How to "Succeed" as a Young Christian?

Tetra · Dec 22, 2018

DamianWarS said:
You can but it feels your starting point is your life goals of monetary gain and you're just a christian while you do it. Try not to put giving God glory as just something you do but rather the core part of everything you. Why not try some spiritual goals and see how they agree with this other plan

That wasn't my starting point, I'm broke.

Nothing wrong with spiritual goals!

Tetra · Dec 22, 2018

Nothing I've written is in opposition to Christian values. I'm simply talking about navigating western culture.

I think what I'm writing is obvious based on simple observations:

Romantic relationships act as a distraction for young people, to me this really isn't good during academic years.
Children are a financial burden, so much so the Canadian government gives you money for just having them. lol
The probability of navigating western society with ease, with a well paying job is higher than not.
If you're a man, the probability you make more money than your future wife is high (especially if you believe the lefts claim of the wage gap)

Toro · Dec 22, 2018

Depends what you consider success and by what standard you use: God's or the world's

If you value God's standard of success, follow Christ.

If you value the world's view of success follow money and the methods the world uses to pursue it.

Tetra · Dec 22, 2018

Toro said:
Depends what you consider success and by what standard you use: God's or the world's

If you value God's standard of success, follow Christ.

If you value the world's view of success follow money.

You can follow Christ, be well educated and financially stable.

Toro · Dec 22, 2018

Tetra said:
You can follow Christ, be well educated and financially stable.

Didnt say you couldnt....

But what comes first? You cant have two masters

Where is your heart? With money or Christ?

Tetra · Dec 22, 2018

Toro said:
Didnt say you couldnt....

But what comes first? You cant have two masters

Where is your heart? With money or Christ?

Again, I'm not advocating serving two masters. The question I posed in the OP, is how does a Christian navigate western culture in this economic climate.

God gave us the ability to reason, and I'd suggest He wants us to use that to the best of our ability.

Toro · Dec 22, 2018

And I posed a biblical truth.

World considers wealth success.

God considers obedience success.

You just didnt like my answer.

God can bring you through wealth and poverty. Intellect can be lost due to age related degeneration as well as other head injuries.

IF your focus is on money and the things of this world do you honestly believe that you are successful in God's eyes?

IF you put your focus on Christ first can He not add the intellect or money that you need to achieve what is in His will?

There is nothing wrong with seizing opportunities for knowledge or finances, but hey SHOULDNT be the goal to measure a successful Christian.

How one navigates this or any culture/time is by following Christ.

EzekielsWheels · Dec 22, 2018

This may be an aside but don't the letters to Timothy and Titus tell us how a young Christian man should conduct himself? It may be focused on a leadership position but I think a lot of it is generally applicable. My apologies if I'm misreading what you're writing but it seems like that advice is geared toward securing financial independence and autonomy as a man

Tetra · Dec 22, 2018

EzekielsWheels said:
This may be an aside but don't the letters to Timothy and Titus tell us how a young Christian man should conduct himself? It may be focused on a leadership position but I think a lot of it is generally applicable. My apologies if I'm misreading what you're writing but it seems like that advice is geared toward securing financial independence and autonomy as a man

You're not misreading per se.

I don't see any inherent issue with financial independence and autonomy, nor do I see them in opposition to Christendom. I also don't think that should be ones focus, which for some bizarre reason people think that's what I'm suggesting. Haha.

I'm just trying to get at, Christians in my peer group were sold on a magical Disney fairy tale, married young with two kids, house paid off and everything is sunshine and rainbows.

Well, given the economic status now, maybe we need to find alternate ways to navigate this culture then the story we were sold.

EzekielsWheels · Dec 22, 2018

Tetra said:
You're not misreading per se.

I don't see any inherent issue with financial independence and autonomy, nor do I see them in opposition to Christendom. I also don't think that should be ones focus, which for some bizarre reason people think that's what I'm suggesting. Haha.

I'm just trying to get at, Christians in my peer group were sold on a magical Disney fairy tale, married young with two kids, house paid off and everything is sunshine and rainbows.

Well, given the economic status now, maybe we need to find alternate ways to navigate this culture then the story we were sold.

Divorce and fracturing of the family in general has a lot to do with it. There are so many young people who can't afford a place and elderly people who are living alone. What's keeping these groups from coming together?

Tetra · Dec 22, 2018

EzekielsWheels said:
Divorce and fracturing of the family in general has a lot to do with it. There are so many young people who can't afford a place and elderly people who are living alone. What's keeping these groups from coming together?

We agree on this that's for sure! It's actually quite sad.

CitizenD · Dec 22, 2018

Tetra said:
When my son asks, "Dad how can I thrive in this economy?" what do you think is the answer? I think what I proposed is fair.

To add to your list, I think you're missing the values that foster well paying careers.

For instance, engineering and the sciences require curiosity about the world and a willingness to sacrifice your ego for the sake of truth. Medicine requires compassion and a degree of empathy. Law requires attention to detail and a love of arguments and/or philosophy (an art, btw). They all require math and hard work.

You shouldn't have your eyes on the destination, you should have your eyes on the journey! Because you're NEVER going to become a doctor or an engineer just being focused on the money. It just won't happen. Likewise, you're never going to become an inventor or entrepreneur just focused on the money because you need first talent(creativity, engineering skills, etc) and ideas (a specific problem to solve, a business model etc).

Sure, don't have kids until you're financially capable. I would say at least 30. Everyone in my mother's generation waited until 30 to have kids and they're all rich (2-10m+ net worth). That's not a coincidence. Kids take time and energy which is better focused on career growth and learning for yourself (at least when you're young).

Your relationship advice is quite a bit more misguided. I got married very young and it has been an absolute boon compared to my peers. I've split expenses with my wife for 14 years and seen our investments explode during a time when our peers haven't even had the money for investments. We've been able to support one another through rough times and generally provide moral support for one another.

Be a good judge of character and don't be afraid of relationships! If you can't gauge someone's character, especially someone you're that close to, you're in DEEP TROUBLE in the rest of your life too.

SoldierOfTheKing · Dec 22, 2018

Tetra said:
So if you were to pose the question, as a young person who is a Christian in western culture, how can I become well educated, financially stable, and successful?

Wrong definition of success.

And he spake a parable unto them, saying, The ground of a certain rich man brought forth plentifully:
And he thought within himself, saying, What shall I do, because I have no room where to bestow my fruits?
And he said, This will I do: I will pull down my barns, and build greater; and there will I bestow all my fruits and my goods.
And I will say to my soul, Soul, thou hast much goods laid up for many years; take thine ease, eat, drink, and be merry.
But God said unto him, Thou fool, this night thy soul shall be required of thee: then whose shall those things be, which thou hast provided?
So is he that layeth up treasure for himself, and is not rich toward God.

Luke 12:16-21

Christgirl67 · Dec 22, 2018

Tetra said:
@DamianWarS made a post about how our culture should operate when it comes to young men and women, and I thought it was excellent. It can be found here:
Should I wait till marriage?

While I like the post above, unless there was a complete upheaval of western culture, it's not going to happen.

So if you were to pose the question, as a young person who is a Christian in western culture, how can I become well educated, financially stable, and successful?

To me the answer is very clear:

Avoid any romantic relationships (especially true if you're a man)

Graduate high school

Graduate university in a program that corresponds to a well paying job (avoid the arts)

Establish a well paying career

Get married to someone of equal success and direction (OR not at all if you're a man)

Get a prenup if the person is not of equal success and direction

Do not have kids

On average, I would say in this culture and economy, following these "rules" will lead to the best outcome. You might think, well I didn't do any of this and I'm doing well, sure, but it's a different time now. Where I live near Toronto the average home is 1/2 a mil, the cost of education, and living expenses is nuts.

What are your thoughts CF?

Tetra

I think I understand what you are saying.Are you saying to avoid being in a relationship while in college, do not have kids out of wedlock?

Tetra · Dec 22, 2018

CitizenD said:
To add to your list, I think you're missing the values that foster well paying careers.

For instance, engineering and the sciences require curiosity about the world and a willingness to sacrifice your ego for the sake of truth. Medicine requires compassion and a degree of empathy. Law requires attention to detail and a love of arguments and/or philosophy (an art, btw). They all require math and hard work.

You shouldn't have your eyes on the destination, you should have your eyes on the journey! Because you're NEVER going to become a doctor or an engineer just being focused on the money. It just won't happen. Likewise, you're never going to become an inventor or entrepreneur just focused on the money because you need first talent(creativity, engineering skills, etc) and ideas (a specific problem to solve, a business model etc).

Sure, don't have kids until you're financially capable. I would say at least 30. Everyone in my mother's generation waited until 30 to have kids and they're all rich (2-10m+ net worth). That's not a coincidence. Kids take time and energy which is better focused on career growth and learning for yourself (at least when you're young).

Your relationship advice is quite a bit more misguided. I got married very young and it has been an absolute boon compared to my peers. I've split expenses with my wife for 14 years and seen our investments explode during a time when our peers haven't even had the money for investments. We've been able to support one another through rough times and generally provide moral support for one another.

Be a good judge of character and don't be afraid of relationships! If you can't gauge someone's character, especially someone you're that close to, you're in DEEP TROUBLE in the rest of your life too.

I would agree a combined income would be better than a single obviously. I thought I made that clear with the caveat of having similar success and direction. I've seen a few of my peers having only a singular partner with a well established career, while the other took a back seat and flip flopped between jobs etc. I find this to be more true when there is a singular partner who is "well off".

I think what I'm getting at here is when there is a difference in success, direction, goals, etc. It can become easy for one person to carry the other in the relationship. It's easier when both partners are on the same page.

Tetra · Dec 22, 2018

Christgirl67 said:
I think I understand what you are saying.Are you saying to avoid being in a relationship while in college, do not have kids out of wedlock?

Most definitely on both!!

Kids out of wedlock would be insanity in this economy, obviously some make mistakes, but if you can control it, avoid that at all costs. Statistically it decreases your chances of even making it to middle class by a long shot. Three Simple Rules Poor Teens Should Follow to Join the Middle Class

From my observations, romantic relationships in high school and college serve as a distraction.

Tetra · Dec 22, 2018

Toro said:
And I posed a biblical truth.

World considers wealth success.

God considers obedience success.

You just didnt like my answer.

God can bring you through wealth and poverty. Intellect can be lost due to age related degeneration as well as other head injuries.

IF your focus is on money and the things of this world do you honestly believe that you are successful in God's eyes?

IF you put your focus on Christ first can He not add the intellect or money that you need to achieve what is in His will?

There is nothing wrong with seizing opportunities for knowledge or finances, but hey SHOULDNT be the goal to measure a successful Christian.

How one navigates this or any culture/time is by following Christ.

You realize I put "success" in quotes for a reason right? I'm also confused about where you think you and I disagree?

I don't take any issue with what you've written.

Christgirl67 · Dec 22, 2018

Tetra said:
Most definitely on both!!

Kids out of wedlock would be insanity in this economy, obviously some make mistakes, but if you can control it, avoid that at all costs. Statistically it decreases your chances of even making it to middle class. Three Simple Rules Poor Teens Should Follow to Join the Middle Class

From my observations, romantic relationships in high school and college serve as a distraction. I'm in university now and honestly, these kids talk non-stop about their relationships. Not to mention, they can barely manage waking up in the morning, going to class, cleaning their rooms etc. let alone handle a romantic relationship. Romantic relationships should take a back seat to their academic studies without question.

I agree with your post.I am purposely choosing to avoid romantic relationships until after college so I can be totally focused on college and building a relationship with God.It causes too many problems.But I know some people can handle a relationship in college, so to each its own.And abstinence is the best way to avoid problems as well.

Tetra · Dec 23, 2018

Christgirl67 said:
I agree with your post.I am purposely choosing to avoid romantic relationships until after college so I can be totally focused on college and building a relationship with God.It causes too many problems.But I know some people can handle a relationship in college, so to each its own.And abstinence is the best way to avoid problems as well.

Most likely few can actually handle a romantic relationship. I see these kids everyday, they can barely get up in the morning, they can't read, they can't write, their dorms are a mess, out late at night, on Facebook in class, eat like garbage, and pretty much have got nothing in their life sorted out. I wish I was joking for goodness sakes.

I'm not going to tell you what to do, but God and academics sounds wise to me.

Damon46789 · Dec 23, 2018

Tetra said:
@DamianWarS made a post about how our culture should operate when it comes to young men and women, and I thought it was excellent. It can be found here:
Should I wait till marriage?

While I like the post above, unless there was a complete upheaval of western culture, it's not going to happen.

So if you were to pose the question, as a young person who is a Christian in western culture, how can I become well educated, financially stable, and successful?

To me the answer is very clear:

Avoid any romantic relationships (especially true if you're a man)

Graduate high school

Graduate university in a program that corresponds to a well paying job (avoid the arts)

Establish a well paying career

Get married to someone of equal success and direction (OR not at all if you're a man)

Get a prenup if the person is not of equal success and direction

Do not have kids

On average, I would say in this culture and economy, following these "rules" will lead to the best outcome. You might think, well I didn't do any of this and I'm doing well, sure, but it's a different time now. Where I live near Toronto the average home is 1/2 a mil, the cost of education, and living expenses is nuts.

What are your thoughts CF?

Tetra

Success with God is not measured by how much money you make and how successful you are. If you obey God’s commandments, then you are successful.1 John 2:4. If you are generous towards those in God’s church regardless of income level and you are wise enough to know how to obey God, then God will bless you.

How to "Succeed" as a Young Christian?

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