Behold, I come as a thief!

Davy said:

I don't apply the year-for-a-day idea outside of the Scripture where it was given. Doing that is confusion. Thus the three and a half days in Rev.11 means literally three and one-half days, not years.

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You assumed with never checking that I figured a year for a day to the three and a half days in Revelation. You just assume wrongly, and make argument that doesn't apply at all. If you really didn't know, the right thing would have been to ask. There are phrases like one thousand two hundred and sixty days in places like Rev 12:6

You just can't know. Everone is going to be surprised with what is really going to happen.

FredVB said:

You assumed with never checking that I figured a year for a day to the three and a half days in Revelation. You just assume wrongly, and make argument that doesn't apply at all. If you really didn't know, the right thing would have been to ask. There are phrases like one thousand two hundred and sixty days in places like Rev 12:6

You just can't know. Everone is going to be surprised with what is really going to happen.

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I don't have to assume. In Scripture where God emphatically gives a day = a year to figure a prophetic time, that's how it is, for THAT particular prophecy. Where He did not give that, it is NOT to be applied, period. Ezekiel 4 and Numbers 14 are the only two places in God's Word where He gave that kind of reckoning of day = year.

But some man who thought to do his own thing, which God did not give His Word to in understanding, no doubt thought he'd come up with some new formula no one else yet had, and it would bring him fame and money. Thus the day = year idea applied to Scripture where God did not... give it. Now if you want to follow those charlatans, then have a good trip.

Davy said:

I don't have to assume. In Scripture where God emphatically gives a day = a year to figure a prophetic time, that's how it is, for THAT particular prophecy. Where He did not give that, it is NOT to be applied, period. Ezekiel 4 and Numbers 14 are the only two places in God's Word where He gave that kind of reckoning of day = year.

But some man who thought to do his own thing, which God did not give His Word to in understanding, no doubt thought he'd come up with some new formula no one else yet had, and it would bring him fame and money. Thus the day = year idea applied to Scripture where God did not... give it. Now if you want to follow those charlatans, then have a good trip.

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Unbelievable! I showed my logic, and you don't even check. It wasn't that

Davy said:

I don't apply the year-for-a-day idea outside of the Scripture where it was given. Doing that is confusion. Thus the three and a half days in Rev.11 means literally three and one-half days, not years.

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Of course I and most of the body of Christ on earth will disagree. We must take these verses in context. In context, this is a sister verse to 12:6 about the "woman" (those living in Judea) that will flee out into the wilderness.

Verse 14 just gives us more information about their fleeing. God will once again feed people supernaturally. It will be again as it was during the Exodus, where Moses wrote, "how I bare you on eagles' wings." Both verses also have "wilderness." In one verse it is for 1260 days, and in the other verse it is for time, times and half of time, which then links this verse to Daniel where he accounted time in the same way.

In total, God have us 7 different verses about the time of the last half of the week, some given in days, some in months, and some in years ("time" equals one year). However, all of these are for the last half of the 70th week of Daniel.

sdowney717 said:

When He returns, and He returns only a second time, He is bringing the dead in Christ with Him as well as the angels of God.
All of heaven, those in heaven, participate in the second coming of Christ together with the Lord.

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This is not really true; He will come the 2nd time FOR His saints, and the third time WITH His saints. His second coming FOR His saints will be right when Paul tells us: a moment before the start of the Day of the Lord: so a moment before the 6th seal. It was no mistake that John saw the raptured church in heaven right after - in chapter 7: the huge crowd too large to number.

iamlamad said:

This is not really true; He will come the 2nd time FOR His saints, and the third time WITH His saints. His second coming FOR His saints will be right when Paul tells us: a moment before the start of the Day of the Lord: so a moment before the 6th seal. It was no mistake that John saw the raptured church in heaven right after - in chapter 7: the huge crowd too large to number.

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So Jesus comes three times?!!
According to scripture, Jesus only comes again, a second time.

sdowney717 said:

So Jesus comes three times?!!
According to scripture, Jesus only comes again, a second time.

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Not true: Paul tells us of a coming FOR His saints before the DAY. Matthew 24 and Rev. 19 show us a third coming, but this time all the way to the ground.

FredVB said:

You assumed with never checking that I figured a year for a day to the three and a half days in Revelation. You just assume wrongly, and make argument that doesn't apply at all. If you really didn't know, the right thing would have been to ask. There are phrases like one thousand two hundred and sixty days in places like Rev 12:6.

Click to expand...

Davy said:

I don't have to assume. In Scripture where God emphatically gives a day = a year to figure a prophetic time, that's how it is, for THAT particular prophecy. Where He did not give that, it is NOT to be applied, period. Ezekiel 4 and Numbers 14 are the only two places in God's Word where He gave that kind of reckoning of day = year.

But some man who thought to do his own thing, which God did not give His Word to in understanding, no doubt thought he'd come up with some new formula no one else yet had, and it would bring him fame and money. Thus the day = year idea applied to Scripture where God did not... give it. Now if you want to follow those charlatans, then have a good trip.

Click to expand...

FredVB said:

Unbelievable! I showed my logic, and you don't even check.

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I still don't know how it wasn't understood that I mean three and a half years is figured from the phrase used of one thousand two hundred and sixty days. It is an approximation of three and a half years, with several days difference, with using three hundred sixty days for a year. I never say the three and a half days the two prophets are prophesied to lie dead in the street is representing three and a half years, because I don't believe that.

I do believe that believers will be here seeing great problems to this earth well before the prophesied time of great tribulation, such that will be coming from contribution to worsening conditions in this world. Believers will be disappointed and rightly so with thinking they can continue doing as they are doing with any contribution to worsening effects in this world, with species extinction, loss of so many natural environments, horrible suffering of so many animals, growing deprivation and starvation among people, and the issue of the climate, and be taken out from this world to be with Christ and never see anything of those negative consequences while others would.

FredVB said:

I still don't know how it wasn't understood that I mean three and a half years is figured from the phrase used of one thousand two hundred and sixty days. It is an approximation of three and a half years, with several days difference, with using three hundred sixty days for a year. I never say the three and a half days the two prophets are prophesied to lie dead in the street is representing three and a half years, because I don't believe that.

I do believe that believers will be here seeing great problems to this earth well before the prophesied time of great tribulation, such that will be coming from contribution to worsening conditions in this world. Believers will be disappointed and rightly so with thinking they can continue doing as they are doing with any contribution to worsening effects in this world, with species extinction, loss of so many natural environments, horrible suffering of so many animals, growing deprivation and starvation among people, and the issue of the climate, and be taken out from this world to be with Christ and never see anything of those negative consequences while others would.

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The question is, do you believe scripture?

Luk 21:36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.

iamlamad said:

The question is, do you believe scripture?

Luk 21:36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.

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Joh 5:27 And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man.
Joh 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
Joh 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
Joh 5:30 I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.


Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.

Rev 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

.

iamlamad said:

The question is, do you believe scripture?

Luk 21:36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.

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Good verse. It's a match to Mark 13:33.

#69 is used only 2 times in the Gospels, and 1 each in Ephesians and Hebrews.

69. agrupneo ag-roop-neh'-o
ultimately from 1 (as negative particle) and 5258; to be sleepless, i.e. keep awake:--watch.

Luke 21:36
Be being vigilant<69>! therefore, and pray always!
that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.

Mark 13:33
33 Be ye looking! and be being vigilant!<69> and be praying!,
for ye have not known when the time is;

Hebrews 13:17
Be obedient to those leading you, and be subject, for these are being vigilant<69> for your souls, as about to give account,
that with joy they may do this, and not sighing, for this [is] unprofitable to you.

iamlamad said:

The question is, do you believe scripture?

Luk 21:36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.

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It's a terrible translation.
I believe the LITERAL translation and its direct application to the ORIGINAL Audience:

36 watch ye, then, in every season, praying that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that are about to come to pass, and to stand before the Son of Man.' (YLT)

Do you?

iamlamad said: ↑The question is, do you believe scripture?

Luk 21:36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.

Click to expand...

parousia70 said:

It's a terrible translation.
I believe the LITERAL translation and its direct application to the ORIGINAL Audience:
36 watch ye, then, in every season, praying that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that are about to come to pass, and to stand before the Son of Man.' (YLT)
Do you?

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Good post and that is indeed a good translation.....I like YLT....

3195. mello mel'-lo
a strengthened form of 3199 (through the idea of expectation); to intend, i.e. be about to be, do, or suffer something....
Strong's Number G3195 matches the Greek μέλλω (mellō),
which occurs 110 times in 107 verses

This is literal from the greek texts:

Used 3 times in the Olivet Discourse:

Luke 21:36
36 watch ye, then, in every season, praying that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these being about<3195> to be becoming,
and to stand before the Son of Man.'

Matthew 24:6
ye shall be being about<3195> to begin hearing battles and tidings of battles;
see, be not troubled!
for it binding all these to be becoming, but the end is not yet.

Mark 13:4
‘Tell us when? these things shall be?
and what? the sign
when all these may be being about<3195> to be together-finished<4931>?’

13 times in Revelation....

1st time used:

Revelation 1:19
‘Write the things that thou hast seen, and the things that are, and which things that are being about<3195> to be becoming after these things;

FredVB said:

I still don't know how it wasn't understood that I mean three and a half years is figured from the phrase used of one thousand two hundred and sixty days. It is an approximation of three and a half years, with several days difference, with using three hundred sixty days for a year. I never say the three and a half days the two prophets are prophesied to lie dead in the street is representing three and a half years, because I don't believe that.

I do believe that believers will be here seeing great problems to this earth well before the prophesied time of great tribulation, such that will be coming from contribution to worsening conditions in this world. Believers will be disappointed and rightly so with thinking they can continue doing as they are doing with any contribution to worsening effects in this world, with species extinction, loss of so many natural environments, horrible suffering of so many animals, growing deprivation and starvation among people, and the issue of the climate, and be taken out from this world to be with Christ and never see anything of those negative consequences while others would.

Click to expand...

iamlamad said:

The question is, do you believe scripture?

Luk 21:36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.

Click to expand...

I certainly do believe scriptures, and I am not saying anything to contradict scriptures for others to not believe them. It is all true including that which is mentioned already now in this thread

Rev 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

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How does that apply? There are destructive activities to the earth including such things that are done for what we choose with our demand in markets, for instance. We should repent of such things, and separate ourselves from any involvement with such destructiveness to this earth. There should be judgment from Yahweh on those who persist in that with destructiveness without repentance.

There have always been great difficulties to believers that they went through, all through history. That isn't over, and we are to persist through that with obedience to Yahweh God. There will be deliverance of believers from the coming judgments on the unrepentant in their wicked disobedience and destructiveness. We would still see some consequences of the changed earth from such, we don't get away from our contribution to leave others to suffer from it.

Dave G. said:

I hate to tell you but there is nothing stealth about the second coming of Jesus Christ. And in your theory how do the 144,000 Jews come into play, the ones who witness to all the world in the time of great tribulation, the ones called to do so because there doesn't seem to be any other Christians around to do so. When did that happen and where ?

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There was a promise to Ismael as well. He was to be fruitful. Fruit had to be at least 4 years old before it could be picked. The year 1440 of the Ismael (archer) calendar is a couple days after the end of 5,778.

FredVB said:

How does that apply?

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Do you understand the bodily resurrection and judgment of the dead found in John 5:27-30?

.