“...be in subjection to the governing authorities” Romans 13

SkyWriting said:

Each should be fully convinced in his own mind.

2 Corinthians 3,3
And you show that you are a letter from Christ delivered by us, written not with ink but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of human hearts.

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good luck with your new religion..

THE W said:

good luck with your new religion..

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I'm not expecting people to discover what scripture says any faster than I did.

Revelation 2,17
He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To the one who conquers I will give some of the hidden manna, and I will give him a white stone, with a new name written on the stone that no one knows except the one who receives it.’

timothyu said:

Matthew 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 This is the first and great commandment.
39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

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The first is "The Reason Why."
The second is treating your neighbors, just as you would wish them to treat you.

2 Corinthians 3,3
And you show that you are a letter from Christ delivered by us, written not with ink but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of human hearts.

Hebrews 4,12
For the word of God is living and active, sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing to the division of soul and of spirit, of joints and of marrow, and discerning the thoughts and intentions of the heart.

Eloy Craft said:

Are you saying that in your opinion the obedience to local government would shift to God's when the jello solidifies?

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Obedience to local government authorities is God's will for us.

Hebrews 13,17
Obey your leaders and submit to them, for they are keeping watch over your souls, as those who will have to give an account. Let them do this with joy and not with groaning, for that would be of no advantage to you.

SkyWriting said:

Obedience to local government authorities is God's will for us.

Hebrews 13,17
Obey your leaders and submit to them, for they are keeping watch over your souls, as those who will have to give an account. Let them do this with joy and not with groaning, for that would be of no advantage to you.

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what if my internal dialogue with God tells me it's okay to disobey government?

Jesus tells Pilate where his authority over Him came from. Jesus describes God's authority descending from the religious leaders to the state.

John 19:11
Jesus answered him, “You would have no power over me unless it had been given you from above; therefore the one who handed me over to you is guilty of a greater sin.”

SkyWriting said:

Matthew 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 This is the first and great commandment.
39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
The first is "The Reason Why."
The second is treating your neighbors, just as you would wish them to treat you.

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That passage is the Law.

SkyWriting said:

Obedience to local government authorities is God's will for us.

Hebrews 13,17
Obey your leaders and submit to them, for they are keeping watch over your souls, as those who will have to give an account. Let them do this with joy and not with groaning, for that would be of no advantage to you.

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The leaders mentioned in that passage are Church leaders.

Eloy Craft said:

The leaders mentioned in that passage are Church leaders.

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Yes. Though you provided no support in the passage for that, you might be correct.
Still the concept of obeying all authority is covered is a few places:

In this case Peter was speaking to a council of bishops and to the High Priest, and telling them to take a hike:

Acts 5:29
But Peter and the apostles answered, “We must obey God rather than men.

In other passages we find:

1 Peter 2:13-17
Titus 3,1
1 Timothy 2,1-3

Psalms 22:28
Daniel 2:20-21
Deuteronomy 16:18-20

1 Timothy 6:15-16
Proverbs 21:1
Romans 13:4

John 19:11
Mark 3:24
Proverbs 8:15

John 19:10-11
Daniel 2:21
2 Chronicles 7:14

Exodus 18:21
Romans 8:28
1 Corinthians 14:40

Deuteronomy 1:13
Romans 12:21
Romans 13:2
Romans 13:6-7

The unconventional belief that Christians are to obey the world's governments over and above GOD's precepts & moral standard falls into the category of an "Unorthodox Christian theology ". It is a nonconformist belief that is outside of accepted Orthodox Christian teachings & according to the Statement of Faith of this Forum the presentation of unorthodox types of Christian belief are to be discussed in the "The Controversial Christian Theology forum."

SkyWriting said:

I'm not expecting people to discover what scripture says any faster than I did.

Revelation 2,17
He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To the one who conquers I will give some of the hidden manna, and I will give him a white stone, with a new name written on the stone that no one knows except the one who receives it.’

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Someone here said they "discovered" they were supposed to ignore most of the 66 books of scripture.

Pedra said:

The unconventional belief that Christians are to obey the world's governments over and above GOD's precepts & moral standard falls into the category of an "Unorthodox Christian theology ".

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Certainly no NT writer taught that.

If the government says "go ahead and kill the Baby" and God's Word says "do not kill" -- it is the duty of the Christian to "not kill".

BobRyan said:

Certainly no NT writer taught that.

If the government says "go ahead and kill the Baby" and God's Word says "do not kill" -- it is the duty of the Christian to "not kill".

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Yes , you are absolutely right Bob! May God bless you, in Christ.

Eloy Craft said:

The leaders mentioned in that passage are Church leaders.

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True of Heb 13... not true of Romans 13

timothyu said:

That passage is the Law.

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Indeed - right out of Lev 19:18 and Deut 6:5 -- the Law of Moses

SkyWriting said:

The Holy Spirit writes God's Laws on our heart. God's laws are no longer in ink or stone.

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What difference does that make?

THE W said:

so if the scripture clearly says something is sinful but my "internal dialogue"(presumably with God) tells me it's okay, I can go ahead with the action as it not being sin?

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Which passages?

Eloy Craft said:

What difference does that make?

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We are no longer judged by the written law, but instead are forgiven becasue of our intent and faith.

THE W said:

good luck with your new religion..

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It's from scripture alone.

BobRyan said:

Someone here said they "discovered" they were supposed to ignore most of the 66 books of scripture.

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Scripture uses the word OBSOLETE. Look it up.