Meet a Caravan Organizer

USincognito

a post by Alan Smithee
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This isn’t Forrest Gump, someone did just decide to go for a run to the border and then people joined in the cause.

They are being transported, fed, clothed and given medical attention.

Find out by whom (UN), and you find out how authentic it is.

Evidence?
 
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Sparagmos

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Why is this such a scary concept for some people? I know why. Because we see that MAYBE, just maybe we will have to give up something so that others may have something. And that is probably the hardest lesson any human can ever digest.

And why real Christianity is so very, very rare.

This is the crux of the matter. And the Bible could not be more clear as to how we should treat those born with less, who come to us for aid.
 
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wing2000

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...there's a simple reason so many joined the caravan -- for their own safety and didn't have to pay a smuggler 7k to make the journey. And yes, many people did feed and provide assistance along the way....

Mujica said increasing numbers of migrants, among them parents with children, are choosing to travel in large groups for safety in hopes of reaching the United States and asking for asylum to stay permanently.

Along the way, they face many threats, including from criminal organizations, that prey on migrants.

"They call it a trail of death ... Out of 10 women, six are raped when they come to the United States," he said. "It is hell going through this (journey). But there is some safety in numbers. ... There is a lot of repression, the police are always on top of you. You sleep in the middle of nowhere. The heat. The elements. Kids have died. There are so many dangers."
 
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USincognito

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...there's a simple reason so many joined the caravan -- for their own safety and didn't have to pay a smuggler 7k to make the journey. And yes, many people did feed and provide assistance along the way....

Mujica said increasing numbers of migrants, among them parents with children, are choosing to travel in large groups for safety in hopes of reaching the United States and asking for asylum to stay permanently.

Along the way, they face many threats, including from criminal organizations, that prey on migrants.

"They call it a trail of death ... Out of 10 women, six are raped when they come to the United States," he said. "It is hell going through this (journey). But there is some safety in numbers. ... There is a lot of repression, the police are always on top of you. You sleep in the middle of nowhere. The heat. The elements. Kids have died. There are so many dangers."

But but but.. the narrative!
 
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PaoloPorini1972

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This is the crux of the matter. And the Bible could not be more clear as to how we should treat those born with less, who come to us for aid.

Agreed. And that's really, really hard. I actually understand the fear that Trump stokes in his followers. It is a fear common to everyone! I am having difficulty thinking of what I will need to give up so that others can have something. I've got it really good. But it never seems to feel like enough.

I want the national conversation to challenge me. To make me embrace those that I don't know, those that NEED.
 
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Sparagmos

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Agreed. And that's really, really hard. I actually understand the fear that Trump stokes in his followers. It is a fear common to everyone! I am having difficulty thinking of what I will need to give up so that others can have something. I've got it really good. But it never seems to feel like enough.

I want the national conversation to challenge me. To make me embrace those that I don't know, those that NEED.
I think the national conversation is effectively challenging many, if not most, Americans. Every once in a while an “historic figure” such as Trump emerges that embodies the worst of human nature. And we then have to choose - is this who we are, who we want to be? Donald Trump helps us see the xenophobia in ourselves, and helps us decide that we want to RID OURSELVES of those outdated fear-based prejudices. When we finally “destroy” trump the scapegoat, we will have chosen a more just, more loving path. We will be a better people.
 
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Shiloh Raven

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This is the crux of the matter. And the Bible could not be more clear as to how we should treat those born with less, who come to us for aid.

Yes, the bible is very clear on how Christians should treat foreigners and the poor. And that's not to mention Jesus' parable of The Sheep and the Goats. He said "whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me." We should remember what He said to the goats.

41 “Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42 For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, 43 I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’

44 “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’

45 “He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’

46 “Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.”
 
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BigDaddy4

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There are even Bible verses about this! As we would want done to us we should do to others. If we can't recognize humanity in THESE people we forfeit our humanity.
Always amusing to hear Bible scripture (mis)applied in these situations, especially from non-believers! So, thanks for that. :rolleyes:
 
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OldWiseGuy

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Bull baloney and that's to put it politely. But like usual, some Christians always seem to find a way to justify themselves and their actions by using the bible and God's name. It reminds me of the Manifest Destiny garbage and the justification to enslave and own black people by using the bible too.

So, we tear those pages out of the bible?
 
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OldWiseGuy

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yes we are. These are HUMAN BEINGS. In other words they are the same as you and I. They just had the misfortune to be born into a much worse-off place than you and I.

How about that aborigine tribe in the news lately. The ones that killed that missionary?

There are even Bible verses about this! As we would want done to us we should do to others. If we can't recognize humanity in THESE people we forfeit our humanity.

I somewhat agree. Like those aborigines many people just want to be left alone.

We are, like it or not, the richest nation in this hemisphere if not the world. This is the price of being well-off.

Do you have numbers for that. Some say we are close to becoming a 'debtor nation'.

Why is this such a scary concept for some people? I know why. Because we see that MAYBE, just maybe we will have to give up something so that others may have something. And that is probably the hardest lesson any human can ever digest.

Depends on whether you have golden eggs or are the goose that lays them.
 
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PaoloPorini1972

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Always amusing to hear Bible scripture (mis)applied in these situations, especially from non-believers! So, thanks for that. :rolleyes:

Always amusing to hear Christians fight so hard against what the Bible clearly states.

thanks for that.

You see, when I see people say the kind of thing you just said I actually find that it shows me how hollow religious faith IS! I don't want to make you feel guilty but here's what I see:

I find some of the most amazing things in the Bible that really, honestly ring true. Doing unto others as we would have them do unto us, and caring for those who have less than we all sound FANTASTIC to me! They really do! They truly are the HOLY part of the Bible. Even Christian salvation is kind of cool. The idea that no one can EARN salvation but that we must accept that we are less than our ideals and that we don't deserve to be treated better or special. That actually is fantastic! It can help to ground us to keep us humble. To remind us all that we are ALL far short of the ideal.

And it helps me to see why we should ALL care for those who have less...for the broken people on the side of the road. We can al be the good samaritan.

But yes, if "witness" for Christ requires that one denigrate the beauty in the Scripture, if ministry is be the Pharisee, the find the loopholes so that we don't ever have to feel guilty for our failures or our lack, then indeed Christianity and religious faith is empty.
 
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PaoloPorini1972

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How about that aborigine tribe in the news lately. The ones that killed that missionary?

Yes they are humans. But why are you changing the subject? Do you forget the scripture? Are you unfamiliar with Matthew 5:39?

I somewhat agree. Like those aborigines many people just want to be left alone.

They do. And I rather assume they were scared of the outsider. The other. Is that what we should be like in America? Should we turn our backs on the world? Should we turn a cold shoulder to suffering?

Do you have numbers for that. Some say we are close to becoming a 'debtor nation'.

You're right. America is nothing. We are poverty stricken and without value. Is that what you meant to say? Or do you think America is a good place to live?

Depends on whether you have golden eggs or are the goose that lays them.

I'm the goose that lays the golden eggs. I am an upper-middle class tax payer who doesn't have a huge number of deductions. I pay a lot of money into this great country and I do so with glee and pleasure! I am wealthy beyond what I deserve. Should I not give back?

I am not happy that I don't give more. I see the need and I want to help. I am as flawed and fallen as any. I hope that we as a nation can come together to be better than the worst of ourselves.
 
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JosephZ

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People all over world routinely move for economic and safety reasons, but the U.S. is being 'targeted' for such movement by masses of people. There must be other places for them to seek 'refuge' as well.
Just because people are coming in organized caravans doesn't mean more people are coming to our borders seeking refuge. The numbers probably wouldn't have been much different otherwise because these same people would have been making the journey at some point. They would have just traveled alone or as families instead of a group. Unfortunately when traveling alone many become victims of rape, murder, human trafficking, or would have become ill with no one to help them.

Looking at the big picture, the US takes in far fewer refugees than other countries. While the charts below are a few years old, I doubt much has changed since the cap on refugees has been dropping since then. In 2015 percentage wise to population we were ranked 70th in the world; when it comes to total numbers of refugees taken in, we were ranked 17th and no where close to the countries at the top of the list.

refugees compared.jpg


What many Christians in America are failing to realize is that supporting policies that restrict immigration for asylum seekers and refugees is causing us to turn our backs on our brothers and sisters in Christ.

For example, as of August we had only taken in 23 Christians from the Middle East for the fiscal year 2018.

"These declines have been most stark for persecuted Christians and other religious minorities in the Middle East, many of whom have endured a genocide at the Islamic State. During the first half of 2016, 1,574 Middle Eastern Christian refugees were admitted from the region, but in the first half of 2018, the United States has admitted only twenty-three, a decline of 98.5 percent. In short, cuts to our refugee admission program affect all persecuted religious minorities, but these cuts significantly impact our persecuted brothers and sisters in Christ."
http://evangelicalimmigrationtable....-Letter-Religious-Freedom-Refugees-8.2018.pdf

Globally, the numbers also show how strict immigration policy hurts the Church.

In the fiscal year 2018, the US received just 15,748 Christian refugees, compared to 24,764 in the fiscal year 2017 and 36,822 in the fiscal year 2016. That's a 57 percent drop in just two years, according to State Department records.

Matt Soerens, the US director of church mobilization for World Relief, says the new trend couldn't come at a worse time, noting that the overall number of refugees worldwide has been growing. The UN estimates the current number to be greater than 25 million.


Number of Christian Refugees Entering the US Hits Historic Low

In the not to distant future I can guarantee that what we are seeing taking place today is going to be looked back on as another dark period in American history. My hope is that more Christians will realize this and join those who will be found on the right side of history.
 
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PaoloPorini1972

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Oh, look, more (mis)application of Scripture! :sigh:

Is it truly a misapplication of the scripture to care for those in need and the stranger?

Deuteronomy 15:11
Deuteronomy 24:14-15
Psalms 41:1
Psalms 82:3-4
Proverbs 14:21
Leviticus 19:10
Leviticus 19:33
Leviticus 23:22
Exodus 23:11
Galatians 2:10
Luke 3:10-11
 
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