SDA

mmksparbud · Oct 6, 2018

LittleLambofJesus said:
OT and NT

Have a heart.................

Jeremiah 17:10
I Yahweh, searching heart, examining the affections/kidneys/ 03629 kilyah and giving to man ways of him, as fruit of his doings. [Revelation 2:23]

Acts 1:6 restore kingdom to Israel/10 kings One Mind Reve 17?

Heart/s<2588> used in 3 verses of Revelation

Revelation 2:23
And the offspring of Her I shall be killing in death,
and shall be knowing all the Assemblies that I AM the One searching kidneys/reins/nefrouV <3510> and hearts<2588>.
and I shall be giving to ye each according to the works of ye. [Jeremiah 17:10]

Revelation 17:
16 And the ten horns that you saw, and the beast, these will hate the Prostitute, and will make Her desolate and naked, and will eat Her flesh, and will burn Her with fire.
17 For God has put into their hearts to accomplish His purpose, and to do one purpose,
and to give their kingdom to the beast, until the words of God will be fulfilled.

Revelation 18:
7 So much as She has glorified herself and lived in luxury, give to Her as much torment and misery, because in Her heart She says, 'I sit as a Queen, and I am never a widow, and never shall I see mourning.'
9 And the kings of the earth, the ones having committed sexual immorality and having lived luxuriously with her, will weep and will wail for her when they see the smoke of Her burning,
10 standing from afar because of the fear of her torment, saying:

She who sits as queen, not widow, never mourns

.

OK--could you possibly put this in your own words now? I am not sure what God knowing my kidneys has to do with the beast of Rev! What us your interpretation of this beast?

1stcenturylady · Oct 6, 2018

mmksparbud said:
No--the Levitical laws were temporary, for Jesus is the Sacrificial Lamb. He fulfilled all the sacrificial laws. The 10 were never a part of that. Those laws were kept in the Ark---the law of Moses was kept outside the Ark. Even today, we still say when something is written in stone it is permanent. Those are the only ones God wrote with His own finger on stone. The others were dictated to Moses, not on stone.

But if the ministry of death, written and engraved on stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of the glory of his countenance, which glory was passing away, 8 how will the ministry of the Spirit not be more glorious? 9 For if the ministry of condemnation had glory, the ministry of righteousness exceeds much more in glory. 10 For even what was made glorious had no glory in this respect, because of the glory that excels. 11 For if what is passing away was glorious, what remains is much more glorious.

What is so hard to understand, that we have to show you verse after verse that the New Covenant supersedes the Old Covenant, and not just sacrifices, but the laws themselves.

The laws - the Ten Commandments - were to show us our sin, UNTIL Jesus was manifested to take away our SIN, and in Him there is no sin, for those who have the seed of the Holy Spirit indwelling them. Instead of the ministry of death, we have the ministry of the Spirit. They are NOT THE SAME.

LittleLambofJesus · Oct 6, 2018

mmksparbud said:
OK--could you possibly put this in your own words now? I am not sure what God knowing my kidneys has to do with the beast of Rev! What us your interpretation of this beast?

I am trying to look at it from the perspective concerning perhaps the 10 Northern tribes of Israel and the 3 Southern tribes of Judah [comprised of Judah, Levi and Benjamin]
Perhaps the beast from the Land is representing Israel and the Sea beast, Judah with Jerusalem/Judah as the Harlot the 10 kings are destroying.
It's the only way I see that makes scriptural sense.
Sounds kind of far fetched, but it's about as good as any other interpretation and uses scriptures.

Acts 1:
6 Then they gathered around Him and asked Him, “Lord! are you at this time going to restore the kingdom to Israel?”
7 Jesus replied, “It is not for you to know times or seasons that the Father has fixed by His own authority.

What caught my interest is, these 10 horns/kings have no Kingdom [Israel was divorced and sent away in the OT]

Revelation 17:12
And the ten horns which you perceived are ten Kings, who any a Kingdom not as yet received,
but authority as Kings one hour they are obtaining with the beast,

Daniel mentions a King of the North and South [don't ask me to get into Daniel here]:

Daniel 11:27
and the two Kings, heart of them to evil, and on a table one lie they shall speak, and not she shall prosper that further end to apointed time.

1 Kings 2 mentions them coming together

1 Kings 22:2
And he is becoming in year, the third, that Josephat King of Judah is going down to King of Israel
10 And king of Israel, and Jehoshaphat king of Judah one sitting man on throne of him having put on their robes, in a void place in the entrance of the gate of Samaria; and all the prophets prophesied before them.

klutedavid · Oct 6, 2018

mmksparbud said:
The Sabbath is not a shodow of things to come!!! You need to read the whole text---you only quoted Col 2:16 and did not post Col 2:17
Col 2:17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

The Jewish feasts were a shadow of things to come--not The Sabbath--there obviously were Jews in the crowd. It is your interpretation that is in serious trouble!!

The Colossians verses.

Paul is telling the Colossians, not to let anyone judge them over meaningless issues, food, feasts, new moons or Sabbaths.

The Colossians are not Jews, the Colossians never celebrated any Sabbaths, and that includes whatever Sabbaths you can name.

Paul is telling the Colossians to disregard the entire Jewish law. Do not accept the judgement of the Jews, that they needed to observe, feasts, new moons or even a Sabbath.

Your interpretation is not just incorrect, your interpretation is bizarre. If Paul meant Sabbath feast days, he would have written that. Paul did not say feast Sabbath days, so we read Sabbath days. Paul was the expert on this and Paul would not have confused the Colossians.

klutedavid · Oct 6, 2018

mmksparbud said:
No--He isn't. He is called the father of the Jews. He gave birth to Isaac, who had the 12 sons from which the 12 tribes came from.

He may have been the father of the Jews, but Abraham was never called a Jew. The name, 'Jew', came in to usage in the scripture much later.

mmksparbud · Oct 6, 2018

1stcenturylady said:
But if the ministry of death, written and engraved on stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of the glory of his countenance, which glory was passing away, 8 how will the ministry of the Spirit not be more glorious? 9 For if the ministry of condemnation had glory, the ministry of righteousness exceeds much more in glory. 10 For even what was made glorious had no glory in this respect, because of the glory that excels. 11 For if what is passing away was glorious, what remains is much more glorious.

What is so hard to understand, that we have to show you verse after verse that the New Covenant supersedes the Old Covenant, and not just sacrifices, but the laws themselves.

The laws - the Ten Commandments - were to show us our sin, UNTIL Jesus was manifested to take away our SIN, and in Him there is no sin, for those who have the seed of the Holy Spirit indwelling them. Instead of the ministry of death, we have the ministry of the Spirit. They are NOT THE SAME.

Of course there is a new covenant! I didn't say there isn't. I also said Jesus is the one that makes obedience of any kind possible. It is He living in us that does it. What you don't seem to understand is that whether they are written in the heart or not--and I know that they are written in the heart--they are to be kept. The difference is that now Jesus is workig through us to that end. But you can't break them, be unrepentant and say they were written in my heart--I just didn't keep them. Bottom line---one way or another---you can't unrepentantly break any of them and be in the presence of God.
If you wish to not keep the 4th as written, and prefer the 1st day --that is up to you. It is my preference to do as He says--it is written in my heart to do so.

LittleLambofJesus · Oct 6, 2018

I am now withdrawing from this thread. Enjoyed it.........
Any takers for this thread?

LUKE 21 MATTHEW 24 OLIVET DISCOURSE CONTROVERSY [Poll Thread]

mmksparbud · Oct 6, 2018

klutedavid said:
The Colossians verses.

Paul is telling the Colossians, not to let anyone judge them over meaningless issues, food, feasts, new moons or Sabbaths.

The Colossians are not Jews, the Colossians never celebrated any Sabbaths, and that includes whatever Sabbaths you can name.

Paul is telling the Colossians to disregard the entire Jewish law. Do not accept the judgement of the Jews, that they needed to observe, feasts, new moons or even a Sabbath.

Your interpretation is not just incorrect, your interpretation is bizarre. If Paul meant Sabbath feast days, he would have written that. Paul did not say feast Sabbath days, so we read Sabbath days. Paul was the expert on this and Paul would not have confused the Colossians.

Paul said exactly what he meant to say---sabbath days---plural--not THE SABBATH. There were Christians, freshly converted who felt that the Jewish feast days should still be kept, he said no. Just as there were those that felt circumcision was still needed--he said no. He absolutely did nit want the Colossians confused. Nor anybody else. Bottom line--The Sabbath was never a shadow of things to come back pointed back to creation and to God as the creator. The Colossians consisted of Jews and pagans.

mmksparbud · Oct 6, 2018

klutedavid said:
He may have been the father of the Jews, but Abraham was never called a Jew. The name, 'Jew', came in to usage in the scripture much later.

No kidding. Who'd have guessed. The first time that name is used is in Esther, Jeremiah and 2 Kings.

mmksparbud · Oct 6, 2018

LittleLambofJesus said:
I am trying to look at it from the perspective concerning perhaps the 10 Northern tribes of Israel and the 3 Southern tribes of Judah [comprised of Judah, Levi and Benjamin]
Perhaps the beast from the Land is representing Israel and the Sea beast, Judah with Jerusalem/Judah as the Harlot the 10 kings are destroying.
It's the only way I see that makes scriptural sense.
Sounds kind of far fetched, but it's about as good as any other interpretation and uses scriptures.

Acts 1:
6 Then they gathered around Him and asked Him, “Lord! are you at this time going to restore the kingdom to Israel?”
7 Jesus replied, “It is not for you to know times or seasons that the Father has fixed by His own authority.

What caught my interest is, these 10 horns/kings have no Kingdom [Israel was divorced and sent away in the OT]

Revelation 17:12
And the ten horns which you perceived are ten Kings, who any a Kingdom not as yet received,
but authority as Kings one hour they are obtaining with the beast,

Daniel mentions a King of the North and South [don't ask me to get into Daniel here]:

Daniel 11:27
and the two Kings, heart of them to evil, and on a table one lie they shall speak, and not she shall prosper that further end to apointed time.

1 Kings 2 mentions them coming together

1 Kings 22:2
And he is becoming in year, the third, that Josephat King of Judah is going down to King of Israel
10 And king of Israel, and Jehoshaphat king of Judah one sitting man on throne of him having put on their robes, in a void place in the entrance of the gate of Samaria; and all the prophets prophesied before them.

OK--I feel it is best to take Rev and Daniel together--the 10 horns being mentioned in both.
Dan_7:24 And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings.
These 2 are the same--

The Roman Empire was never conquered--there were 10 tribes of Europe from the east of Rome that decimated it. Three of those tribes disappeared. The remaining 10 tribes became 10 heads of Europe.

klutedavid · Oct 6, 2018

mmksparbud said:
Paul said exactly what he meant to say---sabbath days---plural--not THE SABBATH. There were Christians, freshly converted who felt that the Jewish feast days should still be kept, he said no. Just as there were those that felt circumcision was still needed--he said no. He absolutely did nit want the Colossians confused. Nor anybody else. Bottom line--The Sabbath was never a shadow of things to come back pointed back to creation and to God as the creator. The Colossians consisted of Jews and pagans.

The text certainly does not say, 'Jewish feast days', the text says, 'a Sabbath day'.

Your right that the Colossians had just become brand new Christians, and not Jews. Hence, Paul was warning them to avoid the Jewish teaching, which would most certainly arrive.

The Jewish teaching concerned, food laws, feasts, new moon observance, and above all, Sabbath days. Don't let the Jews tell you that you must start to become Jews.

stephen pollard · Oct 6, 2018

mmksparbud said:
--it is written in my heart to do so.

It is written in your heart to observe a set Saturday sabbath because you firstly read what is written in ink. It was not written in your heart prior to that

stephen pollard · Oct 6, 2018

1stcenturylady said:
In 2 Corinthians 3, the Ten Commandments were called the ministry of death, engraved on stone. Romans 7 refers to "thou shall not covet" one of the Ten to show that was "the law" referred to. And Romans 8:2 says the law of the Spirit of life in Christ, has freed me from the law of sin and death.

Jesus provides a much better way to be righteous. Not by using our own strength to obey lowest standard, bottom-line commandments, but the highest standard New Covenant commandments through the POWER of the Holy Spirit. Belief on Jesus and LOVE. The lower standard commandments are swallowed up in the NEW. Just as kindergarten is swallowed up in university.

The righteousness Jesus provides is faith in him. No one ever was or ever will be truly righteous by obeying the Ten Commandments, that law, as part of a law of righteousness in now ended. God puts the desire in believers hearts not to covet, steal, lie, commit adultery etc. For what is written in that law is holy, just and good, and what is holy, just and goods was not abolished. There is nothing legalistic about a believer not wanting to commit adultery in their heart. If only love God and love your neighbour were in your heart, if you stole something for example you could only be conscious you sinned by not loving as you should. I doubt any Christian would take that view
Believe on Jesus and love others will bring us to live in accordance with what is placed in our hearts by the power of the Holy Spirit, absolutely.

klutedavid · Oct 6, 2018

mmksparbud said:
No--He isn't. He is called the father of the Jews. He gave birth to Isaac, who had the 12 sons from which the 12 tribes came from.

JEW

According to the Book of Genesis, Judah (יְהוּדָה‬, Yehudah) was the name of the fourth son of the patriarch Jacob. During the Exodus, the name Jew was given to the Tribe of Judah, descended from the patriarch Judah.
(wikipedia)

Abraham was not a Jew.

mmksparbud · Oct 6, 2018

klutedavid said:
The text certainly does not say, 'Jewish feast days', the text says, 'a Sabbath day'.

Your right that the Colossians had just become brand new Christians, and not Jews. Hence, Paul was warning them to avoid the Jewish teaching, which would most certainly arrive.

The Jewish teaching concerned, food laws, feasts, new moon observance, and above all, Sabbath days. Don't let the Jews tell you that you must start to become Jews.

No--it doesn't--it says sabbath days. Which was the Jewish feast days.

klutedavid · Oct 6, 2018

mmksparbud said:
No--it doesn't--it says sabbath days. Which was the Jewish feast days.

This is not a day!

Lev_25:4 But in the seventh year shall be a sabbath of rest unto the land, a sabbath for the LORD: thou shalt neither sow thy field, nor prune thy vineyard.

mmksparbud · Oct 6, 2018

klutedavid said:
JEW

According to the Book of Genesis, Judah (יְהוּדָה‬, Yehudah) was the name of the fourth son of the patriarch Jacob. During the Exodus, the name Jew was given to the Tribe of Judah, descended from the patriarch Judah.
(wikipedia)

And how many times do I have to say that I know that??!!! From the very first post that you quoted I said there were no Jews till Abraham--I only meant because he was the father of the Jews--I know there were no Jews until Isaac had his 12 sons and that is was because of Judah!!!
Abraham was not a Jew--He was the father of them and the Jews and Muslims still claim him a their father. And before you start in on that one---He wasn't Muslim either!!!

klutedavid · Oct 6, 2018

mmksparbud said:
No--it doesn't--it says sabbath days. Which was the Jewish feast days.

You can't do that, covert 'a Sabbath day' into Jewish feast days. A Sabbath day is simply any Sabbath day no matter when it occurs.

Once again, the Colossians became Christians, the Colossians did not become Jews.

mmksparbud · Oct 6, 2018

klutedavid said:
This is not a day!

Lev_25:4 But in the seventh year shall be a sabbath of rest unto the land, a sabbath for the LORD: thou shalt neither sow thy field, nor prune thy vineyard.

No--it is a sabbath year----which is a shadow of things to come---6,000 years and then 1,000 years in which the earth will rest during the millennium.

klutedavid · Oct 6, 2018

mmksparbud said:
No--it is a sabbath year----which is a shadow of things to come---6,000 years and then 1,000 years in which the earth will rest during the millennium.

But Paul says 'a Sabbath day' in the letter to the Colossians. Paul does not say Sabbath feast years or Sabbath feast days.

Just read the text, because you will be examined on the text. You will not be examined on SDA literature.

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