Why do modern Christians promote war in the middle east?

BABerean2 said:

those who claim to be Christians

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As Jesus said, 'by there fruit you will know them.'

Many people claim to be Christian, so what. It is whether their lives, talk, actions match their claim.

BABerean2 said:

Pastor Chuck Baldwin speaks the truth about those who claim to be Christians, but yet promote war in the middle east.

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I'm not in the least bit surprised at your usual confusion.

Fact of the matter is that that passage was referring to Israel per The Law's PERFORMANCE BASED Acceptance from God.

This, and its "The People" (which is how Israel is very often referred to, in Scripture)...

Psalms 68:30 Rebuke the company of spearmen, the multitude of the bulls, with the calves of the people, till every one submit himself with pieces of silver: scatter thou the people that delight in war.

That was regarding Israel, in accordance with an aspect of THEIR Law Covenant with God...

Deuteronomy 28:58 If thou wilt not observe to do all the words of this law that are written in this book, that thou mayest fear this glorious and fearful name, THE LORD THY GOD; 28:59 Then the LORD will make thy plagues wonderful, and the plagues of thy seed, even great plagues, and of long continuance, and sore sicknesses, and of long continuance.

28:64 And the LORD shall scatter thee among all people, from the one end of the earth even unto the other; and there thou shalt serve other gods, which neither thou nor thy fathers have known, even wood and stone.

Deuteronomy 29:1 These are the words of the covenant, which the LORD commanded Moses to make with the children of Israel in the land of Moab, beside the covenant which he made with them in Horeb.

That is with regard to Israel under The Law's Performance Based Standard of Acceptance with God.

And that had had its intent...

Romans 3:19 Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

BUT NOW...

3:21 But now the righteousness of God WITHOUT the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; 3:22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; 3:24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: 3:25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God; 3:26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus. 3:27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. 3:28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

TO WIT...

2 Corinthians 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, NOT Zimputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

THEREFORE BEING...

Romans 5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, we HAVE peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ: 5:6 For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly. 5:7 For scarcely for a righteous man will one die: yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die. 5:8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. 5:9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him. 5:10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by HIS life. 5:11 And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have NOW received the atonement.

We also read of how that just because one is NOT behaving like a Believer is supposedly supposed to behave, that does NOT mean they are NOT a Believer...

Galatians 3:1 O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you? 3:2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? 3:3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?

3:6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.

The irony is that you are ever erroneously presenting yourself as some sort of an expert on Darby, an expert on whom you continually prove yourself not in the least.

For Darby relates in his writings that it was this very distinction between Israel's Performance Based Measure of Acceptance by God and this Other Distinction also made obvious in Scripture - one of the Believer's Acceptance with or by God based on His Son's FINISHED Work ALONE - that resulted in his Distinction Between Israel and The Body, etc.

A Distinction Between the Two that resulted in his finding himself free from the religious bondage he had previously been under, and that you and that speaker are erroneously proposing - The Performance Based Standard of Acceptance (Blessing) and Rejection (Curse) with, before, or by God.

Which, again, is NOT how things work THIS SIDE OF The Cross...

Why?

Romans 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace. 6:15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.

Thus, the Apostle Paul's often repeated greeting to members of the Body regardless of each their particular level of understanding of how they are to conduct themselves as Believers...

Ephesians 1:2 Grace be to you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ.

Why that, across the board generic?

Because the Body member's Acceptance by God has as its intent the Glory of One Person in particular.

Ephesians 1:6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.

You...are preaching the Works Based Blessing and or Cursing of The Law.

Malachi 4:4 Remember ye the law of Moses my servant, which I commanded unto him in Horeb for all Israel, with the statutes and judgments. 4:5 Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD: 4:6 And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse.

You remain...confused.

Not to mention that the ONLY Nation EVER inspired into existence by God and for His Purpose, was the Nation Israel.

Deuteronomy 4:5 Behold, I have taught you statutes and judgments, even as the LORD my God commanded me, that ye should do so in the land whither ye go to possess it. 4:6 Keep therefore and do them; for this is your wisdom and your understanding in the sight of the nations, which shall hear all these statutes, and say, Surely this great nation is a wise and understanding people. 4:7 For what nation is there so great, who hath God so nigh unto them, as the LORD our God is in all things that we call upon him for? 4:8 And what nation is there so great, that hath statutes and judgments so righteous as all this law, which I set before you this day? 4:9 Only take heed to thyself, and keep thy soul diligently, lest thou forget the things which thine eyes have seen, and lest they depart from thy heart all the days of thy life: but teach them thy sons, and thy sons' sons; 4:10 Specially the day that thou stoodest before the LORD thy God in Horeb, when the LORD said unto me, Gather me the people together, and I will make them hear my words, that they may learn to fear me all the days that they shall live upon the earth, and that they may teach their children.

Their Curse should THEY depart from THEIR Law Covenant with Him?

2 Chronicles 7:20 Then will I pluck them up by the roots out of my land which I have given them; and this house, which I have sanctified for my name, will I cast out of my sight, and will make it to be a proverb and a byword among all nations.

(And they were scattered from The Land, per THEIR Law Covenant - they're only back in The Land by their OWN sinful will).

The speaker on that video rightly pointed out some serious misbehavior by many professing Believers today, but then mixed that with his/your obvious error on the difference between The Law's Performance Based Acceptance before God, and Grace's Christ Based Acceptance.

Yours is not unlike Peter's Performance Based Acceptance error, this side of The Cross of Christ, in the following...

Galatians 2:11 But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed. 2:12 For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision. 2:13 And the other Jews dissembled likewise with him; insomuch that Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation. 2:14 But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews? 2:15 We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles, 2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified. 2:17 But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid. 2:18 For if I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor. 2:19 For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God. 2:20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me. 2:21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

I doubt any of this will strike a cord with you. For you have continually proven yourself dead set in your errors and its false sense of expertise.

Romans 5:6-8 - in each...our stead.

BABerean2 said:

Pastor Baldwin's sermon below, destroys your accusations...

Nobody in the history of Israel ever kept the Sinai Covenant perfectly, except Jesus Christ.

King David was an adulterer and conspired to have Uriah killed, so that he could have the man's wife.

However, the New Covenant is a higher standard than the Old Covenant, not for our salvation, but for our conduct.

Mat 5:27 "You have heard that it was said to those of old, 'YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY.'
Mat 5:28 But I say to you that whoever looks at a woman to lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart.


There are two different sets of commandments in the verse below.

Joh 15:10 If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love, just as I have kept My Father's commandments and abide in His love.

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Jer_31:31 "Behold, the days are coming, says the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah—

Mat_26:28 For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

Mar_14:24 And He said to them, "This is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many.

Luk_22:20 Likewise He also took the cup after supper, saying, "This cup is the new covenant in My blood, which is shed for you.

1Co_11:25 In the same manner He also took the cup after supper, saying, "This cup is the new covenant in My blood. This do, as often as you drink it, in remembrance of Me."

2Co_3:6 who also made us sufficient as ministers of the new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

Heb_8:8 Because finding fault with them, He says: "BEHOLD, THE DAYS ARE COMING, SAYS THE LORD, WHEN I WILL MAKE A NEW COVENANT WITH THE HOUSE OF ISRAEL AND WITH THE HOUSE OF JUDAH—

Heb_8:13 In that He says, "A NEW COVENANT," He has made the first obsolete.
Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.

Heb_9:15 And for this reason He is the Mediator of the new covenant, by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions under the first covenant, that those who are called may receive the promise of the eternal inheritance.

Heb_12:24 to Jesus the Mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling that speaks better things than that of Abel.

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Never mind the actual context of Matthew thru John, Early Acts, and Hebrews thru Revelation...

Matthew 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

Matthew 8:1 When he was come down from the mountain, great multitudes followed him. 8:2 And, behold, there came a leper and worshipped him, saying, Lord, if thou wilt, thou canst make me clean. 8:3 And Jesus put forth his hand, and touched him, saying, I will; be thou clean. And immediately his leprosy was cleansed. 8:4 And Jesus saith unto him, See thou tell no man; but go thy way, shew thyself to the priest, and offer the gift that Moses commanded, for a testimony unto them.

Matthew 8:1 When he was come down from the mountain, great multitudes followed him. 8:2 And, behold, there came a leper and worshipped him, saying, Lord, if thou wilt, thou canst make me clean. 8:3 And Jesus put forth his hand, and touched him, saying, I will; be thou clean. And immediately his leprosy was cleansed. 8:4 And Jesus saith unto him, See thou tell no man; but go thy way, shew thyself to the priest, and offer the gift that Moses commanded, for a testimony unto them.

Your errors remain predictable.

As predictable as your ever obvious contempt for anyone who refuses to biy into your obvious ignorance of the great difference between acceptance with God under The Law and acceptance with Him under Grace

Nevertheless, Romans 5:6-8 - in each...our stead.

BABerean2 said:

As long as you ignore the fulfillment of the New Covenant promised to Israel and Judah in Jeremiah 31:31-34, at Calvary, you will remain to be the accuser of the Brethren...


The New Covenant: Bob George

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Quit flaming - or I'll pull a you and tattle tale on ya.

Lol

Rom. 5:6-8.

Danoh said:

Matthew 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

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Luke 18
31 Then he took unto him the twelve, and said unto them, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem, and all things that are written by the prophets concerning the Son of man shall be accomplished.

Luke 24
25 Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken:
26 Ought not Christ to have suffered these things, and to enter into his glory?
27 And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself.
44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.

I know many Christians and none of them promote war .
I however understand that during WW11 many supported the war , but didn't promote it.
There is a difference.
When Christ comes back He won't be riding a donkey waving a olive branch.

jgr said:

Luke 18
31 Then he took unto him the twelve, and said unto them, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem, and all things that are written by the prophets concerning the Son of man shall be accomplished.

Luke 24
25 Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken:
26 Ought not Christ to have suffered these things, and to enter into his glory?
27 And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself.
44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.

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Obviously the fact that He had only been referring to those things Prophesied concerning (His rejection and triumph over same at) His FIRST Advent is not yet clear to you.

That is all He is addressing.

Luke 24: 25 Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken: 26 Ought not Christ to have suffered these things, and to enter into his glory?

Nehemiah 8: 10

Because they're corrupted.

Danoh said:

Obviously the fact that He had only been referring to those things Prophesied concerning (His rejection and triumph over same at) His FIRST Advent is not yet clear to you.

That is all He is addressing.

Luke 24: 25 Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken: 26 Ought not Christ to have suffered these things, and to enter into his glory?

Nehemiah 8: 10

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You don't believe verse 44?

44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.

jgr said:

You don't believe verse 44?

44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.

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I already addressed what that is referring to in my post to you prior to this one.

Nehemiah 8:8 So they read in the book in the law of God distinctly, and gave the sense, and caused them to understand the reading.

Rom. 5:6-8.

Danoh said:

I already addressed what that is referring to in my post to you prior to this one.

Nehemiah 8:8 So they read in the book in the law of God distinctly, and gave the sense, and caused them to understand the reading.

Rom. 5:6-8.

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Yes, He was referring to "all" when He said "all things must be fulfilled".

BABerean2 said:

And what happens after Luke 21:24, Danoh?

Luk 21:24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
Luk 21:25 And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;
Luk 21:26 Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken.
Luk 21:27 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.
Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.


The Second Coming of Christ occurs after the "times of the Gentiles" is fulfilled.

Nobody will be saved outside of the New Covenant Church, during a future time.

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You consistently flame Dispensationalists in a very generic manner so as to be able to get away with doing so.

You then constantly run to the moderators when ever you take offense to one thing or another.

It's gotten old. Consider yourself on ignore.

Romans 5:6-8.

jgr said:

Yes, He was referring to "all" when He said "all things must be fulfilled".

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I suppose He's returned, made heaven and earth new, and we are all living in Paradise.

Nope.

For as He Himself put it in those very passages - He was referring to His having fulfilled all those things concerning His 1st Advent and its' sufferings that had been Prophesied.

Nehemiah 8:8 So they read in the book in the law of God distinctly, and gave the sense, and caused them to understand the reading.