The Restitution Of All Things A.K.A. Universalism

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ClementofA

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Hey, get it straight. This is addressed to the remnant of his heritage

Mic 7:18  Who is a God like unto thee, that pardoneth iniquity, and passeth by the transgression of the remnant of his heritage? he retaineth not his anger for ever, because he delighteth in mercy. 

The author of Micah 7:18 is addressing God:

Micah 7:18a Who is a God like unto thee...

He says a few things about God, including:

Micah 7:18b he retaineth not his anger for ever, because he delighteth in mercy.

Do those words resemble a God who is just itching to nuke people out of existence forever? Or a God who can't wait to bring out his whip & torture them for eternity?

Lam.3:31For the Lord will NOT cast off FOR EVER:
32But though he cause grief, yet will he have compassion according to the multitude of his mercies.
33For he doth not afflict willingly nor grieve THE CHILDREN OF MEN. (KJV, emphasis mine)

Isaiah 57:16 For I will not contend for ever, neither will I be always wroth: for the spirit should fail before me, and the souls which I have made. (KJV)

How many times do the Scriptures have to say something before people will believe it?
 
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FineLinen

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Sorry but God must first choose you before you can accept His invitation!

John 15:16 Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you.

Acts of the Apostles 22:14 And he said, The God of our fathers hath chosen thee, that thou shouldest know his will, and see that Just One, and shouldest hear the voice of his mouth.

Dear he-man: You are correct! The entire Reach of all reaches begins, is sustained, & finalized in the Father known intimately as Abba!

Grace and strength
 
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FineLinen

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The closing verses of Romans 5 have been the standing perplexity of theologians.

Yet nowhere has the Holy Spirit written for our learning plainer conclusions, and never has tradition been blinder than in the treatment of this magnificent passage. Believe the passage as it stands, and the divine logic is irresistible.

It contains a comparison between the first and the last Adam. What the first Adam was, and is, to the whole human race, the last Adam is, and will be also, to the whole human race.

This is the simple and grand logic of verses 18 and 19. "Therefore as by the offence of one, judgment came upon all men to condemnation, EVEN SO by the righteousness of One, the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life." Then there follows a reiteration of the comparison with its Divine logic, so that the fact might be stated again, not only as a climax in the purpose of redemption, but as a future goal in the history of the working out of the redemption of all men. "For as by one man's disobedience the many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall the many be made righteous." The insertion of the definite article, which the Authorized Version unwarrantably leaves out before the word "many" in each case, emphasizes the fact for which it was originally placed there, viz.-- that the company of the righteous is identical in person and number with the company of the sinners to which the passage refers.

So that we have two phrases in these two verses, by which we can establish beyond question the identity of those under discussion. These two phrases are "ALL MEN," and "THE MANY." Of this company it is declared in the first place, that "all men" and "the many" were made sinners and come into condemnation; and in the second place, that "all men" and "the many" will be made righteous, not simply saved but made righteous. If this plain simple language-- and God could not have made it plainer-- does not mean what it says, but infers something quite the opposite, so that the comparison used is not a true one, then we may well pause to ask how ever it came about that on such a subject, and at such a climax in his argument, Paul did not tell us exactly what he meant. -A.E. Saxby-
 
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FineLinen

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Sorry but God must first choose you before you can accept His invitation!

John 15:16 Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you.

Acts of the Apostles 22:14 And he said, The God of our fathers hath chosen thee, that thou shouldest know his will, and see that Just One, and shouldest hear the voice of his mouth.

Though the Authorized Version (King James Version) makes it clear that the action of coming to Christ is not set in motion by our choice to do so, but by the action of the Father, without which NO MAN can come to Christ, yet it, along with other conventional translations, does not make clear the force of the Father's "call." The "call" is really not merely a "call." The Greek word has a far greater force than "call." The force of the Greek word falls nowhere short of "drag." What Jesus really said, in the choice of His wording, was that no man is able to come to Him unless the Father drags that one. -John Gavazzoni_-

Index Of Writings Of John Gavazzoni
 
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he-man

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Though the Authorized Version (King James Version) makes it clear that the action of coming to Christ is not set in motion by our choice to do so, but by the action of the Father, without which NO MAN can come to Christ, yet it, along with other conventional translations, does not make clear the force of the Father's "call." The "call" is really not merely a "call." The Greek word has a far greater force than "call." The force of the Greek word falls nowhere short of "drag." What Jesus really said, in the choice of His wording, was that no man is able to come to Him unless the Father drags that one. -John Gavazzoni_-

Index Of Writings Of John Gavazzoni
Looks like you do not understand Greek; G1670 ἑλκύω, ἕλκω Probably akin to G138; to drag (literally or figuratively): - draw. THAYER says " MetaphoricallyTo draw by inward power".
LSJ MIDDLE LIDDLE attract, draw to oneself, draw after one

G138 αἱρέομαι Thayer Definition: 1) to take for oneself, to prefer, choose

G2564 κάλεσεν καλεώ καλω κληθησεται were given notice, summon, ask, call, bid, call on, invite
G2753 κεκλημενους εκελευσεν κελεύω, κλήση invitation, calling, ordered, prescribed

G3870 παρεκαλουν παρεκαλει, παρακαλώ παρακαλέω petition, comfort, beseech, please, call, send for, summon, invite


4377 προσεφωνησεν he called

G2753 κεκλημενους εκελευσεν κελεύω, κλήση invitation, calling, ordered, prescribed
G2821 κλησεως κλῆσις invitation
G2822 εκλεκτός chosen, selected
G726 αρπασαι αρπάζω draw up

Matthew_11:27  All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him.


John_6:44  No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.
 
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DM25

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Universalism sounds nice and all, and it makes a lot more sense and fits with God's character more than the lie of eternal torment, it can even be just if the people get punished for the appropriate time then eventually get out when they have served their sentence, but I just don't see how it is biblical and therefore I cannot believe it. Bible always gives warnings of eternal punishment for those who don't believe. I believe eternal really means eternal, we have to take these warnings literally. The dead will stay dead. Unless someone shows me solid biblical evidence, I cannot believe in universalism as it just isn't in the word of God and there is no doctrine for it.
 
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Pneuma3

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Universalism sounds nice and all, and it makes a lot more sense and fits with God's character more than the lie of eternal torment, it can even be just if the people get punished for the appropriate time then eventually get out when they have served their sentence, but I just don't see how it is biblical and therefore I cannot believe it. Bible always gives warnings of eternal punishment for those who don't believe. I believe eternal really means eternal, we have to take these warnings literally. The dead will stay dead. Unless someone shows me solid biblical evidence, I cannot believe in universalism as it just isn't in the word of God and there is no doctrine for it.

The problem is the bible NEVER EVER says anything about an eternal death. Go ahead a do a bible search with he words eternal death.

P.S. the Greek word for eternal is aidios, not aionios
 
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Lazarus Short

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The problem is the bible NEVER EVER says anything about an eternal death. Go ahead a do a bible search with he words eternal death.

P.S. the Greek word for eternal is aidios, not aionios

The Problem, further, is that many Bibles, especially denominational Bible versions, are translated with a subtle or overt "theo-illogical" bias. This puts the cart (theology) ahead of the horse (translated text). I maintain this: text first, only then theology.
 
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FineLinen

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Universalism sounds nice and all, and it makes a lot more sense and fits with God's character more than the lie of eternal torment, it can even be just if the people get punished for the appropriate time then eventually get out when they have served their sentence, but I just don't see how it is biblical and therefore I cannot believe it. Bible always gives warnings of eternal punishment for those who don't believe. I believe eternal really means eternal, we have to take these warnings literally. The dead will stay dead. Unless someone shows me solid biblical evidence, I cannot believe in universalism as it just isn't in the word of God and there is no doctrine for it.

Dear DM: Where do you want to start regarding the Restitution of all things sounding "nice & all"? You my young friend need to read & re-read the Father's word to all of us!

The Love of God prevails

"It is in Him, and through the shedding of His blood, that we have our deliverance--the forgiveness of our offences--so abundant was God's grace, the grace which He, the possessor of all wisdom and understanding, lavished upon us, when He made known to us the secret of His will. And this is in harmony with God's merciful purpose for the government of the world when the times are ripe for it--the purpose which He has cherished in His own mind of restoring the whole creation to find its one Head in Christ; yes, things in Heaven and things on earth, to find their one Head in Him. And you...."

He is the Source, the Guide & the Goal of the all
 
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ClementofA

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Universalism sounds nice and all, and it makes a lot more sense and fits with God's character more than the lie of eternal torment, it can even be just if the people get punished for the appropriate time then eventually get out when they have served their sentence, but I just don't see how it is biblical and therefore I cannot believe it. Bible always gives warnings of eternal punishment for those who don't believe. I believe eternal really means eternal, we have to take these warnings literally. The dead will stay dead. Unless someone shows me solid biblical evidence, I cannot believe in universalism as it just isn't in the word of God and there is no doctrine for it.

Dozens of verses alleging endless annihilationism shown not to support it:

Annihilation theory...verses answered

Verses in support of Universalism:

Unique Proof For Christian, Biblical Universalism
 
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FineLinen

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Dear DM: Where do you want to start regarding the Restitution of all things sounding "nice & all"? You my young friend need to read & re-read the Father's word to all of us!

The Love of God prevails

"It is in Him, and through the shedding of His blood, that we have our deliverance--the forgiveness of our offences--so abundant was God's grace, the grace which He, the possessor of all wisdom and understanding, lavished upon us, when He made known to us the secret of His will. And this is in harmony with God's merciful purpose for the government of the world when the times are ripe for it--the purpose which He has cherished in His own mind of restoring the whole creation to find its one Head in Christ; yes, things in Heaven and things on earth, to find their one Head in Him. And you...."

He is the Source, the Guide & the Goal of the all


The Prophets

"He shall come down like rain upon the mown grass; as showers that water the earth. In his days shall the righteous flourish: and abundance of peace so long as the moon endures. He shall have dominion from sea to sea, and from the river unto the ends of the earth." Ps. 72: 6-8.

"All the ends of the world shall remember and turn unto the Lord; and all the kindreds of the nations shall worship before you." Ps. 22: 27.

"All nations whom you have made shall come and worship before you, O Lord; and shall glorify your name. "Ps. 86: 9.

"Will the Lord cast off for ever? and will he be favorable no more? Is his mercy clean gone forever? does his promise fail for evermore? Has God forgotten to be gracious? has he in anger shut up his tender mercies? Selah.

And I said, This is my infirmity: but I will remember the years of the right hand of the Most High." - Ps. 77: 10.

"For he says, The Lord is merciful and gracious, slow to anger, and plenteous in mercy. He will not always chide: neither will he keep his anger forever". Ps. 103: 9.

"For his anger endures but a moment; in his favor is life: weeping may endure for a night, but joy comes in the morning." Ps. 30: 5.

"If his children forsake my law, and walk not in my judgments; if they break my statutes, and keep not my
commandments; then will I visit their transgressions with the rod, and their iniquities with stripes, nevertheless my loving kindness will I not utterly take from him, nor suffer my faithfulness to fail." Ps. 89: 30-33.

"The Lord is gracious and full of compassion; slow to anger and of great mercy. The Lord is good to all and his tender mercies are over all his works." Ps. 165: 8, 9.

"All nations whom you have made shall come and worship before you, O Lord, and shall glorify your name. "Ps. 86: 9.

"O you that hears prayer, unto you shall all flesh come." Ps. 65: 2.

"All the ends of the earth shall remember and turn unto the Lord; and all the kindreds of the nations shall worship before you." Ps. 22: 27.

"He will swallow up death in victory; and the Lord God will wipe away tears from off all faces." Isa. 25: 8.

"Look unto me and be you saved, all the ends of the earth, for I am God, and there is none else. I have sworn by myself; the word is gone out of my mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, that unto me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear, surely shall say: "In the Lord have I righteousness and strength." Isa. 45: 24-27.

"He shall see of the travail of his soul and shall be satisfied."Isa. 53: 11.

"As the rain comes down, and the snow from heaven, and returns not thither, but waters the earth and makes it bring forth and bud that it may give seed to the sower, and bread to the eater, so shall my word be that goes forth out of my mouth, it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it." Isa. 55: 10, 11.

"Can a woman forget her sucking child, that she should not have compassion on the son of her womb? Yea, they may forget, yet will I not forget you." Isa. 49: 15.

"Behold, the days come, says the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah: not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers, in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they broke although I was a husband unto them, says the Lord. But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel: After those days, says the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts, and will be their God and they shall be my people. And they shall teach no more every man his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, know the Lord, for they shall all know me from the least of them unto the greatest of them, says the Lord, for I will forgive their sin and I will remember their iniquity no more." Jer. 31: 31-34.

"I will ransom them from the power of the grave; I will redeem them from death: O death, I will be your plagues: O grave, I will be your destruction: repentance shall be hid from mine eyes." Hos. 13: 14.

"Who is a God like unto you, that pardons iniquity, and passes by the transgression of the remnant of his heritage? he retains not his anger forever because he delights in mercy. He will turn again, he will have compassion upon us. He will subdue our iniquities, and you will cast all their sins into the depth of the sea. You will perform the truth to Jacob, and the mercy to Abraham, which you have sworn unto our fathers from the days of old." Mic. 7: 18, 19, 20.

"And there was given him dominion, and glory and a kingdom, that all people, nations and languages should serve him: his dominion is an ever lasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed." Dan. 7: 14.
 
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FineLinen

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The Problem, further, is that many Bibles, especially denominational Bible versions, are translated with a subtle or overt "theo-illogical" bias. This puts the cart (theology) ahead of the horse (translated text). I maintain this: text first, only then theology.

Dear Lazarus: We as the broken members of a broken race have a bent towards missing the mark. Thank Abba for His great patience with all of us as His Plan cascades into us by the moving of His Spirit!

He is exceedingly abundantly above all we can ask or think
 
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he-man

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Lazarus Short

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Dear Lazarus: We as the broken members of a broken race have a bent towards missing the mark.

Several years ago, God granted me a vision in response to prayer, and He showed me a vast plain strewn with pottery shards. Some were more beautiful than others, and I saw one rather plain one, and knew it represented me. However, His lesson was that the other shards, for all their incised decoration and/or beautiful glazes, were just as broken.
 
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he-man

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The problem is the bible NEVER EVER says anything about an eternal death. Go ahead a do a bible search with he words eternal death.
P.S. the Greek word for eternal is aidios, not aionios
HUH?
G126 αιδιοις ἀΐδιος, everlasting, eternal, (without beginning or end); Only two verses; one in Romans 1:20 and Jude 1:6
And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.

Romans 1:20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

found in 69 verses: everlasting G166
G166 αἰώνιος aiōnios
Thayer Definition: 1) without beginning and end, that which always has been and always will be without end, never to cease, everlasting.

destruction G3639 ὄλεθρος Thayer Definition: 1) ruin, destroy, death
1a) for the destruction of the flesh, A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: from a primary ollumi (to destroy, a prolonged form)

[BULLINGER] destruction. Greek. olethros. See 1 Corinthians 5:5, 1 Thessalonians 5:3. 2 Thessalonians 1:9. 1 Timothy 6:9.

2Th 1:9 who shall pay the penalty of everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his might,

Psalms 115:17 The dead praise not the LORD, neither any that go down into silence.
 
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he-man

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Dear he-man: My friend try and reach out of your cramped little world of negativity.

John 12:32=

John 12:32 - And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to myself.
Those thus drawn are defined in John 6:37 as "all "those who are given (without exception).
[BULLINGER]
John 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.
John 12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.
John 6:37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
 
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FineLinen

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Several years ago, God granted me a vision in response to prayer, and He showed me a vast plain strewn with pottery shards. Some were more beautiful than others, and I saw one rather plain one, and knew it represented me. However, His lesson was that the other shards, for all their incised decoration and/or beautiful glazes, were just as broken.

Dear Lazarus: Many moons ago we were deeply involved with a fellowship of those who God had grasped for Himself. One of these ones had shipped china place settings from Ireland home. In the transit, the pieces were badly broken, but one could still know what they formerly were e.g. cup, saucer.

The Lord began to speak a word to us that still resonates in me regarding the contriter & being ground to powder. This world is badly broken, and not only broken, ground to powder.

One of primary reasons this link has arisen is to give hope to the hopeless and the giving of sight to the blind. Dear brother, a new day breaks on the horizon, the kainos God of Glory knows how to make powder into a new vessel!
 
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