I don't know if its true

JohnB445 · Jan 16, 2019

When I first came to the faith, the first people I have had as teachers and learned from were Reformed, and I have great respect for them, they helped me grow. They did tell me something that wasn't easy to settle for me when they started introducing me to predestination. The first thoughts that came into my head were "There is no way this can be true, God isn't like that is he?", and I objected, which they then showed me Bible verses I wasn't prepared to see. And the moment they showed me some verses about predestination it just stuck to me ever since.

I do wish I never heard about the concept of predestination this early on, if it is true then I was not ready to know about it, and I believe I would be better off not knowing at all about predestination. Because what is the point, when everything is already predetermined?

The whole thing with Reformed theology is I find it utterly depressing, that mankind has no hope and the majority are predestined to damnation before even being created in the womb. I have been thinking if this is true, then what is the point? Is preaching to the lost being done in vain? Can we determine who is elect/non-elect? Can we know if we are the elect or just delusional? Why does God have mercy on some and not other's?

It makes me feel like I can't make a difference knowing that well I can't make a difference if God is selectively choosing who to save, and the guy I preach to doesn't even have a chance or choice unless God makes it that way. What's the purpose of praying for others, if God predestined some of my family members to hell?

This is not meant to be an insult to the Reformed, I just can't reconcile myself with this thinking.

It seems messed up, I try to hold off this belief since I think I may be blaspheming God's character for having it. But it just sticks to me, and I can't seem to fully shake it off unless I am shown proof that it is a twisted view that the Bible doesn't support.

Even though I don't want to believe in the whole 5 points Calvinism, I can't just shake it off, unless I am shown that it is false. I would be happy to find out if its false since that would mean that humanity has a chance.

The big questions I ask are.

1. Why aren't people getting saved?
2. Why aren't more people Christian?
3. Why do people fall away from the faith?
4. Why do some people do evil, harmful acts?
5. Why are people atheists, or agnostics?
6. Why don't the smartest and most knowledgeable people do not believe in Christianity?

It doesn't make any sense why people don't want to get saved. Atheism/Agnosticism makes no sense, no other religions make any sense.

Why does it make sense to them, and not Christianity?

JohnB445 · Jan 16, 2019

One thing I will note is since I am now a 5-month believer.

My Biblical knowledge in the NT isn't high. I have not even read through the whole NT yet. So I don't know what it all says.

saved24 · Jan 16, 2019

When you said ""There is no way this can be true, God isn't like that is he?" you were right! My Mom was from a Reformed church, and never learned about salvation. She was saved when I was 5 years old.
I found an article online and here is part of it: The Bible says, "The Lord…is not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance" (2 Peter 3:9). God wants all people to be saved and does not predestine anyone to be saved or lost. The only thing that God has predestined or predetermined is to save those who are obedient to His commands (Hebrews 5:9) and to punish those who are disobedient (2 Thessalonians 1:7-9). "Predestination" accuses God of being partial and showing favoritism. But God’s word says that, "God shows no partiality. But in every nation whoever fears Him and works righteousness is accepted by Him" (Acts 10:34-35).

Read more of the article here:
New Page 12

timothyu · Jan 16, 2019

Why?
People get too hung up on the religion aspect of it. Non-Christians (and Christians alike) get hung up on the whole church, ceremony, theology aspect of it and forget that most of mankind sees life as division. Actually what does that say about Christianity when it can be fought over in the same way politics are. The means Christianity has dragged back down to the world's concept of divide . They chose to divide secular/secular or secular/religion, but rarely are either side given a glimpse of the true division Jesus represented, the separation between the entire world of man and the Kingdom.

Jesus did not rebel against the world of man, rebellion being something man would understand and perhaps give Him more attention for. He represented a counter culture, a peaceful movement against the world of man, not by strife but as a concept contrary to the traditional ways of man dominating our ways since the Garden. Man tends to avoid that which they don't understand. Division and fighting they understand. Yet Christianity has left them in a vacuum not teaching the division Jesus taught. What do they do with it? They don't know what to fight against so they just reject it or fight against the institution as a whole. Sneaky of the Adversary to distract attention from it in Christianity because it has been aware of the Kingdom as an enemy all along.

Time For Christianity to teach the Kingdom as an alternate way to the world of man as Jesus intended. Give mankind something to either join or fight (His Gospel, not the institution). Either way, they will be involved and with God within their view. Better than no view at all.

Albion · Jan 16, 2019

JohnB445 said:
The whole thing with Reformed theology is I find it utterly depressing, that mankind has no hope and the majority are predestined to damnation before even being created in the womb. I have been thinking if this is true, then what is the point? Is preaching to the lost being done in vain? Can we determine who is elect/non-elect? Can we know if we are the elect or just delusional? Why does God have mercy on some and not other's?

But you know...it is not a clear cut distinction, Reformed vs non-Reformed kinds of Christianity. Most of the above holds true with other churches, too--the coming to faith and peoples' prospects for salvation, etc. Calvinists do believe in the necessity of missionary work and evangelizing, while other varieties of Christianity concede that most people will not be saved (if faith in Christ is indeed necessary).

GTW27 · Jan 16, 2019

JohnB445 said:
When I first came to the faith, the first people I have had as teachers and learned from were Reformed, and I have great respect for them, they helped me grow. They did tell me something that wasn't easy to settle for me when they started introducing me to predestination. The first thoughts that came into my head were "There is no way this can be true, God isn't like that is he?", and I objected, which they then showed me Bible verses I wasn't prepared to see. And the moment they showed me some verses about predestination it just stuck to me ever since.

I do wish I never heard about the concept of predestination this early on, if it is true then I was not ready to know about it, and I believe I would be better off not knowing at all about predestination. Because what is the point, when everything is already predetermined?

The whole thing with Reformed theology is I find it utterly depressing, that mankind has no hope and the majority are predestined to damnation before even being created in the womb. I have been thinking if this is true, then what is the point? Is preaching to the lost being done in vain? Can we determine who is elect/non-elect? Can we know if we are the elect or just delusional? Why does God have mercy on some and not other's?

It makes me feel like I can't make a difference knowing that well I can't make a difference if God is selectively choosing who to save, and the guy I preach to doesn't even have a chance or choice unless God makes it that way. What's the purpose of praying for others, if God predestined some of my family members to hell?

This is not meant to be an insult to the Reformed, I just can't reconcile myself with this thinking.

It seems messed up, I try to hold off this belief since I think I may be blaspheming God's character for having it. But it just sticks to me, and I can't seem to fully shake it off unless I am shown proof that it is a twisted view that the Bible doesn't support.

Even though I don't want to believe in the whole 5 points Calvinism, I can't just shake it off, unless I am shown that it is false. I would be happy to find out if its false since that would mean that humanity has a chance.

The big questions I ask are.

1. Why aren't people getting saved?
2. Why aren't more people Christian?
3. Why do people fall away from the faith?
4. Why do some people do evil, harmful acts?
5. Why are people atheists, or agnostics?
6. Why don't the smartest and most knowledgeable people do not believe in Christianity?

It doesn't make any sense why people don't want to get saved. Atheism/Agnosticism makes no sense, no other religions make any sense.

Why does it make sense to them, and not Christianity?

The further we walk on the path the greater The Light becomes, And the greater The Light becomes, the greater the understanding of His plan becomes. Each thing He reveals to us, has its own season, and its trials to overcome. Be not in a hurry, just trust Him in all things and He will lead you and guide you into all righteousness. In the end of the matter you will find His Plan was perfect from the beginning.

JohnB445 · Jan 16, 2019

I am trying a few experiments.

Praying for a particular friend and family to come to Christ. I think I shouldn't expect it to be answered immediately or overnight. I think that may be my problem, I don't give things time.

timothyu · Jan 16, 2019

JohnB445 said:
Praying for a particular friend and family to come to Christ. I think I shouldn't expect it to be answered immediately or overnight. I think that may be my problem.

Is there any reason in your friend's mind to do so?

JohnB445 · Jan 16, 2019

timothyu said:
Is there any reason in your friend's mind to do so?

I don't think I understand your question fully.

I talked to him about Jesus Christ, and he genuinely told me he has major difficulty believing it. And I tried to show him the gospel and nothing happened.

disciple Clint · Jan 16, 2019

JohnB445 said:
When I first came to the faith, the first people I have had as teachers and learned from were Reformed, and I have great respect for them, they helped me grow. They did tell me something that wasn't easy to settle for me when they started introducing me to predestination. The first thoughts that came into my head were "There is no way this can be true, God isn't like that is he?", and I objected, which they then showed me Bible verses I wasn't prepared to see. And the moment they showed me some verses about predestination it just stuck to me ever since.

I do wish I never heard about the concept of predestination this early on, if it is true then I was not ready to know about it, and I believe I would be better off not knowing at all about predestination. Because what is the point, when everything is already predetermined?

The whole thing with Reformed theology is I find it utterly depressing, that mankind has no hope and the majority are predestined to damnation before even being created in the womb. I have been thinking if this is true, then what is the point? Is preaching to the lost being done in vain? Can we determine who is elect/non-elect? Can we know if we are the elect or just delusional? Why does God have mercy on some and not other's?

It makes me feel like I can't make a difference knowing that well I can't make a difference if God is selectively choosing who to save, and the guy I preach to doesn't even have a chance or choice unless God makes it that way. What's the purpose of praying for others, if God predestined some of my family members to hell?

This is not meant to be an insult to the Reformed, I just can't reconcile myself with this thinking.

It seems messed up, I try to hold off this belief since I think I may be blaspheming God's character for having it. But it just sticks to me, and I can't seem to fully shake it off unless I am shown proof that it is a twisted view that the Bible doesn't support.

Even though I don't want to believe in the whole 5 points Calvinism, I can't just shake it off, unless I am shown that it is false. I would be happy to find out if its false since that would mean that humanity has a chance.

The big questions I ask are.

1. Why aren't people getting saved?
2. Why aren't more people Christian?
3. Why do people fall away from the faith?
4. Why do some people do evil, harmful acts?
5. Why are people atheists, or agnostics?
6. Why don't the smartest and most knowledgeable people do not believe in Christianity?

It doesn't make any sense why people don't want to get saved. Atheism/Agnosticism makes no sense, no other religions make any sense.

Why does it make sense to them, and not Christianity?

Well those are good questions. Do you have a pastor? have you talked these concerns over with that pastor or any pastor? You should, these questions need to be covered in some depth that we cannot go into here.

Do not lump all who have a Reformed Theology into one bunch, there is substantial difference in beliefs within the Reformed Church. You have two major groups called Calvinists and Arminians and many sub groups. There are even substantial differences within the major groups.

Has anyone told you that God predestined everyone to be saved but it is up to each to accept the grace of God? I don't want to point out the major different and divergent views on Theology but I want you to know that you do not now have any perspective on which to make a serious judgment on the pros and cons of the Reformed Church. investigate and I am certain that you will find answers to your objections that will remove your fears and doubts.

There are many answers to the six questions that you have asked and you need to sit down with someone who can help you find the truths. One thing that you now believe that is definitely not true is that the smartest and most knowledgeable people do not believe in Christianity. That just is not true. I can prove that to you and so can many other people but we need more time than what we can devote here. Blessings and please search out the truth.

timothyu · Jan 16, 2019

JohnB445 said:
I talked to him about Jesus Christ, and he genuinely told me he has major difficulty believing it. And I tried to show him the gospel and nothing happened.

Why not instead tell him about the Gospel of the Kingdom and the ways of man vs the ways of God. That's what Jesus taught. Focus on message rather than man to start with.

saved24 · Jan 16, 2019

Things happen in God's time. We have to trust His timing.

John Bowen · Jan 17, 2019

You sound young that

JohnB445 said:
When I first came to the faith, the first people I have had as teachers and learned from were Reformed, and I have great respect for them, they helped me grow. They did tell me something that wasn't easy to settle for me when they started introducing me to predestination. The first thoughts that came into my head were "There is no way this can be true, God isn't like that is he?", and I objected, which they then showed me Bible verses I wasn't prepared to see. And the moment they showed me some verses about predestination it just stuck to me ever since.

I do wish I never heard about the concept of predestination this early on, if it is true then I was not ready to know about it, and I believe I would be better off not knowing at all about predestination. Because what is the point, when everything is already predetermined?

The whole thing with Reformed theology is I find it utterly depressing, that mankind has no hope and the majority are predestined to damnation before even being created in the womb. I have been thinking if this is true, then what is the point? Is preaching to the lost being done in vain? Can we determine who is elect/non-elect? Can we know if we are the elect or just delusional? Why does God have mercy on some and not other's?

It makes me feel like I can't make a difference knowing that well I can't make a difference if God is selectively choosing who to save, and the guy I preach to doesn't even have a chance or choice unless God makes it that way. What's the purpose of praying for others, if God predestined some of my family members to hell?

This is not meant to be an insult to the Reformed, I just can't reconcile myself with this thinking.

It seems messed up, I try to hold off this belief since I think I may be blaspheming God's character for having it. But it just sticks to me, and I can't seem to fully shake it off unless I am shown proof that it is a twisted view that the Bible doesn't support.

Even though I don't want to believe in the whole 5 points Calvinism, I can't just shake it off, unless I am shown that it is false. I would be happy to find out if its false since that would mean that humanity has a chance.

The big questions I ask are.

1. Why aren't people getting saved?
2. Why aren't more people Christian?
3. Why do people fall away from the faith?
4. Why do some people do evil, harmful acts?
5. Why are people atheists, or agnostics?
6. Why don't the smartest and most knowledgeable people do not believe in Christianity?

It doesn't make any sense why people don't want to get saved. Atheism/Agnosticism makes no sense, no other religions make any sense.

Why does it make sense to them, and not Christianity?

You seem young thats good " Jesus said , "Unless you be as little children you shall not inter the kingdom " Children have a inner sense when something is true or not keep honing that . You said it didn't " seem right " about predestination cause its false doctrine . It gives people a excuse to not take responsibility for their salvation and the Earth opposite of everything Jesus Christ taught and showed us .Even on the cross Jesus had to give up the last ghost before he could enter Heaven he had to make that last choice . And to demonstrate to humanity free will reigns supreme . May I suggest to study the words of Jesus first that is the highest truth in the Bible as he even said " I am greater than Soloman " who was considered the wisest person in the OT .

food4thought · Jan 17, 2019

JohnB445 said:
1. Why aren't people getting saved?

There are many different reasons. Unbelief, love of sin, hypocrites in the church, questioning the authenticity of the Bible... just to name a few. The media has also played it's role, almost uniformly painting Christianity and Christians in a negative light.

2. Why aren't more people Christian?

We live in a culture and age that has alternative answers to many of life's questions (science, other religions). People are often overwhelmed by the many different worldviews, and decide that it is unknowable which is correct (skepticism, agnosticism). People are likely to retain the faith (or lack thereof) that they had when growing up, and fewer and fewer parents are raising their kids in a faithful way.

3. Why do people fall away from the faith?

Jesus answered this question in the parable of the sower (Matthew 13:1-23). Some people are hard hearted, and when difficulty comes they fall away. Others let the cares of the world and the love of money draw them away and choke out their faith.

4. Why do some people do evil, harmful acts?

"All have sinned", because people are sinful. It's not that people are incapable of doing any good (many non-Christians do good things for others), but we have a selfish disease in our natural nature that is prone to do evil. Some people are born with sociopathic genes. Some people grow up in terrible homes that teach them evil.

5. Why are people atheists, or agnostics?

See answer to 2. Also, this philosophy has ascended in our culture because we are a secular society, and God has been marginalized and/or eliminated entirely in our educational institutions. People are taught that God is not real from a young age, and that science is the answer to all humanity's problems.

6. Why don't the smartest and most knowledgeable people do not believe in Christianity?

There are many very smart Christians, and there are many very smart people that are not Christians... it all depends on what they have been taught, and what they have chosen to study. People become invested in what they believe if they have spent a good amount of time believing it... it is difficult for someone who has a hard science background to come to faith because the evidences for Christianity are not subject to hard scientific enquiry (how does one do an experiment on the resurrection?), but the evidence is there for those who are willing to accept it.

Hope this was helpful;
Michael

chevyontheriver · Jan 17, 2019

JohnB445 said:
It seems messed up, I try to hold off this belief since I think I may be blaspheming God's character for having it. But it just sticks to me, and I can't seem to fully shake it off unless I am shown proof that it is a twisted view that the Bible doesn't support.

Even though I don't want to believe in the whole 5 points Calvinism, I can't just shake it off, unless I am shown that it is false. I would be happy to find out if its false since that would mean that humanity has a chance.

Check this out, by a Catholic who analyzes TULIP and comes to a position a bit more refined than the Reformed folks would: James Akin

It is a more Augustinian view, in line with Thomas Aquinas, which Calvin built upon, but not very squarely. One does not need to hold to TULIP to be a Christian, and indeed there is much more older theology which explains things better.

JohnB445 · Jan 17, 2019

One thing I noticed about my mind is that it will use things as "fillers".

If I don't quite understand something automatically my mind would place a belief to hold everything together. Especially when I see a interpretation early on without understanding the whole concept.

worshipjunkie · Jan 17, 2019

JohnB445 said:
When I first came to the faith, the first people I have had as teachers and learned from were Reformed, and I have great respect for them, they helped me grow. They did tell me something that wasn't easy to settle for me when they started introducing me to predestination. The first thoughts that came into my head were "There is no way this can be true, God isn't like that is he?", and I objected, which they then showed me Bible verses I wasn't prepared to see. And the moment they showed me some verses about predestination it just stuck to me ever since.

I do wish I never heard about the concept of predestination this early on, if it is true then I was not ready to know about it, and I believe I would be better off not knowing at all about predestination. Because what is the point, when everything is already predetermined?

The whole thing with Reformed theology is I find it utterly depressing, that mankind has no hope and the majority are predestined to damnation before even being created in the womb. I have been thinking if this is true, then what is the point? Is preaching to the lost being done in vain? Can we determine who is elect/non-elect? Can we know if we are the elect or just delusional? Why does God have mercy on some and not other's?

It makes me feel like I can't make a difference knowing that well I can't make a difference if God is selectively choosing who to save, and the guy I preach to doesn't even have a chance or choice unless God makes it that way. What's the purpose of praying for others, if God predestined some of my family members to hell?

This is not meant to be an insult to the Reformed, I just can't reconcile myself with this thinking.

It seems messed up, I try to hold off this belief since I think I may be blaspheming God's character for having it. But it just sticks to me, and I can't seem to fully shake it off unless I am shown proof that it is a twisted view that the Bible doesn't support.

Even though I don't want to believe in the whole 5 points Calvinism, I can't just shake it off, unless I am shown that it is false. I would be happy to find out if its false since that would mean that humanity has a chance.

The big questions I ask are.

1. Why aren't people getting saved?
2. Why aren't more people Christian?
3. Why do people fall away from the faith?
4. Why do some people do evil, harmful acts?
5. Why are people atheists, or agnostics?
6. Why don't the smartest and most knowledgeable people do not believe in Christianity?

It doesn't make any sense why people don't want to get saved. Atheism/Agnosticism makes no sense, no other religions make any sense.

Why does it make sense to them, and not Christianity?

This site has a lot of articles you might find interesting. SOTERIOLOGY 101

Jesus said that most people would reject the Gospel. "Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it. (Matthew 7:14)" "And this is the condemnation, that the light has come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. (John 3:19)"

For most unsaved people, converting to the gospel would mean changing their lifestyle, admitting certain big decisions were wrong, and changing their thinking. I know that's what it meant for me. And I think the older they get the less willing they are to change. It's not fun to look over a life and see it in the light of who you should have been. They cling on to their error because they have spent so much time in it.

Have you read "The Case for Christ" or "The Case for Faith" by Lee Strobel? Both would give you a decent apologetics background if you're interested in talking to people about the faith, and I think they would also answer your question about the smartest, most well educated people not being Christian- you would see that's not the case. There are also good apologetics websites that might give you a little bit more background when evangelizing. I'm sure the apologetics forum here has some info.

1213 · Jan 17, 2019

JohnB445 said:
...
1. Why aren't people getting saved?
2. Why aren't more people Christian?
3. Why do people fall away from the faith?
4. Why do some people do evil, harmful acts?
5. Why are people atheists, or agnostics?
6. Why don't the smartest and most knowledgeable people do not believe in Christianity?

It doesn't make any sense why people don't want to get saved. Atheism/Agnosticism makes no sense, no other religions make any sense.

Why does it make sense to them, and not Christianity?

I think the answer is in this:

This is the judgment, that the light has come into the world, and men loved the darkness rather than the light; for their works were evil. For everyone who does evil hates the light, and doesn't come to the light, lest his works would be exposed. But he who does the truth comes to the light, that his works may be revealed, that they have been done in God."
John 3:19-21

eleos1954 · Jan 17, 2019

JohnB445 said:
When I first came to the faith, the first people I have had as teachers and learned from were Reformed, and I have great respect for them, they helped me grow. They did tell me something that wasn't easy to settle for me when they started introducing me to predestination. The first thoughts that came into my head were "There is no way this can be true, God isn't like that is he?", and I objected, which they then showed me Bible verses I wasn't prepared to see. And the moment they showed me some verses about predestination it just stuck to me ever since.

I do wish I never heard about the concept of predestination this early on, if it is true then I was not ready to know about it, and I believe I would be better off not knowing at all about predestination. Because what is the point, when everything is already predetermined?

The whole thing with Reformed theology is I find it utterly depressing, that mankind has no hope and the majority are predestined to damnation before even being created in the womb. I have been thinking if this is true, then what is the point? Is preaching to the lost being done in vain? Can we determine who is elect/non-elect? Can we know if we are the elect or just delusional? Why does God have mercy on some and not other's?

It makes me feel like I can't make a difference knowing that well I can't make a difference if God is selectively choosing who to save, and the guy I preach to doesn't even have a chance or choice unless God makes it that way. What's the purpose of praying for others, if God predestined some of my family members to hell?

This is not meant to be an insult to the Reformed, I just can't reconcile myself with this thinking.

It seems messed up, I try to hold off this belief since I think I may be blaspheming God's character for having it. But it just sticks to me, and I can't seem to fully shake it off unless I am shown proof that it is a twisted view that the Bible doesn't support.

Even though I don't want to believe in the whole 5 points Calvinism, I can't just shake it off, unless I am shown that it is false. I would be happy to find out if its false since that would mean that humanity has a chance.

The big questions I ask are.

1. Why aren't people getting saved?
2. Why aren't more people Christian?
3. Why do people fall away from the faith?
4. Why do some people do evil, harmful acts?
5. Why are people atheists, or agnostics?
6. Why don't the smartest and most knowledgeable people do not believe in Christianity?

It doesn't make any sense why people don't want to get saved. Atheism/Agnosticism makes no sense, no other religions make any sense.

***
"The big questions I ask are.

1. Why aren't people getting saved?

People ARE getting saved ... that's why the Lord hasn't come back yet.

2. Why aren't more people Christian?

Sin - Satan probates lies through many many means.

3. Why do people fall away from the faith?

They fall into and are overcome by satans' temptations.

4. Why do some people do evil, harmful acts?

SIN and mental issues.

5. Why are people atheists, or agnostics?

Mostly they need something material/tangible representing what they call "proof". Being a Christian is spiritual.

6. Why don't the smartest and most knowledgeable people do not believe in Christianity?

There are many smart and knowledgeable people who believe in Christianity. Don't know who you are talking about here. It's about wisdom and not intellectual knowledge.

It doesn't make any sense why people don't want to get saved. Atheism/Agnosticism makes no sense, no other religions make any sense.

They don't believe in God ... so "being saved" is a non-issue for them.

Why does it make sense to them, and not Christianity?"

Again .... material/tangible is a requirement for them.

Why does it make sense to them, and not Christianity?

Jonaitis · Jan 18, 2019

John,

I remember when I first encountered "Calvinism" years ago as a teenager, it really bothered me. We live in the age of Google, and I searched online what exactly it meant. My first to go to source was Wikipedia, and it shocked me to know that there are literally people out there who believe some are predestined to eternal life and some are predestined to eternal hell. I immediately thought this was monstrous theology.

The strange thing was, though, I was still curious as to how people support such a position with Scripture. I'm sure many members have heard of this site, but I began reading articles on it by GotQuestions and it completely changed my mind. I began seeing Scripture after Scripture be quoted and explained, and it left me speechless. I remember saying to myself, what in the world? I have read the New Testament over and over again, but I never seen these verses in this way before.

Shortly after this, I began reading a little more on it and became very aggressive in my approach to people who never heard of it. They call this the "cage-stage," when someone newly discovers these truths they want to begin telling every person they know all about it, and if they disagree you will fight for it to the death. Usually, if not always, these "cage-stage" Calvinists behave this way when they only have a brief understanding of it. It was probably a few years later I began to thoroughly study these doctrines, and it really humbled me. I no longer enjoy debating them, only sharing them with people who really want to learn them.

There is a lot of misconceptions about Calvinism, and you have made some of them in your post. Some will say, "What's the point of evangelism," for example, "if people must be chosen?" The answer to this is that just because there are some chosen to be saved, they still need to hear the gospel being preached. "But what's the point if only the elect are saved." On the contrary, this gives us hope, because if we preach to an mixed crowd of people, we can be confident that God will draw those whom he has chosen to faith. We don't have to struggle with people to believe, God will do the work to bring them to believe. Salvation belongs to the Lord. "That's not fair for those who aren't drawn." On the contrary, we don't deserve to be drawn. If we, by nature, willfully reject this message, then is it not fair that God can leave us to continue in that path? He is not obligated to bring any to faith, even though he commands all to come to faith.

There are many more misconceptions, but they can be easily addressed with comfort and encouragement. These doctrines are actually beautiful and precious, more than people realize. They comfort and encourage me.

I don't know if its true

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God is Love

Soli Deo Gloria

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