Book - Sealed with 7 Seals

Choose Wisely said:

This verse shows why you are incorrect. It says the fifth trumpet is yet to sound. Therefore the events of the 5th trumpet cannot occur before the 1st four trumpets. You need to understand that there is a difference between the wrath of God and the tribulation. The tribulation ends at the 6th seal......so does the 70th week.

Rev 8
13 And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to sound!

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Sorry, but the wrath of God will occur DURING the tribulation. You cannot rewrite the book to fit your theory. The truth is, God will pour out the vials of His wrath to SHORTEN those days of great tribulation - so "tribulation" is concurrent with God's wrath.

The truth is, the "tribulation" has not even started at the 6th seal. Apparently you don't know what will cause the "tribulation." You don't know where it begins and where in ends in Revelation. You just think you know.

Choose Wisely said:

You have the day of the Lord beginning before the tribulation. The 1000 year day of the Lord begins immediately after the tribulation of those days. The gathering from heaven and earth occurs, then the wrath of God begins. The 70th week of Daniel is over before the wrath begins.

Rev 6
12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;

13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.
14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.
15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;
16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

Matt 24
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

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You have the day of the Lord beginning before the tribulation.

How amazing! He does because JOHN DOES.

Right, THE DAY begins at the 6th seal and continues on through the entire 70th week. It is still going when Jesus returns as seen in chapter 19.

On the other hand, the signs for JESUS' coming is shown in Joel 3 and in Matthew 24 and these signs come after the days of tribulation are over.

Douggg said:

The Day of the Lord begins when the world is saying peace and safety.

1Thessalonians5:
2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.

3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.

Which peace and safety is not the condition during the great tribulation. It has to begin before the great tribulation begins.

The 1000 years is one segment of the Day of the Lord.
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The wrath of God is in Revelation 16, in the 7 vials, poured out on the earth, on them who worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in their forehead or hand (Revelation 14:9-10 and Revelation 14:18-20).

1 And I heard a great voice out of the temple saying to the seven angels, Go your ways, and pour out the vials of the wrath of God upon the earth.

The vials are poured out near the end of the great tribulation. They are so severe that they do not cover a long period of time, or else no life on earth would survive.

The wrath of the Lamb - in Revelation 6:17 - by Jesus - takes place when Jesus returns and is to avenge them martyred during the great tribulation.

Revelation 5:
9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:

10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?

11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

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This is a good post- TRUTH - except this writer has the 5th seal martyrs of the CHURCH AGE misplaced. Everything else is RIGHT ON!

Choose Wisely said:

What makes you think that the wrath of God occurs during the 7 years. The wrath of God is part of the 1000 year day of the Lord. It is not part of the 70th week.

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REaders RUN! This is total myth! Apparently this writer does not even know what the 70th week is, or WHERE it is in Revelation.

The 70th week goes from chapter 8 to chapter 16 in Revelation.
God's wrath covers this entire time and more.

Choose Wisely said:

So, I guess the real question is does the day of the Lord begin when the kingdoms of this world become the kingdoms of our God. That is......does the day of the Lord begin AFTER the wrath of God. Or does the day of the Lord begin with the wrath of God.

I think the day of the Lord begins at the 6th seal when the sun is darkened and the moon does not give it's light and the stars fall from heaven. Jesus comes then as shown in Matt 24. The 1000 year day of the Lord begins with the wrath of God. The 70th week is over when Jesus comes to rapture the 12 tribes that are scattered across the earth. The 144,000 will be the 1st fruits of this harvest.

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John TELLS US when THE DAY begins. There is no need to question John, for the Holy Spirit told him what to write. The DAY begins at the 6th seal And HIS WRATH begins at the same time. The WEEK begins at the 7th seal in chapter 8. Jesus does not come until chapter 19, 7 years later. The 1000 years begins exactly at the 7th trumpet that will sound when Adam's 6000 year lease is finished. But the millennial reign will not begin until after His return in Rev. 19.
The truth is, JOHN has truth in the order he wrote in. ANY theory that must rearrange John's order will be proven wrong.

Choose Wisely said:

Yes he does.

Why would I question John? I believe what he wrote. It is you that seem to be having trouble believing that John and Jesus wrote the same thing regarding end times. They match up perfectly, but you can't believe them because you can't figure out how make your timeline work.

The 5th seal? Can you produce a scripture to support this?

What really happens is that Jesus comes at the 6th seal. The people see Him and try to hide because they know that the time of wrath has come. The wrath comes with the 7th seal is opened.

The week is over when Jesus comes at the 6th seal. The gathering of Matthew 24 occurs. Then the wrath of God begins.


Jesus comes at the 6th seal for the pre wrath rapture of the 12 tribes. He returns in Rev 19 on a white horse.........time, times and half a time.

The 1000 year day of the Lord begins when the wrath of God is poured out at the 7th SEAL.


I have rearranged nothing. It is only your lack of understanding. I know because I used to think just like you........but nothing fit right. Then I decided to listen to what Jesus and John said and figure out why they were right.......instead of saying, it can't be BECAUSE..............

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My mistake: my mind thought 6th and my fingers wrote 5th.
I have admitted my error - a typo. Now lets go through your errors:

Jesus comes at the 6th seal. There is NO COMING at the 6th seal. the 6th seal starts His wrath, and He must come for His Bride BEFORE His wrath begins. The truth then is that He comes for His second coming just BEFORE the 6th seal. So close, but no cigar.

The gathering of Matthew 24 occurs. (at the 6th seal) WRONG place for this gathering. The coming in Matthew 24 - AFTER the days of tribulation - line up with Rev. 19, which comes AFTER the Tribulation, which is found in chapter 8 through 16. The gathering of Mattew 24 gathers from HEAVEN. Paul's gathering gathers from earth. Paul's gathering will be just BEFORE the 6th seal, when Christ comes FOR His saints. He will come the 3rd time WITH His saints as seen in Rev. 19.

The week is over when Jesus comes at the 6th seal. The truth is, the week has not yet started. You are thoroughly mixed up. Your theory requires a total rewrite of Revelation. The truth is, the week ends with the 7th vial in chapter 16. You are only 10 chapters off!

Then the wrath of God begins. Well, you got one part right! Congratulations! God's wrath WILL start at the 6th seal. The rapture will have just taken place

Jesus comes at the 6th seal for the pre wrath rapture of the 12 tribes. MYTH! Prove this with scripture - if you can. I already know you cannot. The 144,000 are not raptured until the midpoint of the week. That would be around the 7th trumpet. John saw them in heaven in chapter 14, so certainly their rapture will be before chapter 14.

He returns in Rev 19 on a white horse.........time, times and half a time. Wow! Yes, he DOES return in chapter 19. It will be His 3rd coming - and this coming will be WITH His saints. It will be OVER 3.5 years from the 7th trumpet that will mark the midpoint. It will be OVER 1260 days (perhaps 1290 days?) from the midpoint when He comes.

The 1000 year day of the Lord begins when the wrath of God is poured out at the 7th SEAL.
The millenniums will change (one end and one begin) at the 7th trumpet - the midpoint of the week.

Congratulations! You have missed on almost every point you have written.

I have rearranged nothing. Your WORST mistake. In every sentence (almost) you are forced to rearrage Revelation to fit. For example, the rapture of the 144,000. For example, the week is over before it has really begun! You really overdid yourself on that one. God places the week from chapter 8 to chapter 16. But you rewrite the book and insist it is before the 6th seal.

And all these mistakes simply because you can't believe God will show the cosmic signs TWICE. And because you cannot see a difference in total darkness and a blood moon.

Choose Wisely said:

I know why all the things you say are wrong. Think about it. Jesus tells us in Matthew 24 what will happen at the end of the age....and John agrees with Him in the seals. Jesus gives us the cosmic signs in Matthew 24 and John agrees with him with the signs of Rev 6. Jesus tells us in Matthew He is coming for the gathering. John tells us the people hide from the face of the one on the throne.........and then we see the gathering of the great multitude. Everything lines perfectly and yet you can't see the obvious as you don't understand Revelation.

Your thought process is.....even though everything fits perfectly........it can't be.......BECAUSE I can't figure out how to make everything fit..........so it must be wrong.

Well it's not.

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and John agrees with Him in the seals. Correct - but Matthew wrote: "the end is not yet" to match with John that the first 5 seals are church age. This is a point you overlook every time. But for the readers, it is the first 5 seals that line up with what Jesus said in Matthew 24 - all the words before verse 14 where "the end" is written. Everything before that is church age: the earthquakes, pestilences, etc.

Jesus gives us the cosmic signs in Matthew 24 and John agrees with him with the signs of Rev 6. WRONG! This is your imagination because you cannot differentiate between a night with a blood red moon - a SEEN moon, and total darkness. You cannot tell time: Matthew is after the trib, but John is before the entire week begins. In other words, you are MILES off from the truth. Worse yet, you imagine your wild theories ARE truth - when they are anything BUT. When these things begin to happen, then you will know your theories were wrong. You are forced to rearrange, so you theories will be proven wrong.

Jesus tells us in Matthew He is coming for the gathering. WRONG Gathering! This Matthew gathering gathers from heaven. Paul's rapture gathers from earth.

the people hide from the face of the one on the throne.........and then we see the gathering of the great multitude. This proves that the gathering came BEFORE the 6th seal start of His wrath. In chapter 7 they are ALREADY in heaven. you are SO CLOSE: just move His coming and the gathering to JUST BEFORE the 6th seal - and you will be dead on.

Everything lines perfectly Your WORST mistake: you imagine you have it right, but your theory requires a rewrite of Revelation. You would have to move chapters 8 through 16 - "the trib" to before the 6th seal! That is a HUGE alteration to the book! May I suggest you study "the trib" so you learn what it is - what causes it - and where it is in Revelation?

The truth is, I DO understand Revelation. That is why I know your theories are SO FAR OFF.

The truth is, it DOES fit if you just believe Revelation is correct in chronology as it is written: rapture just before the 6th seal, then the 6th seal starts the DAY and His wrath, then the 7th seal starts the week, the 7th trumpet marks the midpoint, and finally the 7th vial ends the week. This is perfect order, because this is the order when these things happen.

Choose Wisely said:

No I have the tribulation ending right where it ends...............IMMEDIATELY AFTER THE TRIBULATION of the days the sun shall be darkened..............
Then the great day of His wrath is come.

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Go and read John 2 and 3. Joel 2 is the 6th seal sign, the start of the DAY, while Joel 3 is after the tribulation and aligns with Mattew 24 - after the trib.

You end "the trib" before the 6th seal, but JOHN and the Holy Spirit START "The trib" with the 7th seal. You are indeed ending the trib before God tells us it will start.

No one is disagreeing with you that the sun darkens after the trib. The truth is, the sun will appear black, producing no light. It is DARKNESS. Prewrathers get this part right: when Jesus comes as shown in Rev. 19, it is DARK. The moon will not be seen at all. The sun will appear black (sack cloth made from black Goat hair).

Choose Wisely said:

I'm not the one that has to make up a coming of Jesus at the 5th seal.

I'm not the one that can't find the signs of the sun moon and stars in Revelation as they relate to Matt 24.

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You are the one that requires major rearranging to Revelation to fit a theory.

Choose Wisely said:

The tribulation ends...........the world says peace and safety...........and then sudden destruction comes. They are cast into the wrath of God
Rev 6
16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?


Exactly. Peace and safety is not a condition of the tribulation.

No............ when the tribulation is over, they say peace and safety.......... only to be cast into the wrath of God.



So are you saying that the lamb is NOT God? I hear that wrath of the Lamb stuff quite often and yet when we look in Rev 11 we see that it is the wrath of God occurring in the trumpets

Rev 11
17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.

18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

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Make no mistake here: when our Father God begins His wrath, the SON begins wrath. After all, they are ONE.

The tribulation ends...........the world says peace and safety...........and then sudden destruction comes. They are cast into the wrath of God

MYTH! TOTALLY out of John's correct order! How could ANYONE get this so mixed up? the "trib:" has not yet begun at the 6th seal. In fact, the days of GT will not begin until late in chapter 14 or between 14 and 15. The beheaded (part of "the trib) do not begin to show up in heaven until chapter 15. Then God pours out the vials to SHORTEN those days of "the trib." Yet you insist the events of chapters 8 through 16 will happen before the 6th seal.