What is the obligation of the Christian?

klutedavid

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ahhh the solution of form "let's talk about something else"?? while ignoring every point raised?



1 Corinthians 6:16-18
Or do you not know that the one who joins himself to a prostitute is one body with her? For He says, “The two shall become one flesh.” But the one who joins himself to the Lord is one spirit with Him. Flee immorality. Every other sin that a man commits is outside the body, but the immoral man sins against his own body.


1 Cor 6
18 Flee sexual immorality. Every sin that a man does is outside the body, but he who commits sexual immorality sins against his own body. 19 Or do you not know that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and you are not your own?

1 John 3:4 "SIN IS transgression of the LAW"

1 Cor 6
7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren.
9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 Such were some of you;

It is still a "sin" to "take God's name in vain" Ex 20:7 even in the NT
The LAW of God written on the heart Jer 31:31-33 the LAW known to Jeremiah -- under the New Covenant.

And that LAW is the one where "the fifth commandment is the first commandment with a promise" Eph 6:2
The quotation (1 Corinthians 6:16-18) is from that same chapter we were discussing. A little more context added to the previous verses.

You said, 'Let's talk about something else'. I do not understand what you are saying?

We need the full context in order to understand passages in the scripture.

You then proceeded to quote from John and Jeremiah. I feel like I have entered the twilight zone. Bob, your doing what you just accused me of doing.
 
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BobRyan

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We have no "obligation" to do anything after the Grace is given with forgiveness. .

Until you read the writings of Paul.
1 Cor 6
7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren.
9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 Such were some of you;

Rom 6
12 Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its lusts, 13 and do not go on presenting the members of your body to sin as instruments of unrighteousness; but present yourselves to God as those alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness to God. 14 For sin shall not be master over you, for you are not under law but under grace.

15 What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? May it never be! 16 Do you not know that when you present yourselves to someone as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin resulting in death, or of obedience resulting in righteousness?

You can defraud me all you like of everything .

Your response to the mere post of scripture... noted.

Bob, how about quoting the next verse from the scripture (1 Corinthians 6). You left it hanging in the air giving people the idea, that they must now obey the law.

The one that proves beyond all doubt that the 1 Cor 6 instruction applies to saved saints who are in danger of forgetting the reality and applicability of the 1 Cor 6 warning Paul writes about?

Or did you suppose it said "forget what I just said - this is exactly the kind of instruction saints should ignore"???

This is the part where you let us know how you hope it will help the case you would like to make. I know how it helps the point I highlight in 1 Cor 6. Do you know how it might help your opposition to 1 Cor 6 texts quoted??

Relax Bob, your posts are laden with accusations.

That's an interesting accusation.

I asked you for your view -- how you thought the verse might possibly help your argument. Until you do that I am simply guessing at what your thinking might be there.

Here is the verse you omitted from your quotation of the scripture and a very important verse.

1 Corinthians 6:9-11
Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God

Here is the context verse for that statement that I quoted and that you just omitted.

7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren



. Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.

Indeed - as already stated - this proves that it is to the born-again saved Christian that this dire warning is given. I have already stated that this is devastating to your POV.

It is the "once saved" that are getting this "it is already a defeat for you" dire warning along with "do not be deceived".


This verse passage from 1 Corinthians 6, is not just talking about breaking the ten commandments. Because Paul mentions fornicators, the effeminate, homosexuals, drunkards, e.t.c. Paul uses the law and the prophets

Indeed - reminds them of sin as defined by scripture - and then tells them that such a group of sinners - they used to be before getting saved. (Still can't see how this is helping your argument)


Now they are washed, sanctified, and justified in and through Jesus Christ - yet still under the dire warning with the summary statement "it is already a defeat for you" -- the very verse you just omitted from your quote of the texts I just gave you. Paul is telling them they cannot go down the "already a defeat for you path" without "consequences"

Were we simply "not supposed to notice"???

9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God.


Now Bob, how about you explain this passage from 1 Corinthians 6.

ahhh the solution of form "let's talk about something else"?? while ignoring every point raised?



1 Corinthians 6:16-18
Or do you not know that the one who joins himself to a prostitute is one body with her? For He says, “The two shall become one flesh.” But the one who joins himself to the Lord is one spirit with Him. Flee immorality. Every other sin that a man commits is outside the body, but the immoral man sins against his own body.[/QUOTE]


1 Cor 6
18 Flee sexual immorality. Every sin that a man does is outside the body, but he who commits sexual immorality sins against his own body. 19 Or do you not know that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and you are not your own?

1 John 3:4 "SIN IS transgression of the LAW"

1 Cor 6
7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren.
9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 Such were some of you;

It is still a "sin" to "take God's name in vain" Ex 20:7 even in the NT
The LAW of God written on the heart Jer 31:31-33 the LAW known to Jeremiah -- under the New Covenant.

And that LAW is the one where "the fifth commandment is the first commandment with a promise" Eph 6:2

The quotation (1 Corinthians 6:16-18) is from that same chapter we were discussing.

Same chapter but you did not address any point that was raised in the post that quotes the chapter ...
How "instructive".

1 Cor 6:1 is also "in the chapter" --- "Dare any of you, having a matter against another, go to law before the unrighteous, and not before the saints? "

But does not address any of the points raised.


You said, 'Let's talk about something else'. I do not understand what you are saying?

I said that you ignored every verse , every point raised in 1 Cor 6 -- in the post you were responding to and using a "solution" that was of the form "Let's talk about something else"
 
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BobRyan

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I keep posting this... it keeps getting ignored

==================================
1 Cor 6
7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren.
9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 Such were some of you;

Rom 6
12 Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its lusts, 13 and do not go on presenting the members of your body to sin as instruments of unrighteousness; but present yourselves to God as those alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness to God. 14 For sin shall not be master over you, for you are not under law but under grace.

15 What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? May it never be! 16 Do you not know that when you present yourselves to someone as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin resulting in death, or of obedience resulting in righteousness?

You can defraud me all you like of everything .

Your response to the mere post of scripture... noted.

Bob, how about quoting the next verse from the scripture (1 Corinthians 6). You left it hanging in the air giving people the idea, that they must now obey the law.

The one that proves beyond all doubt that the 1 Cor 6 instruction applies to saved saints who are in danger of forgetting the reality and applicability of the 1 Cor 6 warning Paul writes about?

Or did you suppose it said "forget what I just said - this is exactly the kind of instruction saints should ignore"???

This is the part where you let us know how you hope it will help the case you would like to make. I know how it helps the point I highlight in 1 Cor 6. Do you know how it might help your opposition to 1 Cor 6 texts quoted??

Relax Bob, your posts are laden with accusations.

That's an interesting accusation.

I asked you for your view -- how you thought the verse might possibly help your argument. Until you do that I am simply guessing at what your thinking might be there.

Here is the verse you omitted from your quotation of the scripture and a very important verse.

1 Corinthians 6:9-11
Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God

Here is the context verse for that statement that I quoted and that you just omitted.

7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren



. Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.

Indeed - as already stated - this proves that it is to the born-again saved Christian that this dire warning is given. I have already stated that this is devastating to your POV.

It is the "once saved" that are getting this "it is already a defeat for you" dire warning along with "do not be deceived".


This verse passage from 1 Corinthians 6, is not just talking about breaking the ten commandments. Because Paul mentions fornicators, the effeminate, homosexuals, drunkards, e.t.c. Paul uses the law and the prophets

Indeed "Law AND the prophets"- reminds them of sin as defined by scripture - and then tells them that such a group of sinners - they used to be before getting saved.

"neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor the covetous," -- -- Lev 18 and Ex 20.

(Still can't see how this is helping your argument)


Now they are washed, sanctified, and justified in and through Jesus Christ - yet still under the dire warning with the summary statement "it is already a defeat for you" -- the very verse you just omitted from your quote of the texts I just gave you. Paul is telling them they cannot go down the "already a defeat for you path" without "consequences"

Were we simply "not supposed to notice"???

9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God.
===================================

Responses to it - include the post - then respond to not a single point raised or verse quoted.

How "transparent" that is to the objective unbiased reader...is pretty easy to see.
 
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klutedavid

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I keep posting this... it keeps getting ignored

==================================
1 Cor 6
7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren.
9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 Such were some of you;

Rom 6
12 Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its lusts, 13 and do not go on presenting the members of your body to sin as instruments of unrighteousness; but present yourselves to God as those alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness to God. 14 For sin shall not be master over you, for you are not under law but under grace.

15 What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? May it never be! 16 Do you not know that when you present yourselves to someone as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin resulting in death, or of obedience resulting in righteousness?



Your response to the mere post of scripture... noted.



The one that proves beyond all doubt that the 1 Cor 6 instruction applies to saved saints who are in danger of forgetting the reality and applicability of the 1 Cor 6 warning Paul writes about?

Or did you suppose it said "forget what I just said - this is exactly the kind of instruction saints should ignore"???

This is the part where you let us know how you hope it will help the case you would like to make. I know how it helps the point I highlight in 1 Cor 6. Do you know how it might help your opposition to 1 Cor 6 texts quoted??



That's an interesting accusation.

I asked you for your view -- how you thought the verse might possibly help your argument. Until you do that I am simply guessing at what your thinking might be there.



Here is the context verse for that statement that I quoted and that you just omitted.

7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren





Indeed - as already stated - this proves that it is to the born-again saved Christian that this dire warning is given. I have already stated that this is devastating to your POV.

It is the "once saved" that are getting this "it is already a defeat for you" dire warning along with "do not be deceived".




Indeed - reminds them of sin as defined by scripture - and then tells them that such a group of sinners - they used to be before getting saved. (Still can't see how this is helping your argument)


Now they are washed, sanctified, and justified in and through Jesus Christ - yet still under the dire warning with the summary statement "it is already a defeat for you" -- the very verse you just omitted from your quote of the texts I just gave you. Paul is telling them they cannot go down the "already a defeat for you path" without "consequences"

Were we simply "not supposed to notice"???

9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God.
===================================

Responses to it - include the post - then respond to not a single point raised or verse quoted.

How "transparent" that is to the objective unbiased reader...is pretty easy to see.
Here you are Bob.

1 Cor 6
7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren.

A defeat for the Corinthians is not good but it also is not a fatal behavior. Paul is encouraging the Corinthians to behave themselves, and above all in the way they treat each other.

No doubt the legalist would interpret that somewhat more darkly, doom, doom, doom.

The bottom line according to Paul follows.

1 Corinthians 6:18
Flee sexual immorality. Every other sin that a man commits is outside the body, but the sexually immoral man sins against his own body.

One of a handful of commandments that gentile Christians were given at the Council of Jerusalem (Acts 15:29).
 
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klutedavid

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Hello Bob.

You made the following statement.
It is the "once saved" that are getting this "it is already a defeat for you" dire warning along with "do not be deceived".
I think you think, that I believe in once saved always saved. Not so Bob, a person can drift in their faith to a point of not believing in Jesus.

deed - as already stated - this proves that it is to the born-again saved Christian that this dire warning is given. I have already stated that this is devastating to your
It is not a dire warning, it is a correction intended to guide the Corinthians. Into loving one another as commanded by Jesus, not behaving as the world does so often.
 
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BobRyan

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1 Cor 6
7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren.
9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 Such were some of you;


Here you are Bob.
A defeat for the Corinthians is not good but it also is not a fatal behavior.

Paul does not say they have no hope of salvation - he points out that the path they are on leads to doom. He is warning them rather than pronouncing their demise.

in that warning he points to that which does not get you to the "Kingdom of God" - in fact disqualifies you from it. "Be not deceived" says Paul - choosing outright sin and rebellion gets the reward of hell - no matter that one has in the past been saved. (Interesting he does not claim that the only way to be excluded from the kingdom of God is to choose to think that Christ is not the Son of God)

in that warning Paul clearly upholds the "sin is transgression of the LAW" standard of 1 John 3:4 and goes father by not simply saying "hey you are sinning" but rather makes the point that they should not be "deceived" into thinking that such actions lead to life rather than death.
 
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BobRyan

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1 Cor 6
7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren.
9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 Such were some of you;

It is not a dire warning, .

Rom 6
12 Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its lusts, 13 and do not go on presenting the members of your body to sin as instruments of unrighteousness; but present yourselves to God as those alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness to God. 14 For sin shall not be master over you, for you are not under law but under grace.

15 What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? May it never be! 16 Do you not know that when you present yourselves to someone as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin resulting in death, or of obedience resulting in righteousness?

It is not a dire warning, .

...
Bob, how about quoting the next verse from the scripture (1 Corinthians 6). You left it hanging in the air giving people the idea, that they must now obey the law.

The one that proves beyond all doubt that the 1 Cor 6 instruction applies to saved saints who are in danger of forgetting the reality and applicability of the 1 Cor 6 warning Paul writes about?

Or did you suppose it said "forget what I just said - this is exactly the kind of instruction saints should ignore"???

This is the part where you let us know how you hope it will help the case you would like to make. I know how it helps the point I highlight in 1 Cor 6. Do you know how it might help your opposition to 1 Cor 6 texts quoted??

Here is the verse you omitted from your quotation of the scripture and a very important verse.

1 Corinthians 6:9-11
Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God

Here is the context verse for that statement that I quoted and that you just omitted.

7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren



. Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.

Indeed - as already stated - this proves that it is to the born-again saved Christian that this dire warning is given. I have already stated that this is devastating to your POV.

It is the "once saved" that are getting this "it is already a defeat for you" dire warning along with "do not be deceived".


This verse passage from 1 Corinthians 6, is not just talking about breaking the ten commandments. Because Paul mentions fornicators, the effeminate, homosexuals, drunkards, e.t.c. Paul uses the law and the prophets

Indeed "Law AND the prophets"- reminds them of sin as defined by scripture - and then tells them that such a group of sinners - they used to be before getting saved.

"neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor the covetous," -- -- Lev 18 and Ex 20.

(Still can't see how this is helping your argument)


Now they are washed, sanctified, and justified in and through Jesus Christ - yet still under the dire warning with the summary statement "it is already a defeat for you" -- the very verse you just omitted from your quote of the texts I just gave you. Paul is telling them they cannot go down the "already a defeat for you path" without "consequences"

Were we simply "not supposed to notice"???

9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God.


Hello Bob.
You made the following statement.

I think you think, that I believe in once saved always saved. Not so Bob, a person can drift in their faith to a point of not believing in Jesus.

I simply point out that these folks had been saved.


1 Cor 6
7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren.
9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 Such were some of you;

It is not a dire warning, .

Not sure if you are being serious or are showing what you believe to be a flawed summation of "will not inherit the kingdom of God"
 
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ace of hearts

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ahhh the solution of form "let's talk about something else"?? while ignoring every point raised?



1 Corinthians 6:16-18
Or do you not know that the one who joins himself to a prostitute is one body with her? For He says, “The two shall become one flesh.” But the one who joins himself to the Lord is one spirit with Him. Flee immorality. Every other sin that a man commits is outside the body, but the immoral man sins against his own body.


1 Cor 6
18 Flee sexual immorality. Every sin that a man does is outside the body, but he who commits sexual immorality sins against his own body. 19 Or do you not know that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and you are not your own?

1 John 3:4 "SIN IS transgression of the LAW"

1 Cor 6
7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren.
9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 Such were some of you;

It is still a "sin" to "take God's name in vain" Ex 20:7 even in the NT
The LAW of God written on the heart Jer 31:31-33 the LAW known to Jeremiah -- under the New Covenant.

And that LAW is the one where "the fifth commandment is the first commandment with a promise" Eph 6:2



Same chapter but you did not address any point that was raised in the post that quotes the chapter ...
How "instructive".

1 Cor 6:1 is also "in the chapter" --- "Dare any of you, having a matter against another, go to law before the unrighteous, and not before the saints? "

But does not address any of the points raised.




I said that you ignored every verse , every point raised in 1 Cor 6 -- in the post you were responding to and using a "solution" that was of the form "Let's talk about something else"
I don't think anything was ignored. I do think you don't want to talk about the partial verse you quoted. He's got a legit question.
 
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BobRyan

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We have no "obligation" to do anything after the Grace is given with forgiveness. .

Until you read the writings of Paul.
1 Cor 6
7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren.
9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 Such were some of you;

Rom 6
12 Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its lusts, 13 and do not go on presenting the members of your body to sin as instruments of unrighteousness; but present yourselves to God as those alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness to God. 14 For sin shall not be master over you, for you are not under law but under grace.

15 What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? May it never be! 16 Do you not know that when you present yourselves to someone as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin resulting in death, or of obedience resulting in righteousness?

You can defraud me all you like of everything .

Your response to the mere post of scripture... noted.

Bob, how about quoting the next verse from the scripture (1 Corinthians 6). You left it hanging in the air giving people the idea, that they must now obey the law.

The one that proves beyond all doubt that the 1 Cor 6 instruction applies to saved saints who are in danger of forgetting the reality and applicability of the 1 Cor 6 warning Paul writes about?

Or did you suppose it said "forget what I just said - this is exactly the kind of instruction saints should ignore"???

This is the part where you let us know how you hope it will help the case you would like to make. I know how it helps the point I highlight in 1 Cor 6. Do you know how it might help your opposition to 1 Cor 6 texts quoted??

Relax Bob, your posts are laden with accusations.

That's an interesting accusation.

I asked you for your view -- how you thought the verse might possibly help your argument. Until you do that I am simply guessing at what your thinking might be there.

Here is the verse you omitted from your quotation of the scripture and a very important verse.

1 Corinthians 6:9-11
Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God


Here is the context verse for that statement that I quoted and that you just omitted.

7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren



. Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.

Indeed - as already stated - this proves that it is to the born-again saved Christian that this dire warning is given. I have already stated that this is devastating to your POV.

It is the "once saved" that are getting this "it is already a defeat for you" dire warning along with "do not be deceived".


This verse passage from 1 Corinthians 6, is not just talking about breaking the ten commandments. Because Paul mentions fornicators, the effeminate, homosexuals, drunkards, e.t.c. Paul uses the law and the prophets

Indeed - reminds them of sin as defined by scripture - and then tells them that such a group of sinners - they used to be before getting saved. (Still can't see how this is helping your argument)


Now they are washed, sanctified, and justified in and through Jesus Christ - yet still under the dire warning with the summary statement "it is already a defeat for you" -- the very verse you just omitted from your quote of the texts I just gave you. Paul is telling them they cannot go down the "already a defeat for you path" without "consequences"

Were we simply "not supposed to notice"???

9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God.


Now Bob, how about you explain this passage from 1 Corinthians 6.

ahhh the solution of form "let's talk about something else"?? while ignoring every point raised?



1 Corinthians 6:16-18
Or do you not know that the one who joins himself to a prostitute is one body with her? For He says, “The two shall become one flesh.” But the one who joins himself to the Lord is one spirit with Him. Flee immorality. Every other sin that a man commits is outside the body, but the immoral man sins against his own body.[/QUOTE]


1 Cor 6
18 Flee sexual immorality. Every sin that a man does is outside the body, but he who commits sexual immorality sins against his own body. 19 Or do you not know that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and you are not your own?

1 John 3:4 "SIN IS transgression of the LAW"

1 Cor 6
7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren.
9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 Such were some of you;

It is still a "sin" to "take God's name in vain" Ex 20:7 even in the NT
The LAW of God written on the heart Jer 31:31-33 the LAW known to Jeremiah -- under the New Covenant.

And that LAW is the one where "the fifth commandment is the first commandment with a promise" Eph 6:2

The quotation (1 Corinthians 6:16-18) is from that same chapter we were discussing.

Same chapter but you did not address any point that was raised in the post that quotes the chapter ...
How "instructive".

1 Cor 6:1 is also "in the chapter" --- "Dare any of you, having a matter against another, go to law before the unrighteous, and not before the saints? "

But does not address any of the points raised.


You said, 'Let's talk about something else'. I do not understand what you are saying?

I said that you ignored every verse , every point raised in 1 Cor 6 -- in the post you were responding to and using a "solution" that was of the form "Let's talk about something else"

I don't think anything was ignored.

Fine - the posts are here - show us ...
 
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klutedavid

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Hello Bob.
Until you read the writings of Paul.
1 Cor 6
7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren.
9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 Such were some of you;
That was what some of these folk were before they became Christians.
Rom 6
12 Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its lusts, 13 and do not go on presenting the members of your body to sin as instruments of unrighteousness; but present yourselves to God as those alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness to God. 14 For sin shall not be master over you, for you are not under law but under grace Rom 6
12 Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its lusts, 13 and do not go on presenting the members of your body to sin as instruments of unrighteousness; but present yourselves to God as those alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness to God. 14 For sin shall not be master over you, for you are not under law b.

15 What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? May it never be! 16 Do you not know that when you present yourselves to someone as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin resulting in death, or of obedience resulting in righteousness?
We are not under the law!
Your response to the mere post of scripture... noted.
I read these verses but the passage from Corinthians you cutoff to early.
The one that proves beyond all doubt that the 1 Cor 6 instruction applies to saved saints who are in danger of forgetting the reality and applicability of the 1 Cor 6 warning Paul writes about?
Incorrect Bob, 'such were some of you', is the past tense. Paul's list of sins were the behavior of these people before they became Christians.

The warning was given to the saints regarding their current behavior towards one another. The warning was in relation to the lawsuits, the divisions.

1 Corinthians 6:7
Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another.

Now Bob, having a lawsuit against a Christian brother is not listed in the law as a sin. So legally speaking these folk in Corinth have not breached the law, thus they have not sinned. That is using your definition of sin (1 John 3:4).

According to my interpretation, these folk at Corinth have breached the primary command given by Jesus Christ.

1 John 3:14
We know that we have passed out of death into life, because we love the brethren. He who does not love abides in death.

Your interpretation is invalid and does not address the problem of why the lawsuits were sinful. My interpretation explains why any poor behavior against another Christian, is abiding in death. Hence the lawsuits were the polar opposite of the royal command, the law of Christ.

Now for some more of your post.
Or did you suppose it said "forget what I just said - this is exactly the kind of instruction saints should ignore"???
Just read the scripture and somehow find the ultimate commandment, whereby Bob, you will have life and not death.
This is the part where you let us know how you hope it will help the case you would like to make. I know how it helps the point I highlight in 1 Cor 6. Do you know how it might help your opposition to 1 Cor 6 texts quoted??
No opposition to any text in the letter to the Corinthians.
I asked you for your view -- how you thought the verse might possibly help your argument. Until you do that I am simply guessing at what your thinking might be there.
No need to guess, agape love is what Paul will stress in this letter to the Corinthians. Loving other Christians is life, legalism is death.
ahhh the solution of form "let's talk about something else"?? while ignoring every point raised?
You still need to explain the following text.

1 Corinthians 6:16-18
Or do you not know that the one who joins himself to a prostitute is one body with her? For He says, “The two shall become one flesh.” But the one who joins himself to the Lord is one spirit with Him. Flee immorality. Every other sin that a man commits is outside the body, but the immoral man sins against his own body.
 
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BobRyan

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We have no "obligation" to do anything after the Grace is given with forgiveness. .

Until you read the writings of Paul.
1 Cor 6
7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren.
9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 Such were some of you;

Rom 6
12 Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its lusts, 13 and do not go on presenting the members of your body to sin as instruments of unrighteousness; but present yourselves to God as those alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness to God. 14 For sin shall not be master over you, for you are not under law but under grace.

15 What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? May it never be! 16 Do you not know that when you present yourselves to someone as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin resulting in death, or of obedience resulting in righteousness?

Hello Bob.

1 Cor 6
7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren.
9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 Such were some of you;

That was what some of these folk were before they became Christians.

Nope. That is Paul writing to Christians about their current condition and warning them that the kind of people listed -- do not go to heaven. And that they should not be "deceived" into thinking they can live that way and still "get heaven".

Certainly BEFORE they became Christians and were living that way - they had to have already been convinced to turn from law breaking "sin" and accept the Gospel "born again". But now that they are born-again they are once again having to be reminded "not to be deceived" into thinking they can live that way and still "get heaven for it".

======================next

Rom 6
12 Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its lusts, 13 and do not go on presenting the members of your body to sin as instruments of unrighteousness; but present yourselves to God as those alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness to God. 14 For sin shall not be master over you, for you are not under law but under grace.

15 What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? May it never be! 16 Do you not know that when you present yourselves to someone as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin resulting in death, or of obedience resulting in righteousness?

We are not under the law!

The term "under the law" as defined in Romans... Romans 3:19-20 - means under the condemnation of the law as a lost person.

In Romans 6 Paul contrasts the lost with the saved...

the saved:
15 What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? May it never be!

the lost:
16 Do you not know that when you present yourselves to someone as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin resulting in death,

the saved
or of obedience resulting in righteousness
 
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SkyWriting

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There seems to be a holy war about what the Christian is obligated to preform after being born again. I'd like to see both sides of this war supported with Scripture.
Colossians 3:23
Whatever you do, work heartily, as for the Lord and not for men,

Galatians 6:5
For each will have to bear his own load.

Luke 12:48
But the one who did not know, and did what deserved a beating, will receive a light beating. Everyone to whom much was given, of him much will be required, and from him to whom they entrusted much, they will demand the more.

2 Timothy 1:7
For God gave us a spirit not of fear but of power and love and self-control.

2 Thessalonians 3:6
Now we command you, brothers, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you keep away from any brother who is walking in idleness and not in accord with the tradition that you received from us.

Galatians 6:7
Do not be deceived: God is not mocked, for whatever one sows, that will he also reap.

2 Corinthians 5:10
For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may receive what is due for what he has done in the body, whether good or evil.

Jeremiah 31:33
But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the Lord: I will put my law within them, and I will write it on their hearts. And I will be their God, and they shall be my people.

James 2:10
For whoever keeps the whole law but fails in one point has become accountable for all of it.

James 2:8
If you really fulfill the royal law according to the Scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you are doing well.
 
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ace of hearts

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Until you read the writings of Paul.
1 Cor 6
7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren.
9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 Such were some of you;
I agree with your quote from 1 Cor 6:9-10. That isn't what you're really after.
 
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BobRyan

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read the writings of Paul.
1 Cor 6
7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren.
9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 Such were some of you;

Rom 6
12 Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its lusts, 13 and do not go on presenting the members of your body to sin as instruments of unrighteousness; but present yourselves to God as those alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness to God. 14 For sin shall not be master over you, for you are not under law but under grace.

15 What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? May it never be! 16 Do you not know that when you present yourselves to someone as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin resulting in death, or of obedience resulting in righteousness?

You can defraud me all you like of everything .

Your response to the mere post of scripture... noted.


I agree with your quote from 1 Cor 6:9-10. That isn't what you're really after.

How so??
 
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ace of hearts

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I'd still like very much to discuss what the Christian is obligated to. I don't think the Christian is obligated to the covenant given to Israel alone - Deut 5. I believe the Christian is regulated by the NT if one wants to be involved in legalism. I think the real truth is the Christians is led by the Holy Spirit - Gal 5:18. There are a few passages that talk about walking in the Spirit - Rom 8 or Gal 5. We have commandments and teaching from Jesus. We even have a commandment of God in 1 Jn 3.
 
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safswan

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Deut 5:1 And Moses called all Israel, and said unto them, Hear, O Israel, the statutes and judgments which I speak in your ears this day, that ye may learn them, and keep, and do them.

2 The Lord our God made a covenant with us in Horeb.

3 The Lord made not this covenant with our fathers, but with us, even us, who are all of us here alive this day.

And the question was asked:

So the agreement was only with those who were alive that day and with no one else?

I don't think the Christian is obligated to the covenant given to Israel alone - Deut 5.

And since there was no response,then the question is asked again:

So the agreement was only with those who were alive that day and with no one else?
 
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ace of hearts

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And the question was asked:

So the agreement was only with those who were alive that day and with no one else?



And since there was no response,then the question is asked again:

So the agreement was only with those who were alive that day and with no one else?
So in legalese I guess that means you think the Scripture means only that generation and the law dies upon their demise. From the Scripture my take is that the covenant was made with Israel as Neh 8 indicates. They understood the covenant was made with their nation Israel not just one generation.
 
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