Do not quote Bible to atheists.

Doug Melven · Aug 4, 2018

Skitnik said:
Great. This will get me banned.

Word of God is Torah. Written by Moses. Maybe Job too. The rest are words of kings (including pagan ones. Who wrote much of Daniel?), prophets who were proven to be legit, letters of apostles and pastors to each other, historians (Luke) even many unknown authors. Canonized under rule of a pagan emperor Constantine. Some other books are included in other cannons (Coptic), some are included for no good reason (Kohelet).

When Paul said that all scripture is inspired he was only talking about Torah. "Since childhood. .." you know.

There is nothing "magical", special about the bible overall. You can smash it over heads of anybody but you will just make their heads hurt.

Which bible did the "friend of God" - Abraham read? Which "bible study" did Enoch go to........?

Then use the Torah.
Abraham told the rich man that Moses and the Prophets were enough to convert someone.
But, human logic will not work.
Atheists already deny anything natural. They won't admit the fact that God exists even though the Heavens declare His glory. I don't know why you would think human logic will work?

Loren T. · Aug 4, 2018

I don't know. I kinda think I disagree. Atheists will tell you they are the logical ones. But, if we really are just the sum of all our experiences and our DNA, then how can our brains produce logic? They could only produce what the universe and our DNA, which is part of the universe, programmed us to produce. So, our thoughts, then, in a godless world, are just like fizz in a pop bottle. Honest atheists will admit that everything we are is programmed by our situation, (in the absence of a God, who kind of throws a wrench in everything.) so even if they won't admit it, this logic has to bother them, IMO.

Skitnik · Aug 4, 2018

Loren T. said:
I don't know. I kinda think I disagree. Atheists will tell you they are the logical ones. But, if we really are just the sum of all our experiences and our DNA, then how can our brains produce logic? They could only produce what the universe and our DNA, which is part of the universe, programmed us to produce. So, our thoughts, then, in a godless world, are just like fizz in a pop bottle. Honest atheists will admit that everything we are is programmed by our situation, (in the absence of a God, who kind of throws a wrench in everything.) so even if they won't admit it, this logic has to bother them, IMO.

Honest atheist is an oxymoron They lie to themselves even.

Loren T. · Aug 4, 2018

Skitnik said:
Honest atheist is an oxymoron They lie to themselves even.

doesn't everyone?

Doug Melven · Aug 4, 2018

Loren T. said:
Atheists will tell you they are the logical ones.

There is nothing logical about denying God's existence.
If someone were walking in the woods and they came upon a brick house with lights on and they denied that somebody built that house and installed some type of electricity would not be as illogical as denying God's existence.

Skitnik · Aug 4, 2018

Loren T. said:
doesn't everyone?

I try not to lie to myself and to God because He knows hearts and minds.

Loren T. · Aug 4, 2018

Doug Melven said:
There is nothing logical about denying God's existence.
If someone were walking in the woods and they came upon a brick house with lights on and they denied that somebody built that house and installed some type of electricity would not be as illogical as denying God's existence.

I agree. Did you read the rest of what I wrote?

. But, if we really are just the sum of all our experiences and our DNA, then how can our brains produce logic? They could only produce what the universe and our DNA, which is part of the universe, programmed us to produce. So, our thoughts, then, in a godless world, are just like fizz in a pop bottle.

So, really an atheist has not logical leg to stand on, so to speak.

Skitnik · Aug 4, 2018

Loren T. said:
I agree. Did you read the rest of what I wrote?

. But, if we really are just the sum of all our experiences and our DNA, then how can our brains produce logic? They could only produce what the universe and our DNA, which is part of the universe, programmed us to produce. So, our thoughts, then, in a godless world, are just like fizz in a pop bottle.

So, really an atheist has not logical leg to stand on, so to speak.

Anybody who can say that DNA was not created is insane.

And watch "Exspelled, no intelligence allowed" on Youtube.

Skitnik · Aug 4, 2018

Doug Melven said:
Then use the Torah.
Abraham told the rich man that Moses and the Prophets were enough to convert someone.
But, human logic will not work.
Atheists already deny anything natural. They won't admit the fact that God exists even though the Heavens declare His glory. I don't know why you would think human logic will work?

To an atheist Torah is just a part of a larger book of fairy tails.

Meaning that they were not enough. So sending rich man back to save his brothers will not do it either.

Doug Melven · Aug 4, 2018

Skitnik said:
To an atheist Torah is just a part of a larger book of fairy tails.

Meaning that they were not enough. So sending rich man back to save his brothers will not do it either.

It really doesn't matter what the atheist thinks about God's Word, the Holy Spirit can still work.
Just as we don't have to know how a seed works, if we put a seed in the proper ground that seed will produce.
See the parable of the sower in Matthew 13 or Mark 4.
Note that a good crop isn't always produced, but if no seed is planted there will be no crop.
Human logic is not good seed, it will not produce a child of God. God's word is needed.
1 Corinthians 2:4 And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words ofman's wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power:
1 Corinthians 2:5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.

1 Corinthians 2:13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

1 Peter 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

Skitnik · Aug 4, 2018

Doug Melven said:
It really doesn't matter what the atheist thinks about God's Word, the Holy Spirit can still work.
Just as we don't have to know how a seed works, if we put a seed in the proper ground that seed will produce.
See the parable of the sower in Matthew 13 or Mark 4.
Note that a good crop isn't always produced, but if no seed is planted there will be no crop.
Human logic is not good seed, it will not produce a child of God. God's word is needed.
1 Corinthians 2:4 And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words ofman's wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power:
1 Corinthians 2:5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.

1 Corinthians 2:13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

1 Peter 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

Seed? Sure. But my point is that quotes from the book they do not believe in is not it. It is not the seed that will produce fruit of salvation or anything else for that matter other than it will strengthen the unbelief of an atheist.

True seed is in the evidences that are all around us. GOD put it there.

Like I said before. Try Polaris time lapse. WORKS EVERY TIME! Either it sends an atheist into a total freak out or they will just stare at you just stare like their mind is completely turned of, which it is. People that have controlling demons on them simply get their minds "turned off" by those demons. I have seen that too.

Doug Melven · Aug 4, 2018

Skitnik said:
Seed? Sure. But my point it that quotes from the book they do not believe in is not it. It is not the seed that will produce fruit of salvation on anything else for that matter other than it will strengthen the unbelief of an atheist.

True seed is in the evidences that are all around us. GOD put it there.

True seed is the Word of God. Mark 4:14, 1 Peter 1:23

Skitnik · Aug 4, 2018

Doug Melven said:
True seed is the Word of God. Mark 4:14, 1 Peter 1:23

For those who believe in God and His word. For the rest it is an evidence in His creation.

Job 12:7-12

Which bible did Job read?

Also Romans 1:20

Skitnik · Aug 4, 2018

Doug Melven said:
True seed is the Word of God. Mark 4:14, 1 Peter 1:23

Let them hear that music. Holy Spirit Will replay it in their minds:

Skitnik · Aug 4, 2018

Two hours long but...

Science proves Geocentricity.

Not much to watch. Listen only:

Doug Melven · Aug 4, 2018

Skitnik said:
For those who believe in God and His word. For the rest it is an evidence in His creation.

Job 12:7-12

Which bible did Job read?

Also Romans 1:20

Yes, Romans 1:20.
1:19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
1:20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
1:21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

Let's just say for argument's sake that you are successful and you convince an atheist that God does exist.
What will you have accomplished? That God exists.
But Romans 1 says they already knew that.
They may deny it, but the truth is, when they get all alone and it's just them and there thoughts and the Holy Spirit, then He starts working.

That is a great Scripture to show them.

Skitnik · Aug 4, 2018

Doug Melven said:
Yes, Romans 1:20.
1:19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
1:20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
1:21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

Let's just say for argument's sake that you are successful and you convince an atheist that God does exist.
What will you have accomplished? That God exists.
But Romans 1 says they already knew that.
They may deny it, but the truth is, when they get all alone and it's just them and there thoughts and the Holy Spirit, then He starts working.

That is a great Scripture to show them.

What is accomplished? Now there is an odd question by a Christian. Believing in God maybe the first step to a salvation.

I said "maybe" for a reason. There are plenty of people who believe that God exist and that He is evil. They worship Satan. Oh boy there are a lot of them now days! Now that prospect of immortality apart from God seems to be plausible and within the reach. Met a few.

First step in choosing God is knowing that there is a choice.

Because of what I have said here and there Satanists have an open season on me. Well, God decided when and how I go. Not them.

Doug Melven · Aug 4, 2018

Skitnik said:
What is accomplished? Now there is an odd question by a Christian. Believing in God maybe the first step to a salvation.

I said "maybe" for a reason. There are plenty of people who believe that God exist and that He is evil. They worship Satan. Oh boy there are a lot of them now days! Now that prospect of immortality apart from God seems to be plausible and within the reach. Met a few.

First step in choosing God is knowing that there is a choice.

Because of what I have said here and there Satanists have an open season on me. Well, God decided when and how I go. Not them.

I asked the question and answered it. By spending time proving that God exists all you have done is show them what they already knew.
So show them the goodness of God, that will lead them to repentance. Human logic is worthless when explaining God to someone.
Our job is to plant seed and let the Holy Spirit do His work.
1 Corinthians 3:6, one plants, one waters, but God gives the increase.

Loren T. · Aug 4, 2018

Skitnik said:
Anybody who can say that DNA was not created is insane.

And watch "Exspelled, no intelligence allowed" on Youtube.

Seen it and enjoyed it. I don't think atheists are nesasarily insane. Used to debate one often on another forum. I realized after awhile that he was technically more of an agnostic, and that he had honest doubts about God's existence, in part due to how Christian s treated him. And all the people whose only answer we're to tell him he was going to hell weren't really helping. Some atheists are just broken people who need hope, imo.

Skitnik · Aug 4, 2018

Doug. I see that now you just want to have a last word at any cost to say to yourself "I won the argument, shut him up from my theologian expert perspective". That is pride brother and it is never a good thing. Remember that the best theologians could not see the Son of God while He was standing at front of them. You just feel absolutely determined to have a last word and win the argument (at least in your mind) because some things I said sound crazy to your made up theologian mind.

You want to have a last word? You can have it.

Do not quote Bible to atheists.

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