The Jews to be kept safe during the Great Tribulation

Billy Evmur

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I'm Amillennial. Not Preterist.

Amillennialism is blown, for Augustine taught the church would spread and reign throughout the world, this is the essence of Amill, wars would cease and peace and prosperity along with righteousness would prevail.

It was always a non-starter because Jesus Himself taught that wars and disasters would multiply at the end time.
 
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Eloy Craft

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Nobody can honestly deny that when the Church first began it was made up of Israelites. The Gentiles were grafted in several years later.
Who is he writing to and why are they the twelve tribes scattered?
 
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Dave L

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Amillennialism is blown, for Augustine taught the church would spread and reign throughout the world, this is the essence of Amill, wars would cease and peace and prosperity along with righteousness would prevail.

It was always a non-starter because Jesus Himself taught that wars and disasters would multiply at the end time.
You are calling Post Millennialism Amillennialism. Two different systems.
 
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keras

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Mebbe I will start a new thread because I sniff a long tangled debate here.

You say they are to inherit the land, actually they are promised the ends of the earth, wherever their feet have trodden...Israel have clear different promises made to them to the promises we as the Body of Christ have received...the BOC includes the Jewish church.
Two people, Two Promises. [TP,TP] The doctrine that God will restore and bless the Jews after He has taken the Church to heaven, has been thoroughly debunked here before, but many still grip onto it, as their beliefs demand it.

The error that most have, is in assigning the prophesies for Israel to the Jewish State of Israel. The Bible prophets always carefully separate Judah and Israel and they remain separate today. Judah, the Jewish people, who wrongly call their country Israel, have many specific prophesies of how God will deal with them in these end times.
But Israel is different, one of the best examples of what the Lord will do to each is in Amos 2:4-5; for Judah and Amos 2:6-16 for Israel. Also Jeremiah 19:10-12 and Jeremiah 18:6; Judah smashed beyond repair and Israel remoulded.

So the question is: Who is the true Israel? We know the correct Biblical answer; it is every born again Christian, the Lord's chosen people, 1 Peter 2:9-10, and those bought by His blood, Revelation 5:9-10.
THEY are the faithful Israel of God, Galatians 6:14-16, His Overcomers, literally: true Israelites.
With that truth in mind, the prophesies make sense and we can know our destiny; how the Lord promises to save and Bless all who put their trust in Him. Jeremiah 17:7-8


The idea that the Jewish people still have God's favour, is sadly mistaken. They have had nearly 2000 years of God's grace for them to accept their Messiah. This has not and will not happen, as Jesus knew they wouldn't. That is why He said that He would save the lost House of Israel. the other ten tribes, still in exile, who have largely accepted Jesus and are now His Overcomers, the genuine Israelites of God.

The true Israelites of God are every faithful Christian, from every tribe, race, nation and language. That is how it has been from the beginning; the congregation, the ekkelasia; the church of faithful believers, from Abel, to Elijah's 7000, to the few survivors after 40 years in the desert, to the Pilgrim Fathers, to today’s faithful Christian believers.

Do you pray for Israel? For the people currently occupying the holy Land? Those people who are 50% atheists, who practice Judaism and other religion's far removed from Biblical truths, who approve of the LGBT lifestyle, those proud, arrogant Israeli’s whose nation was founded on communistic principals?
Are they God’s people? No; 1 Peter 2:9-10 and all the NT teaching proves they are not.

We are specifically told to NOT pray for the Jews. Jeremiah 11:14, 14:10-12
 
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BABerean2

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Who is he writing to and why are they the twelve tribes scattered?

On the Day of Pentecost Jews arrived in Jerusalem from many different countries.

Act 2:5 And there were dwelling in Jerusalem Jews, devout men, from every nation under heaven.
Act 2:6 And when this sound occurred, the multitude came together, and were confused, because everyone heard them speak in his own language.
Act 2:7 Then they were all amazed and marveled, saying to one another, "Look, are not all these who speak Galileans?
Act 2:8 And how is it that we hear, each in our own language in which we were born?
Act 2:9 Parthians and Medes and Elamites, those dwelling in Mesopotamia, Judea and Cappadocia, Pontus and Asia,
Act 2:10 Phrygia and Pamphylia, Egypt and the parts of Libya adjoining Cyrene, visitors from Rome, both Jews and proselytes,
Act 2:11 Cretans and Arabs—we hear them speaking in our own tongues the wonderful works of God."
Act 2:12 So they were all amazed and perplexed, saying to one another, "Whatever could this mean?"

Act 2:36 "Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly that God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Christ."


We also have to remember that most of the Northern tribes were carried into captivity hundreds of years before the time of Christ.
Many of their descendants had also become Christians during the time that James wrote his letter.


.
 
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jgr

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No Jews no Jesus.
Sure. But only One of them of Whom is salvation.

Acts 4
10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.

11 This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.

12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.
 
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Billy Evmur

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You are calling Post Millennialism Amillennialism. Two different systems.

Nay Augustine thought this present age was the reign of Christ with His people. Post Mill is the reign as described after the Lord's return, which I believe.
 
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Billy Evmur

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Two people, Two Promises. [TP,TP] The doctrine that God will restore and bless the Jews after He has taken the Church to heaven, has been thoroughly debunked here before, but many still grip onto it, as their beliefs demand it.

The error that most have, is in assigning the prophesies for Israel to the Jewish State of Israel. The Bible prophets always carefully separate Judah and Israel and they remain separate today. Judah, the Jewish people, who wrongly call their country Israel, have many specific prophesies of how God will deal with them in these end times.
But Israel is different, one of the best examples of what the Lord will do to each is in Amos 2:4-5; for Judah and Amos 2:6-16 for Israel. Also Jeremiah 19:10-12 and Jeremiah 18:6; Judah smashed beyond repair and Israel remoulded.

So the question is: Who is the true Israel? We know the correct Biblical answer; it is every born again Christian, the Lord's chosen people, 1 Peter 2:9-10, and those bought by His blood, Revelation 5:9-10.
THEY are the faithful Israel of God, Galatians 6:14-16, His Overcomers, literally: true Israelites.
With that truth in mind, the prophesies make sense and we can know our destiny; how the Lord promises to save and Bless all who put their trust in Him. Jeremiah 17:7-8


The idea that the Jewish people still have God's favour, is sadly mistaken. They have had nearly 2000 years of God's grace for them to accept their Messiah. This has not and will not happen, as Jesus knew they wouldn't. That is why He said that He would save the lost House of Israel. the other ten tribes, still in exile, who have largely accepted Jesus and are now His Overcomers, the genuine Israelites of God.

The true Israelites of God are every faithful Christian, from every tribe, race, nation and language. That is how it has been from the beginning; the congregation, the ekkelasia; the church of faithful believers, from Abel, to Elijah's 7000, to the few survivors after 40 years in the desert, to the Pilgrim Fathers, to today’s faithful Christian believers.

Do you pray for Israel? For the people currently occupying the holy Land? Those people who are 50% atheists, who practice Judaism and other religion's far removed from Biblical truths, who approve of the LGBT lifestyle, those proud, arrogant Israeli’s whose nation was founded on communistic principals?
Are they God’s people? No; 1 Peter 2:9-10 and all the NT teaching proves they are not.

We are specifically told to NOT pray for the Jews. Jeremiah 11:14, 14:10-12

I disagree with the lot of it...mebbe we will debate it one time.
 
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iamlamad

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Unsurprising. The choice:

1. Interpretation by realization.
2. Interpretation by imagination.

History realizes. Futurism fantasizes.
I don't think you would want to tell Daniel, Ezekiel and Isaiah that they were fantasizing!
 
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iamlamad

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Thats the problem with 'End times' 'experts'. Each one has his own belief. His own take on scripture. Which one is right? :scratch:
Here is a hint: ANY theory that must rearrange John's God given chronology will be proven wrong.
 
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BABerean2

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Here is a hint: ANY theory that must rearrange John's God given chronology will be proven wrong.

Rev 16:15 "Behold, I am coming as a thief. Blessed is he who watches, and keeps his garments, lest he walk naked and they see his shame."
Rev 16:16 And they gathered them together to the place called in Hebrew, Armageddon.
Rev 16:17 Then the seventh angel poured out his bowl into the air, and a loud voice came out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, "It is done!"
Rev 16:18 And there were noises and thunderings and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such a mighty and great earthquake as had not occurred since men were on the earth.
Rev 16:19 Now the great city was divided into three parts, and the cities of the nations fell. And great Babylon was remembered before God, to give her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of His wrath.
Rev 16:20 Then every island fled away, and the mountains were not found.

Do you know what happens when the most powerful earthquake in the history of man occurs?
It is an earthquake so powerful that it destroys all of the mountains.


Do you deny that the passage above is a reference to the Second Coming of Christ at Armageddon?

.
 
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Billy Evmur

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Unsurprising. The choice:

1. Interpretation by realization.
2. Interpretation by imagination.

History realizes. Futurism fantasizes.

You can cobble any amount of scriptures together into a compendium, totally disregard the context of each scripture, totally ignore other scripture which say something different and offer it as evidence to prove any doctrine.

Those people who deny that Christ is God do that by pointing to all the scriptures that show He is a man [which nobody denies] but completely ignore all the scriptures that show that He is God.

I always reject their evidence too.
 
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Billy Evmur

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I bank on God's word to Jeremiah in my OP which specifically addresses the great trib and specifically states that God will keep them safe and Daniel 12. which specifically addresses the great trib and states categorically that at that time Michael will stand up and Israel will be delivered.
 
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