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Scapegoat
- Thread starter Pneuma3
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amen, and He did it for ALL humanity.
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Try not to get bogged down with what Calvinists believe.
Can “world” in 1 John 2:2 mean something other than all people for all time?
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I know, the picture of life and death is good one and preaches well. But...
Lev. 16:6 Aaron shall offer the bull as a sin offering for himself and shall make atonement for himself and for his house. 7 Then he shall take the two goats and set them before the Lord at the entrance of the tent of meeting. 8 And Aaron shall cast lots over the two goats, one lot for the Lord and the other lot for Azazel. 9 And Aaron shall present the goat on which the lot fell for the Lord and use it as a sin offering, 10 but the goat on which the lot fell for Azazel shall be presented alive before the Lord to make atonement over it, that it may be sent away into the wilderness to Azazel.
Many bibles translate the bold "as a scapegoat," it is the Hebrew la-azazel. The "la" prefix is for or of... and Azazel... so "for Azazel." This goat is case away, out of the congregation, away from the community... not to be a part of Israel. So I get the picture but sin originated with satan and will be heaped back upon him when we are perfected... an event we all await for.
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His work is "once for all." It covers and all who looked to God's redemption all the way back to Adam.
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That didn’t answer the question.
Can “world” in 1 John 2:2 mean something other than all people for all time?
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However I believe it is a Hebrew idiom speaking of all that is evil and sins in humanity placed upon him who was without sin that he might take the sins
What you are doing is making Satan the sacrifice for our sin.
Does Jesus take away our sin or does Satan take them away?
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That has nothing to do with my question. It’s one of grammar.
Can “world” in 1 John 2:2 mean something other than all people for all time?
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well if it does not answer your question I do not know what you are asking me. Give me your understanding of the world in 1 jn.2:2 so I have some type of reference to where you are going.
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mmksparbud
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No--the 1st goat represents Jesus.
Lev_16:8 And Aaron shall cast lots upon the two goats; one lot for the LORD, and the other lot for the scapegoat.
Dictionaries - Easton's Bible Dictionary - Scapegoat
Scapegoat [N]
At a later period an evasion or modification of the law of Moses was introduced by the Jews. "The goat was conducted to a mountain named Tzuk, situated at a distance of ten Sabbath days' journey, or about six and a half English miles, from Jerusalem. At this place the Judean desert was supposed to commence; and the man in whose charge the goat was sent out, while setting him free, was instructed to push the unhappy beast down the slope of the mountain side, which was so steep as to insure the death of the goat, whose bones were broken by the fall. The reason of this barbarous custom was that on one occasion the scapegoat returned to Jerusalem after being set free, which was considered such an evil omen that its recurrence was prevented for the future by the death of the goat" (Twenty-one Years' Work in the Holy Land). This mountain is now called el-Muntar.
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mmksparbud
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How do you get rid of those lines??? That happened once before and I can't remember how I got rid of them.
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It is idiomatic... and Yeshua does remove our sin... but the picture is placing it back where it came from. That goat is sent away from the camp never to return... never to return! That is sin being sent back to hasatan and him be permanently exiled from God and His people.
That's how I see it, there are other reasons I see it this way. But if you see it differently, that's fine. It will be whatever it will be and perhaps we're both wrong.
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The question was whether or not "world" can be all people from all time, correct? I am saying messiah's work wasn't just for those born after his ascension, it covers all of creation for all time. He earned the right to reverse the curse, the curse happened in the garden, hence my starting his work with Adam.
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I’ll try this. It’s common knowledge (or should be) that John uses the word “world” in at least 8 different ways. So could his use, grammatically, be different than what you think it is?
For instance, could the use be “people from all tongues, tribes, and nations?
He is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the sins of people from every tongue, tribe, and nation.
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Actually, the question was could it be something other than that.
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You have no idea how accurate their oral tradition was. It was extremely accurate; way beyond anything today.
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