The trinity is foundational, not an option

ewq1938 said:

I never said anything of the sort. The Holy Spirit conceiving a child in Mary is hardly "natural procreation".

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Still doesn't make sense. The Spirit overshadowing her conception isn't the same thing as the Father begetting him, unless I am missing something?

ewq1938 said:

The Father used the HS to conceive Christ. It makes sense to me.

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I've always viewed the overshadowing of Mary's conception to be about the forming of Christ's body from a fallen nature, besides the miraculous conception itself, rather than it being an act of being begotten by God the Father. He formed the perfect body for our Lord at his incarnation, while in Mary who knew no man, that's about how far I will take that.

Jonaitis said:

Do you believe the eternal generation of the Son, that he isn't "proceeding" forth from the Father only in the incarnation, but always is the Word "proceeding?"

I agree that God is one mind, one will, one eternity, etc. However, I am wondering if you see a real personal distinction between all three in relation to each other?

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Hey brother, sorry for the late reply. Does the term “eternal generation” mean that Jesus was created and is not fully God? What does that term mean exactly? I’ve never heard the term.

I believe what the Bible says in regard to Christ being the Word that was with God and was God in the beginning. I also believe that Jesus came forth and proceeded from God, as he stated in John 8:42.

I believe that he was speaking of the incarnation, in which the Word became flesh as taught in John 1:14 and 1 Timothy 3:16.

I definitely see a distinction within the Godhead between the Father and the Son. For me personally, the primary distinction is the flesh that Christ put on; the Father, being a Spirit according to John 4:24 means that he is distinguished from Christ, who has flesh and bone. However, I don’t see it against the teaching of scripture to say that Jesus Christ is the same Lord God as the Father. Christ was not created, and was with the Father as the Word from the very beginning. I believe that Christ is one with and equal to the Father like John 10:30 teaches, because the Father was in him and he in the Father. Since the Father is a Spirit, I believe the scripture about them being together within themselves is a show of the unified and singular Spirit of God, which is the same Holy Spirit we as believers are sealed with.

When I speak of distinction within the Godhead, I must also speak of the unity thereof; telling only either one is only telling half the truth. God is distinct within himself as one.

Did I answer your question?

I find it rather impossible to reconcile all scriptures that speak of the nature of God unto one solid idea, because we can’t understand an infinite God with our finite minds. I have a strong conviction about believing that while God is made up of three who bear record, that he is at the same time one. You can’t separate the three from the one. Great is the mystery of godliness.

New Birth said:

really thats the best you can do to skirt around it. seriously?

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If the Father is the Son and the Son the Father, how does the Father sit next to the Father?

“Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;” (Hebrews 1:3) (KJV 1900)

Dave L said:

If the Father is the Son and the Son the Father, how does the Father sit next to the Father?

“Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;” (Hebrews 1:3) (KJV 1900)

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Another good question is how can the Son of man both be in heaven and on earth at the same time like in John 3:13?

John 3:13 “And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.”

I think the answer is that God is omnipresent, which answers both your question and mine, as evidenced by John 3:13.

Marieke589 said:

The basis of our belief is under attack by the religion of the Antichrist. We see it everywhere, oneness is growing. People do not believe in the trinity anymore, welcome to the end times.

Who here still believes in the true God, the father, the son and the holy ghost?

In this sermon you see a very upset pastor because the had to throw out oneness heretics out of his church again. People who had pretended to be real believers for years, even were on the payroll of the church were spreading this false doctrine of oneness.

Trinity 101 (Throwing Out Oneness Heretics) by Steven Anderson – IFBTube

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if anyone didn't believe in the Trinity CF rules would prohibit them from talking about it in the theology section. I would also use caution with Steven Anderson who IMO is a poor advocate for Christian essentials.

Jonaitis said:

But I think the disagreement is that you see him as God's son by natural procreation, which I don't know how that works (and I am afraid to know the possibilities).

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Because Jesus was born of a woman.

Dave L said:

If the Father is the Son and the Son the Father, how does the Father sit next to the Father?

“Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;” (Hebrews 1:3) (KJV 1900)

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Good Morning I see we're back at it. This is not speaking of Jesus sitting on the literal right hand of the Father. This is speaking of Jesus having authority and power. It is a figurative phrase "right hand"
The right hand of God (Dextera Domini "right hand of the Lord" in Latin) or God'sright hand may refer to the Bible and common speech as a metaphor for the omnipotence of God and as a motif in art. In the Bible, to be at the right side "is to be identified as being in the special place of honor".

New Birth said:

Good Morning I see we're back at it. This is not speaking of Jesus sitting on the literal right hand of the Father. This is speaking of Jesus having authority and power. It is a figurative phrase "right hand"
The right hand of God (Dextera Domini "right hand of the Lord" in Latin) or God'sright hand may refer to the Bible and common speech as a metaphor for the omnipotence of God and as a motif in art. In the Bible, to be at the right side "is to be identified as being in the special place of honor".

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Really? How so?

DamianWarS said:

if anyone didn't believe in the Trinity CF rules would prohibit them from talking about it in the theology section. I would also use caution with Steven Anderson who IMO is a poor advocate for Christian essentials.

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I don’t think anyone here denies the Father, Son and Holy Ghost.

New Birth said:

Because Jesus was born of a woman.

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Jesus is YAHWEH, the eternal God.

Dave L said:

Jesus is YAHWEH, the eternal God.

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agree! so Jesus was a man like you and I. Jesus had a body and Jesus had a spirit. What part of Jesus was the Son and what Part of Jesus was YAHWEH?

New Birth said:

agree! so Jesus was a man like you and I. Jesus had a body and Jesus had a spirit. What part of Jesus was the Son and what Part of Jesus was YAHWEH?

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You need to study Christology. It will clear things right up for you.

Dave L said:

You need to study Christology. It will clear things right up for you.

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This rhetorical for me. I already know the answer. Im asking you because if you say Jesus is YAHWEH you are saying Jesus is the Father.

New Birth said:

This rhetorical for me. I already know the answer. Im asking you because if you say Jesus is YAHWEH you are saying Jesus is the Father.

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No, They baptized in the name (singular) of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit which is Jesus Christ = God our salvation anointed.

Dave L said:

No, They baptized in the name (singular) of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit which is Jesus Christ = God our salvation anointed.

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So your saying the singular name of the Father is Jesus and the singular name of the Son is Jesus and the singular name of the Holy Spirit is Jesus?
Did you just turn into a oneness believer?

New Birth said:

So your saying the singular name of the Father is Jesus and the singular name of the Son is Jesus and the singular name of the Holy Spirit is Jesus?
Did you just turn into a oneness believer?

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No, Jesus Christ = YAHWEH the triune God.

Dave L said:

No, Jesus Christ = YAHWEH the triune God.

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You’re proving his point.