Christians don't need to worry about Mark of the Beast?

HTacianas · Sep 28, 2018

JohnB445 said:
Because its going to happen after the rapture?

But why are we warned about it then?

How about: There is no such thing as the rapture.

Dave L · Sep 28, 2018

LastSeven said:
Dave, every time I see your picture I think I'm looking at David Hasselhoff.

That's an old picture, I look more like Randy Quaid (cousin Eddy) according to the gals at the BMV. Buzz cut and all........

timewerx · Sep 28, 2018

JohnB445 said:
Because its going to happen after the rapture?

But why are we warned about it then?

It already happened. It's simply the plain 'ol money. Mark=engraving on a coin. Money on the hand (possesed money), money on the mind / always thinking or worrying about money (forehead).

Jesus also warned about money as the counter-nature of the good Father - you cannot serve both (neither can you love one more than the other....) You can only love one but hate the other (Luke 16:13).

St. John again said love of the things of this world (which includes money) shows a lack of love of the Father - 1 John 2:15-17.

Therefore, if you don't love the Father because of love of money, they you cannot love Christ also. You will hate both the Father and the Christ if you love money. You will be like the AntiChrist.

What about the "God" and the "Christ" who "says" it's okay to feel good or even like money? - this is the counterfeit god and christ of the false religion as preach The false prophet / The AntiChrist who made you worship this false god.

And finally, you cannot buy or sell without money. And that's it. The problem is way way worse than we think.

StephenDiscipleofYHWH · Sep 28, 2018

JohnB445 said:
Because its going to happen after the rapture?

But why are we warned about it then?

1. We are told that in the time of the tribulation we all must flee(Luke 17:29,31; Mark 13:15-19; Matt 24:16-21,38-39; Luke 21:21-22)
2. For these days will be days of great affliction(Luke 21:20-24;Mark 13:19; Matt 24:20-21) and persecution(Matt 24:9; Mark 13:9,11,Luke 21:12-15) Even by those of your own household(Mark 12:12; Matt 24:10; Luke 21:16)
3. That except these days be shortened no flesh(including the flesh of the saints) would survive(Matt 24:22; Mark 13:20)
4. We will be killed all the day long for the Lord's namesake(Luke 21:23-24;Romans 8:36; Revelation 12:11; Matt 24:33; Revelation 13:10,15)
5. But we that endure such things until the end(even until death) will be saved(Mark 13:13; Matt 24:13).
6. It will be a time where only those who are watchful and waiting for the Lord will survive(Luke 21:29-31,34-36; Luke 17:27,29,30-32; Mark 13:28-29,32-37; Matt 24:32-33, 36-39, 42-47)
7. And those who do not prepare themselves will be cut asunder and be killed(Matt 24:40-41, 48-51; Luke 17:34-36)
8. For the Lord will look for these untrue servants(Matt 24:48-51) these are the people who the apostles inquired of(Luke 17:37).
9. The Lord said that the bodies of these people will be found wherever the eagles are gathered(Luke 17:37; Matt 24:28). The word used for eagles here refers to birds that devour dead flesh showing those who are taken are not whisked away into the heavens by God, but killed.
10. Only at the Lord's coming are the elect of the Lord(that yet live) gathered up from about the world to him in the last/second resurrection(Mark 13:25-27;

_______________________________________________________________________

As to the rapture we are told that there are only two resurrections(times people are taken to heaven/judged by God), and both of them are shown as follows.

1. The first fruits/First resurrection of the Righteous dead: those who are the Firstfruits of the Lord(those of the first resurrection) are those who died for the Lord, those spoken of in revelation 20:1-7. Those to whom thrones and judgment are given to, they are also those who cried under the alter to the lord(Revelation 6:9-11). They are the first fruits of the Lord. Risen before any of the living(1 Thess 4:13-16; 1 Cor 15:12-13,20-21,23) except for Christ who rose from the dead(1 Cor 15:20). Every man is risen in their own order(1 Cor 15:23) first the dead in Christ(1 Thess 4:15-16).

2. And in the second resurrection(second fruits are those righteous living, and those who died in Christ after the first resurrection). This is at his coming, at the destruction of the world by fire(1 Cor 15:23,51-52; 1 Thess 4:17; Revelation 20:11-15, Luke 21:27-28).

Jerusalem will be taken (Zech 14:1-2, Isaiah 13:16; Luke 22:20-21) this is the sign that we must flee, for the end is nigh at hand. The second resurrection of the living, rest of the dead, and the wicked does not take place until the last moments of this world, it is the time heavens and the earth are destroyed by fire((Matthew 24:29-31; Micha 1:3-4; Isaiah 66:15-17,26:21,2:9; Zephaniah 1:18,2:22,3:8,1:2-3; Haggi 2:6-7; Malichi 4:1; Joel 2:10,31; Hosea 10:8; 1 Thess 1:7-9,2; 2 Peter 3:10; Revelation 6:12-17; Revelation 20:9) at the Lords coming, that this resurrection takes place(Revelation 20:9-15; 2 Peter 3:10)

As shown in the above study we can see that there is no rapture. The idea of a rapture does not come from, and cannot be shown from, the word of God. Instead we are told that we(the righteous of God) will suffer and must endure until the end.

ItIsFinished! · Sep 28, 2018

JohnB445 said:
Sorry, I took your post the wrong way.

But yes, I can tell you my spirit is telling me there will be believers during the mark of the beast.

I hope its correct. Its sometimes hard to tell if its my mind telling me or my spirit.

LastSeven said:
Take the rapture out of the equation and things will make more sense.

Actually take the concept of the rapture out and you are left with much confusion.
God is not the author of confusion.

LastSeven · Sep 28, 2018

JohnB445 said:
I don't necessarily feel comfortable sharing this but I feel I should. I don't 100% know if this is all in my head or if this was God's answer in my prayer. The answer has always been by thought.

I did already know about the characteristics of the mark of the beast so it may have been influenced by my own thinking.

I was curious and prayed what my final fate would be, immediately I thought persecution, and being murdered. I was in shock, I didn't believe this was from God, I decided to read about the mark of the beast and it wasn't pleasant reading about it, I heard about a teaching about a rapture before this happens and I was hoping for it to be true. But the rapture before mark of the beast just didn't make any sense to me.

I pray for a different fate and I get no answer. I prayed again what my fate really is, and my mind is blank. Maybe the Lord doesn't want me to know, or already told me.

I agree that you should be very careful in terms of what you attribute these thoughts to. In my own experience I've seen how over the years my thoughts have changed. What I used to believe was "a direct revelation from God", I now see was no such thing. You're right to say that your existing beliefs influence your thoughts and of course also dreams.

Jeremiah 17:9
The human mind is the most deceitful of all things. It is incurable. No one can understand how deceitful it is.

LastSeven · Sep 28, 2018

ItIsFinished! said:
Actually take the concept of the rapture out and you are left with much confusion.
God is not the author of confusion.

On the contrary. The rapture doctrine can not be reconciled with all of scripture, which is why there's so much debate around the timing of it. Just take out the trash.

ItIsFinished! · Sep 28, 2018

LastSeven said:
On the contrary. The rapture doctrine can not be reconciled with all of scripture, which is why there's so much debate around the timing of it. Just take out the trash.

StephenDiscipleofYHWH said:
1. We are told that in the time of the tribulation we all must flee(Luke 17:29,31; Mark 13:15-19; Matt 24:16-21,38-39; Luke 21:21-22)
2. For these days will be days of great affliction(Luke 21:20-24;Mark 13:19; Matt 24:20-21) and persecution(Matt 24:9; Mark 13:9,11,Luke 21:12-15) Even by those of your own household(Mark 12:12; Matt 24:10; Luke 21:16)
3. That except these days be shortened no flesh(including the flesh of the saints) would survive(Matt 24:22; Mark 13:20)
4. We will be killed all the day long for the Lord's namesake(Luke 21:23-24;Romans 8:36; Revelation 12:11; Matt 24:33; Revelation 13:10,15)
5. But we that endure such things until the end(even until death) will be saved(Mark 13:13; Matt 24:13).
6. It will be a time where only those who are watchful and waiting for the Lord will survive(Luke 21:29-31,34-36; Luke 17:27,29,30-32; Mark 13:28-29,32-37; Matt 24:32-33, 36-39, 42-47)
7. And those who do not prepare themselves will be cut asunder and be killed(Matt 24:40-41, 48-51; Luke 17:34-36)
8. For the Lord will look for these untrue servants(Matt 24:48-51) these are the people who the apostles inquired of(Luke 17:37).
9. The Lord said that the bodies of these people will be found wherever the eagles are gathered(Luke 17:37; Matt 24:28). The word used for eagles here refers to birds that devour dead flesh showing those who are taken are not whisked away into the heavens by God, but killed.
10. Only at the Lord's coming are the elect of the Lord(that yet live) gathered up from about the world to him in the last/second resurrection(Mark 13:25-27;

_______________________________________________________________________

As to the rapture we are told that there are only two resurrections(times people are taken to heaven/judged by God), and both of them are shown as follows.

1. The first fruits/First resurrection of the Righteous dead: Revelation 14:7-11 shows us that the Harvest of the ripe fruit comes after the mark has been put into place. Reading Revelation 14:4 we see that those who are the Firstfruits of the Lord(those of the first resurrection) are those 144 thousand who died for the Lord, those spoken of in revelation 20:1-7. Those to whom thrones and judgment are given to, they are also those spoken of in Revelation 7:4, who cried under the alter to the lord(Revelation 6:9-11). They are the first fruits of the Lord. Risen before any of the living(1 Thess 4:13-16; 1 Cor 15:12-13,20-21,23) except for Christ who rose from the dead(1 Cor 15:20). Every man is risen in their own order(1 Cor 15:23) first the dead in Christ(1 Thess 4:15-16).

2. And in the second resurrection(second fruits are those righteous living, and those who died in Christ after the first resurrection). This is at his coming, at the destruction of the world by fire(1 Cor 15:23,51-52; 1 Thess 4:17; Revelation 20:11-15, Luke 21:27-28).

Jerusalem will be taken (Zech 14:1-2, Isaiah 13:16; Luke 22:20-21) this is the sign that we must flee, for the end is nigh at hand. The second resurrection of the living, rest of the dead, and the wicked does not take place until the last moments of this world, it is the time heavens and the earth are destroyed by fire((Matthew 24:29-31; Micha 1:3-4; Isaiah 66:15-17,26:21,2:9; Zephaniah 1:18,2:22,3:8,1:2-3; Haggi 2:6-7; Malichi 4:1; Joel 2:10,31; Hosea 10:8; 1 Thess 1:7-9,2; 2 Peter 3:10; Revelation 6:12-17; Revelation 20:9) at the Lords coming, that this resurrection takes place(Revelation 20:9-15; 2 Peter 3:10)

As shown in the above study we can see that there is no rapture. The idea of a rapture does not come from, and cannot be shown from, the word of God. Instead we are told that we(the righteous of God) will suffer and must endure until the end.

You mean from your stated study and opinion there is no rapture.
I and many , many others disagree.
Why?
Because The Word of God clearly presents the concept of the rapture without much complexities .
A mystery now revealed as Paul stated in
First Corinthians 15:51-52.

parousia70 · Sep 28, 2018

Nicolaus Mourer said:
Eh, I don't buy that interpretation at all. The very fact that the same language is used in a plethora of places all over the Bible seems to me that God is telling us that what is described is completely literal.

After David Defeated Saul and His armies, he described the battle this way:

(2 Samuel 22:8-16)

8“Then the earth shook and trembled;
The foundations of heaven quaked and were shaken,
Because He was angry.
9 Smoke went up from His nostrils,
And devouring fire from His mouth;
Coals were kindled by it.
10 He bowed the heavens also, and came down
With darkness under His feet.
11 He rode upon a cherub, and flew;
And He was seen upon the wings of the wind.
12 He made darkness canopies around Him,
Dark waters and thick clouds of the skies.
13 From the brightness before Him
Coals of fire were kindled.

14 “The Lord thundered from heaven,
And the Most High uttered His voice.
15 He sent out arrows and scattered them;
Lightning bolts, and He vanquished them.
16 Then the channels of the sea were seen,
The foundations of the world were uncovered,
At the rebuke of the Lord,
At the blast of the breath of His nostrils.

Boy, God sure was a huffin and a puffin right there wasn't He?

Bowing the heavens, starting fires with his nostrils, shooting arrows, actually seen riding on Clouds and Cherubs, shaking the heavens and laying the foundation of the entire earth bare.

Since you have stated that this language MUST be Literal, where is the physical evidence of this global catastrophe happening at that time?

Call me Nic · Sep 28, 2018

parousia70 said:
After David Defeated Saul and His armies, he described the battle this way:

(2 Samuel 22:8-16)

8“Then the earth shook and trembled;
The foundations of heaven quaked and were shaken,
Because He was angry.
9 Smoke went up from His nostrils,
And devouring fire from His mouth;
Coals were kindled by it.
10 He bowed the heavens also, and came down
With darkness under His feet.
11 He rode upon a cherub, and flew;
And He was seen upon the wings of the wind.
12 He made darkness canopies around Him,
Dark waters and thick clouds of the skies.
13 From the brightness before Him
Coals of fire were kindled.

14 “The Lord thundered from heaven,
And the Most High uttered His voice.
15 He sent out arrows and scattered them;
Lightning bolts, and He vanquished them.
16 Then the channels of the sea were seen,
The foundations of the world were uncovered,
At the rebuke of the Lord,
At the blast of the breath of His nostrils.

Boy, God sure was a huffin and a puffin right there wasn't He?

Bowing the heavens, starting fires with his nostrils, shooting arrows, actually seen riding on Clouds and Cherubs, shaking the heavens and laying the foundation of the entire earth bare.

Since you have stated that this language MUST be Literal, where is the physical evidence of this global catastrophe happening at that time?

David was a prophet, and many of the psalms he wrote were prophetic in nature whilst being written about an event in David's life, such as Psalm 22 and many others.

iamlamad · Sep 28, 2018

1am3laine said:
There is NO pretrib rapture. 2 Thessalonians 2:3-4
The Antichrist comes after a great falling away which means people leaving Christianity in mass numbers.

These links below can help
The Secrets of The Gospel: Has the falling away begun? Blasphemous Tweets
The Secrets of The Gospel: Matt 24:4-15 = 2 thess 2 :3-4
The Secrets of The Gospel: The 666?
The Secrets of The Gospel: GPS Microchip in the works?

Actually, there is NO significant "falling away." That is a poor translation.
What there IS is a very significant departing or catching away as the restraining is taken out of the way so the man of sin can be revealed.

The truth has always been, when one falls away, two come in. The church is growing, not getting smaller!

keras · Sep 28, 2018

Nicolaus Mourer said:
David was a prophet, and many of the psalms he wrote were prophetic in nature whilst being written about an event in David's life, such as Psalm 22 and many others.

I totally agree with you.
Those cosmic events did not happen in ancient times. David was prophesying about a future time, still to happen, when those things will literally happen. It will be the Sixth Seal worldwide disaster, that will change the world as we know it, setting the scene for all that must happen before Jesus Returns.

Re the 'falling away' of Christians.
That will happen just before the last seven years of this Church era. When the leader of the One World Govt comes to Beulah, the new Christian nation in all of the holy Land, Isaiah 62:1-5, he will convince many of them, Daniel 9:27, to agree to a 7 year peace treaty.
This divides the Christians into two groups. We see them in Daniel 11:32 and in Revelation 12:6-17

Mantishand · Sep 28, 2018

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ItIsFinished! · Sep 28, 2018

Mantishand said:
The way I read it is Jesus comes after/during/before(not sure) a world shattering event, scoops up 144,000 people and then scat hits the fan. Later in the book it talks about the people with the seal of God in their forehead have to endure until the end. This is before Jesus has come back to reign. So I think 144,00 people escape the tribulation, thats it.

100% wrong.
1. The rapture of past and present believers in Christ Jesus must not be confused with the second coming of Jesus Christ.

2. The rapture occurs before the 7 year tribulation.

3. The 144,000 that you speak of are Jews.
12,000 taken from every tribe of the "sons of Israel. "
They will be "sealed" divinely protected to evangelize the post rapture world.

The only ones who escape (if you will) is the Church, the bride of Christ.
The Church= those who have accepted the forgiveness of their sins by the redemptive work of Jesus Christ on the Cross and His precious shed blood by faith through God's amazing grace.

That being said, there will be multitudes of believers that place their faith in Christ during the 7 year tribulation and will have to endure it.

He which testifieth these things saith , Surely I come quickly. Amen.
Even so , come, Lord Jesus.
⚘

All glory be to God now and forever!
Amen.

Mantishand · Sep 28, 2018

ItIsFinished! said:
100% wrong.
1. The rapture of past and present believers in Christ Jesus must not be confused with the second coming of Jesus Christ.

2. The rapture occurs before the 7 year tribulation.

3. The 144,000 that you speak of are Jews.
12,000 taken from every tribe of the "sons of Israel. "
They will be "sealed" divinely protected to evangelize the post rapture world.

The only ones who escape (if you will) is the Church, the bride of Christ.
The Church= those who have accepted the forgiveness of their sins by the redemptive work of Jesus Christ on the Cross and His precious shed blood by faith through God's amazing grace.

That being said, there will be multitudes of believers that place their faith in Christ during the 7 year tribulation and will have to endure it.

He which testifieth these things saith , Surely I come quickly. Amen.
Even so , come, Lord Jesus.
⚘

All glory be to God now and forever!
Amen.

-----

ItIsFinished! · Sep 28, 2018

Mantishand said:
Ok so I thought the 144,000 was the rapture. Can you show me in there where the rapture is?

I can , but first the 144,000 thousand needs to be cleared up.
This should help.

Rev. 7:4
And I heard the number of them which were sealed:
and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.

No one knows (except God) how many believers will be raptured before the 7 year tribulation.
These 144,000 will be evangelizing the post rapture world.

It will consist of the dead in Christ first then all living believers.
The "Church" will be gone during the 7 year tribulation, but multitudes will receive salvation through Jesus Christ during this time.

ItIsFinished! · Sep 28, 2018

The last paragraph is in regards to the pre-tribulation rapture as to who will be raptured.

Mantishand · Sep 28, 2018

ItIsFinished! said:
The last paragraph is in regards to the pre-tribulation rapture as to who will be raptured.

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ItIsFinished! · Sep 28, 2018

Mantishand said:
Is there a verse or scripture that talks about the rapture? I have read revelation many times and every time it seems is different lol. The 144,000 I thought was the rapture. 144,00 from each tribe, virgins.

The Book of Revelation is a controversial book to say the least . Ones approach towards it plays a big part of how one interprets it. (Another discussion in itself)
Just like the concept (which the Scriptures clearly teach) of the rapture.

Please read the following passages.
First Thessalonians 4:13-18 in regards to the rapture.

Please be advised the concept of the rapture is one if not the one of the most controversial topics within the church today .

StephenDiscipleofYHWH · Sep 28, 2018

ItIsFinished! said:
You mean from your stated study and opinion there is no rapture.
I and many , many others disagree.
Why?
Because The Word of God clearly presents the concept of the rapture without much complexities .
A mystery now revealed as Paul stated in
First Corinthians 15:51-52.

This is at the last trump, read on
51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

This time is shown to be at the time of Christs return shown here
Revelation 20:9-11
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.

2 Peter 3:10-12
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

The dead in Christ will rise first, then afterward at the last trump the rest of the living and the dead will be risen. Every man in his own order.
1 Thess 4:16-17
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

1 Cor 15:23
23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

Christians don't need to worry about Mark of the Beast?

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