What do you believe?

CherubRam

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The Romans did not see him as a god but a man condemned to death by lots...Their method was just a method and pagan had nothing to do with it...

The cross is a symbol of the 2 sticks of Judah and Israel...and that's not pagan either....


The el taw should convince you that it was a cross ...the sacrifice el on the taw (cross) and this is not pagan....

Yahshua is the el taw....
The word Cross a note


Homeric and classical Greek

In Homeric and classical Greek, stauros meant an upright stake, pole, or piece of paling, upon which anything might be hung.

In the literature of that time, it never means two pieces of timber placed across one another at any angle, but always one piece alone.

Koine Greek

In Koine Greek, the form of Greek used between about 300 BC and AD 300, the word σταυρός (Stauros) was used to denote a structure on which the Romans executed criminals. In the writings of the Diodorus Siculus (1st century BC), Plutarch and Lucian – non-Christian writers, of whom only Lucian makes clear the shape of the device – the word stauros is generally translated as "stake."

Origin of the word crux. Latin for: stake, scaffold, or cross, used in executions or torment.

The English term "cross" is derived from the Latin word crux. From about 1635 to 1645 AD.


Labarum

An upright pole with cross section to display a standard such as a flag, banner, or emblem.


Word Origin

From Late Latin, and of obscure origin

This standard was known by the name "labarum"—a word the etymology of which is very uncertain. The etymology of the word is unclear. Some derive it from Latin /labāre/ "to totter, or to waver." The labarum was also used to hold the ancient Babylonian sky-god emblem.


Patibulum

It is a establish fact that the two-beamed cross was in existence in the time of Yahshua, and that the word crux was used to refer to it. The crux was composed of two main pieces: The stipes, which is the upright pole, and the patibulum attached to it. The patibulum is the cross beam.


Stipe

Stipe is an upright support.

From Latin stipes "log, post, tree trunk"


Stauros

Stauros (σταυρός) is the Greek word for stake or post.
 
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CherubRam

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Yahshua did not die on a "cross", but died upon a torture stake, for that is the meaning of the Greek word stauros, and is used interchangeably by the Bible writers with the Greek word xylon, translated as "tree" or "wood" by the King James Bible.(Acts 5:30)

For Yahshua to become the "accursed" one, to fulfill the Mosaic Law, it was required for him to die upon a "tree" or more literally a "stake", for Deuteronomy 21:22,23 says: " And if a man have committed a sin worthy of death, and he be to be put to death, and thou hang him on a tree.(Hebrew ‛ets´) His body shall not remain all night upon the tree (Hebrew ‛ets´), but thou shalt in any wise bury him that day; (for he that is hanged is accursed of God."

The apostle Paul quoted from Deuteronomy 21:23, saying that "Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree (Greek xylon ):"(Gal 3:13, King James Bible)

Thus, the Hebrew word ‛ets´ corresponds to the Greek word xylon and means a timber, or a "beam". To show that this is the case, at 1 Kings 6:15, in building the temple, it said that Solomon, "from the floor of the house up to the rafters of the ceiling he overlaid (the walls) with timber (Hebrew ‛ets´) inside." Thus, "timber" ("a large piece of wood, usually squared, used in a building, for example, as a beam", Microsoft® Encarta® Reference Library 2005) of cedar was used to overlay the walls, and was upright "timber" of wood and not "cross" forms.

The online interlinear Scripture4all renders xylon as "wood". Another Greek word used for the instrument Yahshua died upon, stauros, is at Matthew 10:38; 16:24; 27:32, 40, 42 and is rendered as "pale"(online interlinear Scripture4all ), which means "fence stake: a pointed slat of wood for a fence."(Microsoft® Encarta® Reference Library 2005) That he died upon a "pole" or "stake", is that the apostle Peter said of Yahshua, that "we are witnesses of all things which he did both in the land of the Jews, and in Jerusalem; whom they slew and hanged on a tree:"(Acts 10:39, King James Bible; "tree", Greek xylon)
 
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CherubRam

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The mark of the cross is made on the forehead with ash during lent.


Sign of the cross

The Byzantine sign of the cross made with the right hand.


The Byzantine sign of the cross is made with thumb and the first two fingers of the right hand joined at the tips. The third and fourth fingers are closed on the palm.


The Byzantine way of making the sign of the cross pre-dates the Latin style used by the Roman Catholics.


The sign of the Trinity and Cross are both in the right hand.


The Hebrew word for sin is "chet," which literally means "missing the mark.”


The sign of being forgiven.

During the ancient days of Israel, if a person was forgiven in a court, the person would receive a single ash mark on their forehead for everyone to see; that was done in remembrance of Moses’s snake on a pole.



The Catholic mark is a cross on the fore head made with a trinity sign with the right hand. By the way, the word “cross’ is not biblical; it was added to scriptures.

The Seal of God is the law and the Sabbath Day.



Numbers 21:8’9

The Lord said to Moses, “Make a snake and put it up on a pole; anyone who is bitten can look at it and live.” So Moses made a bronze snake and put it up on a pole. Then when anyone was bitten by a snake and looked at the bronze snake, they lived.


Deuteronomy 21:23

you must not leave the body hanging on the pole overnight. Be sure to bury it that same day, because anyone who is hung on a pole is under God’s curse. You must not desecrate the land the Lord your God is giving you as an inheritance.


1 Corinthians 1:23. NIV

23 but we preach Christ crucified / staked out a stumbling block to Jews and foolishness to Gentiles,


Galatians 3:13

Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us, for it is written: “Cursed is everyone who is hung on a pole.”


Acts 5:30

The God of our fathers raised up Yahshua, whom you killed and hanged on a tree.


Acts 10:39

And we are witnesses of all things which he did both in the land of the Jews, and in Jerusalem; whom they killed and hanged on a tree:
 
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CherubRam

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I pretty well support all of them. :)
That's because God is completely inclusive with an infinite number of ways to explore the mystery.
If so, then you must believe that truth is broad and all encompassing.
 
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Robban

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Havayah = Basics in Kabbalah

Actually Exodus 5:2 in the Hebrew script says Yahwah twice. And Elohiym means "God of the living."

HaVaYaH.

It can hardly be said that there basics in Kabbalah, not Jewish Kabbalah at any rate.

Kabbalah is the deeper inner dimension of Torah.

The crown jewels are kept in the palace.

There are two ways to the palace,

The long short way and
the short long way.
 
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Robban

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Mashiach is alive and present in every generation though concealed.

"Mashiach will reveal altogether new insights,
making manifest the hidden mysteries of the Torah,
to the point that all the Torah learned in the present world
will be in vain compared to the Torah of Mashiach."

Have not noted the source of this but nonetheless have noted it.

Was looking through many notes this evening wondering what will happen to them when I,m gone, probably thrown in the rubbish.

So thought would post this one,
 
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CherubRam

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HaVaYaH.

It can hardly be said that there basics in Kabbalah, not Jewish Kabbalah at any rate.

Kabbalah is the deeper inner dimension of Torah.

The crown jewels are kept in the palace.

There are two ways to the palace,

The long short way and
the short long way.

Quote:
A fundamental notion in Kabbalah is the belief that the world is created and sustained by ten channels (sefirot) of divine plenty.

Sure sounds like Mysticism to me.
 
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dlamberth

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Quote: A fundamental notion in Kabbalah is the belief that the world is created and sustained by ten channels (sefirot) of divine plenty.

Sure sounds like Mysticism to me.
Your quote may point towards Mysticism, but the way it works is that it doesn't actually move into the realm of Mysticism until what is believed is turned into inner experience. So with my very limited understanding of the Kabbalah, those 10 channels are like attributes of God revealing ItSelf through this Creation, both the seen and unseen. The Mystical aspect comes into play when those attributes are experienced inwardly by the devotee. I can imagine a person spending time working with each of those 10 attributes. But like I said, my understanding of Kabbalah is very limited so I'm totally open to any correction.
 
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ViaCrucis

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The Romans like to hang their gods on crosses, but they normally hanged people on stakes.

"I see before me crosses not all alike, but differently made by different peoples: some hang a man head downwards, some force a stick upwards through his groin, some stretch out his arms on a forked gibbet. I see cords, scourges, and instruments of torture for each limb and each joint: but I see Death also." - Seneca the Younger, Of Consolation: To Marcia, 6.20 (c. AD 40)

The Romans used many different kinds of crosses for crucifixion, the crux simplex--a simple upright pole--was the simplest of these, but not the only kind.

Again, you are saying things you don't know anything about.

-CryptoLutheran
 
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CherubRam

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"I see before me crosses not all alike, but differently made by different peoples: some hang a man head downwards, some force a stick upwards through his groin, some stretch out his arms on a forked gibbet. I see cords, scourges, and instruments of torture for each limb and each joint: but I see Death also." - Seneca the Younger, Of Consolation: To Marcia, 6.20 (c. AD 40)

The Romans used many different kinds of crosses for crucifixion, the crux simplex--a simple upright pole--was the simplest of these, but not the only kind.

Again, you are saying things you don't know anything about.

-CryptoLutheran

Yahshua did not die on a "cross", but died upon a torture stake, for that is the meaning of the Greek word stauros, and is used interchangeably by the Bible writers with the Greek word xylon, translated as "tree" or "wood" by the King James Bible.(Acts 5:30)

For Yahshua to become the "accursed" one, to fulfill the Mosaic Law, it was required for him to die upon a "tree" or more literally a "stake", for Deuteronomy 21:22,23 says: " And if a man have committed a sin worthy of death, and he be to be put to death, and thou hang him on a tree.(Hebrew ‛ets´) His body shall not remain all night upon the tree (Hebrew ‛ets´), but thou shalt in any wise bury him that day; (for he that is hanged is accursed of God."

The apostle Paul quoted from Deuteronomy 21:23, saying that "Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree (Greek xylon ):"(Gal 3:13, King James Bible)

Thus, the Hebrew word ‛ets´ corresponds to the Greek word xylon and means a timber, or a "beam". To show that this is the case, at 1 Kings 6:15, in building the temple, it said that Solomon, "from the floor of the house up to the rafters of the ceiling he overlaid (the walls) with timber (Hebrew ‛ets´) inside." Thus, "timber" ("a large piece of wood, usually squared, used in a building, for example, as a beam", Microsoft® Encarta® Reference Library 2005) of cedar was used to overlay the walls, and was upright "timber" of wood and not "cross" forms.

The online interlinear Scripture4all renders xylon as "wood". Another Greek word used for the instrument Yahshua died upon, stauros, is at Matthew 10:38; 16:24; 27:32, 40, 42 and is rendered as "pale"(online interlinear Scripture4all ), which means "fence stake: a pointed slat of wood for a fence."(Microsoft® Encarta® Reference Library 2005) That he died upon a "pole" or "stake", is that the apostle Peter said of Yahshua, that "we are witnesses of all things which he did both in the land of the Jews, and in Jerusalem; whom they slew and hanged on a tree:"(Acts 10:39, King James Bible; "tree", Greek xylon)

The apostle Paul told the Jews in Antioch in Pisidia, that "when they had fulfilled all that was written of him, they took him (Yahshua) down from the tree." (Acts 13:29, King James Bible; "tree", Greek xylon) The apostle Peter wrote: "Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree."(1 Peter 2:24, King James Bible; "tree", Greek xylon) Hence, Yahshua died upon a "tree" or "pale", a "stake", not cross.

The Hebrews had no word for the traditional cross. To designate such an implement, they used “warp and woof,” alluding to yarns running lengthwise in a fabric and others going across it on a loom.(Lev 13:56-59) The French Dictionnaire Encyclopédique Universel (Encyclopedic Universal Dictionary) says: “For a long time we believed that the cross, considered a religious symbol, was specifically for Christians. This is not the case.” The book Dual Heritage—The Bible and the British Museum (1986) states: “It may come as a shock to know that there is no word such as ‘cross’ in the Greek of the New Testament. The word translated ‘cross’ is always the Greek word [stau·ros´] meaning a ‘stake’ or ‘upright pale.’ The cross was not originally a Christian symbol; it is derived from Egypt and Constantine.”

The New Strong's Concise Concordance & Vine's Concise Dictionary of the Bible states that the meaning of "stauros (4716) denotes, primarily , "an upright pale or stake." On such malefactors were nailed for execution. Both the noun and the verb stauroo, "to fasten to a stake or pale," are originally to be distinguished from the ecclesiastical form of a two beamed "cross." The shape of the latter had its origin in ancient Chaldea, and was used as the symbol of the god Tammuz (being in the shape of the mystic Tau, the initial of his name) in that country and in adjacent lands, including Egypt. By the middle of the 3rd cent. A.D. the churches had either departed from, or had travestied, certain doctrines of the Christian faith. In order to increase the prestige of the apostate ecclesiastical system pagans were received into the churches apart from regeneration by faith, and were permitted largely to retain their pagan signs and symbols. Hence the Tau or T, in its most frequent form, with the cross-piece lowered, was adopted to stand for the "cross" of Christ."(Vine's Concise Dictionary of the Bible, pg 75, 1999 edition)

Under the Hebrew word ‛ets´ (6086), Vine's Concise Dictionary of the Bible says "tree; wood; timber; stick; stalk." It goes on to say that "this word may signify a single "tree," as it does in Gen. 2:9; or a genus of tree, Isa. 41:19. ‛ets´ can mean "wood as a material from which things are constructed, as a raw material to be carved, Exod. 31:5. Large unprocessed pieces of "wood or timber" are also signified by ‛ets´, Hag 1:8. The end product of wood already processed and fashioned into something may be indicated by ‛ets´, Lev 11:32. This word means "stick" or "piece of wood" in Ezek. 37:16...‛ets´ one time means "stalk," Josh. 2:6."(pg 387)

And under the Greek word xylon (3586), Vine's Concise Dictionary of the Bible says "wood, a piece of wood, anything made of wood," is used, with the rendering "tree,"....the tree being the stauros, the upright pale or stake to which Romans nailed those who were thus to be executed, Acts 5:30; 10:39; 13:29; 1 Pet 2:24."(pg 387-88)

Thus, whether it be ‛ets´, xylon, or stauros, the meaning was the same, that of a "tree", "timber", "wood", "stick", or "upright pale or stake" and not a cross.
 
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ViaCrucis

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Yahshua did not die on a "cross", but died upon a torture stake, for that is the meaning of the Greek word stauros, and is used interchangeably by the Bible writers with the Greek word xylon, translated as "tree" or "wood" by the King James Bible.(Acts 5:30)

For Yahshua to become the "accursed" one, to fulfill the Mosaic Law, it was required for him to die upon a "tree" or more literally a "stake", for Deuteronomy 21:22,23 says: " And if a man have committed a sin worthy of death, and he be to be put to death, and thou hang him on a tree.(Hebrew ‛ets´) His body shall not remain all night upon the tree (Hebrew ‛ets´), but thou shalt in any wise bury him that day; (for he that is hanged is accursed of God."

The apostle Paul quoted from Deuteronomy 21:23, saying that "Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree (Greek xylon ):"(Gal 3:13, King James Bible)

Thus, the Hebrew word ‛ets´ corresponds to the Greek word xylon and means a timber, or a "beam". To show that this is the case, at 1 Kings 6:15, in building the temple, it said that Solomon, "from the floor of the house up to the rafters of the ceiling he overlaid (the walls) with timber (Hebrew ‛ets´) inside." Thus, "timber" ("a large piece of wood, usually squared, used in a building, for example, as a beam", Microsoft® Encarta® Reference Library 2005) of cedar was used to overlay the walls, and was upright "timber" of wood and not "cross" forms.

The online interlinear Scripture4all renders xylon as "wood". Another Greek word used for the instrument Yahshua died upon, stauros, is at Matthew 10:38; 16:24; 27:32, 40, 42 and is rendered as "pale"(online interlinear Scripture4all ), which means "fence stake: a pointed slat of wood for a fence."(Microsoft® Encarta® Reference Library 2005) That he died upon a "pole" or "stake", is that the apostle Peter said of Yahshua, that "we are witnesses of all things which he did both in the land of the Jews, and in Jerusalem; whom they slew and hanged on a tree:"(Acts 10:39, King James Bible; "tree", Greek xylon)

The apostle Paul told the Jews in Antioch in Pisidia, that "when they had fulfilled all that was written of him, they took him (Yahshua) down from the tree." (Acts 13:29, King James Bible; "tree", Greek xylon) The apostle Peter wrote: "Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree."(1 Peter 2:24, King James Bible; "tree", Greek xylon) Hence, Yahshua died upon a "tree" or "pale", a "stake", not cross.

The Hebrews had no word for the traditional cross. To designate such an implement, they used “warp and woof,” alluding to yarns running lengthwise in a fabric and others going across it on a loom.(Lev 13:56-59) The French Dictionnaire Encyclopédique Universel (Encyclopedic Universal Dictionary) says: “For a long time we believed that the cross, considered a religious symbol, was specifically for Christians. This is not the case.” The book Dual Heritage—The Bible and the British Museum (1986) states: “It may come as a shock to know that there is no word such as ‘cross’ in the Greek of the New Testament. The word translated ‘cross’ is always the Greek word [stau·ros´] meaning a ‘stake’ or ‘upright pale.’ The cross was not originally a Christian symbol; it is derived from Egypt and Constantine.”

The New Strong's Concise Concordance & Vine's Concise Dictionary of the Bible states that the meaning of "stauros (4716) denotes, primarily , "an upright pale or stake." On such malefactors were nailed for execution. Both the noun and the verb stauroo, "to fasten to a stake or pale," are originally to be distinguished from the ecclesiastical form of a two beamed "cross." The shape of the latter had its origin in ancient Chaldea, and was used as the symbol of the god Tammuz (being in the shape of the mystic Tau, the initial of his name) in that country and in adjacent lands, including Egypt. By the middle of the 3rd cent. A.D. the churches had either departed from, or had travestied, certain doctrines of the Christian faith. In order to increase the prestige of the apostate ecclesiastical system pagans were received into the churches apart from regeneration by faith, and were permitted largely to retain their pagan signs and symbols. Hence the Tau or T, in its most frequent form, with the cross-piece lowered, was adopted to stand for the "cross" of Christ."(Vine's Concise Dictionary of the Bible, pg 75, 1999 edition)

Under the Hebrew word ‛ets´ (6086), Vine's Concise Dictionary of the Bible says "tree; wood; timber; stick; stalk." It goes on to say that "this word may signify a single "tree," as it does in Gen. 2:9; or a genus of tree, Isa. 41:19. ‛ets´ can mean "wood as a material from which things are constructed, as a raw material to be carved, Exod. 31:5. Large unprocessed pieces of "wood or timber" are also signified by ‛ets´, Hag 1:8. The end product of wood already processed and fashioned into something may be indicated by ‛ets´, Lev 11:32. This word means "stick" or "piece of wood" in Ezek. 37:16...‛ets´ one time means "stalk," Josh. 2:6."(pg 387)

And under the Greek word xylon (3586), Vine's Concise Dictionary of the Bible says "wood, a piece of wood, anything made of wood," is used, with the rendering "tree,"....the tree being the stauros, the upright pale or stake to which Romans nailed those who were thus to be executed, Acts 5:30; 10:39; 13:29; 1 Pet 2:24."(pg 387-88)

Thus, whether it be ‛ets´, xylon, or stauros, the meaning was the same, that of a "tree", "timber", "wood", "stick", or "upright pale or stake" and not a cross.

"Such are his verbal offences against man; his offences in deed remain. Men weep, and bewail their lot, and curse Cadmus with many curses for introducing Tau into the family of letters; they say it was his body that tyrants took for a model, his shape that they imitated, when they set up the erections on which men are crucified. Stayros the vile engine is called, and it derives its vile name from him. Now, with all these crimes upon him, does he not deserve death, nay, many deaths? For my part I know none bad enough but that supplied by his own shape — that shape which he gave to the gibbet named Stayros after him by men." - Lucian of Samosata, Trial in the Court of Vowels, 12 (2nd century AD)

-CryptoLutheran
 
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dlamberth

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Yahshua did not die on a "cross", but died upon a torture stake, for that is the meaning of the Greek word stauros, and is used interchangeably by the Bible writers with the Greek word xylon, translated as "tree" or "wood" by the King James Bible.(Acts 5:30)

For Yahshua to become the "accursed" one, to fulfill the Mosaic Law, it was required for him to die upon a "tree" or more literally a "stake", for Deuteronomy 21:22,23 says: " And if a man have committed a sin worthy of death, and he be to be put to death, and thou hang him on a tree.(Hebrew ‛ets´) His body shall not remain all night upon the tree (Hebrew ‛ets´), but thou shalt in any wise bury him that day; (for he that is hanged is accursed of God."

The apostle Paul quoted from Deuteronomy 21:23, saying that "Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree (Greek xylon ):"(Gal 3:13, King James Bible)

Thus, the Hebrew word ‛ets´ corresponds to the Greek word xylon and means a timber, or a "beam". To show that this is the case, at 1 Kings 6:15, in building the temple, it said that Solomon, "from the floor of the house up to the rafters of the ceiling he overlaid (the walls) with timber (Hebrew ‛ets´) inside." Thus, "timber" ("a large piece of wood, usually squared, used in a building, for example, as a beam", Microsoft® Encarta® Reference Library 2005) of cedar was used to overlay the walls, and was upright "timber" of wood and not "cross" forms.

The online interlinear Scripture4all renders xylon as "wood". Another Greek word used for the instrument Yahshua died upon, stauros, is at Matthew 10:38; 16:24; 27:32, 40, 42 and is rendered as "pale"(online interlinear Scripture4all ), which means "fence stake: a pointed slat of wood for a fence."(Microsoft® Encarta® Reference Library 2005) That he died upon a "pole" or "stake", is that the apostle Peter said of Yahshua, that "we are witnesses of all things which he did both in the land of the Jews, and in Jerusalem; whom they slew and hanged on a tree:"(Acts 10:39, King James Bible; "tree", Greek xylon)

The apostle Paul told the Jews in Antioch in Pisidia, that "when they had fulfilled all that was written of him, they took him (Yahshua) down from the tree." (Acts 13:29, King James Bible; "tree", Greek xylon) The apostle Peter wrote: "Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree."(1 Peter 2:24, King James Bible; "tree", Greek xylon) Hence, Yahshua died upon a "tree" or "pale", a "stake", not cross.

The Hebrews had no word for the traditional cross. To designate such an implement, they used “warp and woof,” alluding to yarns running lengthwise in a fabric and others going across it on a loom.(Lev 13:56-59) The French Dictionnaire Encyclopédique Universel (Encyclopedic Universal Dictionary) says: “For a long time we believed that the cross, considered a religious symbol, was specifically for Christians. This is not the case.” The book Dual Heritage—The Bible and the British Museum (1986) states: “It may come as a shock to know that there is no word such as ‘cross’ in the Greek of the New Testament. The word translated ‘cross’ is always the Greek word [stau·ros´] meaning a ‘stake’ or ‘upright pale.’ The cross was not originally a Christian symbol; it is derived from Egypt and Constantine.”

The New Strong's Concise Concordance & Vine's Concise Dictionary of the Bible states that the meaning of "stauros (4716) denotes, primarily , "an upright pale or stake." On such malefactors were nailed for execution. Both the noun and the verb stauroo, "to fasten to a stake or pale," are originally to be distinguished from the ecclesiastical form of a two beamed "cross." The shape of the latter had its origin in ancient Chaldea, and was used as the symbol of the god Tammuz (being in the shape of the mystic Tau, the initial of his name) in that country and in adjacent lands, including Egypt. By the middle of the 3rd cent. A.D. the churches had either departed from, or had travestied, certain doctrines of the Christian faith. In order to increase the prestige of the apostate ecclesiastical system pagans were received into the churches apart from regeneration by faith, and were permitted largely to retain their pagan signs and symbols. Hence the Tau or T, in its most frequent form, with the cross-piece lowered, was adopted to stand for the "cross" of Christ."(Vine's Concise Dictionary of the Bible, pg 75, 1999 edition)

Under the Hebrew word ‛ets´ (6086), Vine's Concise Dictionary of the Bible says "tree; wood; timber; stick; stalk." It goes on to say that "this word may signify a single "tree," as it does in Gen. 2:9; or a genus of tree, Isa. 41:19. ‛ets´ can mean "wood as a material from which things are constructed, as a raw material to be carved, Exod. 31:5. Large unprocessed pieces of "wood or timber" are also signified by ‛ets´, Hag 1:8. The end product of wood already processed and fashioned into something may be indicated by ‛ets´, Lev 11:32. This word means "stick" or "piece of wood" in Ezek. 37:16...‛ets´ one time means "stalk," Josh. 2:6."(pg 387)

And under the Greek word xylon (3586), Vine's Concise Dictionary of the Bible says "wood, a piece of wood, anything made of wood," is used, with the rendering "tree,"....the tree being the stauros, the upright pale or stake to which Romans nailed those who were thus to be executed, Acts 5:30; 10:39; 13:29; 1 Pet 2:24."(pg 387-88)

Thus, whether it be ‛ets´, xylon, or stauros, the meaning was the same, that of a "tree", "timber", "wood", "stick", or "upright pale or stake" and not a cross.
The Mystery, The Mystery...where's the Mystery?
 
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CherubRam

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In order for Christ to have fulfilled the prophecy, he had to die on a stake, not a cross.

Again: If Christ died on a cross, then he did not fulfill the prophecy.

Deuteronomy 21:23
you must not leave the body hanging on the pole overnight. Be sure to bury it that same day, because anyone who is hung on a pole is under God’s curse. You must not desecrate the land the Lord your God is giving you as an inheritance.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

Galatians 3:13
Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us, for it is written: “Cursed is everyone who is hung on a pole.”
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
 
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Robban

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In order for Christ to have fulfilled the prophecy, he had to die on a stake, not a cross.

Again: If Christ died on a cross, then he did not fulfill the prophecy.

Deuteronomy 21:23
you must not leave the body hanging on the pole overnight. Be sure to bury it that same day, because anyone who is hung on a pole is under God’s curse. You must not desecrate the land the Lord your God is giving you as an inheritance.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

Deuteronomy 21:22,
If a man commits a sin for which he is sentenced to death,
and he his put to death,
you shall (then) hang him on a pole.

So was Jesus dead before being hanged up?



Galatians 3:13
Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us, for it is written: “Cursed is everyone who is hung on a pole.”
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
 
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CherubRam

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Retake of post #96,

Deuteronomy 21:22,

If a man commits a sin for which he is sentenced to death,
and he is put to death,
you shall (then) hang him on a pole.

Was Jesus dead when he was hung up?
Your translation is defective.
Deut 21:22
If someone guilty of a capital offense is put to death and their body is exposed on a pole, 23 you must not leave the body hanging on the pole overnight. Be sure to bury it that same day, because anyone who is hung on a pole is under God’s curse.
 
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Robban

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Your translation is defective.
Deut 21:22
If someone guilty of a capital offense is put to death and their body is exposed on a pole, 23 you must not leave the body hanging on the pole overnight. Be sure to bury it that same day, because anyone who is hung on a pole is under God’s curse.

Was that not what I wrote?

Put to death then hung up on a pole.
 
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To add a little substance to the matter, consider,
Rashi comments,

"Our Rabbis said,
All who are stoned (by the court) must (afterwards) be hanged,
for the verse (23) says,
"a hanging (human corpse) is a blasphemy of God."

(Thus, we find that the sins of blasphemy is connected with hanging)
and a basphemer is punished by stoning.

(Consequently, our Rabbis taught that all those stoned must be hanged)
(San 45b)

Then of course the question arises,
what do we put into,"Stoning"?

What do we put into "being hanged out"?
 
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