Should we sell our possessions to gain eternal life?

Wordkeeper

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He also was saying to be generous with what you have, be hospitable, etc. How does a person do any of that if they have nothing?
I don't recall saying your poverty would be permanent. Every cross has a resurrection. That's how others will be convinced to emulate your example and come out of Egypt:

Mark 10:28Peter began to say to Him, “Behold, we have left everything and followed You.” 29Jesus said, “Truly I say to you, there is no one who has left house or brothers or sisters or mother or father or children or farms, for My sake and for the gospel’s sake, 30but that he will receive a hundred times as much now in the present age, houses and brothers and sisters and mothers and children and farms, along with persecutions; and in the age to come, eternal life.
 
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Wordkeeper

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"Should we sell our possessions to gain eternal life?"


I wish that it was that easy.

M-Bob
Its one of the steps of which none can be left out in the process of being complete, justified, the good news that the Old Covenant could not achieve.

  1. Becoming aliens in a life of serving interests of self for gains that perish
  2. Crying out to God for citizenship in a life of serving His interests for treasure that lasts
  3. God is not afraid to be called your God and has prepared a country for you to enter and reveals to you how to enter it, gives you bread from heaven, teaches you the Way, how picking up across results in resurrection through God's great work, after He pulls you out of the water.
  4. Remembering God's great works, the Way.
  5. Hearing His voice.
  6. Moving forward to pick up your cross.
  7. Resurrecting into Christ.
  8. Coming near to God.
  9. Becoming blessings to the world.
 
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Mountainmanbob

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Its one of the steps of which none can be left out in the process of being complete, justified, the good news that the Old Covenant could not achieve.

  1. Becoming aliens in a life of serving interests of self for gains that perish
  2. Crying out to God for citizenship in a life of serving His interests for treasure that lasts
  3. God is not afraid to be called your God and has prepared a country for you to enter and reveals to you how to enter it, gives you bread from heaven, teaches you the Way, how picking up across results in resurrection through God's great work, after He pulls you out of the water.
  4. Remembering God's great works, the Way.
  5. Hearing His voice.
  6. Moving forward to pick up your cross.
  7. Resurrecting into Christ.
  8. Coming near to God.
  9. Becoming blessings to the world.

The above are all good but, does not seem to mention what must one do to Be Born Again? Jesus told Nicodemus it's not that easy (not in those words.)

Jesus could have told Nicodemus, just say this little prayer with me but, he did not say that.

M-Bob
 
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Wordkeeper

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The above are all good but, does not seem to mention what must one do to Be Born Again? Jesus told Nicodemus it's not that easy (not in those words.)

Jesus could have told Nicodemus, just say this little prayer with me but, he did not say that.

M-Bob
Drinking from the Rock, Christ is metonymy for the Way of Christ. All that Christ did can be summed up as parallels to God creating a cross for Israel, water shortage, and then resurrecting, providing water.

The point of this revelation was to act like the signs and wonders that Moses performed, to convince people to leave serving the interests of Egypt for gains that perish to serving the interests of God for treasure that lasts. God even created a problem like making a man blind from birth, so that He could reveal His great work in rescuing.

The prospect of picking up crosses terrified Israel and she wanted to go back, forgetting the great works of God. Caleb remembered God's great works and changed his mindset of Egypt to the mindset of Christ. This is called being born again:

Numbers 14:24"But My servant Caleb, because he has had a different spirit and has followed Me fully, I will bring into the land which he entered, and his descendants shall take possession of it.

BTW, you can't receive God's revelation of the Way in your life unless you are disillusioned with Egypt and ask for baptism, entry into Covenant.
 
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Mountainmanbob

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The prospect of picking up crosses terrified Israel and she wanted to go back, forgetting the great works of God. Caleb remembered God's great works and changed his mindset of Egypt to the mindset of Christ. This is called being born again:

Never have heard that?
Who teaches that's what it takes to be Born Again?
M-Bob
 
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Wordkeeper

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Never have heard that?
Who teaches that's what it takes to be Born Again?
M-Bob
You need a different spirit in order to be able to enter the kingdom:

Numbers 14:24"But My servant Caleb, because he has had a different spirit and has followed Me fully, I will bring into the land which he entered, and his descendants shall take possession of it.

John 3:3Jesus replied, “Very truly I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless they are born again. a

How did this change happen.

Because of seeing God's great work in resurrecting.

How do we see God's great work in resurrecting?

By being baptised.

1 Corinthians 10:1For I do not want you to be ignorant of the fact, brothers and sisters, that our ancestors were all under the cloud and that they all passed through the sea. 2They were all baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea. 3They all ate the same spiritual food 4and drank the same spiritual drink; for they drank from the spiritual rock that accompanied them, and that rock was Christ.
 
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RaymondG

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Its one of the steps of which none can be left out in the process of being complete, justified, the good news that the Old Covenant could not achieve.

  1. Becoming aliens in a life of serving interests of self for gains that perish
  2. Crying out to God for citizenship in a life of serving His interests for treasure that lasts
  3. God is not afraid to be called your God and has prepared a country for you to enter and reveals to you how to enter it, gives you bread from heaven, teaches you the Way, how picking up across results in resurrection through God's great work, after He pulls you out of the water.
  4. Remembering God's great works, the Way.
  5. Hearing His voice.
  6. Moving forward to pick up your cross.
  7. Resurrecting into Christ.
  8. Coming near to God.
  9. Becoming blessings to the world.
You could create your own denomination and would gain many followers using these steps as your doctrine. Keep up the work. Would giving up your money and possessions fit into step one, or is that before these steps start?
 
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Wordkeeper

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You could create your own denomination and would gain many followers using these steps as your doctrine. Keep up the work. Would giving up your money and possessions fit into step one, or is that before these steps start?

Step 6. It's the building of the tower, the battle with the approaching army, which you must check if you have the resources to take on, and finish.

It's the step that scared the rich young ruler and Ananias and Sapphira and kept many from joining Peter and the church. Don't you think your way would have led all the people to jump at the chance to be saved without any hesitation. In other words, why the hesitation?

Acts 51:3No one else dared join them, even though they were highly regarded by the people.
 
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RaymondG

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Step 6. It's the building of the tower, the battle with the approaching army, which you must check if you have the resources to take on, and finish.

It's the step that scared the rich young ruler and Ananias and Sapphira and kept many from joining Peter and the church. Don't you think your way would have led all the people to jump at the chance to be saved without any hesitation. In other words, why the hesitation?

Acts 51:3No one else dared join them, even though they were highly regarded by the people.
What is this "my way" that you speak of. And do you believe that the story of A and S has to do with literal money? And that you give literal money in one of the steps in your plan of salvation?
 
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Drinking from the Rock, Christ is metonymy for the Way of Christ. All that Christ did can be summed up as parallels to God creating a cross for Israel, water shortage, and then resurrecting, providing water.

Christ giving Himself as a sacrifice for our sins was parallel to the lambs that were sacrificed for the people during the days of the old covenant.
 
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Aldebaran

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Step 6. It's the building of the tower, the battle with the approaching army, which you must check if you have the resources to take on, and finish.

It's the step that scared the rich young ruler and Ananias and Sapphira and kept many from joining Peter and the church. Don't you think your way would have led all the people to jump at the chance to be saved without any hesitation. In other words, why the hesitation?

Acts 51:3No one else dared join them, even though they were highly regarded by the people.

Sounds like the thief on the cross next to Jesus never managed to be with Jesus in Paradise after all. He didn't have the resources, or even the time, to finish.
 
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Wordkeeper

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What is this "my way" that you speak of.
Those who object to my view are mostly free gracers.

And do you believe that the story of A and S has to do with literal money?

The text says A&S sold their property and laid half the proceeds at Peter's feet.

And that you give literal money in one of the steps in your plan of salvation?

A&S knew that when they heard God's voice they should not disbelieve like the Israelites of whom it was said God swore they would never enter His Rest.
 
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[

Christ giving Himself as a sacrifice for our sins was parallel to the lambs that were sacrificed for the people during the days of the old covenant.

God created a crisis and then rescued. Israel was taught that this was the Way she would have to live in the future so that the hearts of the nations would melt and cause them to turn to God. Worked with Rahab.

God even made a man blind from birth so that His great work could be displayed. When none of these works, which would have caused Sidon and Tyre to repent in ashes, worked with Israel, God had no choice but to give the sign of Jonah, making Gentiles the recipient of the Kingdom.

Sounds like the thief on the cross next to Jesus never managed to be with Jesus in Paradise after all. He didn't have the resources, or even the time, to finish.

The rich young ruler was taught that the Old Covenant was a pedagogos, protector, babysitter, till the real parents, Christ and the New Covenant could take over. All in the Old Covenant who observed the weightier points of the law, justice mercy and faithfulness went to paradise. But those in the Kingdom could be perfect, be complete, which is what Christ and the New Covenant promised. They could enter the Rest that Joshua never led into, because Canaan was the shadow of Christ. Obviously the thief only enjoyed the benefit of the Old Covenant.[/QUOTE]
 
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Strong in Him

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The text says A&S sold their property and laid half the proceeds at Peter's feet.

It also says that the problem wasn't money but that they lied to God - they claimed that what they gave the Apostles was ALL the money they had received for their property. If they'd just said, "this is half the money we received", they probably would have been fine. As Peter said, the money was theirs and they
could have done anything they chose with it - they chose to give a fraction and claim that it was the whole amount.
 
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It also says that the problem wasn't money but that they lied to God - they claimed that what they gave the Apostles was ALL the money they had received for their property. If they'd just said, "this is half the money we received", they probably would have been fine. As Peter said, the money was theirs and they
could have done anything they chose with it - they chose to give a fraction and claim that it was the whole amount.

This is the promise of the New Covenant, that if you place all your faith in God, repent, change your mind about needing to make provision for your own nourishment, security and well being, are born again with a different mind set, you will see the Kingdom of God, understand what it is, and if you act on your belief, you will ENTER the Kingdom of God, a blessing the Old Covenant could not give.

Galatians 2:21"I do not nullify the grace of God, for if righteousness comes through the Law, then Christ died needlessly."

God created a crisis??
God made sin and evil come into the world just so that he could rescue us from it?

No.

A crisis is a harmful situation. In Egypt, the harm was upon Pharaoh. In the wilderness, God led Israel into a desert, where she faced danger, with no visible sources of water or food. His intention was to show how Israel was to be a blessing to the world. She would lay down her life and pick it up, with God's help. Notice how Caleb reacted and how the rest of Israel reacted:

Numbers 14:24"But My servant Caleb, because he has had a different spirit and has followed Me fully, I will bring into the land which he entered, and his descendants shall take possession of it.

1 Corinthians 10:1For I do not want you to be ignorant of the fact, brothers and sisters, that our ancestors were all under the cloud and that they all passed through the sea. 2They were all baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea. 3They all ate the same spiritual food 4and drank the same spiritual drink; for they drank from the spiritual rock that accompanied them, and that rock was Christ. 5Nevertheless, God was not pleased with most of them; their bodies were scattered in the wilderness.
 
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Strong in Him

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This is the promise of the New Covenant, that if you place all your faith in God, repent, change your mind about needing to make provision for your own nourishment, security and well being, are born again with a different mind set, you will see the Kingdom of God, understand what it is, and if you act on your belief, you will ENTER the Kingdom of God, a blessing the Old Covenant could not give.

The NEW Covenant was prophesied in Jeremiah 31:31-34, brought in by Christ and sealed with his blood.
The NEW Covenant says that we can be reconciled to God, not by the blood of animals which had to be repeated many times, but by the blood of Christ who died once and for all. He was the Lamb of God who gave his life for the sin of the world, John 1:29, and the Good Shepherd who lay down his life for the sheep, John 10:11. Without blood there is no forgiveness of sin, Hebrews 9:22, and Jesus shed his blood for the forgiveness of sins, Matthew 26:28.
This is the gift of God - eternal life for all who accept Christ, Romans 6:23, and every spiritual blessing in him, Ephesians 1:3.

The story of Ananais and Sapphira does not speak of, or even mention covenant, ot matters relating to property. They lied to God - simples.

A crisis is a harmful situation.

No; a crisis is a stressful situation involving conflict.
cri·sis
(krī′sĭs)
n. pl. cri·ses (-sēz)
1. A crucial or decisive point or situation, especially a difficult or unstable situation involving an impending change.
2. A sudden change in the course of a disease or fever, toward either improvement or deterioration.
3. An emotionally stressful event or traumatic change in a person's life.
4. A point in a story or drama when a conflict reaches its highest tension and must be resolved.

In Egypt, the harm was upon Pharaoh.

Pharaoh suffered because he rejected Moses' plea to let the Israelite's go and worship God. He said that he didn't know their God, and would not release them.
Ultimately he rejected God - time after time he was told that god would cause x to happen if the Hebrew people were not released; time after time he refused, repented when the plague came, then changed his mind again when the danger was past. HE rejected God, and he brought harm upon himself and the nation.

In the wilderness, God led Israel into a desert, where she faced danger, with no visible sources of water or food.

Yes, they were led into the wilderness on their way to the Promised Land; that was the journey. After all that they had seen of the plagues in Egypt, they should have been able to trust in God for whatever they needed; instead, they grumbled and complained.

His intention was to show how Israel was to be a blessing to the world. She would lay down her life and pick it up, with God's help.

The text doesn't say that.
God rescued the nation from Egypt - as he prophesied through Jacob, Genesis 46:4, and Joseph, Genesis 50:24. He saved them from there, just as he had saved their lives from the famine by sending them there in the first place. Having rescued them, he led them to Mt Sinai where they would receive his law and covenant and instructions how to live as his people.

The journey through the wilderness could have taken only a short time; a few months, or maybe a couple of years. It took 40 years because, once again, the people didn't trust God. 10 of those sent out said that the Promised Land was full of enemies and danger; only 2 said that the Lord had promised it to them, they should trust him and that he would deliver and help them, Deuteronomy 1:20-36.

In each of these situations - with Pharaoh, and then with the nation - if they suffered "harm", it was because they rejected God or didn't trust in him. It was not God who caused that harm; people suffered because of their own attitudes or actions.
 
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Wordkeeper believes if you receive the Holy Spirit as the disciples did at Pentecost and speak in tongues , you may still not be in a saved state. A novel idea, even on the internet I have found.

?? I don't see how anyone can receive the Holy Spirit and not be saved. And I don't see how he can support that view from Scripture.
 
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