rather sarcastic reposte I was answering, so as to make it look as though I am saying your belief resulted from your grandparent(s) belief.

You snydily said: "I am sure that you are much "Holier" than me, and have always been so, (since you were baptized into the covenant as an infant...)"

I replied, and intended you to understand: "If one or both of your parents / grandparents, were believing God's Promise of Salvation, then so were you." :- ( Baptised into the covenant ), (even though you may not have been 'sprinkled' physically or properly done).

Now I know what Jesus was up against. Luke 11:54.

I'm done with this too. Prov.26:4-5. Either way is futile. There is no point in going on with it, my patience is not inexhaustable.
.

THANK GOD!!!!!
 
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