Going "Undercover" as a "Mormon" question for non LDS christians

mmksparbud said:

Diversion. Just asked -- as the person sounds Mormon. If they are not--the answer is no. Because as I said--the point is that you believe you do become God eventually--so it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to make a big deal of how soon you become one. I agree that the truth is what is important---I understand standing up for what your believes are and correcting what you feel is wrong--I do it constantly. I don't mind people arguing against SDA believes--just be against what we actually believe and not what non-SDA's think we believe. It's just that you guys have a way of hiding what you actually do believe.

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Mormons hold that all sincere Mormons become gods, which is NOT in the scriptures, so they had to add false teachings in false revelations in Book of Mormon and Pearl of Great price!

Ironhold said:

As far as Martin himself goes -

Christian Countercult Movement: W.R. Martin

He went to the grave having to defend his credibility against several severe allegations, so you'd do better to avoid him on principal.

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Who was doing th research on him though? As he was a starch defender of Biblical Christianity, and against cults such as Mormons and JW!

SimplyMe said:

Whether she does it elsewhere or not, that particularly instance is a very clear use of quote mining. She is using a verse from the D&C that, if you read the "Section" it comes from, does not support what she is trying to say. The chapter (or section, as they call it) talks solely about what occurs at the time of the resurrection and nothing in LDS theology suggest they will "instantly," upon resurrection, become gods -- much less equal to God. Every instance of Mormons talking about how they can become gods talks about it as an ultimate goal they strive towards after the resurrection.

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Have you considered that Phoebe Ann isn't quote mining per se rather heeding what Jesus revealed:

Considering she is routinely comes under opposition by the same individuals … maybe what is seen on the surface as quote mining is quite possibly more of being wise and harmless in the midst of wolf LDS teaching and so is simply frustrating those who actually mine quote to justify Mormon beliefs to begin with.

YeshuaFan said:

Who was doing th research on him though? As he was a starch defender of Biblical Christianity, and against cults such as Mormons and JW!

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He made his fortune lying to evangelical Christians about everything: who he was, what other people believe, etc.

Evangelical Christianity is a strong faith and does not need this type of "defense".

At the resurrection, the Latter-day Saint has already either achieved Spirit Prison or Paradise.


Latter-day Saints teach that Godhood is eternal life.

Furthermore, the Book of Mormon states:

Alma 34
32 For behold, this life is the time for men to prepare to meet God; yea, behold the day of this life is the day for men to perform their labors.

33 And now, as I said unto you before, as ye have had so many witnesses, therefore, I beseech of you that ye do not procrastinate the day of your repentance until the end; for after this day of life, which is given us to prepare for eternity, behold, if we do not improve our time while in this life, then cometh the night of darkness wherein there can be no labor performed.

34 Ye cannot say, when ye are brought to that awful crisis, that I will repent, that I will return to my God. Nay, ye cannot say this; for that same spirit which doth possess your bodies at the time that ye go out of this life, that same spirit will have power to possess your body in that eternal world.

35 For behold, if ye have procrastinated the day of your repentance even until death, behold, ye have become subjected to the spirit of the devil, and he doth seal you his; therefore, the Spirit of the Lord hath withdrawn from you, and hath no place in you, and the devil hath all power over you; and this is the final state of the wicked.

YeshuaFan said:

Mormons hold that all sincere Mormons become gods, which is NOT in the scriptures, so they had to add false teachings in false revelations in Book of Mormon and Pearl of Great price!

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Only those Mormons who are "valiant in their testimony of Jesus" will become gods.

YeshuaFan said:

Mormonism teaches that there are many gods, that there was never was an Eternal God, deny the trinity, deny the blood atonement of Christ, hold to becoming gods themselves, really as much a Christian church as the JW are!

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Mormonism teaches that all humans and gods are made of uncreated matter that has always existed.

YeshuaFan said:

The Mormon Apostles have held that Mormonism teaches that there are 3 separate gods, and do NOT hold to the Christian view of God being One God in 3 persons!

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Then feel free to try and defend three-in-one if you think it's so correct.

Mormon Prophets have held that Adam was the God of the earth that had physical sex with Mary, and Jesus was the result.

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Again, you've got random statements from individuals - statements not accepted as canon - being mashed together to say something that the speakers never actually said.

Common issue with anti-Mormon material, which is why you need to put it down and study for yourself.

Mormonism greatest tenet is that God was once a man just like us who evolved to being God, just as all faithful Mormons shall one day do... As Man now is, God once was, as God now is, we shall one day become!

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Your problem with this is?

YeshuaFan said:

Who was doing th research on him though? As he was a starch defender of Biblical Christianity, and against cults such as Mormons and JW!

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The page I linked you to is from a college, and the sources are cited.

Will you read it?

Or are you willing to accept the issues with Martin's credibility because he agreed with you?

Ironhold said:

Then feel free to try and defend three-in-one if you think it's so correct.



Again, you've got random statements from individuals - statements not accepted as canon - being mashed together to say something that the speakers never actually said.

Common issue with anti-Mormon material, which is why you need to put it down and study for yourself.



Your problem with this is?

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God is eternally God, never was a human, and Jesus is eternally God Himself...

Phoebe Ann said:

Only those Mormons who are "valiant in their testimony of Jesus" will become gods.

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Interesting that Mormons and WoF both bought the lie of Satan"you shall be as God", as both hold to being gods!

Jane_Doe said:

He made his fortune lying to evangelical Christians about everything: who he was, what other people believe, etc.

Evangelical Christianity is a strong faith and does not need this type of "defense".

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His work on the Mormons and JW were spot on though!

Phoebe Ann said:

Mormonism teaches that all humans and gods are made of uncreated matter that has always existed.

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They also hold to all humans being already created and Heaven and waiting on physical bodies to enter, so hence the push for large families, as need to go those spirit children into the world!

Ironhold said:

The page I linked you to is from a college, and the sources are cited.

Will you read it?

Or are you willing to accept the issues with Martin's credibility because he agreed with you?

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He agreed with the Bible in regards to cults such as Mormons and JW!

YeshuaFan said:

His work on the Mormons and JW were spot on though!

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HAHA!!! I'm sorry, but that statement is nothing but a huge comedic laugh.

Walter Martian can't go a single paragraph without lying. And I'm not just saying this to "defend" (*rolls eyes*) my faith. Rather, he can't go a single paragraph without lying about any faith he doesn't like.

Jane_Doe said:

HAHA!!! I'm sorry, but that statement is nothing but a huge comedic laugh.

Walter Martian can't go a single paragraph without lying. And I'm not just saying this to "defend" (*rolls eyes*) my faith. Rather, he can't go a single paragraph without lying about any faith he doesn't like.

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Seriously.

Martin's the guy who said that personal attacks were OK in the first place, and it came back to haunt him big time.

Look into the man and his claims from a skeptic eye, and you'll see that a lot of what he said over the years just doesn't hold weight.

Jane_Doe said:

HAHA!!! I'm sorry, but that statement is nothing but a huge comedic laugh.

Walter Martian can't go a single paragraph without lying. And I'm not just saying this to "defend" (*rolls eyes*) my faith. Rather, he can't go a single paragraph without lying about any faith he doesn't like.

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Why are you being so vague? Please give us a list of some of his lies. Thank you.