Is the Bride of Christ a woman?

Andrea Blum

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I have no idea where you are misunderstanding me. I never contradicted your conclusion, only saying something to add to what you already said. Please, tell me where you think I am contradicting your understanding? I have no ideas what is upsetting you. Maybe, its something you think I am saying, but am not. Unless you tell me? I have no idea what's bothering you.

You wrote in this thread that the resurrected Old Testament believers will be the guests as friends of the bridegroom and you go on to quote John 3:29 which makes clear that John is a friend of the bridegroom. While it is true that John is NOT the 1 woman bride of Christ, it is clear that everyone who died before and after Christ's crucifixion make up the body of Christ, the church. The bride is 1 woman only, a Proverbs 31 woman, Yeshua's wife of Psalm 128:3 and Revelation 19:7. To be so arrogant to say that only Old Testament believers who died prior to Christ's crucifixion are the friends of the bridegroom and everyone who died after Christ's crucifixion make up the bride is absolutely insane! Totally arrogant! YOU WROTE THE FOLLOWING:

Resurrected OT believers will be the guests as friends of the bridegroom.
John the Baptist died before the Church age began. He remained an OT saint, not Church.
John knew that he was "a friend of the bridegroom." He knew he was not the bride.

To rebuke and correct your false statments: It is clear Paul wrote in Colossians 1:24 that the church is the body of Christ and this would include all Believers that have died before and after Christ's crucifixion. Colossians 1:24 KJV Who now rejoice in my sufferings for you, and fill up that which is behind of the afflictions of Christ in my flesh for his body's sake, which is the church.

You also wrote:

Its possible that the Tribulation saints will be the friends of the Bride. More study is needed on that one.
This is not possible as the Bride of Christ is 1 woman, 1 wife, not 144,000 wives, not wives and husbands, 1 wife (1 Timothy 3:2 & Revelation 19:7).

You also wrote:
The church collectively is His bride.
We in the Church are all parts of one body = Bride of Christ.

This would be false as it is clear according to Matthew 19 that marriage is between 1 man and 1 woman. And it is clear in Mark 12:25 that those who are raptured up (both the dead in Christ and also those who are alive at His coming) will not be given in marriage. Yeshua's wife will return from the wedding with Him as proven in Luke 12:36 and then the 5 wise who go out to meet the groom and the bride will be the same people mentioned in Mark 12:25 who will NOT be given in marriage! Mark 12:25 KJV For when they shall rise from the dead, they neither marry, nor are given in marriage; but are as the angels which are in heaven.
 
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Andy centek

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THE BRIDE -Who or What is it?
The bride is the New Israel, it is not a literal woman or a thing. Jesus Christ said that He would set up His bride. Looking at the wedding were He and His disciples were at, He gave out the New Wine, that is, the word of God to The Elect of God. Revelation also shows that the New Israel is His Bride.

Andy Centek
 
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GenemZ

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In the old testament--His people, the nation of Israel, is often referred to as His wife--usually--His adulterous wife:

Jer_3:20 Surely as a wife treacherously departeth from her husband, so have ye dealt treacherously with me, O house of Israel, saith the LORD.
Jer_3:8 And I saw, when for all the causes whereby backsliding Israel committed adultery I had put her away, and given her a bill of divorce; yet her treacherous sister Judah feared not, but went and played the harlot also.
Eze 16:31 In that thou buildest thine eminent place in the head of every way, and makest thine high place in every street; and hast not been as an harlot, in that thou scornest hire;
Eze 16:32 But as a wife that committeth adultery, which taketh strangers instead of her husband!

However, in the NT, Jesus calls the New Jerusalem the bride. He has gotten her ready for us. The city, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit call us home.

That means that both men and women were seen as His Bride!

We have the physical sex issue confused with the gender of immaterial souls. God created man in His Image - male AND female souls. Souls are masculine and other souls are feminine. Our eternal bodies will not sexually reproduce. But, our souls remain as assigned from birth. But, we will all be in submission to the Lord as a wife should be to her husband. Its about being a responder.
 
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mmksparbud

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That means that both men and women were seen as His Bride!

We have the physical sex issue confused with the gender of immaterial souls. God created man in His Image - male AND female souls. Souls are masculine and other souls are feminine. Our eternal bodies will not sexually reproduce. But, our souls remain as assigned from birth. Male


Gal_3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

There is no such thing as an immortal soul. The soul--spirit is also translated to mean "breath or person".

Mat_10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

Both are in the body. Without breath, there is no life.
Gen_2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

It is the same breath that He gave all creation.
Gen_6:17 And, behold, I, even I, do bring a flood of waters upon the earth, to destroy all flesh, wherein is the breath of life, from under heaven; and every thing that is in the earth shall die.
Gen_7:15 And they went in unto Noah into the ark, two and two of all flesh, wherein is the breath of life.
Gen_7:22 All in whose nostrils was the breath of life, of all that was in the dry land, died.


Lev_4:2 Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, If a soul shall sin through ignorance against any of the commandments of the LORD concerning things which ought not to be done, and shall do against any of them:

This means if any person sins.
 
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GenemZ

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You wrote in this thread that the resurrected Old Testament believers will be the guests as friends of the bridegroom and you go on to quote John 3:29 which makes clear that John is a friend of the bridegroom. While it is true that John is NOT the 1 woman bride of Christ, it is clear that everyone who died before and after Christ's crucifixion make up the body of Christ, the church.

Glad I asked. I had no idea.

If we are all the bride of Christ? Who are the ones that the Bride will reign with the Lord over during the Millennium? The Bride will have been with Christ in Heaven.

And, if there is neither Jew nor Gentile in Christ? Why the Rapture? The Bride is divided? And, why will it be 144,000 JEWS who will evangelize during the Tribulation? Why not Christians? Different dispensations...

And? If the Bride's citizenship is in Heaven? Who will be the citizens of the new earth? Abraham was promised land he did not live to see. It will be his eternal inheritance. Not as the Bride. As a friend of the Groom.
 
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GenemZ

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Gal_3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

There is no such thing as an immortal soul. The soul--spirit is also translated to mean "breath or person".

Mat_10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

Both are in the body. Without breath, there is no life.
Gen_2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

It is the same breath that He gave all creation.
Gen_6:17 And, behold, I, even I, do bring a flood of waters upon the earth, to destroy all flesh, wherein is the breath of life, from under heaven; and every thing that is in the earth shall die.
Gen_7:15 And they went in unto Noah into the ark, two and two of all flesh, wherein is the breath of life.
Gen_7:22 All in whose nostrils was the breath of life, of all that was in the dry land, died.


Lev_4:2 Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, If a soul shall sin through ignorance against any of the commandments of the LORD concerning things which ought not to be done, and shall do against any of them:

This means if any person sins.

"He gave it a run for the money." "He hit a home run." Words.. Playing games is not good.
 
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Tone

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I know most of the people think church is the bride, but does anyone think the bride is a real woman living on this earth? Could it be possible? I think Bible talks about one woman for example in Song of Solomon and psalm 45. If the church is the bride who are the wedding guests?

...probably not...
 
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GenemZ

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I know most of the people think church is the bride, but does anyone think the bride is a real woman living on this earth? Could it be possible?


"For we were all baptized by one Spirit so as to form one body-
-whether Jews or Gentiles, slave or free--and we were all given
the one Spirit to drink."

1 Cor 12:13


We collectively are that One Bride. All working in unison once the Lord can clear out all the garbage thinking we are all weighed down with now. No more false teachings once He takes over. All will be One.
 
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GenemZ

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Well then, please explain what you're post is trying to say! What word games do you mean?

Nephesh holds various meanings. Anyone can choose the wrong one to obfuscate. Paul said he wanted to be "absent from the body" and face to face with the Lord. Our souls are real substance in the spiritual realm.

Just like how Jesus cast out spirits. Spirits that were immaterial, yet that had minds and feelings, but no bodies of their own.

Our souls were created to exist forever. What our soul chooses for now determines where in eternity it will spend that existence. Either living in eternal life (in God) - - or everlasting torments.

Everlasting and eternal are not the same things. Everlasting had a beginning, but never ends. Eternal has no beginning and no end. When in God we will be able to be at any time in any place to study and observe, like stories designed to amuse and educate.
 
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mmksparbud

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Nephesh holds various meanings. Anyone can choose the wrong one to obfuscate. Paul said he wanted to be "absent from the body" and face to face with the Lord. Our souls are real substance in the spiritual realm.

Just like how Jesus cast out spirits. Spirits that were immaterial, yet that had minds and feelings, but no bodies of their own.

Our souls were created to exist forever. What our soul chooses for now determines where in eternity it will spend that existence. Either living in eternal life (in God) - - or everlasting torments.

Everlasting and eternal are not the same things. Everlasting had a beginning, but never ends. Eternal has no beginning and no end. When in God we will be able to be at any time in any place to study and observe, like stories designed to amuse and educate.

Jesus caste out spirits from another realm. They are the fallen angels-- we are not like them, they are not like us. They operate at a different dimension than us, we have to have our eyes opened to see angels. They definitely have bodies--just not at the same level as ours.

2Ki 6:17 And Elisha prayed, and said, LORD, I pray thee, open his eyes, that he may see. And the LORD opened the eyes of the young man; and he saw: and, behold, the mountain was full of horses and chariots of fire round about Elisha.

Psa_41:13 Blessed be the LORD God of Israel from everlasting, and to everlasting. Amen, and Amen.

Again---Gen_2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

We became a living person. Without the breath of life from God--we do not exist. You will not find the words "immortal soul" anywhere in the bible.
 
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GenemZ

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Jesus caste out spirits from another realm. They are the fallen angels-- we are not like them, they are not like us. They operate at a different dimension than us, we have to have our eyes opened to see angels. They definitely have bodies--just not at the same level as ours.
Please....


Angels have bodies. Fallen angels have been denied their bodies. Fallen angels are their spirit without a body. The angel's spirit is to angels as a soul is to man. Soul and spirit are different invisible entities that think and reason. Bodies are only the biological

Both angel spirit and human soul are immaterial.

Immaterial souls and spirits that are invisible in the material creation, yet, a living essence that can be seen and heard without a body only in the spirit dimension.

Human souls having no body can be seen in Heaven.

"When he opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls
of those who had been slain because of the word of God and
the testimony they had maintained. They (souls) called out in
a loud voice, “How long, Sovereign Lord, holy and true, until
you judge the inhabitants of the earth and avenge our blood?
” Rev 6:9-10​

Human souls without a body can be seen and heard in Heaven. In the Resurrection these souls will enter into everlasting physical life to experience the created material worlds of the future.
 
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mmksparbud

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Please....


Angels have bodies. Fallen angels have been denied their bodies. Fallen angels are their spirit without a body. The angel's spirit is to angels as a soul is to man. Soul and spirit are different invisible entities that think and reason. Bodies are only the biological

Both angel spirit and human soul are immaterial.

Immaterial souls and spirits that are invisible in the material creation, yet, a living essence that can be seen and heard without a body only in the spirit dimension.

Human souls having no body can be seen in Heaven.

"When he opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls
of those who had been slain because of the word of God and
the testimony they had maintained. They (souls) called out in
a loud voice, “How long, Sovereign Lord, holy and true, until
you judge the inhabitants of the earth and avenge our blood?
” Rev 6:9-10​

Human souls without a body can be seen and heard in Heaven. In the Resurrection these souls will enter into everlasting physical life to experience the created material worlds of the future.



If you want to believe that God keeps the souls of the saved stuck under an altar for eons--You have the right to your believes. I can not agree. Those are not actual horses--these are symbolic. Just about all of Revelation is symbolic. There would be no need of a resurr4ection if the souls of everyone go to heaven or hell upon death. God does not need to have the original body--He resurrects the saved from death. The determination of who is saved or lost is not settled until Jesus work as High Priest in the Most Holy Place in the heavenly sanctuary is finished. At which point He is done and comes for us. The decisions have been made.

Rev 22:10 And he saith unto me, Seal not the sayings of the prophecy of this book: for the time is at hand.
Rev 22:11 He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.
Rev 22:12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.
Rev 22:13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.

Rev_16:17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.

Rev_21:6 And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.
 
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GenemZ

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If you want to believe that God keeps the souls of the saved stuck under an altar for eons-

Where did you get "eons" from? :scratch:

Those souls were only recently martyred (during the Tribulation) awaiting and praying for God's revenge.

Do you believe your soul is only an energizing force? That the real you is a living body?
 
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GenemZ

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There would be no need of a resurr4ection if the souls of everyone go to heaven or hell upon death.


Why not?

Resurrection provides an immortal physical body for those in eternity as the means to experience all the new and radically different physical creations that will take place.

There will be a new heavens and new earth. = new kind of bodies.

Those will be physical creations the resurrections bodies will fit right in with. That eternal new heavens and new earth are not to be confused with the "transformed" new heavens and earth that will only last a thousand years for the time of the Millennial reign of Christ.
 
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mmksparbud

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Where did you get "eons" from? :scratch:

Those souls were only recently martyred (during the Tribulation) awaiting and praying for God's revenge.

Do you believe your soul is only an energizing force? That the real you is a living body?

Rev 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
Rev 6:10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
Rev 6:11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

Where does it say they were recently slain? If it was recent, why are they asking "How long?" It just says these were the souls of them that were slain for the word of God. Nothing about it having been just recently.

So---what was Adam before he got that body of dust? Nothing. What was he until God breathed in His nostrils?---a pile of dust. And what would he have remained if God had not breathed into him?---a pile of dust. It was the same breath that God gave to every living creature---you believe that birds and animals and fish have souls floating in heaven also?


Why not?

Resurrection provides an immortal physical body for those in eternity as the means to experience all the new and radically different physical creations that will take place.

There will be a new heavens and new earth. = new kind of bodies.

Those will be physical creations the resurrections bodies will fit right in with. That eternal new heavens and new earth are not to be confused with the "transformed" new heavens and earth that will only last a thousand years for the time of the Millennial reign of Christ.

The new heavens and the new earth are not until after the 1000 years. We are given new bodies at the resurrection. At which time the earth is destroyed by His coming.

2Pe_3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
2Pe_3:12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?


1Co 15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
1Co 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
1Co 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
1Co 15:53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
1Co 15:54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.





If the souls were up there--God could give them a physical body--He doesn't need the old one. He calls the dead to life--not the living. The 1000 years is in heaven---. It is after the 1000 years that the judgment takes place and the earth is made new. Then the city comes down from heaven.
Rev 21:1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
Rev 21:2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.


During the 1000 years, the saved are with Jesus in heaven--the wicked remain dead until they are resurrected for their judgment.

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.



When Jesus comes, the saved dead are resurrected, the saved living are all transformed into their new bodies---the earth is burned up, all the living wicked die with the brightness of His coming. the wicked dead remain so--we spend 1000 years in heaven with Jesus then He comes down with the city
Rev 20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
Rev 20:8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
Rev 20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
Rev 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

No one is in either heaven or hell right now---well--except for Moses, Enoch and Elijah---and maybe those that were resurrected at His death--though it doesn't say they went to heaven with Him.
 
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GenemZ

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Rev 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
Rev 6:10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
Rev 6:11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

Where does it say they were recently slain? If it was recent, why are they asking "How long?" It just says these were the souls of them that were slain for the word of God. Nothing about it having been just recently.

Revelation chapter six covers what will take place the seven year Tribulation. Those souls were slain by the Antichrist system of the Tribulation. Seven years is hardly considered aeons. Read all of chapter Six.
 
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GenemZ

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The new heavens and the new earth are not until after the 1000 years. We are given new bodies at the resurrection. At which time the earth is destroyed by His coming.

2Pe_3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
2Pe_3:12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

There will be two New heavens earth. The first will be the Millennium. Isaiah refers to that 1000 year period as being a new heavens and earth. Man shall learn war no more and the lion will lay down with the lamb.

20 “Never again will there be in it
an infant who lives but a few days,
or an old man who does not live out his years;
the one who dies at a hundred
will be thought a mere child;
the one who fails to reach a hundred

will be considered accursed." Isa 65:20​


A person will be considered a mere child if they die at age one hundred! Those who live right will live to the end of the 1000 year reign of Christ.

Here is that verse in Isaiah again as it appears in its context. Notice that Isaiah speaks of a new heavens and earth as well.

17 “See, I will create
new heavens and a new earth.
The former things will not be remembered,
nor will they come to mind.

18 But be glad and rejoice forever
in what I will create,
for I will create Jerusalem to be a delight
and its people a joy.

19 I will rejoice over Jerusalem
and take delight in my people;
the sound of weeping and of crying
will be heard in it no more.

20 “Never again will there be in it
an infant who lives but a few days,
or an old man who does not live out his years;

the one who dies at a hundred
will be thought a mere child;
the one who fails to reach a hundred

will be considered accursed."


Now, the new heavens and earth you pointed to? It is to be the final new heavens and earth... The "Home of Righteousness." There will be no more death in that new heavens and earth. Everyone will have a resurrection body. And, all unbelievers and Satan will be in the Lake of Fire forever.

I was once confused by that one too. It took a while before I learned there are to be two different types of new heavens and earth in the future.
 
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