IS ISRAEL IN THE NEW COVENANT GOD'S CHURCH?

LoveGodsWord

Well-Known Member
Jun 5, 2017
22,242
6,634
Queensland
Visit site
✟252,319.00
Country
Australia
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
No, rich man cannot enter the kingdom of God.
Matthew 19
24 Again I say to you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."

Hi brother Righttruth, nice to meet you. Rich people can be saved though for many it is not easy. Read the next few scriptures after v24.

[25], When his disciples heard it, they were exceedingly amazed, saying, Who then can be saved?
[26], But Jesus beheld them, and said to them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible.

God bless
 
  • Agree
Reactions: OldWiseGuy
Upvote 0

OldWiseGuy

Wake me when it's soup.
Supporter
Feb 4, 2006
46,773
10,981
Wisconsin
Visit site
✟960,122.00
Country
United States
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
Sorry OWG, I seem to have missed this post of yours somehow. Good point on REVELATION 12. For me I see the birthright promise being fulfilled in the NEW COVENANT as it is both JEWS and GENTILE BELIEVERS and followers of God's WORD that make up God's ISREAL under the NWE COVENANT. This is what the scriptures in ther OP are saying.

God bless.

Salvation is part of the scepter promise, not the birthright.

Genesis 49:10
"The sceptre shall not depart from Judah, nor a lawgiver from between his feet, until Shiloh come; and unto him shall the gathering of the people be" (referring to spiritual Israel, the church).

1 Chronicles 5:2
"For Judah prevailed above his brethren, and of him came the chief ruler; but the birthright was Joseph's" (referring to national Israel).
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

yeshuaslavejeff

simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua
Jan 6, 2005
39,944
11,098
okie
✟214,996.00
Faith
Anabaptist
Hi brother Righttruth, nice to meet you. Rich people can be saved though for many it is not easy. Read the next few scriptures after v24.

[25], When his disciples heard it, they were exceedingly amazed, saying, Who then can be saved?
[26], But Jesus beheld them, and said to them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible.

God bless
For every one, not for many, it is not easy.

That's why the disciples WITH JESUS , were shocked and dismayed and cried out "Who then can be saved" not "Who then who is rich can be saved" but "Who then anywhere, anyone, can be saved" ?

This is most often missed entirely by the rest of mankind/ whoever....
 
Upvote 0

OldWiseGuy

Wake me when it's soup.
Supporter
Feb 4, 2006
46,773
10,981
Wisconsin
Visit site
✟960,122.00
Country
United States
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
For every one, not for many, it is not easy.

That's why the disciples WITH JESUS , were shocked and dismayed and cried out "Who then can be saved" not "Who then who is rich can be saved" but "Who then anywhere, anyone, can be saved" ?

This is most often missed entirely by the rest of mankind/ whoever....

To fully understand this passage one must know what "rich" meant in Jesus's day.
 
Upvote 0

yeshuaslavejeff

simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua
Jan 6, 2005
39,944
11,098
okie
✟214,996.00
Faith
Anabaptist
To fully understand this passage one must know what "rich" meant in Jesus's day.
To understand any Scripture,
it must be granted from the Father in heaven.
(as Jesus noted, as Yochanan the immerser stated, et al )
 
Upvote 0

OldWiseGuy

Wake me when it's soup.
Supporter
Feb 4, 2006
46,773
10,981
Wisconsin
Visit site
✟960,122.00
Country
United States
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
To understand any Scripture,
it must be granted from the Father in heaven.
(as Jesus noted, as Yochanan the immerser stated, et al )

God grants understanding to those who study.

2 Timothy 2:15
Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
 
Upvote 0

yeshuaslavejeff

simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua
Jan 6, 2005
39,944
11,098
okie
✟214,996.00
Faith
Anabaptist
God grants understanding to those who study.

2 Timothy 2:15
Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
If He wants to.
Most scholars though , HE HIDES TRUTH FROM.
 
Upvote 0

LoveGodsWord

Well-Known Member
Jun 5, 2017
22,242
6,634
Queensland
Visit site
✟252,319.00
Country
Australia
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
Salvation is part of the scepter promise, not the birthright.

Genesis 49:10
"The sceptre shall not depart from Judah, nor a lawgiver from between his feet, until Shiloh come; and unto him shall the gathering of the people be" (referring to spiritual Israel, the church).

1 Chronicles 5:2
"For Judah prevailed above his brethren, and of him came the chief ruler; but the birthright was Joseph's" (referring to national Israel).

Not sure if I am getting your meaning here brother. Did you wish you explain yourself a little better? The birthright promise I am referring to is that of Jacob and Esua *GENESIS 25:30-35. This is the promise to Abraham and his decendence to make ISRAEL (Jacob) a great nation *GENESIS :12-2; GENESIS 46:1-3; 2 SAMUEL 7:23. This is the salvation promise to God's church who in the NEW COVENANT are all those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD.

God bless.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

LoveGodsWord

Well-Known Member
Jun 5, 2017
22,242
6,634
Queensland
Visit site
✟252,319.00
Country
Australia
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
For every one, not for many, it is not easy.

That's why the disciples WITH JESUS , were shocked and dismayed and cried out "Who then can be saved" not "Who then who is rich can be saved" but "Who then anywhere, anyone, can be saved" ?

This is most often missed entirely by the rest of mankind/ whoever....

Hi Jeff, nice to see you. True as the scripture says many are called but few are chosen.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Righttruth

Regular Member
Supporter
Jan 13, 2015
4,484
341
✟154,410.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Hi brother Righttruth, nice to meet you. Rich people can be saved though for many it is not easy. Read the next few scriptures after v24.

[25], When his disciples heard it, they were exceedingly amazed, saying, Who then can be saved?
[26], But Jesus beheld them, and said to them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible.

God bless
What makes you think that God will nullify what Jesus said for one and all?
 
Upvote 0

LoveGodsWord

Well-Known Member
Jun 5, 2017
22,242
6,634
Queensland
Visit site
✟252,319.00
Country
Australia
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
What makes you think that God will nullify what Jesus said for one and all?

Hi brother Jesus did not nulify salvation for the rich brother. He only says it is harder for them because they rely on their riches. Your missing the point on the second of the verses you left out earlier.... but with God all things are possible *MATTHEW 19:26.

Another words, the answer to the question the dsiciples were asking which was who can be saved? Jesus answered men cannot save themselves both rich or poor they need God to save them.

God bless.
 
Upvote 0

OldWiseGuy

Wake me when it's soup.
Supporter
Feb 4, 2006
46,773
10,981
Wisconsin
Visit site
✟960,122.00
Country
United States
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
Not sure if I am getting your meaning here brother. Did you wish you explain yourself a little better? The birthright promise I am referring to is that of Jacob and Esua *GENESIS 25:30-35. This is the promise to Abraham and his decendence to make ISRAEL (Jacob) a great nation *GENESIS :12-2; GENESIS 46:1-3; 2 SAMUEL 7:23. This is the salvation promise to God's church who in the NEW COVENANT are all those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD.

God bless.

The birthright promise is specifically a material promise, not a spiritual one. Salvation is not a right of one's birth, else only those who hold it could be saved. Abraham was blessed by God in two parts, called race and grace. Race, because his descendants would be materially blessed, and grace, because through the one seed, Christ, all nations would be blessed spiritually.

A word study of the term, in it's context, will be helpful.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

LoveGodsWord

Well-Known Member
Jun 5, 2017
22,242
6,634
Queensland
Visit site
✟252,319.00
Country
Australia
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
The birthright promise is specifically a material promise, not a spiritual one.

Is there any scripture to support this idea brother?

Salvation is not a right of one's birth, else only those who hold it could be saved. [/QUOTE]

The birthright promise was to the physical decendence of Abraham that BELIEVED and FOLLOWED God's WORD and was not given outside of the physical decendence of Abraham until the NEW COVENANT when God's WORD was given to all mankind. Those who were physical decendence of Abraham and were UNBELIEVERS and were no FOLLOWERS of God's WORD were not considered God's ISRAEL by JESUS and God under the OLD COVENANT or the NEW.

JOHN 8:37-44
[37], I know that ye are Abraham's seed [PHYSICAL ISRAEL]: yet ye seek to kill me, because my word hath not free course in you.
[38], I speak the things which I have seen with my Father: and ye also do the things which ye heard from your father.
[39], They answered and said unto him, Our father is Abraham. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham [JESUS SHOWS THEY WERE NOT A PART OF GOD'S ISRAEL BECAUSE THEY WERE NOT BELIEVING AND FOLLOWING GOD'S WORD].
[40], But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I heard from God: this did not Abraham.
[41], Ye do the works of your father. They said unto him, We were not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God.
[42], Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I came forth and am come from God; for neither have I come of myself, but he sent me.
[43], Why do ye not understand my speech? Even because ye cannot hear my word.
[44], Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father it is your will to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and standeth not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father thereof.

God's ISRAEL under both COVENANTS are only those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD. Salvation under both COVNENANT was only ever conditional to those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD regardless of a physical birthright.

Abraham was blessed by God in two parts, called race and grace. Race, because his descendants would be materially blessed, and grace, because through the one seed, Christ, all nations would be blessed spiritually.
A word study of the term, in it's context, will be helpful.

Once again God's ISRAEL under both COVENANTS are only those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD. Salvation under both COVNENANT was only ever conditional to those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD. Under both COVENANTS those who did not BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD lost the presence of God.

ISAIAH 59:2 But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, so that he will not hear.

PROVERBS 28:9 He that turns away his ear from hearing the law, even his prayer shall be abomination.

Being under the physical birth right promise in the OLD COVENANT did not automatically grant salvation. Slavation was granted only to all those who BELIEVED and FOLLOWED God's WORD. Under the NEW COVENANT physical the invitation to be a part of God's ISRAEL has gone to ALL NATIONS *MATTHEW 28:19. Once again to be a part of God's ISRAEL in the NEW COVENANT it conditional on BELIEVING and FOLLOWING God's WORD *1 JOHN 2:3-4.
 
Upvote 0

YeshuaFan

Well-Known Member
Oct 19, 2018
3,003
996
63
Macomb
✟56,324.00
Country
United States
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Hi brother Jesus did not nulify salvation for the rich brother. He only says it is harder for them because they rely on their riches. Your missing the point on the second of the verses you left out earlier.... but with God all things are possible *MATTHEW 19:26.

Another words, the answer to the question the dsiciples were asking which was who can be saved? Jesus answered men cannot save themselves both rich or poor they need God to save them.

God bless.
It is so hard for rich people to get saved due to them trusting in their own financial resources, and not trusting in the resources of God...
 
  • Agree
Reactions: LoveGodsWord
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

yeshuaslavejeff

simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua
Jan 6, 2005
39,944
11,098
okie
✟214,996.00
Faith
Anabaptist
It is so hard for rich people to get saved due to them trusting in their own financial resources, and not trusting in the resources of God...

I think you mean not trusting Yahweh (God).

He Says Trust Me. not trust my ability, or my resources, or something else...

Directly.

Who ever heard of the resources of God ? per se......
 
Upvote 0

OldWiseGuy

Wake me when it's soup.
Supporter
Feb 4, 2006
46,773
10,981
Wisconsin
Visit site
✟960,122.00
Country
United States
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
Is there any scripture to support this idea brother?

Salvation is not a right of one's birth, else only those who hold it could be saved.

The birthright promise was to the physical decendence of Abraham that BELIEVED and FOLLOWED God's WORD and was not given outside of the physical decendence of Abraham until the NEW COVENANT when God's WORD was given to all mankind. Those who were physical decendence of Abraham and were UNBELIEVERS and were no FOLLOWERS of God's WORD were not considered God's ISRAEL by JESUS and God under the OLD COVENANT or the NEW.

JOHN 8:37-44
[37], I know that ye are Abraham's seed [PHYSICAL ISRAEL]: yet ye seek to kill me, because my word hath not free course in you.
[38], I speak the things which I have seen with my Father: and ye also do the things which ye heard from your father.
[39], They answered and said unto him, Our father is Abraham. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham [JESUS SHOWS THEY WERE NOT A PART OF GOD'S ISRAEL BECAUSE THEY WERE NOT BELIEVING AND FOLLOWING GOD'S WORD].
[40], But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I heard from God: this did not Abraham.
[41], Ye do the works of your father. They said unto him, We were not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God.
[42], Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I came forth and am come from God; for neither have I come of myself, but he sent me.
[43], Why do ye not understand my speech? Even because ye cannot hear my word.
[44], Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father it is your will to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and standeth not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father thereof.

God's ISRAEL under both COVENANTS are only those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD. Salvation under both COVNENANT was only ever conditional to those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD regardless of a physical birthright.



Once again God's ISRAEL under both COVENANTS are only those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD. Salvation under both COVNENANT was only ever conditional to those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD. Under both COVENANTS those who did not BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD lost the presence of God.

ISAIAH 59:2 But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, so that he will not hear.

PROVERBS 28:9 He that turns away his ear from hearing the law, even his prayer shall be abomination.

Being under the physical birth right promise in the OLD COVENANT did not automatically grant salvation. Slavation was granted only to all those who BELIEVED and FOLLOWED God's WORD. Under the NEW COVENANT physical the invitation to be a part of God's ISRAEL has gone to ALL NATIONS *MATTHEW 28:19. Once again to be a part of God's ISRAEL in the NEW COVENANT it conditional on BELIEVING and FOLLOWING God's WORD *1 JOHN 2:3-4.[/QUOTE]

Once again, you are conflating the promise of race and the promise of grace. The promise of race is unconditional. God's promise of wealth and power, the birthright, was passed to Isaac, then to Joseph, and finally to Joseph's sons Ephraim and Manasseh. The fullness of the birthright promise was never realized in the old testament period. Genesis 49 reveals that that fullness would occur in the last days.

Genesis 49
49 And Jacob called unto his sons, and said, Gather yourselves together, that I may tell you that which shall befall you in the last days.

The "last days" are generally reckoned from the time of Christ. Therefore the birthright blessing had not yet been realized. The tribes of the northern kingdom were scattered after the fall of Assyria. Until the rise of the British Empire and America no nation or people could claim to be the beneficiary of this promise.

22 Joseph is a fruitful bough, even a fruitful bough by a well; whose branches run over the wall:

23 The archers have sorely grieved him, and shot at him, and hated him:

24 But his bow abode in strength, and the arms of his hands were made strong by the hands of the mighty God of Jacob; (from thence is the shepherd, the stone of Israel:)

25 Even by the God of thy father, who shall help thee; and by the Almighty, who shall bless thee with blessings of heaven above, blessings of the deep that lieth under, blessings of the breasts, and of the womb:

26 The blessings of thy father have prevailed above the blessings of my progenitors unto the utmost bound of the everlasting hills: they shall be on the head of Joseph, and on the crown of the head of him that was separate from his brethren

The birthright is the 'right of inheritance' commonly reserved for the first born son. It is usually unconditional. The claim to the birthright promise rests solely on the birth order, unless mitigated by some extreme factor. In this case Reuben, the actual firstborn of Jacob, was denied this blessing for 'inappropriate sexual behavior' with one of Jacob's 'wives'. But even this is suspect as Joseph was the 'morally legitimate' first born son of Jacob by Rachel, who was his true love. It is my feeling that God found a way to undue the damage caused by the deception of Laban and Leah and convey the birthright to Joseph.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

LoveGodsWord

Well-Known Member
Jun 5, 2017
22,242
6,634
Queensland
Visit site
✟252,319.00
Country
Australia
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
Hi brother, thanks for your thoughts. Your last post however is a little confusing as your formatting is mixing up my post into yours and not separating them out. I have tried to separate them out here.

.............

LGW poster here...

The birthright promise was to the physical decendence of Abraham that BELIEVED and FOLLOWED God's WORD and was not given outside of the physical decendence of Abraham until the NEW COVENANT when God's WORD was given to all mankind. Those who were physical decendence of Abraham and were UNBELIEVERS and were no FOLLOWERS of God's WORD were not considered God's ISRAEL by JESUS and God under the OLD COVENANT or the NEW.

JOHN 8:37-44
[37], I know that ye are Abraham's seed [PHYSICAL ISRAEL]: yet ye seek to kill me, because my word hath not free course in you.
[38], I speak the things which I have seen with my Father: and ye also do the things which ye heard from your father.
[39], They answered and said unto him, Our father is Abraham. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham [JESUS SHOWS THEY WERE NOT A PART OF GOD'S ISRAEL BECAUSE THEY WERE NOT BELIEVING AND FOLLOWING GOD'S WORD].
[40], But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I heard from God: this did not Abraham.
[41], Ye do the works of your father. They said unto him, We were not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God.
[42], Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I came forth and am come from God; for neither have I come of myself, but he sent me.
[43], Why do ye not understand my speech? Even because ye cannot hear my word.
[44], Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father it is your will to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and standeth not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father thereof.

God's ISRAEL under both COVENANTS are only those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD. Salvation under both COVNENANT was only ever conditional to those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD regardless of a physical birthright.

Once again God's ISRAEL under both COVENANTS are only those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD. Salvation under both COVNENANT was only ever conditional to those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD. Under both COVENANTS those who did not BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD lost the presence of God.

ISAIAH 59:2 But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, so that he will not hear.

PROVERBS 28:9 He that turns away his ear from hearing the law, even his prayer shall be abomination.

Being under the physical birth right promise in the OLD COVENANT did not automatically grant salvation. Slavation was granted only to all those who BELIEVED and FOLLOWED God's WORD. Under the NEW COVENANT physical the invitation to be a part of God's ISRAEL has gone to ALL NATIONS *MATTHEW 28:19. Once again to be a part of God's ISRAEL in the NEW COVENANT it conditional on BELIEVING and FOLLOWING God's WORD *1 JOHN 2:3-4.

Once again, you are conflating the promise of race and the promise of grace. The promise of race is unconditional. God's promise of wealth and power, the birthright, was passed to Isaac, then to Joseph, and finally to Joseph's sons Ephraim and Manasseh. The fullness of the birthright promise was never realized in the old testament period. Genesis 49 reveals that that fullness would occur in the last days.

Genesis 49
49 And Jacob called unto his sons, and said, Gather yourselves together, that I may tell you that which shall befall you in the last days.

The "last days" are generally reckoned from the time of Christ. Therefore the birthright blessing had not yet been realized. The tribes of the northern kingdom were scattered after the fall of Assyria. Until the rise of the British Empire and America no nation or people could claim to be the beneficiary of this promise.

22 Joseph is a fruitful bough, even a fruitful bough by a well; whose branches run over the wall:

23 The archers have sorely grieved him, and shot at him, and hated him:

24 But his bow abode in strength, and the arms of his hands were made strong by the hands of the mighty God of Jacob; (from thence is the shepherd, the stone of Israel:)

25 Even by the God of thy father, who shall help thee; and by the Almighty, who shall bless thee with blessings of heaven above, blessings of the deep that lieth under, blessings of the breasts, and of the womb:

26 The blessings of thy father have prevailed above the blessings of my progenitors unto the utmost bound of the everlasting hills: they shall be on the head of Joseph, and on the crown of the head of him that was separate from his brethren

The birthright is the 'right of inheritance' commonly reserved for the first born son. It is usually unconditional. The claim to the birthright promise rests solely on the birth order, unless mitigated by some extreme factor. In this case Reuben, the actual firstborn of Jacob, was denied this blessing for 'inappropriate sexual behavior' with one of Jacob's 'wives'. But even this is suspect as Joseph was the 'morally legitimate' first born son of Jacob by Rachel, who was his true love. It is my feeling that God found a way to undue the damage caused by the deception of Laban and Leah and convey the birthright to Joseph.

What I have noticed is that you have not addressed the post and scriptures from my post that disagrees with you. I also do not see how the scripture you posted disagrees with the scriptures I have provided. Did you wish to have another go?

God bless.
 
Upvote 0

OldWiseGuy

Wake me when it's soup.
Supporter
Feb 4, 2006
46,773
10,981
Wisconsin
Visit site
✟960,122.00
Country
United States
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
Hi brother, thanks for your thoughts. Your last post however is a little confusing as your formatting is mixing up my post into yours and not separating them out. I have tried to separate them out here.

.............

LGW poster here...

The birthright promise was to the physical decendence of Abraham that BELIEVED and FOLLOWED God's WORD and was not given outside of the physical decendence of Abraham until the NEW COVENANT when God's WORD was given to all mankind. Those who were physical decendence of Abraham and were UNBELIEVERS and were no FOLLOWERS of God's WORD were not considered God's ISRAEL by JESUS and God under the OLD COVENANT or the NEW.

JOHN 8:37-44
[37], I know that ye are Abraham's seed [PHYSICAL ISRAEL]: yet ye seek to kill me, because my word hath not free course in you.
[38], I speak the things which I have seen with my Father: and ye also do the things which ye heard from your father.
[39], They answered and said unto him, Our father is Abraham. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham [JESUS SHOWS THEY WERE NOT A PART OF GOD'S ISRAEL BECAUSE THEY WERE NOT BELIEVING AND FOLLOWING GOD'S WORD].
[40], But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I heard from God: this did not Abraham.
[41], Ye do the works of your father. They said unto him, We were not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God.
[42], Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I came forth and am come from God; for neither have I come of myself, but he sent me.
[43], Why do ye not understand my speech? Even because ye cannot hear my word.
[44], Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father it is your will to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and standeth not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father thereof.

God's ISRAEL under both COVENANTS are only those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD. Salvation under both COVNENANT was only ever conditional to those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD regardless of a physical birthright.

Once again God's ISRAEL under both COVENANTS are only those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD. Salvation under both COVNENANT was only ever conditional to those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD. Under both COVENANTS those who did not BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD lost the presence of God.

ISAIAH 59:2 But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, so that he will not hear.

PROVERBS 28:9 He that turns away his ear from hearing the law, even his prayer shall be abomination.

Being under the physical birth right promise in the OLD COVENANT did not automatically grant salvation. Slavation was granted only to all those who BELIEVED and FOLLOWED God's WORD. Under the NEW COVENANT physical the invitation to be a part of God's ISRAEL has gone to ALL NATIONS *MATTHEW 28:19. Once again to be a part of God's ISRAEL in the NEW COVENANT it conditional on BELIEVING and FOLLOWING God's WORD *1 JOHN 2:3-4.



What I have noticed is that you have not addressed the post and scriptures from my post that disagrees with you. I also do not see how the scripture you posted disagrees with the scriptures I have provided. Did you wish to have another go?

God bless.

As I pointed out several times the birthright promise has nothing to do with salvation. Whereas salvation is a blessing for all of mankind the birthright belongs only to the physical descendants of Israel, namely the descendants of the tribe of Joseph.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Righttruth

Regular Member
Supporter
Jan 13, 2015
4,484
341
✟154,410.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Hi brother Jesus did not nulify salvation for the rich brother. He only says it is harder for them because they rely on their riches. Your missing the point on the second of the verses you left out earlier.... but with God all things are possible *MATTHEW 19:26.

Another words, the answer to the question the dsiciples were asking which was who can be saved? Jesus answered men cannot save themselves both rich or poor they need God to save them.

God bless.
A rich man cannot continue thinking that God will help him to get saved. Jesus asked the rich young ruler to give up all to follow Him.
 
Upvote 0