If the Bible is so cut and dry why do no two Christians agree on doctrine?

Chris V++ said:

Can't all Christian denominations can make claims to have roots in the 1 St Century church. There were breaks before the Great Schism of 1054. Schism - Wikipedia

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No not really. There are no recorded groups until the Reformation believing what most Protestants/evangelicals believe. There weren't even any groups outside the mainstream church that believed in the communional elements not being the real body and blood of Christ, with the exception of docetists who claimed Christ wasn't actually God. Most of those later schisms had to do with Christology more than anything else and was always without exception when a singular Bishop tried to form his own narrative outside the church and it's councils.

Kenny'sID said:

The scripture says nothing bout earthly, it was a matter of heaven and hell for the Jews just as it is us.

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God gave Jews the promised land of Israel and current Jerusalem and the New Jerusalem promised in Revelation.
Hell was preached to the Jews not to Gentiles.
Yes we are promised heaven and heavenly places according to Christ through Paul our Apostle.

I believe that in other threads (like controversial) this can be discussed better, and disclosed more accurately.
Here it is probably, and simply , against the rules of the forum ....

re 101

because sin and rebellion muddy the waters. scripture is spiritually discerned.

yeshuaslavejeff said:

I don't agree, necessarily with this.
What, for instance, specifically, does that translation say is nailed to the tree ?

vs

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Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; Col 2:14

hid in him said:

Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; Col 2:14

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That is a little better, good.

Also I should note that until the great schism biblical interpretation wasn't as much of a personal issue as no one person determined doctrine. The most pious church leaders would gather in councils to debate when it was necessary, just as the apostles did in the NT. They would pray for the guidance of the spirit and hold true to the decision of the council. All those early heretics couldn't accept these councils relying instead on their own proud interpretations which were always strange and typically blasphemous. All the way up to the schism when Rome decided one man could lead the church instead of many and split away, and then the Protestant Reformation amplified that to every individual.

Neostarwcc said:

Whether it's eternal security or some other basic truth of scripture how come no two Christians will agree with the Bible? I mean there are Christians out there that dont even believe that belief is good enough for salvation when the Bible clearly says "believe in Christ and you will be saved" in multiple spots. I mean its extremely difficult to get the truth out of scripture because everyone will interpret a particular verse differently. Why isn't there just one huge believe all belief that one can pick and say "Okay I believe that. Yay! I am saved now!"? Why all the divisions in the church and among Christians? What is the truth about scripture?

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Essentially I believe it’s because more of us listen to pastors rather than reading the Word for ourselves for conveniences sake. They’ve been to Bible college, they know Hebrew and Greek therefore they must be teaching the right stuff and if another church teaches differently then they must be wrong. Denominations are human foolishness. There’s only one church our Lord made and every believing individual is a member of the Body of Christ.

Also we’re bound to get confused when we read the whole of Scripture and apply what was intended for Israel to ourselves as Christians. Apostles contradicting each other how can this be if God is the God of order not of chaos?
Well, they’re not they just have different audiences as Acts explains. Peter, John, James and Jude carrying the gospel to the Jews and Paul carrying it to us the Gentiles. That takes the confusion out when as Paul and Timothy tell us we rightly divide what is for Israel as the Bride and what is for us as the Body.

The whole Bible is for us but it’s not all to us. When we mix it all up that’s when confusion sets in and faith with works or without works crops up.
The Body of Christ and how salvation was to come to the Gentiles was a mystery hid in God.
Prophecy belongs to Israel.
Mystery belongs to Gentiles.

Neostarwcc said:

Whether it's eternal security or some other basic truth of scripture how come no two Christians will agree with the Bible?

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False premise. Matthew 12:30.

Neostarwcc said:

Why all the divisions in the church and among Christians?

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1 Corinthians 14:33, James 4:1.

Neostarwcc said:

What is the truth about scripture?

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Eg: 1 John 4:1, 2 Peter 2:1-2, 2 Thessalonians 2:3.

There has been an apostasy - a great falling away from the original faith. Jesus said this in Luke 19:13-15 - the parable, when He went to receive His crown in heaven and then to return, He left The Kingdom in the hands of servants - but His subjects hated Him, sent a delegation after Him, to say "we will not have this man to reign over us".

St. Paul warns too: "now even more in my absence—work out your salvation with fear and trembling" - "I have no one else like Timothy who will genuinely care about you—for all seek after their own interests, not those of Christ Jesus".

Most Christians (not all of them, by miracle) have been deceived by the false doctrines of apostate teachers before they have come to maturity, and therefore they are under the spell of the devil - the father of lies. They twist the scriptures to make them fit with their predefined doctrinal views, that they did not from from the bible, but from subjecting themselves to the distorted teachings of the apostates at the pulpits.

The truth is the thing that Jesus said would set us free, and there is unity in the truth when we are united in our love of it. But He also said that we would need to keep His commandments in order to know the truth that would set us free.. and that is what they don't do (eg: want to say that a baby will go to hell because of what Adam did? then you do not teach justice in God's name).

There are some people, calling themselves Christian, who don't actually love the truth at all - they just like to argue (possibly something within you will feel like arguing with me now, and that is how it happens - that is the flesh, ego, pride).

The false Christians have followed some idea that made them think that they have to make a covenant with death in order to escape eternal torment (Isaiah 28:15-19).

hid in him said:

God gave Jews the promised land of Israel and current Jerusalem and the New Jerusalem promised in Revelation.
Hell was preached to the Jews not to Gentiles.
Yes we are promised heaven and heavenly places according to Christ through Paul our Apostle.

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In telling us Christians will not be judged, you are teaching a false doctrine. Also it's clear you had no reason not to answer my question about the Sheep/Goats, you simply could not answer because that answer would men works are necessary, absolutely necessary.

Here is my proof Christians will be judged, and that you are wrong, pay close attention to the term "all".

2 Corinthians 5:10 ESV
For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may receive what is due for what he has done in the body, whether good or evil.

BTW, if we don't need to be good in order to be saved, or we can do evil /live in sin and still be saved, why does that verse say otherwise? And if I have to spell it out, what do you think God has in store on that day for the evil/those who don't do good? It only take a bit of common sense to answer that question.

hid in him said:

The gospels are for all but not to all for salvation.

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It is through the gospel preached to Jews that Gentiles understand that the law was given by Moses but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

Kenny'sID said:

In telling us Christians will not be judged, you are teaching a false doctrine. Also it's clear you had no reason not to answer my question about the Sheep/Goats, you simply could not answer because that answer would men works are necessary, absolutely necessary.

Here is my proof Christians will be judged, and that you are wrong, pay close attention to the term "all".

2 Corinthians 5:10 ESV
For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may receive what is due for what he has done in the body, whether good or evil.

BTW, if we don't need to be good in order to be saved, or we can do evil /live in sin and still be saved, why does that verse say otherwise? And if I have to spell it out, what do you think God has in store on that day for the evil/those who don't do good? It only take a bit of common sense to answer that question.

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Nothing I have typed here tonight has been of my own opinion but what I have understood of the Scriptures which I fully admit I could be misunderstanding because I’m only human. And I thank you for your warning because it serves us all to be reminded and responsible for what we believe.

My understanding is that at judgment we are not under condemnation because of Christ’s blood not judged under wrath but that we will go through a baptism of fire with our lives tested and rewarded or suffer loss of what we added to His foundation but ourselves will be unhurt.
But judged by how we lived in accordance to the Holy Spirit and grace we are each given to follow based on our understanding of His revealed will to us and the convictions He has given each of us and how we used and were responsible for the talents He gives us.

Of course we need to live a good life we are saved and enabled to be His ambassadors on earth being merciful to others as He is, to go back to a life of self and sin would be worse than having never known of His mercies, unthinkable.

I didn’t answer the sheep and the goats question because I haven’t spent much time studying it and I don’t want to spout unfounded theories or opinions to aid in my own and others confusion. Also I didn’t think I needed too because I said Revelation was about Israel so that ended the point. But I will happily go back and do some research, I don’t mind being in the wrong and seeming foolish as long as God is glorified and the gospel of grace preached to the world.

EDITED FOR TYPOS.

Well of course, people falsely think the reformed, and baptists are antinomians when they are not.

Of course, they won't say it explicitly.

We are not antinomians.

Because we as human beings cling to our pride and humility comes so difficultly.

IF we were all humble, truly humble, not a false show of humility..... we would ALL be open to correction.

None would see themselves greater than their brother or sister

The reason why is pride. That is why God opposes the proud. Not the sick, the weak, the sinner... but the proud.

IF we were all humble we would all recognize truth for truth. Instead pride says "Only my Christianity is the right one!".

Handmaid for Jesus said:

It is through the gospel preached to Jews that Gentiles understand that the law was given by Moses but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

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God's Grace and Mercy has been undiminished and full and seen throughout all history - including His Dealings with Moses and the Israelites, with Abraham, Isaac and Jacob ,
with Job, Joshua, Adam, Havah (Eve), etc etc etc

yeshuaslavejeff said:

God's Grace and Mercy has been undiminished and full and seen throughout all history - including His Dealings with Moses and the Israelites, with Abraham, Isaac and Jacob ,
with Job, Joshua, Adam, Havah (Eve), etc etc etc

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Are you saying that grace and truth did not come by Jesus Christ?

Handmaid for Jesus said:

Are you saying that grace and truth did not come by Jesus Christ?

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Oops sorry wrong button!

Handmaid for Jesus said:

Are you saying that grace and truth did not come by Jesus Christ?

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You will have to quote me where (and why) you think that.

yeshuaslavejeff said:

You will have to quote me where (and why) you think that.

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I quoted you already.Maybe I misunderstood your meaning in post #116. I took that to mean that grace and truth did not come by Jesus Christ.