Latest Caravan ready to head north

brinny · Jan 14, 2019

wing2000 said:
...it's rather curious how the rest of the Prophet Isaiah's scripture is ignored....

"Learn to do right! Seek justice, encourage the oppressed. Defend the cause of the fatherless, plead the case of the widow." Isaiah 1:17

"The LORD enters into judgment against the elders and leaders of his people: It is you who have ruined my vineyard; the plunder from the poor is in your houses. What do you mean by crushing my people and grinding the faces of the poor?' declares the Lord, the LORD Almighty." Isaiah 3:14-15

"to deprive the poor of their rights and withhold justice from the oppressed of my people, making widows their prey and robbing the fatherless." Isaiah 10:2

"With righteousness he will judge the needy; with justice he will give decisions for the poor of the earth. He will strike the earth with the rod of his mouth; with the breath of his lips he will slay the wicked." Isaiah 11:4

"The poorest of the poor will find pasture, and the needy will lie down in safety. But your root I will destroy by famine; it will slay your survivors." Isaiah 14:30

"You have been a refuge for the poor, a refuge for the needy in his distress, a shelter from the storm and a shade from the heat. For the breath of the ruthless is like a storm driving against a wall." Isaiah 25:4

"Once more the humble will rejoice in the LORD ; the needy will rejoice in the Holy One of Israel." Isaiah 29:19

"The scoundrel's methods are wicked, he makes up evil schemes to destroy the poor with lies, even when the plea of the needy is just." Isaiah 32:7

"The poor and needy search for water, but there is none; their tongues are parched with thirst. But I the LORD will answer them; I, the God of Israel, will not forsake them." Isaiah 41:17

"Is not this the kind of fasting I have chosen: to loose the chains of injustice and untie the cords of the yoke, to set the oppressed free and break every yoke? Is it not to share your food with the hungry and to provide the poor wanderer with shelter — when you see the naked, to clothe him, and not to turn away from your own flesh and blood?" Isaiah 58:6-7

"If you spend yourselves in behalf of the hungry and satisfy the needs of the oppressed, then your light will rise in the darkness, and your night will become like the noonday." Isaiah 58:10

"The Spirit of the Sovereign LORD is on me, because the LORD has anointed me to preach good news to the poor. He has sent me to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim freedom for the captives and release from darkness for the prisoners." Isaiah 61:1

Isaiah is one of my fav'rite books. Would you care to join me in a Bible study of Isaiah, especially those verses you posted, and including all of Isaiah 54, and how they apply to not only my own life experiences, but also this thread? I will break down how those verses apply to the truly desperate, of which i was, and have been on many occasions, etc.

The offer stands, wing.

Let me know if you are interested.

dogs4thewin · Jan 14, 2019

Halbhh said:
As Christians in the U.S. we should vote for representatives and a new president that will obey Christ instead of acting directly against God's commandments to us, about refugees.

It's good to pray to better follow Christ -- we should humbly admit we are not perfect, and need His help, and pray the prayer He gave us in Matthew chapter 6.

First of all thank goodness our laws are not based solely on the Bible, but second of all, no one is saying the refugees should not be allowed in if they are honest to goodness refugees, although there still is need to limit the number and have rules. for which refugees and how many are allowed in.

brinny · Jan 14, 2019

brinny said: ↑
None are seeking "asylum". Nor are they "refugees"

GoldenBoy89 said:
Says you.

What makes you such an expert on the subject?

i see you've missed some of my recent posts, GB.

i've been both a "refugee", and desperately seeking "asylum", amongst other things.

dogs4thewin · Jan 14, 2019

GlabrousDory4 said:
My post merely points out that not all (in fact very few) of the folks at the border are there with ill intent to the US.

They are people in need of help.

They are God's children, just as you are.

Sure a few threw some rocks which isn't good, nor should it be condoned.

But we defile our own humanity when we only see the evil in a mass of good people in need.

Pray, yes...but pray for help for those in need and desperate. Don't pray for a wall, don't pray that we are able to keep these people out. Pray that we can and will help however we can.

No matter what we cannot have people coming over here ( even if they do need help) where we do not know who they are what they are doing or how many of them there are. Even for people who NEED help there have to be rules and laws as to who can come, why they can come and how many can come.

dogs4thewin · Jan 14, 2019

Halbhh said:
“The arrest rate for illegal immigrants was 40 percent below that of native-born Americans.”

In addition, he wrote, the homicide arrest rate for native-born Americans was “about 46 percent higher than the illegal immigrant homicide arrest rate.”

That means if you met 10,000 native born Americans, you'd be in more danger than you would if you met 10,000 illegal immigrants to the U.S.

The illegal immigrants are more law abiding than the native-born Americans.

Is Illegal Immigration Linked to More or Less Crime? - FactCheck.org

Maybe so, but they broke the law to come here, so right there they have loss that. If they are otherwise following the law then maybe offer ways to become legal with certain requirements attached.

dogs4thewin · Jan 14, 2019

GlabrousDory4 said:
Pray to help others, not build walls against them.

We can do both. Pray for them, but also have security messures that control who comes in and why. We have the option of doing missions over there or personally sending money, but there is nothing wrong with protecting our borders and ensuring that those coming are very well-vetted.

dogs4thewin · Jan 14, 2019

brinny said:
No one should be anywhere near our border unless they are seeking legal means to become a LEGAL immigrant by LEGAL channels and are entering our border legitimately and LEGALLY.

Praying.

"Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!" ~Isa 5:20

Thank you there are laws concerning who may come, the reasons they may come ECT if you choose to break those laws you lose that protection.

dogs4thewin · Jan 14, 2019

Halbhh said:
Sincerely, we are ready to learn from scripture what God commands us.

We do know He said this --

“When a stranger sojourns with you in your land, you shall not do him wrong. You shall treat the stranger who sojourns with you as the native among you, and you shall love him as yourself, for you were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God."
What Does the Bible Say About Foreigners?

New International Version
The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

King James Bible
But the stranger that dwelleth with you shall be unto you as one born among you, and thou shalt love him as thyself; for ye were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the LORD your God.

Young's Literal Translation
as a native among you is the sojourner to you who is sojourning with you, and thou hast had love to him as to thyself, for sojourners ye have been in the land of Egypt; I am Jehovah your God.

We have laws choose to break them get kicked out. There is nothing wrong with having laws to determining who may come in, why and how many. There are billions of people in this world who are very poor and probably have a number of other problems we cannot accept them all. What we can do is if caught and that is the only law they have broken give them the chance to make it right, but if they choose not to then kick them out.

GlabrousDory4 · Jan 14, 2019

brinny said:
Aaah, i see you've been paying attention.

What else did i say?

I am not in the mood for a quiz.

All of life shouldn't be viewed as a chance to fight others all the time. There is good in people. All I'm saying is that these people on the southern border as just as much children of God as YOU are. If you weren't a bad person for being in need, they aren't bad people.

Sure there are a few bad apples who threw some rocks. But that isn't the majority of these people.

I feel sad that you had a horrible time at some point in your life. I also feel sad that you don't seem to have attained any sort of insight into the suffering of others due to your own travails. I, too, have suffered at times. I hope I took something good away from it that I can use to find the good in people who suffer today.

You want to build a wall, you want to keep the bad people out. That's fine. That's normal.

Just make sure you can actually figure out who the bad people are. Don't try to sit at the Right Hand of the Father and don't try to judge the quick and the dead. It's not necessarily your job.

And remember the times YOU were in need. Just as I hope I remember the times I was in need.

dogs4thewin · Jan 14, 2019

GoldenBoy89 said:
Says you.

What makes you such an expert on the subject?

There may be some in the crowd that are coming for the right reason, but a certain percentage of them are not. Usually people who need help are not going to come in numbers quite that large, for one thing.

brinny · Jan 14, 2019

GlabrousDory4 said:
I am not in the mood for a quiz.

All of life shouldn't be viewed as a chance to fight others all the time. There is good in people. All I'm saying is that these people on the southern border as just as much children of God as YOU are. If you weren't a bad person for being in need, they aren't bad people.

Sure there are a few bad apples who threw some rocks. But that isn't the majority of these people.

I feel sad that you had a horrible time at some point in your life. I also feel sad that you don't seem to have attained any sort of insight into the suffering of others due to your own travails. I, too, have suffered at times. I hope I took something good away from it that I can use to find the good in people who suffer today.

You want to build a wall, you want to keep the bad people out. That's fine. That's normal.

Just make sure you can actually figure out who the bad people are. Don't try to sit at the Right Hand of the Father and don't try to judge the quick and the dead. It's not necessarily your job.

And remember the times YOU were in need. Just as I hope I remember the times I was in need.

Don't try to sit at the Right Hand of the Father

Only Jesus the Christ the only begotten Son of the living God, the risen Christ, sits at the right hand of the Father.

I feel sad that you had a horrible time at some point in your life.

Several times. They were quite inexplicable and i should not have lived through any of them.

It was by His inexplicable grace that i survived, and as i have already posted to you, that God rose beauty from ashes, and a staunch and formidable advocate to the very similar ones akin to what is mentioned in Isaiah (the "invisible" ones, so to speak). What i realized is that He had a purpose in all my suffering. I became a "voice" for the "voiceless", a defender of those unable to defend themselves (including the tiniest, most defenseless, and voiceless amongst us). But i've already told you this.

Forgot?

In addition, God grants us the wisdom and the discernment to recognize when His Truth is twisted, which He abhors.

As stated in this verse:

"Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!" ~Isa 5:20

Belk · Jan 14, 2019

brinny said:
Hi Belk.

Did i say "I" was arresting anyone?

As far as laws are concerned any lawyer worth their salt needs to explore this, including any uses of RICO, etc. It's worth an investigation, at the very least.

There should've ALREADY been a wall up.

Needless to say, NO ONE trampling through "whole countries", including Mexico, should be violently attacking and throwing rocks at our border patrol.

The sponsors of these caravans need to be investigated.

Happy New Year Belk.

So you do not know they are breaking the law? It makes your calls for prosecution troubling then. If we are to be a nation of laws who keeps out illegal immigrants it seems that we should prosecute people based upon that law, not upon our own passions.

GlabrousDory4 · Jan 14, 2019

brinny said:
Only Jesus the Christ the only begotten Son of the living God, the risen Christ, sits at the right hand of the Father.

Why do you think I said it?

It was by His inexplicable grace that i survived, and as i have already posted to you, that God rose beauty from ashes, and a staunch and formidable advocate to the very similar ones akin to what is mentioned in Isaiah (the "invisible" ones, so to speak). What i realized is that He had a purpose in all my suffering. I became a "voice" for the "voiceless", a defender of those unable to defend themselves (including the tiniest, most defenseless, and voiceless amongst us). But i've already told you this.

So no one helped you, just God? No person took pity on you at all? It was only God that lifted you out of poverty?

That is a sad place you must have lived. I am sorry to hear that no one helped you at all.

In addition, God grants us the wisdom and the discernment to recognize when His Truth is twisted, which He abhors.

Is it considered good to seek out to see only the evil in others?

As stated in this verse:

"Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!" ~Isa 5:20

You keep quoting this. Does it bring comfort?

GoldenBoy89 · Jan 14, 2019

dogs4thewin said:
There may be some in the crowd that are coming for the right reason, but a certain percentage of them are not. Usually people who need help are not going to come in numbers quite that large, for one thing.

I don't label people criminals until they've been shown to have committed a crime.

dogs4thewin · Jan 14, 2019

GoldenBoy89 said:
I don't label people criminals until they've been shown to have committed a crime.

Well they are in a sense committing a crime by being here without lawful authority.

GoldenBoy89 · Jan 14, 2019

dogs4thewin said:
Well they are in a sense committing a crime by being here without lawful authority.

They're not here.

brinny · Jan 14, 2019

Belk said:
So you do not know they are breaking the law? It makes your calls for prosecution troubling then. If we are to be a nation of laws who keeps out illegal immigrants it seems that we should prosecute people based upon that law, not upon our own passions.

See post #59.

What you posted has nothing to do with my post that you responded to, Belk.

dogs4thewin · Jan 14, 2019

GoldenBoy89 said:
They're not here.

but they are trying to come without us knowing who they are and without lawful permission.

Speedwell · Jan 14, 2019

dogs4thewin said:
but they are trying to come without us knowing who they are and without lawful permission.

It's lawful to seek asylum.

KCfromNC · Jan 14, 2019

GoldenBoy89 said:
Says you.

What makes you such an expert on the subject?

Dunning-Kruger?

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