The Cross- The tree of the Knowledge of GOOD and EVIL

Dkh587 · Jul 22, 2018

pinacled said:
Shaul is a Pharisee who wrote well and had a gift for d,rashing. And i do not recall that he ever said sin entered the world with adam.

Romans 5:12

Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned

pinacled · Jul 22, 2018

Dkh587 said:
Romans 5:12

And what man is shaul speaking about?
Is there more in the Spirit of Knowledge and Understaning being given by shaul?
"For Lack of knowledge"
"By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith."

I don't recall shaul mentioning Adam in Romans 5
Perhaps he is speaking of the man of sin, qayin (cain)
the serpent is cursed for its actions seperate from Adam and Chavah. While the soil is cursed on account of adam. cain is cursed even more than the ground!

And the Lord said to Cain, "Why are you annoyed, and why has your countenance fallen? ווַיֹּ֥אמֶר יְהֹוָ֖ה אֶל־קָ֑יִן לָ֚מָּה חָ֣רָה לָ֔ךְ וְלָ֖מָּה נָֽפְל֥וּ פָנֶֽיךָ:
7Is it not so that if you improve, it will be forgiven you? If you do not improve, however, at the entrance, sin is lying, and to you is its longing, but you can rule over it." זהֲל֤וֹא אִם־תֵּיטִיב֙ שְׂאֵ֔ת וְאִם֙ לֹ֣א תֵיטִ֔יב לַפֶּ֖תַח חַטָּ֣את רֹבֵ֑ץ וְאֵלֶ֨יךָ֙ תְּשׁ֣וּקָת֔וֹ וְאַתָּ֖ה תִּמְשָׁל־בּֽוֹ: And Cain spoke to Abel his brother, and it came to pass when they were in the field, that Cain rose up against Abel his brother and slew him. חוַיֹּ֥אמֶר קַ֖יִן אֶל־הֶ֣בֶל אָחִ֑יו וַֽיְהִי֙ בִּֽהְיוֹתָ֣ם בַּשָּׂדֶ֔ה וַיָּ֥קָם קַ֛יִן אֶל־הֶ֥בֶל אָחִ֖יו וַיַּֽהַרְגֵֽהוּ:
And the Lord said to Cain, "Where is Abel your brother?" And he said, "I do not know. Am I my brother's keeper?" טוַיֹּ֤אמֶר יְהֹוָה֙ אֶל־קַ֔יִן אֵ֖י הֶ֣בֶל אָחִ֑יךָ וַיֹּ֨אמֶר֙ לֹ֣א יָדַ֔עְתִּי הֲשֹׁמֵ֥ר אָחִ֖י אָנֹֽכִי:
And He said, "What have you done? Hark! Your brother's blood cries out to Me from the earth. יוַיֹּ֖אמֶר מֶ֣ה עָשִׂ֑יתָ ק֚וֹל דְּמֵ֣י אָחִ֔יךָ צֹֽעֲקִ֥ים אֵלַ֖י מִן־הָֽאֲדָמָֽה:
And now,
you are cursed
even more than the ground,

which opened its mouth to take your brother's blood from your hand. יאוְעַתָּ֖ה אָר֣וּר אָ֑תָּה מִן־הָֽאֲדָמָה֙ אֲשֶׁ֣ר פָּֽצְתָ֣ה אֶת־פִּ֔יהָ לָקַ֛חַת אֶת־דְּמֵ֥י אָחִ֖יךָ מִיָּדֶֽךָ:

“You have heard that our fathers were told, ‘Do not murder,’ and that anyone who commits murder will be subject to judgment.
But I tell you that anyone who nurses anger without cause against his brother will be subject to judgment;

Blessings Always

Lulav · Jul 22, 2018

Heber Book List said:
It's a really interesting debate. Initially we need to know whether the Garden was where Israel now is. If this was so, then it is not going to be a problem because G_d could easily guide the Romans to cut down a particular tree - but which tree would it have been? Just one of the two for both the upright and the cross beam, or both with each tree making up a part of the cross e.g. the tree of good and evil as the cross beam and the Tree of Life as the vertical post (or vice versa); the symbalism would be amazing if that were to be the case. So many possibilities!

We know that there is a tree in the Garden of Gethesmane, the roots of which (and possibly the trunk) date back some two millennia, so treees can certainly live for long periods of time - longevity of tree life is not necessarily a problem. I read, many years ago, that it had been discovered, to the surprise of all in the scientific world, that under the ice in the Arctic circle evidence was found of lush green grasses, plants and trees, so maybe the Garden could have been anywhere. But where? It would be nice to think that it was, at least, somewhere in Israel, so that we could solve these issues, but maybe G_d would not want that tree / those trees to be found today.

Although the Romans would have cut down what was, to them, a random tree, there is no reason G_d could not have guided them to cut down a very old tree, even if they didn't realise it; there were, of course, a number of events within Yeshua's life that 'fulfilled prophecy' without the Romans, and others, ever realising them. This maybe one of those?

Certainly trees, or parts thereof, are used a lot, metaphorically, in the scriptures, some causing many problems (Romans 11:17ff), others having a feeling of reality that we can understand and accept (the trunk of Jesse), making Yeshua the Tree of Life, as well as the Vine, then there is the Garden , as you mention, and so on. Of course, all this will make no sense to those who say the Garden of Eden account is irrelevant, because the earth was not created as the Bible says.

I really love the Tree of Life in the Grand Synagogue in Jerusalem! My all time favourite stained glass window. I have a picture of it that I was given to me when I went there just after the synagogue was opened

Edited to add: If the Romans used the Tree of Life on which to crucify Yeshua, does that not mean that the Tree of Life (or the Tree of Good and Evil) is dead? Just an after-thought.

Strong painkiller effect might be the cause of the error in counting!

I hope you are feeling better now.

I don't think that the tree of life would be used in this, he was not conquering life, but the other one that lead to mans disobedience. That is the one that brought death into the world.

Yes, that tree in Gethsemane I've heard some interesting things about it, I hope to visit there someday but that may be a dream.

As far as where the garden was or more likely, 'is' I've been pondering different dimensions lately. Parallel universes or earths. Could it have been made available when it came time to crucify him?

A thought, since the serpent on a pole represented sin and they were told when they looked upon it they would be healed, which I believe represents what would happen in the future to Yeshua, and if we take this scripture along side that:

Isaiah 53
But He was pierced for our transgressions, He was crushed for our iniquities; the punishment that brought us peace was upon Him, and by His stripes we are healed.
6 We all like sheep have gone astray, each one has turned to his own way;and the L-RD has laid on Him the iniquity of us all.

I believe that at the moment before he gave up the Spirit and said Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?,
that was when the Father 'laid' upon him the sins of the world. That is what crushed him to death I believe.

But first the cross was laid upon him, could it have been a stake from the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil that caused death, which by dying on that cross he conquered?

Dkh587 · Jul 22, 2018

pinacled said:
And what man is shaul speaking about?
Is there more in the Spirit of Knowledge and Understaning being given by shaul?
"For Lack of knowledge"
"By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith."

I don't recall shaul mentioning Adam in Romans 5
Perhaps he is speaking of the man of sin, qayin (cain)

And the Lord said to Cain, "Why are you annoyed, and why has your countenance fallen? ווַיֹּ֥אמֶר יְהֹוָ֖ה אֶל־קָ֑יִן לָ֚מָּה חָ֣רָה לָ֔ךְ וְלָ֖מָּה נָֽפְל֥וּ פָנֶֽיךָ:
7Is it not so that if you improve, it will be forgiven you? If you do not improve, however, at the entrance, sin is lying, and to you is its longing, but you can rule over it." זהֲל֤וֹא אִם־תֵּיטִיב֙ שְׂאֵ֔ת וְאִם֙ לֹ֣א תֵיטִ֔יב לַפֶּ֖תַח חַטָּ֣את רֹבֵ֑ץ וְאֵלֶ֨יךָ֙ תְּשׁ֣וּקָת֔וֹ וְאַתָּ֖ה תִּמְשָׁל־בּֽוֹ:
8And Cain spoke to Abel his brother, and it came to pass when they were in the field, that Cain rose up against Abel his brother and slew him. חוַיֹּ֥אמֶר קַ֖יִן אֶל־הֶ֣בֶל אָחִ֑יו וַֽיְהִי֙ בִּֽהְיוֹתָ֣ם בַּשָּׂדֶ֔ה וַיָּ֥קָם קַ֛יִן אֶל־הֶ֥בֶל אָחִ֖יו וַיַּֽהַרְגֵֽהוּ:
9And the Lord said to Cain, "Where is Abel your brother?" And he said, "I do not know. Am I my brother's keeper?" טוַיֹּ֤אמֶר יְהֹוָה֙ אֶל־קַ֔יִן אֵ֖י הֶ֣בֶל אָחִ֑יךָ וַיֹּ֨אמֶר֙ לֹ֣א יָדַ֔עְתִּי הֲשֹׁמֵ֥ר אָחִ֖י אָנֹֽכִי:
10And He said, "What have you done? Hark! Your brother's blood cries out to Me from the earth. יוַיֹּ֖אמֶר מֶ֣ה עָשִׂ֑יתָ ק֚וֹל דְּמֵ֣י אָחִ֔יךָ צֹֽעֲקִ֥ים אֵלַ֖י מִן־הָֽאֲדָמָֽה:
11And now, you are cursed even more than the ground, which opened its mouth to take your brother's blood from your hand. יאוְעַתָּ֖ה אָר֣וּר אָ֑תָּה מִן־הָֽאֲדָמָה֙ אֲשֶׁ֣ר פָּֽצְתָ֣ה אֶת־פִּ֔יהָ לָקַ֛חַת אֶת־דְּמֵ֥י אָחִ֖יךָ מִיָּדֶֽךָ:

“You have heard that our fathers were told, ‘Do not murder,’ and that anyone who commits murder will be subject to judgment. 22 But I tell you that anyone who nurses anger without cause against his brother will be subject to judgment;

Blessings Always

Paul is making a contrast & comparison between the first and second Adam. Christ is the 2nd Adam. Paul is contrasting how through 1 man, sin and death came into the world. And by 1 man(Christ) we have life and righteousness.

He’s not talking about Cain. Adam brought sin and death into the world, not Cain.

pinacled · Jul 22, 2018

Dkh587 said:
Paul is making a contrast & comparison between the first and second Adam. Christ is the 2nd Adam. Paul is contrasting how through 1 man, sin and death came into the world. And by 1 man(Christ) we have life and righteousness.

He’s not talking about Cain. Adam brought sin and death into the world, not Cain.

Which death is it that Adam brought into The world?

Cain is another matter from what I've been taught.

Heber Book List · Jul 23, 2018

Lulav said:
I hope you are feeling better now.

I don't think that the tree of life would be used in this, he was not conquering life, but the other one that lead to mans disobedience. That is the one that brought death into the world.

Yes, that tree in Gethsemane I've heard some interesting things about it, I hope to visit there someday but that may be a dream.

As far as where the garden was or more likely, 'is' I've been pondering different dimensions lately. Parallel universes or earths. Could it have been made available when it came time to crucify him?

A thought, since the serpent on a pole represented sin and they were told when they looked upon it they would be healed, which I believe represents what would happen in the future to Yeshua, and if we take this scripture along side that:

Isaiah 53
But He was pierced for our transgressions, He was crushed for our iniquities; the punishment that brought us peace was upon Him, and by His stripes we are healed.
6 We all like sheep have gone astray, each one has turned to his own way;and the L-RD has laid on Him the iniquity of us all.

I believe that at the moment before he gave up the Spirit and said Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?,
that was when the Father 'laid' upon him the sins of the world. That is what crushed him to death I believe.

But first the cross was laid upon him, could it have been a stake from the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil that caused death, which by dying on that cross he conquered?

Yes, thank you, I am better. It took a month of rest and many painkillers, but I am up and about but must not lift heavy items any more or do things like digging the garden etc.

As I said in my post there are certainly lots of 'challenges' in thinking this through. I have a different view to you regarding forgiveness of sin so I am not wanting to go down that route, but I understand your logic in that regard.

When I first went to see the Garden of Gethsemane (1986) it was an open area where you could roam, or just sit in the shade and you could touch the tree but... because people have been cutting bits from it, the Garden is now protected and there are defined walkways and barriers to stop people getting close to the tree.

pinacled · Jul 23, 2018

Dkh587 said:
Paul is making a contrast & comparison between the first and second Adam. Christ is the 2nd Adam. Paul is contrasting how through 1 man, sin and death came into the world. And by 1 man(Christ) we have life and righteousness.

He’s not talking about Cain. Adam brought sin and death into the world, not Cain.

Yes,
I know that the first Adam is a Living soul and the second Adam a quickening Spirit'
You are not expounding upon scripture with Fruits..
Lacking a measure of something perhaps.

Think of what ole sha,aul spoke of about studying to show yourselves approved. Then consider the terrain of the torah and ask the Wonderful counselor for Understanding..
2 corinthians 10
"For although we do live in the world, we do not wage war in a worldly way; 4 because the weapons we use to wage war are not worldly. On the contrary, they have God’s power for demolishing strongholds. We demolish arguments 5 and every arrogance that raises itself up against the knowledge of God; we take every thought captive and make it obey the Messiah. 6 And when you have become completely obedient, then we will be ready to punish every act of disobedience."

who and what is cursed?
the serpent., and the soil..

I dont recall anything of a curse on Adam or Chavah.
its not till qayin(cain) murders his brother that the separation begins and the lineage of sheth for ten generations is preserved till noach and 7 others are redeemed from the destruction brought on by the wickedness of qayins' line.
Seems fairly simple to me..
The only thing i can speak of is what is written plainly first. PRDS.

romans 3
Generations
Then what advantage has the Jew? What is the value of being circumcised? 2 Much in every way! In the first place, the Jews were entrusted with the very words of God.
3 If some of them were unfaithful, so what? Does their faithlessness cancel God’s faithfulness? 4 Heaven forbid! God would be true even if everyone were a liar! — as the TaNaKh says,

“so that you, God, may be proved right in your words
and win the verdict when you are put on trial.”

5 Now if our unrighteousness highlights God’s righteousness, what should we say? That God is unrighteous to inflict his anger on us?
(I am speaking here the way people commonly do.)
6 Heaven forbid!
Else, how could God judge the world?
7 “But,” you say, “if, through my lie, God’s truth is enhanced and brings him greater glory, why am I still judged merely for being a sinner?” 8 Indeed! Why not say
(as some people slander us by claiming we do say),

“Let us do evil, so that good may come of it”?
Against them the judgment is a just one!

I believe there is more than most want to see in the genealogy accounts given by Matthew and Luke.
There is Discernment being offered with each.
Matthew speaks of a specific number of generations to share something important to all of us. Especially to those who think to heap a burden on the innocent who the Lord never asked to carry such.

Then in Luke we are allowed to follow the Blood line all the way to Adam the son of God.
Where their is Blood there is?
I can only imagine a reason the serpent would think to call the woman cursed.

Perhaps she has been secreted away for a time this yr.

2 corinthians 4
The Tanakh says, “I trusted, therefore I spoke.” Since we have that same Spirit who enables us to trust, we also trust and therefore speak; 14 because we know that he who raised the Lord Yeshua will also raise us with Yeshua and bring us along with you into his presence. 15 All this is for your sakes, so that as grace flows out to more and more people, it may cause thanksgiving to overflow and bring glory to God.

16 This is why we do not lose courage. Though our outer self is heading for decay, our inner self is being renewed daily. 17 For our light and transient troubles are achieving for us an everlasting glory whose weight is beyond description. 18 We concentrate not on what is seen but on what is not seen, since things seen are temporary, but things not seen are eternal.

Dkh587 · Jul 23, 2018

pinacled said:
Yes,
I know that the first Adam is a Living soul and the second Adam a quickening Spirit'
You are not expounding upon scripture with Fruits..
Lacking a measure of something perhaps.

Think of what ole sha,aul spoke of about studying to show yourselves approved. Then consider the terrain of the torah and ask the Wonderful counselor for Understanding..
2 corinthians 10
"For although we do live in the world, we do not wage war in a worldly way; 4 because the weapons we use to wage war are not worldly. On the contrary, they have God’s power for demolishing strongholds. We demolish arguments 5 and every arrogance that raises itself up against the knowledge of God; we take every thought captive and make it obey the Messiah. 6 And when you have become completely obedient, then we will be ready to punish every act of disobedience."

who and what is cursed?
the serpent., and the soil..

I dont recall anything of a curse on Adam or Chavah.
its not till qayin(cain) murders his brother that the separation begins and the lineage of sheth for ten generations is preserved till noach and 7 others are redeemed from the destruction brought on by the wickedness of qayins' line.
Seems fairly simple to me..
The only thing i can speak of is what is written plainly first. PRDS.

romans 3
Generations
Then what advantage has the Jew? What is the value of being circumcised? 2 Much in every way! In the first place, the Jews were entrusted with the very words of God.
3 If some of them were unfaithful, so what? Does their faithlessness cancel God’s faithfulness? 4 Heaven forbid! God would be true even if everyone were a liar! — as the TaNaKh says,

“so that you, God, may be proved right in your words
and win the verdict when you are put on trial.”

5 Now if our unrighteousness highlights God’s righteousness, what should we say? That God is unrighteous to inflict his anger on us?
(I am speaking here the way people commonly do.)
6 Heaven forbid!
Else, how could God judge the world?
7 “But,” you say, “if, through my lie, God’s truth is enhanced and brings him greater glory, why am I still judged merely for being a sinner?” 8 Indeed! Why not say
(as some people slander us by claiming we do say),

“Let us do evil, so that good may come of it”?
Against them the judgment is a just one!

I believe there is more than most want to see in the genealogy accounts given by Matthew and Luke.
There is Discernment being offered with each.
Matthew speaks of a specific number of generations to share something important to all of us. Especially to those who think to heap a burden on the innocent who the Lord never asked to carry such.

Then in Luke we are allowed to follow the Blood line all the way to Adam the son of God.
Where their is Blood there is?
I can only imagine a reason the serpent would think to call the woman cursed.

Perhaps she has been secreted away for a time this yr.

2 corinthians 4
The Tanakh says, “I trusted, therefore I spoke.” Since we have that same Spirit who enables us to trust, we also trust and therefore speak; 14 because we know that he who raised the Lord Yeshua will also raise us with Yeshua and bring us along with you into his presence. 15 All this is for your sakes, so that as grace flows out to more and more people, it may cause thanksgiving to overflow and bring glory to God.

16 This is why we do not lose courage. Though our outer self is heading for decay, our inner self is being renewed daily. 17 For our light and transient troubles are achieving for us an everlasting glory whose weight is beyond description. 18 We concentrate not on what is seen but on what is not seen, since things seen are temporary, but things not seen are eternal.

i have no idea what you’re going on about, but my only purpose of responding was to show that the Apostle Paul did teach that sin came through 1 man: Adam

pinacled · Jul 23, 2018

Dkh587 said:
i have no idea what you’re going on about, but my only purpose of responding was to show that the Apostle Paul did teach that sin came through 1 man: Adam

Paul taught no such thing.
You were taught this.
And you are not being sincere enough to see what is plainly wrtten before venturing further through the P.(R.ez)D.S. of what paul was teaching in many letters.
I hope you haven't made up your mind about a doctrine that leads to destruction.

One that imputes sin where there is none.

Listen closer to what paul said of Adam not being deceived.
And ask the Holy Spirit what that might mean.
There is far more going on than a mere transgression.
Imagine if no one was ever allowed to read the from the Torah.
Trust and Faithfullnes is in every Promise given from the Lord's mouth.

pinacled · Jul 24, 2018

I don't recall ever hearing anything about the 4 women on the ark.
And i imagine the reason is purity.
From chavah (mother of all living) till rebecah there is no mention of women as far as I can see.
But what do I know.

Perhaps if someone where to listen to the Holy Spirit with the gift of clarity given by our Lord in the Living Water They would consider the genealogy account given by yair(luke).
Yes,
The difference between him and matit,yahu (matthew) giving a generational account is a beautiful gift as far as I can see.

Has anyone here ever considered the Torah and walked with a strength of forgiveness with the wonderfull counselor To ask for instruction?

I see something profound in what was freely given to yair(luke) concerning this genealogy.
A blood line that a person can follow all the way to Adam the Living soul and son of God.
Where there is blood?
The life is in the?

Ah yes,
Three that bare witness on earth.

Only a yet, to peirce time with 3s and 4s.
Stand or stumble, faith is a handbreadth to bring forth the Lily of the feild.

Mattit,yahu justly gave with charity what yeshayahu spoke of freely. The place beyond the sod that was once hidden in the first command with promise. Is now a seal the enemy cannot reach.
Sealed to be trampled into the very dust outside the garden the Adam was formed from.

Blessings Always.

visionary · Jul 24, 2018

pinacled said:
I don't recall ever hearing anything about the 4 women on the ark.
And i imagine the reason is purity.
From chavah (mother of all living) till rebecah there is no mention of women as far as I can see.
But what do I know.

Perhaps if someone where to listen to the Holy Spirit with the gift of clarity given by our Lord in the Living Water They would consider the genealogy account given by yair(luke).
Yes,
The difference between him and matit,yahu (matthew) giving a generational account is a beautiful gift as far as I can see.

Has anyone here ever considered the Torah and walked with a strength of forgiveness with the wonderfull counselor To ask for instruction?

I see something profound in what was freely given to yair(luke) concerning this genealogy.
A blood line that a person can follow all the way to Adam the Living soul and son of God.
Where there is blood?
The life is in the?

Ah yes,
Three that bare witness on earth.

Only a yet, to peirce time with 3s and 4s.
Stand or stumble, faith is a handbreadth to bring forth the Lily of the feild.

Mattit,yahu justly gave with charity what yeshayahu spoke of freely. The place beyond the sod that was once hidden in the first command with promise. Is now a seal the enemy cannot reach.
Sealed to be trampled into the very dust outside the garden the Adam was formed from.

Blessings Always.

Noah and three sons... =four men with their wives.
Genesis 7:7
Noah, his sons, his wife, and his sons’ wives with him entered the ark to escape the floodwaters.

pinacled · Jul 24, 2018

visionary said:
Noah and three sons... =four men with their wives.
Genesis 7:7
Noah, his sons, his wife, and his sons’ wives with him entered the ark to escape the floodwaters.

I like to think their wives names were so beautiful that the world could not restrain them.
I imagine they are like a still small voice that shook the enemy to fear.
The first to be blessed.
I imagine they were a blessing very few find.

But what do I know.

If only Solomon in all the gifts of wisdom would of said I don't know.

visionary · Jul 24, 2018

I heard one explanation about why after the cleaning by water, that within a short period of time the Babylon was being built... So the water cleansing did not cleanse the 8 souls and in the children came for a new generation of sinners. It is said that is was one of the wives who had "nephilim blood" and thus there ran the DNA for giants. We know that Noah was "perfect" in his generation.
Genesis 6:9
These are the generations of Noah: Noah was a just man and perfect in his generations, and Noah walked with God.

pinacled · Jul 25, 2018

genesis 10
The sons of Shem were Elam and Asshur and Arpachshad and Lud and Aram
1 chronicles 1
And Arpachshad begot Shelah, and Shelah begot Eber.

luke 3
of Shelah,
of Arpakhshad, of Shem, of Noach, of Lemekh,
37 of Metushelach, of Hanokh, of Yered, of Mahalal’el, of Keinan,
38 of Enosh, of Shet, of Adam, of God.

I wonder how and why this name is listed in the lineages?
36 of Keinan,

pinacled · Jul 26, 2018

pinacled said:
And what man is shaul speaking about?
Is there more in the Spirit of Knowledge and Understaning being given by shaul?
"For Lack of knowledge"
"By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith."

I don't recall shaul mentioning Adam in Romans 5
Perhaps he is speaking of the man of sin, qayin (cain)
the serpent is cursed for its actions seperate from Adam and Chavah. While the soil is cursed on account of adam. cain is cursed even more than the ground!

And the Lord said to Cain, "Why are you annoyed, and why has your countenance fallen? ווַיֹּ֥אמֶר יְהֹוָ֖ה אֶל־קָ֑יִן לָ֚מָּה חָ֣רָה לָ֔ךְ וְלָ֖מָּה נָֽפְל֥וּ פָנֶֽיךָ:
7Is it not so that if you improve, it will be forgiven you? If you do not improve, however, at the entrance, sin is lying, and to you is its longing, but you can rule over it." זהֲל֤וֹא אִם־תֵּיטִיב֙ שְׂאֵ֔ת וְאִם֙ לֹ֣א תֵיטִ֔יב לַפֶּ֖תַח חַטָּ֣את רֹבֵ֑ץ וְאֵלֶ֨יךָ֙ תְּשׁ֣וּקָת֔וֹ וְאַתָּ֖ה תִּמְשָׁל־בּֽוֹ: And Cain spoke to Abel his brother, and it came to pass when they were in the field, that Cain rose up against Abel his brother and slew him. חוַיֹּ֥אמֶר קַ֖יִן אֶל־הֶ֣בֶל אָחִ֑יו וַֽיְהִי֙ בִּֽהְיוֹתָ֣ם בַּשָּׂדֶ֔ה וַיָּ֥קָם קַ֛יִן אֶל־הֶ֥בֶל אָחִ֖יו וַיַּֽהַרְגֵֽהוּ:
And the Lord said to Cain, "Where is Abel your brother?" And he said, "I do not know. Am I my brother's keeper?" טוַיֹּ֤אמֶר יְהֹוָה֙ אֶל־קַ֔יִן אֵ֖י הֶ֣בֶל אָחִ֑יךָ וַיֹּ֨אמֶר֙ לֹ֣א יָדַ֔עְתִּי הֲשֹׁמֵ֥ר אָחִ֖י אָנֹֽכִי:
And He said, "What have you done? Hark! Your brother's blood cries out to Me from the earth. יוַיֹּ֖אמֶר מֶ֣ה עָשִׂ֑יתָ ק֚וֹל דְּמֵ֣י אָחִ֔יךָ צֹֽעֲקִ֥ים אֵלַ֖י מִן־הָֽאֲדָמָֽה:
And now,
you are cursed
even more than the ground,

which opened its mouth to take your brother's blood from your hand. יאוְעַתָּ֖ה אָר֣וּר אָ֑תָּה מִן־הָֽאֲדָמָה֙ אֲשֶׁ֣ר פָּֽצְתָ֣ה אֶת־פִּ֔יהָ לָקַ֛חַת אֶת־דְּמֵ֥י אָחִ֖יךָ מִיָּדֶֽךָ:

“You have heard that our fathers were told, ‘Do not murder,’ and that anyone who commits murder will be subject to judgment.
But I tell you that anyone who nurses anger without cause against his brother will be subject to judgment;

Blessings Always

deuteronomy 21
“If, in the land Adonai your God is giving you to possess, a murder victim is found lying in the countryside; and the perpetrator of the murder is not known; 2 then your leaders and judges are to go out and measure the distance between it and the surrounding towns. 3 After it has been determined which town is the closest, the leaders of that town are to take a young female cow that has never been put to work or yoked for use as a draft animal. 4 The leaders of that town are to bring the heifer down to a vadi with a stream in it that never dries up, to a place that is neither plowed nor sown; and they are to break the cow’s neck there in the vadi. 5 Then the cohanim, who are L’vi’im, are to approach; for Adonai your God has chosen them to serve him and to pronounce blessings in the name of Adonai; they will decide the outcome of every dispute and matter involving violence. 6 All the leaders of the town nearest the murder victim are to wash their hands over the cow whose neck was broken in the vadi. (Maftir) 7 Then they are to speak up and say, ‘This blood was not shed by our hands, nor have we seen who did it. 8 Adonai, forgive your people Isra’el, whom you redeemed; do not allow innocent blood to be shed among your people Isra’el.’ And they will be forgiven this bloodshed. 9 Thus you will banish the shedding of innocent blood from among you, by doing what Adonai sees as right.

Haftarah Shof’tim: Yesha‘yahu (Isaiah) 51:12–52:12 [Messianic adaptation: conclude the reading at 53:12]

B’rit Hadashah suggested readings for Parashah Shof’tim: Mattityahu (Matthew) 5:38–42; 18:15–20; Acts 3:13–26; 7:35–53; 1 Corinthians 5:9–13; 1 Timothy 5:17–22; Messianic Jews (Hebrews) 10:28–31

Parashah 49: Ki Tetze (When you go out) 21:10 –25:19
10 “When you go out to war against your enemies, and Adonai your God hands them over to you, and you take prisoners, 11 and you see among the prisoners a woman who looks good to you, and you feel attracted to her and want her as your wife; 12 you are to bring her home to your house, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails 13 and remove her prison clothing. She will stay there in your house, mourning her father and mother for a full month; after which you may go in to have sexual relations with her and be her husband, and she will be your wife. 14 In the event that you lose interest in her, you are to let her go wherever she wishes; but you may not sell her for money or treat her like a slave, because you humiliated her.

15 “If a man has two wives, the one loved and the other unloved, and both the loved and unloved wives have borne him children, and if the firstborn son is the child of the unloved wife; 16 then, when it comes time for him to pass his inheritance on to his sons, he may not give the inheritance due the firstborn to the son of the loved wife in place of the son of the unloved one, who is in fact the firstborn. 17 No, he must acknowledge as firstborn the son of the unloved wife by giving him a double portion of everything he owns, for he is the firstfruits of his manhood, and the right of the firstborn is his.

18 “If a man has a stubborn, rebellious son who will not obey what his father or mother says, and even after they discipline him he still refuses to pay attention to them; 19 then his father and mother are to take hold of him and bring him out to the leaders of his town, at the gate of that place, 20 and say to the leaders of his town, ‘This son of ours is stubborn and rebellious, he doesn’t pay attention to us, lives wildly, gets drunk.’ 21 Then all the men of his town are to stone him to death; in this way you will put an end to such wickedness among you, and all Isra’el will hear about it and be afraid.

(ii) 22 “If someone has committed a capital crime and is put to death, then hung on a tree, 23 his body is not to remain all night on the tree, but you must bury him the same day, because a person who has been hanged has been cursed by God — so that you will not defile your land, which Adonai your God is giving you to inherit.

Devarim (The words...) (Deuteronomy)
}5 The light shines in the darkness,
and the darkness has not suppressed it.

1 corinthians 12
Therefore, I want to make it clear to you that no one speaking by the Spirit of God ever says, “Yeshua is cursed!” and no one can say, “Yeshua is Lord,” except by the Ruach HaKodesh.

pinacled · Jul 27, 2018

pinacled said:
genesis 10
The sons of Shem were Elam and Asshur and Arpachshad and Lud and Aram
1 chronicles 1
And Arpachshad begot Shelah, and Shelah begot Eber.

luke 3
of Shelah,
of Arpakhshad, of Shem, of Noach, of Lemekh,
37 of Metushelach, of Hanokh, of Yered, of Mahalal’el, of Keinan,
38 of Enosh, of Shet, of Adam, of God.

I wonder how and why this name is listed in the lineages?
36 of Keinan,

Not that it matters much concerning the Honorable bond of Peace sealed upon the faithful.
It just seems to me that it would benefit many if and when the original Aramaic or hebrew script were realeased to the public.
Titus 1
The spirit of knowledge and understanding of truth in the certainty of Hope offered by the Holy One of Yisrael.

Titus 2
Sons and Daughters.

Titus 3
No manner of genealogy nor census ever records our Lord's existence in the flesh by Mark of any government of the world.
No,
And i imagine he kept it this way for Good reason.
From: Sha’ul, God’s slave and an emissary of Yeshua the Messiah, sent to promote among God’s chosen people the trust and knowledge of truth which lead to godliness 2 and which are based on the certain hope of eternal life. God, who does not lie, promised that life before the beginning of time 3 but made public this word of his in its own season through a proclamation with which I have been entrusted by order of God, our Deliverer.

Blessings Always.

pinacled · Jul 27, 2018

John 19
[ "Pilate then took Yeshua and had him flogged. 2 The soldiers twisted thorn-branches into a crown and placed it on his head, put a purple robe on him, 3 and went up to him, saying over and over, “Hail, ‘king of the Jews’!” and hitting him in the face.

4 Pilate went outside once more and said to the crowd, “Look, I’m bringing him out to you to get you to understand that I find no case against him.” 5 So Yeshua came out, wearing the thorn-branch crown and the purple robe. Pilate said to them, “Look at the man!” 6 When the head cohanimand the Temple guards saw him they shouted, “Put him to death on the stake! Put him to death on the stake!” Pilate said to them, “You take him out yourselves and put him to death on the stake, because I don’t find any case against him.” 7 The Judeans answered him, “We have a law; according to that law, he ought to be put to death, because he made himself out to be the Son of God.” 8 On hearing this, Pilate became even more frightened.

9 He went back into the headquarters and asked Yeshua, “Where are you from?” But Yeshua didn’t answer. 10 So Pilate said to him, “You refuse to speak to me? Don’t you understand that it is in my power either to set you free or to have you executed on the stake?” 11 Yeshua answered, “You would have no power over me if it hadn’t been given to you from above; this is why the one who handed me over to you is guilty of a greater sin.” 12 On hearing this, Pilate tried to find a way to set him free; but the Judeans shouted, “If you set this man free, it means you’re not a ‘Friend of the Emperor’! Everyone who claims to be a king is opposing the Emperor!” 13 When Pilate heard what they were saying, he brought Yeshua outside and sat down on the judge’s seat in the place called The Pavement (in Aramaic,Gabta); "]

Being reminded of the vainity is painful enough when reading iyov, or yirmiyahu.
But always I am reminded of His authority.
If the Lord says iyov is blameless, that is the end of the matter. If the Lord says noach is righteous, that is the end of the matter.
If the Lord says danyl is faithful, that is the end of the matter.

And when Yeshua speaks, it is the Lord All mighties Authority, and the Love poured upon all who enter His rest.

It is difficult to accept.
But Yeshua was convicted by the whole of Yisrayl,s appointed judges of a certain generation that convicted Yeshua to death for claiming to be a Son of God. To the judges who knew the Torah and being a people chosen, this is amazing in how the Lord showed himself on horev until they were ready to recieve the double blessing upon tzion. I look at the meekness and pain Moshe carries as a gift. Water and bread.
Upon a time even he was willing to sacrifice more than what I've heard spoken of these days. I imagine the Lord knew His heart very well. And i imagine that his ears and eyes are a gift that some have forsaken.
Until a time the Lord sees so fit too Wash the Souls of mankind once again.

I see Pilate as a type baal, who refused to curse until forced. Similar to what ya,akov spoke of concerning the blessing and curse.
James 3
For those who listen in the Spirit of Understanding, this is the pain to carry that Yeshua spoke of.
There was a time when rebellion was sealed away by the Blood of an animal.
Innocent blood to cover the filth of the serpent.
Yet the serpent being a violent murderer, became even more envious of man. To a point where it thought it could deceive Yeshua himself.
The second Adam was more than a match for the would be ursurper. Being trampled over by the seed of promise for so many generations. It's mind being sealed to the dust outside the garden became a place of desolation. in desperation and delerium it's kind consumes its own mother with no regard.
Power corrupts....?

Blessed be the Name.

pinacled · Jul 27, 2018

Lulav said:
Was the Cross actually made of the tree from the Garden in Eden?

8 And the L-RD God planted a garden eastward in Eden; and there he put the man whom he had formed.
9 And out of the ground made the L-RD God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

This paradise was not created on earth, in stead we read that it was 'planted' there by G-d.

Many think because it's talking about a garden that it means that G-d stuck seeds in the ground and trees came up. I don't think that is what it was trying to convey.

You can 'plant your feet'. This means you pick them up and put them down in a place you want. It can mean to put into place, to post or station something firmly.

Now in this 'garden' this is what the L-RD did: out of the ground made the L-RD God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food.

So these are beautiful trees that would provide a great environment and also be good for food if one so desired.

Now what follows has been a riddle of the centuries.

"the tree of life also in the midst of the garden,
and the tree of knowledge of good and evil."

In the middle of the fruit trees we find these two other 'trees'.

Why are they there? Why not just the fruit trees?

If one is called the Tree of Life, why isn't the other called the Tree of Death?

The eating from it is what brought death to mankind.

but it is called' the tree of knowledge of good and evil'

In other words, The Tree of the knowledge of right and wrong (in G-ds eyes)

Only one knew what that was because he had defied G-d and rebelled.

That one in Revelation 12 is called :

…But the dragon was not strong enough, and no longer was any place found in heaven for him and his angels.
9 And the great dragon was hurled down — the ancient serpent called the devil and Satan, the deceiver of the whole world.

I won't get into why he was allowed in the Garden with Adam and Havah, but it seems by the passage in Ezekiel he was there before he fell and was allowed to stay to test the new creation.

So it is not too much conjecture to postulate that the 'tree' of the knowledge of good/evil right/wrong, is the Adversary.

The Adversary is the one who opposes G-d.

Now there was another Tree there, and this is the 'Opposed'.

the Gospel of John harkens back many times to the Creation story and Genesis. This passage does so as well.

5 “Lord,” said Thomas, “we do not know where You are going, so how can we know the way?”
6 Jesus answered, “I am the way, the truth, and the life".

Since Ancient times when the Torah is brought up Proverbs 3:17-18 is recited as follows.

“It is a tree of life to all who grasp it, and whoever holds on to it is happy; its ways are ways of pleasantness, and all it paths are peace.

The Torah is considered Israel's wisdom , direct from G-d.

When we look in the last book of the Bible, Revelation we see back to the Garden, however this time something is missing, the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil.

There is only one tree standing there,

The tree of LIFE>

Gen 3:…23 therefore the L-RD God sent him out from the garden of Eden, to cultivate the ground from which he was taken.
24 So He drove the man out; and at the east of the garden of Eden He stationed the cherubim and the flaming sword which turned every direction to guard the way to the tree of life.

No mention of the other tree there. Nor here either.

Rev 22:1Then the angel showed me a river of the water of life, as clear as crystal, flowing from the throne of God and of the Lamb,
2 down the middle of the main street of the city. On either side of the river stood a tree of life, producing twelve kinds of fruit and yielding a fresh crop for each month. And the leaves of the tree are for the healing of the nations.

So what happened to that other tree?

I propose that was used to make the Cross upon whom our Savior hung from.

The unblemished lamb who took on the sins of the world.

Good -- Evil

Right (keeping G-ds laws) ---Wrong--(lawless)

The deceiver who was in the garden did not just lie that would be too easy, a deceiver is one who 'mixes' truth with lies.

When the Israelites were in the wilderness they not only rebelled agaisnt Moses, but of G-d himself, they became like the Adversary.

…5 The people spoke against God and Moses, "Why have you brought us up out of Egypt to die in the wilderness? For there is no food and no water, and we loathe this miserable food." 6 The L-RD sent fiery serpents among the people and they bit the people, so that many people of Israel died.

What was the cure?

They repented and Moses interceded for them. (Numbers 21)

And the L-RD said unto Moses, Make thee a fiery serpent, and set it upon a pole: and it shall come to pass, that every one that is bitten, when he looketh upon it, shall live.
And Moses made a serpent of brass, and put it upon a pole, and it came to pass, that if a serpent had bitten any man, when he beheld the serpent of brass, he lived.

The serpent is of course the Adversary, but why is it put upon a pole?

Because it represented the Salvation G-d was to ultimately bring to his people.

Yeshua was that Serpent on the Pole.

He 'became' sin for us. The Father put the sins of the people upon him. What was Good and pure now became Evil and impure.

The tree of life became the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil to restore us back to the Garden where we can once again Walk with G-d with no more temptation.

I let my beard grow for a month .

The Cross- The tree of the Knowledge of GOOD and EVIL

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walking with the Shekinah

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Your God is my God... Ruth said, so say I.

walking with the Shekinah

Your God is my God... Ruth said, so say I.

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