GingerBeer

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Does the bible teach shunning of friends and family whenever they change their mind about any belief taught in your church?

I wrote to you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral people— not at all meaning the sexually immoral of this world, or the greedy and swindlers, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world. But now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of brother if he is guilty of sexual immorality or greed, or is an idolater, reviler, drunkard, or swindler—not even to eat with such a one. For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge? God judges those outside. Purge the evil person from among you. (I Corinthians 5:9-13)

Some use the above passage as justification for shunning.
 

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I went to a very strict traditional Catholic church for 13 years. When I got divorced, I left, for several reasons. I fully expected to keep my friendships. Whether I was deliberately being shunned or not I cannot say, but 2 years down the road I am not in touch with a single person from that church. And these were the closest people in my life. I talked to them every day, our children played together. They were my emergency contacts and people who I had listed in advanced directives. We spent holidays and prayer time together. They were there when my daughter almost died. It still hurts a lot.
 
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GingerBeer

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I went to a very strict traditional Catholic church for 13 years. When I got divorced, I left, for several reasons. I fully expected to keep my friendships. Whether I was deliberately being shunned or not I cannot say, but 2 years down the road I am not in touch with a single person from that church. And these were the closest people in my life. I talked to them every day, our children played together. They were my emergency contacts and people who I had listed in advanced directives. We spent holidays and prayer time together. They were there when my daughter almost died. It still hurts a lot.
Was it one of the churches connected with that French Archbishop who objected to John XXIII and the Second Vatican council?
 
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Tolworth John

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Does the bible teach shunning of friends and family whenever they change their mind about any belief taught in your church?

For the reasons you've given No the bible doesnot teach 'shunning'.

The passage you've quoted is about gross physical sins and about those who have been challenged about their behaviour and have not tried to change.

The biblical practice is for a 'sinner' to be talked to by someone, then for the leadership to talk several times with the 'sinner', if there is no change then it is brought before the church and they are formally excluded from taking communion, they may attend church.

For them to be excluded from attending church there rejection of a christian life style would have to be blatent, as in the quote.

There are no grounds for shunning someone just because they are YEC or reject KJ only, are pedo baptists, etc

It is an abuse if it happens because of devorce, living together, or being sent to prison.
 
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Norbert L

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Does the bible teach shunning of friends and family whenever they change their mind about any belief taught in your church?

I wrote to you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral people— not at all meaning the sexually immoral of this world, or the greedy and swindlers, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world. But now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of brother if he is guilty of sexual immorality or greed, or is an idolater, reviler, drunkard, or swindler—not even to eat with such a one. For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge? God judges those outside. Purge the evil person from among you. (I Corinthians 5:9-13)

Some use the above passage as justification for shunning.
I think it depends on how a disagreement gets handled. Which is about specifics.

IIRC years back on these forums a former pastor of the SDA explained what happened to him when he no longer believed in the third angels message doctrine. What occurred is they still allowed him to attend their church but he would no longer be a pastor.

Depending on what's going on, I believe Gal 6:10 would need to be factored in.
 
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devin553344

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Does the bible teach shunning of friends and family whenever they change their mind about any belief taught in your church?

I wrote to you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral people— not at all meaning the sexually immoral of this world, or the greedy and swindlers, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world. But now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of brother if he is guilty of sexual immorality or greed, or is an idolater, reviler, drunkard, or swindler—not even to eat with such a one. For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge? God judges those outside. Purge the evil person from among you. (I Corinthians 5:9-13)

Some use the above passage as justification for shunning.

I'm not sure shunning is a practice of Christianity. Since Jesus spent time with the sinners: Matthew 11:19
 
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GingerBeer

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I'm not sure shunning is a practice of Christianity. Since Jesus spent time with the sinners: Matthew 11:19
And it is significant that the sinners Jesus spent time with were Jews, part of the people of God, "a brother" so to speak.
 
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GingerBeer

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For the reasons you've given No the bible doesnot teach 'shunning'.

The passage you've quoted is about gross physical sins and about those who have been challenged about their behaviour and have not tried to change.

The biblical practice is for a 'sinner' to be talked to by someone, then for the leadership to talk several times with the 'sinner', if there is no change then it is brought before the church and they are formally excluded from taking communion, they may attend church.

For them to be excluded from attending church there rejection of a christian life style would have to be blatent, as in the quote.

There are no grounds for shunning someone just because they are YEC or reject KJ only, are pedo baptists, etc

It is an abuse if it happens because of devorce, living together, or being sent to prison.
I agree, any shunning seems abusive to me; to have family refuse to even acknowledge you on the street or on the phone or letter or email just seems excessively cruel.
 
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GingerBeer

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I think it depends on how a disagreement gets handled. Which is about specifics.

IIRC years back on these forums a former pastor of the SDA explained what happened to him when he no longer believed in the third angels message doctrine. What occurred is they still allowed him to attend their church but he would no longer be a pastor.

Depending on what's going on, I believe Gal 6:10 would need to be factored in.
I was thinking of Amish, Mennonite, and Jehovah's witnesses kind of shunning which is very stringent and means no contact with family except when it is absolutely necessary for the family who are still in the religion. It's alleged to be a kind of "loving punishment" that is intended to draw you back by imposing isolation from friends, family, and what is familiar.
 
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RaymondG

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Does the bible teach shunning of friends and family whenever they change their mind about any belief taught in your church?

I wrote to you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral people— not at all meaning the sexually immoral of this world, or the greedy and swindlers, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world. But now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of brother if he is guilty of sexual immorality or greed, or is an idolater, reviler, drunkard, or swindler—not even to eat with such a one. For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge? God judges those outside. Purge the evil person from among you. (I Corinthians 5:9-13)

Some use the above passage as justification for shunning.
These verses could also mean for us to, when speaking to "sinners", not address them based on their outward appearances, but , instead to speak to the light in them....thereby bringing that light forward.

E.G. you are not speaking to a prostitute....but a future child of God..... therefore, associate not with prostitutes....but with children of God.
 
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Jonaitis

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Does the bible teach shunning of friends and family whenever they change their mind about any belief taught in your church?

I wrote to you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral people— not at all meaning the sexually immoral of this world, or the greedy and swindlers, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world. But now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of brother if he is guilty of sexual immorality or greed, or is an idolater, reviler, drunkard, or swindler—not even to eat with such a one. For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge? God judges those outside. Purge the evil person from among you. (I Corinthians 5:9-13)

Some use the above passage as justification for shunning.

I think this passage indicates that this is referring to church discipline within a body (maybe not so far to excommunicate), and regarding a member living in sin.
 
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GingerBeer

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I think this passage indicates that this is referring to church discipline within a body (maybe not so far to excommunicate), and regarding a member living in sin.
I agree yet it does appear to exclude social contact when it says "I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of brother if he is guilty of sexual immorality or greed, or is an idolater, reviler, drunkard, or swindler—not even to eat with such a one."
 
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Jonaitis

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I agree yet it does appear to exclude social contact when it says "I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of brother if he is guilty of sexual immorality or greed, or is an idolater, reviler, drunkard, or swindler—not even to eat with such a one."

I don't want to isolate this passage, so what came to my mind was the cross-reference of 2 Thessalonians 3:15 and Matthew 18:17. He should be constantly encouraged and exhorted about his particular problem.

The case of "shunning" in this case, as I had seen it, is not only to avoid fellowshipping with him in such a way as to encourage his own sinning, but specifically to avoid association in the open public. This is why we should not eat with such a one, because others will see us dining with a "brother" who is leading an unruly life, damaging our own witness and credibility. I believe the apostle is more concerned for that, than he is in the individual and private life.

Don't associate with a "Christian" outside the church and in the gathering of the church, your witness and your credibility is at stake, and the man will not be ashamed to repent.
 
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GingerBeer

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I don't want to isolate this passage, so what came to my mind was the cross-reference of 2 Thessalonians 3:15 and Matthew 18:17. He should be constantly encouraged and exhorted about his particular problem.

The case of "shunning" in this case, as I had seen it, is not only to avoid fellowshipping with him in such a way as to encourage his own sinning, but specifically to avoid association in the open public. This is why we should not eat with such a one, because others will see us dining with a "brother" who is leading an unruly life, damaging our own witness and credibility. I believe the apostle is more concerned for that, than he is in the individual and private life.

Don't associate with a "Christian" outside the church and in the gathering of the church, your witness and your credibility is at stake, and the man will not be ashamed to repent.
The bible can be a mixed feast with good things and horrible things in it. I think that Christians try very hard to read it in an exclusively good light as much as they can. Some advice in scripture is fairly bad advice when applied to situations today. So the scriptures that deal with shunning are also mixed and some are good and pastoral while others seem harsh.
 
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Does the bible teach shunning of friends and family whenever they change their mind about any belief taught in your church?

I wrote to you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral people— not at all meaning the sexually immoral of this world, or the greedy and swindlers, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world. But now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of brother if he is guilty of sexual immorality or greed, or is an idolater, reviler, drunkard, or swindler—not even to eat with such a one. For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge? God judges those outside. Purge the evil person from among you. (I Corinthians 5:9-13)

Some use the above passage as justification for shunning.

If someone in our church is in unrepentant sin like sexual immorality then we should confront them like Jesus taught in Matthew 18. If they refuse to repent then we should excommunicate them like Paul teaches in 1 Corinthians 5. Paul says not to associate with them. This at least means excommunication. I'm not sure that it must always include all social shunning.

But if someone changes their mind on whether or not they're going to baptize their babies or whether or not they believe women should be ordained then we certainly should not shun them. There must be room for disagreement on secondary issues in the body of Christ.
 
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chevyontheriver

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Does the bible teach shunning of friends and family whenever they change their mind about any belief taught in your church?

I wrote to you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral people— not at all meaning the sexually immoral of this world, or the greedy and swindlers, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world. But now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of brother if he is guilty of sexual immorality or greed, or is an idolater, reviler, drunkard, or swindler—not even to eat with such a one. For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge? God judges those outside. Purge the evil person from among you. (I Corinthians 5:9-13)

Some use the above passage as justification for shunning.
We don't do shunning, but we do rarely use excommunication. Excommunication is Biblical. It ought to be quite uncommon, but it should be expected from time to time.
 
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chevyontheriver

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I went to a very strict traditional Catholic church for 13 years. When I got divorced, I left, for several reasons. I fully expected to keep my friendships. Whether I was deliberately being shunned or not I cannot say, but 2 years down the road I am not in touch with a single person from that church. And these were the closest people in my life. I talked to them every day, our children played together. They were my emergency contacts and people who I had listed in advanced directives. We spent holidays and prayer time together. They were there when my daughter almost died. It still hurts a lot.
Wait. You were not kicked out? You left? Made new friends elsewhere? Had you stayed what might have been different?
 
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redleghunter

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Does the bible teach shunning of friends and family whenever they change their mind about any belief taught in your church?

I wrote to you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral people— not at all meaning the sexually immoral of this world, or the greedy and swindlers, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world. But now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of brother if he is guilty of sexual immorality or greed, or is an idolater, reviler, drunkard, or swindler—not even to eat with such a one. For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge? God judges those outside. Purge the evil person from among you. (I Corinthians 5:9-13)

Some use the above passage as justification for shunning.
Changing a theological view or teaching is not being discussed by Paul in 1 Corinthians 5. He's addressing immorality.

So if one has a church member or family member who is unrepentant of their sin, then Matthew 18:15-18 applies. When one is repentant of said sin then we are to restore them to the fellowship as in Galatians 6:1-2
 
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GingerBeer

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We don't do shunning, but we do rarely use excommunication. Excommunication is Biblical. It ought to be quite uncommon, but it should be expected from time to time.
Quite true. Occasional and without shunning.
 
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