Hughestimo

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So we all know sin is a burden which carries death as punishment. We know that believing on him can grant us everlasting life. Obviously, if it is eternal, it is never ending, but if you throw away a gift, is it not gone?

Paul describes in Ephesians 2:8-9

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.

The key word is faith. Without faith in Christ, to whom are they in Christ? To believe, is to have faith?

The act of faith in another is not a work of yourself. By no means does it mean that we can save ourselves, but you have a choice to have faith in Christ or not have faith in Christ.

Now we will delve into hebrews 10.


For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries. He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
Hebrews 10:26-29

Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him. But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.
Hebrews 10:38-39

So obviously God is displeased with them that abuse grace as well as those who fall from Grace. Which leads to the next section, the unpardonable sin.

First, there have been many claiming this or that is the sin. Simply put, the most common is blaphesmy of the holy spirit, and wouldn't pernamently denying the prompting of the holy spirit make it the unpardonable sin.

So, a person spends 20 years of their life building a relationship with their spouse. Very devout, constantly in scripture. So the man feels safe in God's hands and an event occurs simliar to Job. He loses his wife because his house caught fire and lost everything, and the insurance company wouldn't pay anything. Under the stress, he started drinking. Then more and started making bad decisions. This goes on, and stops going to church, and lives alone until he died.

His faith in the promises of God are now gone, yet he was very faithful. Where does he go? He believed on Christ, believed his power, but fell back into perdition and sin and his faith waivered to nil.

So requirement for Eternal life is The gift of Grace, and to accept it you need to have and keep Faith in Him as an atonement. Without that faith there is no longer a sacrifice for our sins. This could also explain why few make it to heaven stated in Matthew 7:14-15

Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

(The false prophets teaching that salvation is permanent leading many astray. No offense, but the bible should be our goto, not traditions of men, or wisdom of men.)

Thoughts and comments. Please try to avoid hostility, support your answers with bible or biblical history (no opinions)
 

yeshuaslavejeff

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1 Peter 1, et al
Live Holy Lives
13 Therefore, your minds must be clear and ready for action. Place your confidence completely in what God’s kindness will bring you when Jesus Christ appears again. 14 Because you are children who obey God, don’t live the kind of lives you once lived. Once you lived to satisfy your desires because you didn’t know any better. 15 But because the God who called you is holy, you must be holy in every aspect of your life. 16 Scripture says, “Be holy, because I am holy.” 17 So if you call God your Father, live your time as temporary residents on earth in fear. He is the God who judges all people by what they have done, and he doesn’t play favorites.......

18 Realize that you weren’t set free from the worthless life handed down to you from your ancestors by a payment of silver or gold which can be destroyed. 19 Rather, the payment that freed you was the precious blood of Christ, the lamb with no defects or imperfections. 20 He is the lamb who was known long ago before the world existed


1 Peter 2:11-13 GOD’S WORD Translation (GW)

11 Dear friends, since you are foreigners and temporary residents in the world, I’m encouraging you to keep away from the desires of your corrupt nature. These desires constantly attack you. 12 Live decent lives among unbelievers. Then, although they ridicule you as if you were doing wrong while they are watching you do good things, they will praise God on the day he comes to help you.
 
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bcbsr

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So we all know sin is a burden which carries death as punishment. We know that believing on him can grant us everlasting life. Obviously, if it is eternal, it is never ending, but if you throw away a gift, is it not gone?

Paul describes in Ephesians 2:8-9

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.

The key word is faith. Without faith in Christ, to whom are they in Christ? To believe, is to have faith?

The act of faith in another is not a work of yourself. By no means does it mean that we can save ourselves, but you have a choice to have faith in Christ or not have faith in Christ.

Now we will delve into hebrews 10.


For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries. He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
Hebrews 10:26-29

Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him. But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.
Hebrews 10:38-39

So obviously God is displeased with them that abuse grace as well as those who fall from Grace. Which leads to the next section, the unpardonable sin.

First, there have been many claiming this or that is the sin. Simply put, the most common is blaphesmy of the holy spirit, and wouldn't pernamently denying the prompting of the holy spirit make it the unpardonable sin.

So, a person spends 20 years of their life building a relationship with their spouse. Very devout, constantly in scripture. So the man feels safe in God's hands and an event occurs simliar to Job. He loses his wife because his house caught fire and lost everything, and the insurance company wouldn't pay anything. Under the stress, he started drinking. Then more and started making bad decisions. This goes on, and stops going to church, and lives alone until he died.

His faith in the promises of God are now gone, yet he was very faithful. Where does he go? He believed on Christ, believed his power, but fell back into perdition and sin and his faith waivered to nil.

So requirement for Eternal life is The gift of Grace, and to accept it you need to have and keep Faith in Him as an atonement. Without that faith there is no longer a sacrifice for our sins. This could also explain why few make it to heaven stated in Matthew 7:14-15

Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

(The false prophets teaching that salvation is permanent leading many astray. No offense, but the bible should be our goto, not traditions of men, or wisdom of men.)

Thoughts and comments. Please try to avoid hostility, support your answers with bible or biblical history (no opinions)
I'm one of those people who advocate the idea that the Bible indicates salvation is permanent.

Jesus said, "I tell you the truth, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be condemned; he has crossed over from death to life." John 5:24

What about those who fall away. John writes clearly on that matter. Here's John analyzing the situation when people "fall away".
1John 2:19
They went out from us, but they did not really belong to us.
For if they had belonged to us,
(ONCE SAVED)
they would have remained with us; (ALWAYS SAVED)
but their going showed that none of them belonged to us.

That is to say, they were never saved to begin with. So those of the really of the faith never fall away, and 1John 3:9, tells us why, if you want to read it.

Is a person's salvation contingent upon his ongoing performance. That's salvation by works. He can boast that his performance was good enough to get him saved. That's justification by the law.

Under the gospel - which is justification by faith apart from works - a person's salvation is not contingent upon his performance. Rather a person's performance is an indicator of his salvation status. To be qualified to be save a person must not work to be saved. "to the man who does not work but trusts God who justifies the wicked, his faith is credited as righteousness." Rom 4:5
 
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yeshuaslavejeff

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The Bible, Yahweh's Word, DOES indicate Salvation is permanent FOR A FEW - for those who endure to the end, for those who do not trample underfoot the Gospel of Jesus after tasting the goodness of the heavenlies, and so on ......

SINCE some in the BIBLE do not keep on being saved, Salvation is NOT PERMANENT for many.

Today especially - so many think they are saved, and show by their lives every day that there is NO LIGHT in them (1 John) , that they are not saved, whether they ever were or not doesn't matter.
 
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SeventyOne

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Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him. But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.
Hebrews 10:38-39

So obviously God is displeased with them that abuse grace as well as those who fall from Grace. Which leads to the next section, the unpardonable sin.

The writer is equating the just who live by faith with those who 'believe to the saving of the soul'. He then states tells that these are not of the people who draws back unto perdition. So those who draw back are not the just or those who believe, by evidence of their mere drawing back. In today's wording, those who draw back are not the true believers, but the false converts.
 
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Hughestimo

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The writer is equating the just who live by faith with those who 'believe to the saving of the soul'. He then states tells that these are not of the people who draws back unto perdition. So those who draw back are not the just or those who believe, by evidence of their mere drawing back. In today's wording, those who draw back are not the true believers, but the false converts.
So what of all those "Christians" who claim they are so but are not. For they follow his commandments not, the father is not in them. Though they maintain an image and pray and do well, without true faith they are but false converts? So if I understand correctly, if you leave the church, you are not saved. If you are in the church, without faith, you are not saved. If you are in or out of the church with faith, you are saved, and with no faith at all, you are lost, not saved. So those who spent many years within the church, after leaving without faith, they were never saved to begin with?
 
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