One of the most controversial issues, is the DAY OF WORSHIP

Danthemailman · Dec 7, 2018

ace of hearts said:
Why isn't the sabbath mentioned in Genesis if it was given to all mankind. What evidence do you have showing sabbath observance prior to the departure of Egypt?

Amen! The word "Sabbath" first appears in Exodus 16:23 - Then he said to them, “This is what the Lord has said: ‘Tomorrow is a Sabbath rest, a holy Sabbath to the Lord. Bake what you will bake today, and boil what you will boil; and lay up for yourselves all that remains, to be kept until morning.

If every man from Adam to Moses kept the Sabbath, why is the Hebrew word for the weekly Sabbath found in the Ten Commandments, never found in the book of Genesis? Why is no one before Moses ever being told to keep the Sabbath? Why are there no examples of anyone keeping the Sabbath before Moses? Why were the Patriarchs never instructed about the Sabbath, but were instructed regarding: offerings: Genesis 4:3-4, Altars Genesis 8:20, Priests: Genesis 14:18, Tithes: Genesis 14:20, Circumcision: Genesis 17:10, Marriage: Genesis 2:24 and Genesis 34:9.

*Why would God leave out the Sabbath command in Genesis if it was for everyone to keep before Moses? *Nowhere in Scripture is there any hint that Sabbath keeping was practiced from Adam to Moses.

Deuteronomy 5:1 - And Moses called all Israel, and said to them: “Hear, O Israel, the statutes and judgments which I speak in your hearing today, that you may learn them and be careful to observe them. 2 The Lord our God made a covenant with us in Horeb. 3 The Lord did not make this covenant with our fathers, but with us, those who are here today, all of us who are alive.

Nehemiah 9:13 - Then You came down on Mount Sinai, And spoke with them from heaven; You gave them just ordinances and true laws, Good statutes and commandments. 14 So You made known to them Your holy sabbath, And laid down for them commandments, statutes and law, Through Your servant Moses.

The Word of God makes it quite clear that Sabbath observance was a sign between God and Israel: The Israelites are to observe the Sabbath, celebrating it for the generations to come as a lasting covenant. It will be a sign between me and the Israelites forever, for in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, and on the seventh day he abstained from work and rested” (Exodus 31:16-17).

In Deuteronomy 5, Moses restates the Ten Commandments to the next generation of Israelites. Here, after commanding Sabbath observance in verses 12–14, Moses gives the reason the Sabbath was given to the nation Israel: Remember that you were slaves in Egypt and that the Lord your God brought you out of there with a mighty hand and an outstretched arm. Therefore the Lord your God has commanded you to observe the Sabbath day (verse 15).

liberty of conscience · Dec 7, 2018

Danthemailman said:
The Word of God makes it quite clear that Sabbath observance was a sign between God and Israel: The Israelites are to observe the Sabbath, celebrating it for the generations to come as a lasting covenant. It will be a sign between me and the Israelites forever, for in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, and on the seventh day he abstained from work and rested” (Exodus 31:16-17).

You have been answered on numerous occasions, and on numerous webforums. I ask you now to deal with the material presented:

It was given to the "children of Israel" (Exodus 31:13) as a "perpetual (eternal) covenant" (Exodus 31:16) since it is the "sign" that the LORD is the Creator ("made") of "heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed" (Exodus 31:17).

Hint:

Jesus is the real Israel (Matthew 2:13-15; Hosea 11:1; his children are his disciples; Hebrews 2:13; Isaiah 8:16,18; John 13:33), the real "Prince" (Genesis 32:28; Acts 5:31) with God, the "overc[omer]" (John 16:33; Revelation 3:21), who himself is the "elect" (Isaiah 42:1; Matthew 12:18; 1 Peter 2:6) of the Father, in whom all the promises of God find their realization (2 Corinthians 1:20) with whom the eternal covenant was made and His "disciples" are His "children", in whom the "law" of God (Exodus 20:1-17; Isaiah 8:20) is sealed, given Him by His Father (Hebrews 2:13; Isaiah 8:16,18; John 13:33).

Mat 2:13-15; Hos 11:1; Jer 31:33; Rom 9:6-8; Heb 2:13; Isa 8:16,18; Jhn 13:33, 16:33, 17:12, 18:9, 21:5; 1 Cor 15:46; 2 Cor 1:20; Gal 6:16; Heb 3:6, 8:8,10; Rev 3:21; Gen 32:28; Act 5:31;

Matthew:

Matthew 2:13 KJB - And when they were departed, behold, the angel of the Lord appeareth to Joseph in a dream, saying, Arise, and take the young child and his mother, and flee into Egypt, and be thou there until I bring thee word: for Herod will seek the young child to destroy him.

Matthew 2:14 KJB - When he arose, he took the young child and his mother by night, and departed into Egypt:

Matthew 2:15 KJB - And was there until the death of Herod: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying, Out of Egypt have I called my son.

Hosea:

Hosea 11:1 KJB - When Israel was a child, then I loved him, and called my son out of Egypt.

According to the prophet Hosea, “Israel” is the [male, “him”] “child”, even the “son” of God [JEHOVAH, the Father], whom God “called” “out of Egypt”.

Compare again to the words specifically used by Matthew in Matthew 2:13-15:

"the young child", "into Egypt", "the young child", "him", "the young child", "into Egypt", "that it might be fulfilled" "which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet", "Out of Egypt", "have I called", "my son".

To the words used in Hosea 11:1:

“a child”, “him”, “called” “my son” “out of Egypt”.

What was this "child's" name? Who is speaking through the prophet? Who then is the "my" of "my son", and who then is this "son"?

Notice:

1 Corinthians 15:46 KJB - Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.

Just as Adam (the first), Jesus is Adam the second/last (1 Corinthians 15:45,47), for (Colossians 1:16) whom the Sabbath was "made" (Mark 2:27) at Creation (Genesis 2:1-3; Exodus 20:8-11).

Just as David, Jesus is the real David (Jeremiah 30:9; Ezekiel 34:23,24, 37:24,25; Hosea 3:5).

Just as Solomon, Jesus is the real Solomon, the "son of David" (Luke 18:38), the "Prince of Peace" (Isaiah 9:6).

Just as Joshua the son of Nun (perpetual/eternal), Jesus is the real Joshua (Matthew 1:21; Luke 1:31) the Son of the Eternal Father.

Just as Moses, Jesus is "that Prophet" that God the Father raised up (Deuteronomy 18:15-19; John 1:21, 6:14, 7:40; Acts 3:22-23, 7:37) who would lead his people out of bondage of sin into the promised land.

Just as Melchizedek priest of Salem, Jesus is the High Priest of Peace/Gospel (Hebrews 5:10, 7:26, 9:11).

Just as Isaac (rejoicing in joy), Jesus is the true Isaac, our rejoicing (Jeremiah 15:16; John 16:22).

The everlasting covenant (Malachi 2:5; Hebrews 13:20) was made (between God the Father, and) with the real "Israel" (Jesus (Matthew 2:13-15; Hosea 11:1), the "elect"; Isaiah 42:21; Matthew 12:18), for it is said, it is with the "house of Israel" (Jeremiah 31:33; Hebrews 8:8), and Jesus is over His own "house", whose "house are we" (Hebrews 3:6).

Matthew is clear, under inspiration of the Holy Ghost, citing the inspired prophet Hosea, that Jesus is the real fulfillment of Hosea 11:1, and his name is there given as "Israel" - the real overcomer over all things with God.

liberty of conscience · Dec 7, 2018

Danthemailman said:
If every man from Adam to Moses kept the Sabbath, why is the Hebrew word for the weekly Sabbath found in the Ten Commandments, never found in the book of Genesis?

God said it is:

Exo 20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
Exo 20:9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
Exo 20:10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
Exo 20:11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

Gen 2:1 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.
Gen 2:2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
Gen 2:3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

God defines His own words. He said that the seventh day (at creation, "made") is the sabbath of God.

Why are you attempting to re-define what God said is in Genesis?

liberty of conscience · Dec 7, 2018

Danthemailman said:
Deuteronomy 5:1 - And Moses called all Israel, and said to them: “Hear, O Israel, the statutes and judgments which I speak in your hearing today, that you may learn them and be careful to observe them. 2 The Lord our God made a covenant with us in Horeb. 3 The Lord did not make this covenant with our fathers, but with us, those who are here today, all of us who are alive.

Again, you are reading your apriori into the word 'covenant' in Deuteronomy 5:1. Everytime you read that word ('covenant') around Mt Sinai, you automatically assume 10C (which is God's "my covenant", totally different covenant, see Romans 3:31; Jeremiah 31:33, etc). This is not the case. The 'covenant' that was not made with their fathers is found in Exodus 19:8 and is not the 10C at all.

Exo 19:8 And all the people answered together, and said, All that the LORD hath spoken we will do. And Moses returned the words of the people unto the LORD.

(old) Covenant struck. God's "if", "then" condition, and their "All that the LORD hath spoken we will do", with Moses as the Mediator between the elders of the people and God. This is seen in Hebrews 8:6-9, involving their faulty promises. You will find nowhere such a 'struck deal' before that event.

liberty of conscience · Dec 7, 2018

Danthemailman said:
Why is no one before Moses ever being told to keep the Sabbath? Why are there no examples of anyone keeping the Sabbath before Moses?

You are ignorant (not knowing) of the word of God, defining itself line upon line.

The many times that the "Sabbath" of the LORD is given in the Old Testament (Genesis to Malachi)

Genesis 2:1-3; (see also, Genesis 18:19, 26:5, &c.)

The sabbath commandment in the beginning with God (Genesis 2:1-3; Exodus 20:8-11; Psalms 119:142).

The sabbath commandment with Adam (Mark 2:27).
The sabbath commandment with Enoch (Genesis 5:22,24; Hebrews 11:5; Isaiah 58:13)
The sabbath commandment with Noah (Genesis 6:9; 2 Peter 2:5; Psalms 119:172).
The sabbath commandment with Eber (Genesis 10:21,24-25; Exodus 3:18, 5:3, 7:16).
The sabbath commandment with Abaham (Genesis 17:9, 18:19, 26:5; 2 Chronicles 20:7; Isaiah 41:8; James 2:23; John 15:14).
The sabbath commandment with Isaac (Genesis 17:9, 18:19, 26:5).
The sabbath commandment with Jacob/Israel (Genesis 17:9, 18:19, 26:5, 32:28).
The sabbath commandment with Moses (Exodus 5:4-5;, 16:1-36, 20:8-11; Deuteronomy 5:12-15, 31:12-18). ...
The sabbath commandment with Jesus (Luke 4:16-19).
The sabbath commandment with the Apostles/Disciples (Acts 1:2, (4:24), 13:14,27,42,44, (14:15), 15:21, 16:13, 17:2, 18:4; Hebrews 3:11,18, 4:1,3,4,5,8,9,10,11; Revelation 1:10, 10:6, 12:17, 14:6-7)
The sabbath commandment with us today (Hebrews 4:9; Revelation 12:17, 14:6-7; John 14:15; Exodus 20:6,8-11).
The sabbath commandment on into eternity (Isaiah 66:23).

Exodus 5:4-5,8-9, 16:23-30, 20:8-11, 23:12, 31:12-18, 34:21, 35:1-3
Leviticus 19:3,30, 23:3,11,15-16,38, 24:8, 26:2
Numbers 15:32, 28:9
Deuteronomy 5:12-15
2 Kings 4:23, 11:5,7,9, 16:18
1 Chronicles 9:32, 23:31
2 Chronicles 2:4, 8:13, 23:4,8, 31:3
Nehemiah 9:6,14, 10:31,33, 13:15-22
Psalms 92:1, 146:6
Isaiah 56:2,4,6, 58:13, 66:23
Jeremiah 17:21-27
Ezekiel 20:12-24, 22:8,26, 23:38, 44:24, 46:1,3-4,12
Amos 8:5

The many times that the "Sabbath" of the LORD is given in the New Testament:

Matthew 12:1,2,5,8,10,11,12, 24:20, 28:1;
Mark 1:21, 2:23,24,27,28, 3:2,4, 6:2, 7:6-9, 15:42, 16:1;
Luke 4:16,31, 6:1,2,5,6,7,9, 13:10,14,15,16, 14:1,3,5, 23:54,56;
John 5:9,10,16,18, 7:22,23, 9:14,16, 12:1 (calculated), 19:31;
Acts 1:2, 13:14,27,42,44, 15:21, 16:13, 17:2, 18:4;

Additional references are:

John 12:1 (six days before the Passover, Jesus was at Lazarus' house, on Sabbath)

Hebrews 3:11, 4:1,3,4,5,8,9,10,11; [Hebrews 4:9 "rest" Greek: sabbatismos, literal sabbath-keeping]

This has been posted previously

Hebrews 3-4 is clear.

Hebrews 4:3, "my (God's) rest" and "the works were finished from the foundation of the world", which is a direct reference to Genesis 2:1-3. It even uses the word "finished". God rested the 7th day in Genesis 2:1-3. It is His rest, the 7th day, the sabbath (rest) of the LORD thy God, Exodus 20:8-11.

Hebrews 4:4, "he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works", which "certain place" is Genesis 2:1-3; re-cited in Exodus 20:8-11. The 7th day the sabbath (rest) of the LORD thy God.

Hebrews 4:5, "my (God's) rest)", citing Psalms 95, which is citing Genesis 2:1-3; Exodus 20:8-11, etc. Again, this is the 7th day the sabbath (rest) of God at Creation in Genesis 2:1-3.

Hebrews 4:6, "remaineth", from when? "from the foundation of the world" as per Hebrews 4:3 and thus it is not new, but has been around from the beginning.

Hebrews 4:9, "rest", sabbatismos, literally and truly sabbath keeping in scripture and in all known extant Greek sources, dictionaries, and so on and again "remaineth".

Hebrews 4:10, "his (God's) rest", which is the 7th day the sabbath (rest) of the LORD thy God from Genesis 2:1-3., "as God did from his (works)", which "works were finished from the foundation of the world" as per Hebrews 4:3.

Hebrews 4:11, "that rest" (ie God's rest), the 7th day the sabbath (rest) of the LORD thy God.

Look around by using the "search" option on Hebrews 3-4, and there is found even a whole thread on Hebrews 3 - 4 that seems to have been around awhile now that has gone into this in some considerable depth- Hebrews 3-4 [KJB], the 7th Day the Sabbath of the LORD JEHOVAH - "my rest" "remaineth" to My people.

Revelation 1:10 [kuriake hemera, "the Lord's Day" [the 7th Day Sabbath, not "the Day of the Lord", this is totally different in the Greek], see Genesis 2:1-3, Exodus 20:8-11, Deuteronomy 5:12:15, Isaiah 58:13, 66:23, Matthew 12:8, Mark 2:27,28; Luke 6:5 ], Revelation 10:6 [see also Exodus 20:11, 31:17; Nehemiah 9:6; Psalms 146:6; Acts 4:24, 14:15, Revelation 14:7]; Revelation 14:7 [see previous], etc

Additionally, further references in the Greek are [every single 'first [day] of the week' text, as each text clearly shows that the first day is simply a number, with no special association or designation, other than it is simply one day toward the culmination of the week, being the 7th Day the Sabbath of the LORD thy God]:

Matthew 28:1(a) - (Koine Greek) οψε δε σαββατων (Transliterated) oye de sabbatwn
Matthew 28:1(b) - (Koine Greek) εις μιαν σαββατων (Transliterated) eiV mian sabbatwn
Mark 16:2 - (Koine Greek) και λιαν πρωι της μιας σαββατων (Transliterated) kai lian prwi ths mias sabbatwn
Mark 16:9 - (Koine Greek) αναστας δε πρωι πρωτη σαββατου (Transliterated) anastas de prwi prwth sabbatou
Luke 24:1 - (Koine Greek) τη δε μια των σαββατων (Transliterated) th de mia twn sabbatwn
John 20:1 - (Koine Greek) τη δε μια των σαββατων (Transliterated) th de mia twn sabbatwn
John 20:19 - (Koine Greek) τη μια των σαββατων (Transliterated) th mia twn sabbatwn
Acts 20:7 - (Koine Greek) εν δε τη μια των σαββατων (Transliterated) en de th mia twn sabbatwn
1 Corinthians 16:2 - (Koine Greek) κατα μιαν σαββατων (Transliterated) kata mian sabbatwn

That the Sabbath [of the Lord thy God], [being] the 7th day, is always the culmination of the week in God's Created order and is always referred to as such in all of scripture.

Therefore, every single “first [day] of the week” text upholds the 7th Day Sabbath, and is undeniable evidence of its continued existence and prominence.

Dkh587 · Dec 7, 2018

Danthemailman said:
Amen! The word "Sabbath" first appears in Exodus 16:23 - Then he said to them, “This is what the Lord has said: ‘Tomorrow is a Sabbath rest, a holy Sabbath to the Lord. Bake what you will bake today, and boil what you will boil; and lay up for yourselves all that remains, to be kept until morning.

If every man from Adam to Moses kept the Sabbath, why is the Hebrew word for the weekly Sabbath found in the Ten Commandments, never found in the book of Genesis? Why is no one before Moses ever being told to keep the Sabbath? Why are there no examples of anyone keeping the Sabbath before Moses? Why were the Patriarchs never instructed about the Sabbath, but were instructed regarding: offerings: Genesis 4:3-4, Altars Genesis 8:20, Priests: Genesis 14:18, Tithes: Genesis 14:20, Circumcision: Genesis 17:10, Marriage: Genesis 2:24 and Genesis 34:9.

*Why would God leave out the Sabbath command in Genesis if it was for everyone to keep before Moses? *Nowhere in Scripture is there any hint that Sabbath keeping was practiced from Adam to Moses.

Deuteronomy 5:1 - And Moses called all Israel, and said to them: “Hear, O Israel, the statutes and judgments which I speak in your hearing today, that you may learn them and be careful to observe them. 2 The Lord our God made a covenant with us in Horeb. 3 The Lord did not make this covenant with our fathers, but with us, those who are here today, all of us who are alive.

Nehemiah 9:13 - Then You came down on Mount Sinai, And spoke with them from heaven; You gave them just ordinances and true laws, Good statutes and commandments. 14 So You made known to them Your holy sabbath, And laid down for them commandments, statutes and law, Through Your servant Moses.

The Word of God makes it quite clear that Sabbath observance was a sign between God and Israel: The Israelites are to observe the Sabbath, celebrating it for the generations to come as a lasting covenant. It will be a sign between me and the Israelites forever, for in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, and on the seventh day he abstained from work and rested” (Exodus 31:16-17).

In Deuteronomy 5, Moses restates the Ten Commandments to the next generation of Israelites. Here, after commanding Sabbath observance in verses 12–14, Moses gives the reason the Sabbath was given to the nation Israel: Remember that you were slaves in Egypt and that the Lord your God brought you out of there with a mighty hand and an outstretched arm. Therefore the Lord your God has commanded you to observe the Sabbath day (verse 15).

Food for thought: the word for sabbath, which is ‘Shabbat’, first appears in Genesis 2:2 when it says “and he rested”. The Hebrew text literally says “and he shabbat”.

There are many things not recorded in the Torah - for example, Noah knowing the difference between clean and unclean animals. Just because it’s not written that Noah was instructed on what animals are clean and unclean, does not mean that God didn’t instruct him, which he obviously did. He knew things that were revealed to Israel hundreds of years prior.

Stop acting like it’s farfetched that Adam knew of the Sabbath just because it’s not written verbatim.

ace of hearts · Dec 7, 2018

liberty of conscience said:
You have been answered on numerous occasions, and on numerous webforums. I ask you now to deal with the material presented:

It was given to the "children of Israel" (Exodus 31:13) as a "perpetual (eternal) covenant" (Exodus 31:16) since it is the "sign" that the LORD is the Creator ("made") of "heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed" (Exodus 31:17).

Hint:

Jesus is the real Israel (Matthew 2:13-15; Hosea 11:1; his children are his disciples; Hebrews 2:13; Isaiah 8:16,18; John 13:33), the real "Prince" (Genesis 32:28; Acts 5:31) with God, the "overc[omer]" (John 16:33; Revelation 3:21), who himself is the "elect" (Isaiah 42:1; Matthew 12:18; 1 Peter 2:6) of the Father, in whom all the promises of God find their realization (2 Corinthians 1:20) with whom the eternal covenant was made and His "disciples" are His "children", in whom the "law" of God (Exodus 20:1-17; Isaiah 8:20) is sealed, given Him by His Father (Hebrews 2:13; Isaiah 8:16,18; John 13:33).

Mat 2:13-15; Hos 11:1; Jer 31:33; Rom 9:6-8; Heb 2:13; Isa 8:16,18; Jhn 13:33, 16:33, 17:12, 18:9, 21:5; 1 Cor 15:46; 2 Cor 1:20; Gal 6:16; Heb 3:6, 8:8,10; Rev 3:21; Gen 32:28; Act 5:31;

Matthew:

Matthew 2:13 KJB - And when they were departed, behold, the angel of the Lord appeareth to Joseph in a dream, saying, Arise, and take the young child and his mother, and flee into Egypt, and be thou there until I bring thee word: for Herod will seek the young child to destroy him.

Matthew 2:14 KJB - When he arose, he took the young child and his mother by night, and departed into Egypt:

Matthew 2:15 KJB - And was there until the death of Herod: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying, Out of Egypt have I called my son.

Hosea:

Hosea 11:1 KJB - When Israel was a child, then I loved him, and called my son out of Egypt.

According to the prophet Hosea, “Israel” is the [male, “him”] “child”, even the “son” of God [JEHOVAH, the Father], whom God “called” “out of Egypt”.

Compare again to the words specifically used by Matthew in Matthew 2:13-15:

"the young child", "into Egypt", "the young child", "him", "the young child", "into Egypt", "that it might be fulfilled" "which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet", "Out of Egypt", "have I called", "my son".

To the words used in Hosea 11:1:

“a child”, “him”, “called” “my son” “out of Egypt”.

What was this "child's" name? Who is speaking through the prophet? Who then is the "my" of "my son", and who then is this "son"?

Notice:

1 Corinthians 15:46 KJB - Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.

Just as Adam (the first), Jesus is Adam the second/last (1 Corinthians 15:45,47), for (Colossians 1:16) whom the Sabbath was "made" (Mark 2:27) at Creation (Genesis 2:1-3; Exodus 20:8-11).

Just as David, Jesus is the real David (Jeremiah 30:9; Ezekiel 34:23,24, 37:24,25; Hosea 3:5).

Just as Solomon, Jesus is the real Solomon, the "son of David" (Luke 18:38), the "Prince of Peace" (Isaiah 9:6).

Just as Joshua the son of Nun (perpetual/eternal), Jesus is the real Joshua (Matthew 1:21; Luke 1:31) the Son of the Eternal Father.

Just as Moses, Jesus is "that Prophet" that God the Father raised up (Deuteronomy 18:15-19; John 1:21, 6:14, 7:40; Acts 3:22-23, 7:37) who would lead his people out of bondage of sin into the promised land.

Just as Melchizedek priest of Salem, Jesus is the High Priest of Peace/Gospel (Hebrews 5:10, 7:26, 9:11).

Just as Isaac (rejoicing in joy), Jesus is the true Isaac, our rejoicing (Jeremiah 15:16; John 16:22).

The everlasting covenant (Malachi 2:5; Hebrews 13:20) was made (between God the Father, and) with the real "Israel" (Jesus (Matthew 2:13-15; Hosea 11:1), the "elect"; Isaiah 42:21; Matthew 12:18), for it is said, it is with the "house of Israel" (Jeremiah 31:33; Hebrews 8:8), and Jesus is over His own "house", whose "house are we" (Hebrews 3:6).

Matthew is clear, under inspiration of the Holy Ghost, citing the inspired prophet Hosea, that Jesus is the real fulfillment of Hosea 11:1, and his name is there given as "Israel" - the real overcomer over all things with God.

You must be very busy with a huge data base tracking people. Collecting lots of good info from here? Just don't see an relevance in your statement.

ace of hearts · Dec 7, 2018

liberty of conscience said:
God said it is:

Exo 20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
Exo 20:9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
Exo 20:10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
Exo 20:11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

Gen 2:1 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.
Gen 2:2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
Gen 2:3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

God defines His own words. He said that the seventh day (at creation, "made") is the sabbath of God.

Why are you attempting to re-define what God said is in Genesis?

Good question seeing the word "shabbath" doesn't appear in Genesis. The word "shabath" a verb does appear in Genesis two. Shabath is never translated as sabbath.

ace of hearts · Dec 7, 2018

liberty of conscience said:
You are ignorant (not knowing) of the word of God, defining itself line upon line.

The many times that the "Sabbath" of the LORD is given in the Old Testament (Genesis to Malachi)

Genesis 2:1-3; (see also, Genesis 18:19, 26:5, &c.)

The sabbath commandment in the beginning with God (Genesis 2:1-3; Exodus 20:8-11; Psalms 119:142).

The sabbath commandment with Adam (Mark 2:27).
The sabbath commandment with Enoch (Genesis 5:22,24; Hebrews 11:5; Isaiah 58:13)
The sabbath commandment with Noah (Genesis 6:9; 2 Peter 2:5; Psalms 119:172).
The sabbath commandment with Eber (Genesis 10:21,24-25; Exodus 3:18, 5:3, 7:16).
The sabbath commandment with Abaham (Genesis 17:9, 18:19, 26:5; 2 Chronicles 20:7; Isaiah 41:8; James 2:23; John 15:14).
The sabbath commandment with Isaac (Genesis 17:9, 18:19, 26:5).
The sabbath commandment with Jacob/Israel (Genesis 17:9, 18:19, 26:5, 32:28).
The sabbath commandment with Moses (Exodus 5:4-5;, 16:1-36, 20:8-11; Deuteronomy 5:12-15, 31:12-18). ...
The sabbath commandment with Jesus (Luke 4:16-19).
The sabbath commandment with the Apostles/Disciples (Acts 1:2, (4:24), 13:14,27,42,44, (14:15), 15:21, 16:13, 17:2, 18:4; Hebrews 3:11,18, 4:1,3,4,5,8,9,10,11; Revelation 1:10, 10:6, 12:17, 14:6-7)
The sabbath commandment with us today (Hebrews 4:9; Revelation 12:17, 14:6-7; John 14:15; Exodus 20:6,8-11).
The sabbath commandment on into eternity (Isaiah 66:23).

Exodus 5:4-5,8-9, 16:23-30, 20:8-11, 23:12, 31:12-18, 34:21, 35:1-3
Leviticus 19:3,30, 23:3,11,15-16,38, 24:8, 26:2
Numbers 15:32, 28:9
Deuteronomy 5:12-15
2 Kings 4:23, 11:5,7,9, 16:18
1 Chronicles 9:32, 23:31
2 Chronicles 2:4, 8:13, 23:4,8, 31:3
Nehemiah 9:6,14, 10:31,33, 13:15-22
Psalms 92:1, 146:6
Isaiah 56:2,4,6, 58:13, 66:23
Jeremiah 17:21-27
Ezekiel 20:12-24, 22:8,26, 23:38, 44:24, 46:1,3-4,12
Amos 8:5

The many times that the "Sabbath" of the LORD is given in the New Testament:

Matthew 12:1,2,5,8,10,11,12, 24:20, 28:1;
Mark 1:21, 2:23,24,27,28, 3:2,4, 6:2, 7:6-9, 15:42, 16:1;
Luke 4:16,31, 6:1,2,5,6,7,9, 13:10,14,15,16, 14:1,3,5, 23:54,56;
John 5:9,10,16,18, 7:22,23, 9:14,16, 12:1 (calculated), 19:31;
Acts 1:2, 13:14,27,42,44, 15:21, 16:13, 17:2, 18:4;

Additional references are:

John 12:1 (six days before the Passover, Jesus was at Lazarus' house, on Sabbath)

Hebrews 3:11, 4:1,3,4,5,8,9,10,11; [Hebrews 4:9 "rest" Greek: sabbatismos, literal sabbath-keeping]

This has been posted previously

Hebrews 3-4 is clear.

Hebrews 4:3, "my (God's) rest" and "the works were finished from the foundation of the world", which is a direct reference to Genesis 2:1-3. It even uses the word "finished". God rested the 7th day in Genesis 2:1-3. It is His rest, the 7th day, the sabbath (rest) of the LORD thy God, Exodus 20:8-11.

Hebrews 4:4, "he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works", which "certain place" is Genesis 2:1-3; re-cited in Exodus 20:8-11. The 7th day the sabbath (rest) of the LORD thy God.

Hebrews 4:5, "my (God's) rest)", citing Psalms 95, which is citing Genesis 2:1-3; Exodus 20:8-11, etc. Again, this is the 7th day the sabbath (rest) of God at Creation in Genesis 2:1-3.

Hebrews 4:6, "remaineth", from when? "from the foundation of the world" as per Hebrews 4:3 and thus it is not new, but has been around from the beginning.

Hebrews 4:9, "rest", sabbatismos, literally and truly sabbath keeping in scripture and in all known extant Greek sources, dictionaries, and so on and again "remaineth".

Hebrews 4:10, "his (God's) rest", which is the 7th day the sabbath (rest) of the LORD thy God from Genesis 2:1-3., "as God did from his (works)", which "works were finished from the foundation of the world" as per Hebrews 4:3.

Hebrews 4:11, "that rest" (ie God's rest), the 7th day the sabbath (rest) of the LORD thy God.

Look around by using the "search" option on Hebrews 3-4, and there is found even a whole thread on Hebrews 3 - 4 that seems to have been around awhile now that has gone into this in some considerable depth- Hebrews 3-4 [KJB], the 7th Day the Sabbath of the LORD JEHOVAH - "my rest" "remaineth" to My people.

Revelation 1:10 [kuriake hemera, "the Lord's Day" [the 7th Day Sabbath, not "the Day of the Lord", this is totally different in the Greek], see Genesis 2:1-3, Exodus 20:8-11, Deuteronomy 5:12:15, Isaiah 58:13, 66:23, Matthew 12:8, Mark 2:27,28; Luke 6:5 ], Revelation 10:6 [see also Exodus 20:11, 31:17; Nehemiah 9:6; Psalms 146:6; Acts 4:24, 14:15, Revelation 14:7]; Revelation 14:7 [see previous], etc

Additionally, further references in the Greek are [every single 'first [day] of the week' text, as each text clearly shows that the first day is simply a number, with no special association or designation, other than it is simply one day toward the culmination of the week, being the 7th Day the Sabbath of the LORD thy God]:

Matthew 28:1(a) - (Koine Greek) οψε δε σαββατων (Transliterated) oye de sabbatwn
Matthew 28:1(b) - (Koine Greek) εις μιαν σαββατων (Transliterated) eiV mian sabbatwn
Mark 16:2 - (Koine Greek) και λιαν πρωι της μιας σαββατων (Transliterated) kai lian prwi ths mias sabbatwn
Mark 16:9 - (Koine Greek) αναστας δε πρωι πρωτη σαββατου (Transliterated) anastas de prwi prwth sabbatou
Luke 24:1 - (Koine Greek) τη δε μια των σαββατων (Transliterated) th de mia twn sabbatwn
John 20:1 - (Koine Greek) τη δε μια των σαββατων (Transliterated) th de mia twn sabbatwn
John 20:19 - (Koine Greek) τη μια των σαββατων (Transliterated) th mia twn sabbatwn
Acts 20:7 - (Koine Greek) εν δε τη μια των σαββατων (Transliterated) en de th mia twn sabbatwn
1 Corinthians 16:2 - (Koine Greek) κατα μιαν σαββατων (Transliterated) kata mian sabbatwn

That the Sabbath [of the Lord thy God], [being] the 7th day, is always the culmination of the week in God's Created order and is always referred to as such in all of scripture.

Therefore, every single “first [day] of the week” text upholds the 7th Day Sabbath, and is undeniable evidence of its continued existence and prominence.

I find the above quoted post nothing more than regurgitated religious babble. It certainly isn't from scholarship.

ace of hearts · Dec 7, 2018

Dkh587 said:
Food for thought: the word for sabbath, which is ‘Shabbat’, first appears in Genesis 2:2 when it says “and he rested”. The Hebrew text literally says “and he shabbat”.

There are many things not recorded in the Torah - for example, Noah knowing the difference between clean and unclean animals. Just because it’s not written that Noah was instructed on what animals are clean and unclean, does not mean that God didn’t instruct him, which he obviously did. He knew things that were revealed to Israel hundreds of years prior.

Stop acting like it’s farfetched that Adam knew of the Sabbath just because it’s not written verbatim.

"shabbath" is being substituted for "shabath." The first is a noun, the second is a verb. Rested is a verb.

ace of hearts · Dec 7, 2018

Dkh587 said:
This post is full of emotion and falsehood. Nowhere did I say or do anything you have falsely accused me of doing.

Then what is this -

Dkh587 said:
Have you ever posted on here before under a different name? You are trolling very similar to how I’ve some pro-lawlessness people troll before.

bekkilyn · Dec 7, 2018

Basically, the argument boils down to, "Well God didn't say anything about implementing sabbath laws in Eden, but he meant to!"

Psalm 65:6 proves it because he established the law like he established the mountains, and since he made mountains during creation, it must mean that Adam was commanded to worship the sabbath back at that time too!

liberty of conscience · Dec 7, 2018

ace of hearts said:
It certainly isn't from scholarship.

Thank God. Praise the Lord.

Mal 2:11 Judah hath dealt treacherously, and an abomination is committed in Israel and in Jerusalem; for Judah hath profaned the holiness of the LORD which he loved, and hath married the daughter of a strange god. (Sunday sacredness; Ezekiel 8:16)

Mal 2:12 The LORD will cut off the man that doeth this, the master and the scholar, out of the tabernacles of Jacob, and him that offereth an offering unto the LORD of hosts.

(better leave the scholar - ship, before it sinks to the bottom, and join us who are in the disciple - ship)

1Ti_6:20 O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called:

Mar_12:37 David therefore himself calleth him Lord; and whence is he then his son? And the common people heard him gladly.

BobRyan · Dec 7, 2018

Danthemailman said:
Amen! The word "Sabbath" first appears in Exodus 16:23 - Then he said to them, “This is what the Lord has said: ‘Tomorrow is a Sabbath rest, a holy Sabbath to the Lord.

And "do not take God's name in vain" is first found in Exodus 20 ... and not found at all in the NT.

Those little games "mean nothing" at all in terms of license to rebel against God's Word.

And we all know it.

Dkh587 · Dec 7, 2018

BobRyan said:
And "do not take God's name in vain" is first found in Exodus 20 ... and not found at all in the NT.

Those little games "mean nothing" at all in terms of license to rebel against God's Word.

And we all know it.

Sadly, it's all a bunch of games in order to justify disobedience to God's commandments.

Danthemailman · Dec 8, 2018

liberty of conscience said:
God said it is:

Exo 20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
Exo 20:9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
Exo 20:10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
Exo 20:11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

Gen 2:1 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.
Gen 2:2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
Gen 2:3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

God defines His own words. He said that the seventh day (at creation, "made") is the sabbath of God.

Why are you attempting to re-define what God said is in Genesis?

It's you who is attempting to re-define what God said in Genesis, not me. Although God's rest on the seventh day (Genesis 2:3) did foreshadow a future Sabbath law, there is no Biblical record of the Sabbath law before the children of Israel left the land of Egypt. *Nowhere in Scripture is there any hint that Sabbath keeping was practiced from Adam to Moses.* There is nothing in the Bible to suggest that Adam's responsibilities in Eden were limited to only six days of the week. The seventh-day Sabbath law that God later gave to Israel through Moses was a shadow of this original rest.

Here is a helpful article for Sabbatarians and especially SDA's

The Sabbath & Sunday

Danthemailman · Dec 8, 2018

Dkh587 said:
Sadly, it's all a bunch of games in order to justify disobedience to God's commandments.

BobRyan said:
Those little games "mean nothing" at all in terms of license to rebel against God's Word.

Typical straw man arguments. Those who pervert the gospel by teaching salvation by "grace plus law, faith plus works" are in rebellion to God's Word. (Galatians 1:6-9)

ace of hearts · Dec 8, 2018

liberty of conscience said:
Thank God. Praise the Lord.

Mal 2:11 Judah hath dealt treacherously, and an abomination is committed in Israel and in Jerusalem; for Judah hath profaned the holiness of the LORD which he loved, and hath married the daughter of a strange god. (Sunday sacredness; Ezekiel 8:16)

Mal 2:12 The LORD will cut off the man that doeth this, the master and the scholar, out of the tabernacles of Jacob, and him that offereth an offering unto the LORD of hosts.

(better leave the scholar - ship, before it sinks to the bottom, and join us who are in the disciple - ship)

1Ti_6:20 O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called:

Mar_12:37 David therefore himself calleth him Lord; and whence is he then his son? And the common people heard him gladly.

Do you have anything pertaining to this thread? Even tho I like your statement about scholar ship, I'm wondering if you can't do better than making accusations.

Disciples of Jesus follow His teachings, not the law.

ace of hearts · Dec 8, 2018

BobRyan said:
And "do not take God's name in vain" is first found in Exodus 20 ... and not found at all in the NT.

Those little games "mean nothing" at all in terms of license to rebel against God's Word.

And we all know it.

How does your verse deal with the subject? What is danthemailman in rebellion with? Doesn't he have to be subject to that?

ace of hearts · Dec 8, 2018

Danthemailman said:
It's you who is attempting to re-define what God said in Genesis, not me. Although God's rest on the seventh day (Genesis 2:3) did foreshadow a future Sabbath law, there is no Biblical record of the Sabbath law before the children of Israel left the land of Egypt. *Nowhere in Scripture is there any hint that Sabbath keeping was practiced from Adam to Moses.* There is nothing in the Bible to suggest that Adam's responsibilities in Eden were limited to only six days of the week. The seventh-day Sabbath law that God later gave to Israel through Moses was a shadow of this original rest.

Here is a helpful article for Sabbatarians and especially SDA's

The Sabbath & Sunday

Very good site. Bookmarked. thanks.

One of the most controversial issues, is the DAY OF WORSHIP

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