The Holy Spirit did not "come into" Jesus at his baptism - he make have re-filled him, strengthened him for his earthly ministry, but He was already present.
This is simply incorrect.
The Bible says that the Holy Spirit descended bodily, as a dove, upon Jesus. Luke 3:22 In that one moment we have the entirety of God present at the baptism of Jesus. The fact that Jesus was who He was even before His baptism is my point. Jesus, the Word made flesh, contains within Himself the fullness of the Godhead. Yet it was through the power of the Holy Spirit that Jesus did His works. And His first miracle, indeed His earthly ministry, did not come about until after the Holy Spirit descended upon Him. Until born of water and spirit, and it is this way for us - whose names were already in the Book of Life from the creation of the world.
Nonetheless, Jesus returned the Spirit on the cross: "Father, into your hands I commit my Spirit." Luke 23:46
Satan is the devil - another name for Lucifer. Satan is not eternal, he was created to be a good angel.
Judas Iscariot was a man, and certainly not eternal.
This has nothing to do with anything. It's not at all necessary for Satan to be eternal for Judas to have been Satan. And as far as I know, Satan's origin as an angel has nothing to do with this either.
Yes, Jesus called him a devil. That doesn't mean that Judas was Satan himself - do you really think Jesus would have chosen Satan to be one of his closest disciples? When Scripture says that Jesus taught the 12, that included Judas. When Jesus sent the 12 out to drive out demons,
Luke 9:1-6, that included Judas. Jesus said that Satan cannot drive out Satan,
Mark 3:23-26 - so how can Judas have gone out casting out himself?
Jesus Himself called Judas a devil. A devil is a fallen angel. Satan is one of many fallen angels, as you yourself pointed out. You ask why Jesus would choose Satan to be a disciple, but it was Jesus who acknowledged this very thing. in John 6:70.
Is there reason why Jesus wouldn't pick Satan, but would, in fact, pick one who would be filled with Satan - even to the point of identifying him as a devil
before Satan had entered him? The handing over of Jesus - this was Judas' purpose. It was why Judas was in the world. To serve this purpose.
Dipping bread was how they ate; doubt it's got anything to do with baptism.
I said it was symbolic. The going down and coming up. It was when the sop had been dipped that Satan filled Judas - and Judas, the son of perdition, accomplished what he was put on this earth to do.
No, Jesus was in fact incredibly strong. He arranged the time that he would go to Jerusalem, he had predicted his death and resurrection, he knew that he would be handed over to be arrested and what would happen to him afterwards. He did not run away from any of that. He even told Judas to do what he had to do - Judas, who was invited to the Last Supper. Jesus could have said, "Judas, I know you'll betray me, so you're not invited"; but he didn't.
As a human being, Jesus didn't want to suffer pain and was distressed as the time got closer. That doesn't make him weak.
Jesus was at His weakest in the Garden. It is a theme of Satan to attack at one when they are at their weakest. This is why Jesus told His disciples to pray. Matthew 26:41
"Watch and pray, that ye enter not into temptation: the spirit indeed
is willing, but the flesh
is weak."
Notice the comma between "Watch and pray" and "that". Jesus is saying that it is by prayer, by drawing close to God, that we can avoid giving in to temptation when it arises.
Jesus was praying and sweating great drops. He said, "My soul is overwhelmed with sorrow even to the point of death." Matthew 26:38 This is when Satan knew it was time.
Notice Jesus said, "When I was daily with you in the temple, ye stretched forth no hands against me..." Luke 22:53 Satan could've taken Him at any time.
It is much easier to understand when you realize that Satan did NOT want Jesus to go the cross. GOD WILL WAS FOR JESUS to go to the cross and Satan is EVER AGAINST God's will. This was no exception. Satan chose this time, hoping Jesus to RESIST.
Strange how you know so much about the mind, and motives, of Satan.
Jesus also knew. This is the kind of knowledge that comes from being assaulted continually and without rest. You get to where you can almost smell it.
So Satan - who you say was Judas remember - repented? Wow!!
The Word of God says that it was when Judas (who had Satan inside himself) saw that Jesus now stood condemned that he repented himself - that is to say, he regretted his actions. Matthew 27:3 Ever against God's will to the bitter end.
Re read what you've written and think about it.
"Satan hung himself"?
Therefore, Satan is dead!
The early church could not have driven out demons. Paul didn't need to teach about spiritual warfare and there is no evil at all in the world today!!
Satan's vessel died bodily. The Bible says that the Beast - the antichrist - which goes into perdition will ascend out of the bottomless pit. It states that this Beast was alive, and at this time is no longer alive, but will ascend out of the bottomless pit and go unto perdition. Rev 17:8
Jesus defeated Satan on the cross.
Indeed. Jesus' death and Resurrection defeated sin and death. It is without power over those who are in Christ. Rev 20:6
If Satan had left, Jesus, who knew all things, would not have needed to go to the cross at all - he could have just said, "wait a day, then Satan (the devil) will kill himself and it will all be over."
Jesus was being tempted even on the cross - Satan wanted him to be rescued, then he would have failed in his mission, sinned and Satan would not have been defeated.
I encourage you to become more familiar with God's Word. Without respect to what I propose in this thread, the fact that you consider the above as a valid rebuttal suggests a lack of familiarity.
Er, no.
The Holy Spirit is mentioned occasionally in the OT.
Jesus was conceived by, and filled with, the Holy Spirit, Luke 1:35; Mark 1:10. He was led by the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted by Satan, Luke 4:1-2.When Jesus cast out demons, they HAD to leave - God was ordering them to. Jesus cast out demons in the power of the Spirit. Mark says that Jesus was casting out demons before he appointed his 12 disciples.
All the time Jesus was ministering to people, the Holy Spirit was present. Satan was in the presence of the Spirit for at least 3 years - it was a bit late to "skip town" by then. Pentecost was the time that the Spirit was poured out on all people - not the time when he first "showed up".
He was led into the wilderness to be tempted IMMEDIATELY after His baptism.
Jesus said, "Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you." John 16:7
Therefore the Holy Spirit had NOT YET been poured out. The disciples were not yet partakers of the Holy Spirit. The radical change in Peter from before Pentecost to after Pentecost illustrates this point better than I could.
See it that way if you wish. But it's strange that Jesus chose the "son of hell" to be his disciple, see and perform miracles and drive out demons.
The Bible never explicitly states that Judas himself drove out demons, nor perform miracles. Remember what Jesus said about "a Kingdom divided"? Matthew 12:25 The same Jesus who spoke those words called Judas a devil. I hardly think Judas was casting out devils.
As Judas Iscariot IS dead, yet the devil (Satan) is active in the world, that argument sort of falls at the first hurdle.
As of the writing of the Book of Revelation, the Antichrist, the Beast, was already dead. As for my "argument" falling at the first hurdle. I do not agree. I do not feel that it is my argument. I believe the Bible teaches this. By careful application of scripture and the searching out of God's Word, the man of sin is already revealed.
I encourage anyone to read carefully the original post again. The case pretty much makes itself and harmonizes with the Word of God. The son of perdition is the son of perdition. A devil. The Lord spoke it.
Think about something. Of all the people in the history of the world, only one man had his hand in the cup with our Lord Jesus Christ. Matthew 26:23 Just really think about that, as if an image frozen for all time. It doesn't prove anything in and of itself but it seems very appropriate.
