What is the Scriptural Basis for Cessationism?

RestoreTheJoy said:

There are many warnings in scripture too about false prophets. It was happening then, during and after Jesus being here. It still happens now. It will happen until Jesus comes back. So will the real thing.

Ezekiel 13:9: My hand will be against the prophets who see false visions and utter lying divinations. They will not belong to the council of my people or be listed in the records of Israel, nor will they enter the land of Israel. Then you will know that I am the Sovereign LORD.

Jer 23:16: This is what the LORD Almighty says: “Do not listen to what the prophets are prophesying to you; they fill you with false hopes. They speak visions from their own minds, not from the mouth of the LORD.

Matthew 7:15-20:
Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves.
16 By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles?
17 Likewise, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit.
18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit.
19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.
20 Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them.

2 Peter 2: But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them—bringing swift destruction on themselves.

If you are right that the gifts have ceased, then Paul is a liar. The great falling away is underway, I believe. We see it every day as another church disbelieves another scriptural thing.

Click to expand...

Innerfire89 said:

The word "perfect" simply means mature in the Greek. Notice how the next verses show this, "when I was a child I spoke like a child...
We see through a mirror dimly...

So being that before those verses is about prophecy and tounges ceassing, it is the prophecy and tounges of the still growing and immature church, in due time when the church is grown into maturity, with all that was before needed to get there, then those things will pass away.

P.S. Don't I know you from another site. It was crossdressers anonymous, lol, just kidding. It was Christforums.

Click to expand...

W2L said:

We dont need signs any more. We have the Word. Faith comes by hearing.

John 20:29 Jesus said to him, “Thomas,[d] because you have seen Me, you have believed. Blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.”

30 And truly Jesus did many other signs in the presence of His disciples, which are not written in this book; 31 but these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing you may have life in His name.

Click to expand...

Innerfire89 said:

The word "perfect" simply means mature in the Greek. Notice how the next verses show this, "when I was a child I spoke like a child...
We see through a mirror dimly...

So being that before those verses is about prophecy and tounges ceassing, it is the prophecy and tounges of the still growing and immature church, in due time when the church is grown into maturity, with all that was before needed to get there, then those things will pass away.

P.S. Don't I know you from another site. It was crossdressers anonymous, lol, just kidding. It was Christforums.

Click to expand...

Billy Evmur said:

"Blessed are those who have not seen [ME] and yet believe"

Click to expand...

Major1 said:

May I say to you that we as humans will do what we WANT TO DO.

If we want to go to a football game in the rain, we will go.
If someone says, "Do not go to Ruby Falls", we will go if we want to.

In that light, IMO, it seems to me that the teaching of "cessationism" originated in EXPERIENCE.

When anyone reads and studies the Bible and focuses the sign gifts of miracles and healing should come away with several questions about these things.

I think that we all need to ask ourselves these question......…
1. Why do the epistles have little discussion about them?
2. Why does Paul leave people sick (Phil 2:26-27; 1 Tim 5:23; 2 Tim 4:20)?
3. Why does James have the sick call the elders and not one with the gift of healing?
4. Why do I not see miracles today?
5. Why do we not see healings today?

When I said that "cessationism originates in experience", I am saying that what we actually see and experience plays a huge part in what we understand the Bible actual says.

No One could affirm cessationism if miracles and healing and the real Bible tongues were happening all about him.

Yes, we see so called miracles on religious T.V. We see carefully orchestrated events that in most cases have been proven to be faked and fraudulent.

We see people speaking in gibberish with no interpreters and nothing said that glorifies the Lord Jesus and we accept it as valid because we KNOW that born again believers would never ever fake tongues to make themselves appear spiritual.
All of those things come under the roof of EXPERIENCE.

PETER POPOFF claimed to be a faith healer when all the time he had his wife speaking to him in a ear phone telling him what his works had found out from people standing in line to enter his tent meeting.

In 1991 ABC-TV’s Prime Time Live ran an investigative report where W.V. GRANT was included with segments on ROBERT TILTON and LARRY LEAL. All were thoroughly busted for their misrepresentations to the public and the church and fraud.

Ole Anthony of the Trinity Foundation, a watchdog organization keeping tabs on the tele-evangelists was influential in making this happen. So began an era of open discovery for those fleecing the flock.

ABC’s hidden cameras caught W.V. Grant and his staff informally circulating among audience members before services. They would hand-pick those who were to be called forth that night. They would ask them questions about their personal lives, their goals, finances, sicknesses, making careful note it would be passed on to Grant who would later claim was revealed to him by the Holy Spirit.
http://www.evidenceunseen.com/theology/practical-theology/faith-healers/

Experience is the confirming factor in the case of either continuation or cessationism. Ultimately, the Bible must affirm or allow our experience.

If we experience REAL, VERIFIABLE miracles and healings and the correct use of tongues as recorded in the Scriptures then there would be no need to promote CESSATIONALISM at all.

Just something for you to think about. You certainly do not have to agree with me.

Click to expand...

W2L said:

Believe what exactly? Whats this scripture say? Not healing miracles but salvation.

Click to expand...

W2L said:

Believe what exactly? Whats this scripture say? Not healing miracles but salvation.

Click to expand...

St_Worm2 said:

Here is part of it:

1 Corinthians 13
8 Love never fails; but if there are gifts of prophecy, they will be done away; if there are tongues, they will cease; if there is knowledge, it will be done away.
9 For we know in part and we prophesy in part;
10 but when the perfect comes, the partial will be done away.​

Yours and His,
David

Click to expand...

Billy Evmur said:

*
People dichotomise but God doesn't dichotomise...when Jesus healed the woman with the issue of blood He said "thy faith hath saved thee" to the man brought to him paralysed He said "cheer up son thy sins be forgiven thee"

How important was the raising of Lazarus to the saving of many? how many were saved at Pentecost because the gift of tongues were being manifest? How many would be saved in YOUR city if a notable work of healing took place?

To be saved means to be made whole, it is for body mind and spirit...no Jew would have understood salvation in any other way. The drug addict today will hardly get saved unless he/she is first delivered of addiction.

We all know that our souls are the most important...yet God specifically does not give priority emphasis to that, the church does but she has no right to, it is presumptious.

Click to expand...

Billy Evmur said:

So has knowledge been done away? and has the "we know in part" been overtaken by perfect knowledge?

Who has this perfect in the church today? what is the perfect? the scriptures?

but the scriptures exhort us to earnestly desire the gifts....

Click to expand...

Hazelelponi said:

Jacob was called Israel because he wrestled with God and won. He named the place where it happened Penial because he saw God face to face there yet lived..

I think of key importance, rather than deciding the bible is a thing of the past that isn't just as real today as it was 2,000 years ago, is to wrestle with God to find out the truth...to see His face.

The Bible says ask and you shall receive, knock and it shall be opened to you. Why pretend in a faith you don't have?

"I believe, now help me with my unbelief"

A powerless god is no God at all..

Click to expand...

Billy Evmur said:

Yet Paul spake in tongues more than they all...he never spake as a child...How was the church after the apostles ever more mature than the primitive church? is the church today mature?

Click to expand...

RestoreTheJoy said:

Jesus came to Preach, Teach, and Heal, and he sent the Apostles and then the 70 to do the same. Nothing has ever changed from that day, and will not until His return. The only thing that changed is we stopped believing him and think of faith as a "hang on until you get to heaven" card.

Click to expand...

Billy Evmur said:

We have the Word...it is the Word which encourages us to seek the gifts, that's where we got it from.

"Blessed are those who have not seen [ME] and yet believe"

The Pharisees saw the miracles but did not believe

Click to expand...

Oscarr said:

Yep. I have been involved in other projects. I started to read the works of Francis Schaeffer and am getting a great refresher course in Reformed theology as opposed to modernist philosophical existential theology. So, having some fresh material to contribute I decided to make some comments on CF again.

I guess my comments about Cessationism will make your juices flow!! Hahahaha! I'm looing forward to some fun discussions with you about that. Its all in good natured debate.

Click to expand...

RestoreTheJoy said:

Prophecy is still active in the church today. It will never violate scripture. It may not even look like what prophesy might be imagined to be, but someone can give a word from the Lord today with direction about tomorrow to an individual or to a group or congregation. Happens all the time. Is only proved out in time.

Cessationism is not only a doctrine of unbelief, but was primarily aimed toward diminishing Roman papal authority and advancing sola scriptura, though a proper understanding of the spiritual gifts is that they exist for building up the church in love, not tearing down the Word of God. They have never changed. We have. That's why we don't see what they see in the early church - not much in the States, anyway.

Augustine, Justin Martyr, and a large number of the early church fathers knew and wrote of the gifts of the Spirit.

Click to expand...

Billy Evmur said:

We have the Word...it is the Word which encourages us to seek the gifts, that's where we got it from.

"Blessed are those who have not seen [ME] and yet believe"

The Pharisees saw the miracles but did not believe

Click to expand...

Billy Evmur said:

*
People dichotomise but God doesn't dichotomise...when Jesus healed the woman with the issue of blood He said "thy faith hath saved thee" to the man brought to him paralysed He said "cheer up son thy sins be forgiven thee"

How important was the raising of Lazarus to the saving of many? how many were saved at Pentecost because the gift of tongues were being manifest? How many would be saved in YOUR city if a notable work of healing took place?

To be saved means to be made whole, it is for body mind and spirit...no Jew would have understood salvation in any other way. The drug addict today will hardly get saved unless he/she is first delivered of addiction.

We all know that our souls are the most important...yet God specifically does not give priority emphasis to that, the church does but she has no right to, it is presumptious.

Click to expand...