Finneyism

redleghunter said:

"Whenever he sins, he must, for the time being, cease to be holy. This is self-evident. Whenever he sins, he must be condemned; he must incur the penalty of the law of God ... If it be said that the precept is still binding upon him, but that with respect to the Christian, the penalty is forever set aside, or abrogated, I reply, that to abrogate the penalty is to repeal the precept, for a precept without penalty is no law. It is only counsel or advice. The Christian, therefore, is justified no longer than he obeys, and must be condemned when he disobeys or Antinomianism is true ... In these respects, then, the sinning Christian and the unconverted sinner are upon precisely the same ground (p. 46)."
We can start there. What do you think? Is he right and can we find Scriptural support for his statements? Is he wrong? If so where is Finney refuted from the Scriptures?

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I don't know much about Finney's beliefs and so answer only to what is offered in this quotation. Finney seems to ignore the fact that in Christ a Christian has obtained a right standing before God. In Christ, the child of God is sanctified, justified and redeemed. (1 Corinthians 1:30) And because this is so, the Christian is accepted by God "in the Beloved" (Ephesians 1:6), who is Christ. It is only on this basis that anyone is accepted by God (John 14:6; 1 Timothy 2:5). The believer's spiritual position in Christ does not alter because it does not exist as a product of their conduct or human condition but as a consequence of Christ's unchanging perfection and eternal work at Calvary. So, when a Christian sins, he is not condemned, falling from his eternal position in Christ. That position was not obtained by dint of the believer's work (Ephesians 2:8-9; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9), but of God's. It stands to reason, then, that what was fashioned entirely apart from the believer's works and power, is not susceptible to dissolution by the believer's works and power (John 10:28-29; Romans 8:38-39).

The cost of sin to the believer is the immediate loss of fellowship (not relationship) with their Heavenly Father (Luke 15:11-32). What could be more awful than to cease to enjoy moment-by-moment, loving, holy, intimate communion with the Creator of the Universe? Of course, those who have never enjoyed such communion think nothing of its loss and largely dismiss it as a serious consequence of sin. But once experienced, there is nothing, not even the prospect of hell, that is worse than the loss of genuine, joyful fellowship with one's holy, loving Maker.

Finneyism? 1st time I heard his name used that way I would disagree on this one point with him.

The sweet sweet Holy Spirit as I read it.. convicts the world of sin..yes. But WHAT sin? Christ told us.. that they dont believe on Him. He does not convict the world of SINS. What SIN would HE convict the world of? Well "behold the lamb of God that takes away the sins of the world"..so they have not been taken away? What.. before Christ was.. that sin that was offered .. where did they UNCOVER that sin that was only covered? Christ took away.. ALL so.. I cant find them.. if HE cant.. YES

A precept without penalty is no law?

The Holy Spirit also testifies to us about this. First he says:

16 ‘This is the covenant I will make with them
after that time, says the Lord.
I will put my laws in their hearts,
and I will write them on their minds.’

17 Then he adds:

‘Their sins and lawless acts
I will remember no more.

Heb10:15-17

The book in the Bible, yeshuaslavejeff. Sorry, I tried to quote your last post in this reply, but it doesn't show for some reason.

A bit off topic, but was it Finney who prayed for rain and then took his umbrella to an outdoor meeting to show his confidence that God would answer his prayer. And then it really did start raining...?

Oh! And then there was the church service where he was preaching and a wood beam from the ceiling fell in front of him!

Finney is a controversial figure certainly, but I do think he had some things right. I'd like to read more about his theology and sermons.