Boyfriend thinks everything I wear is sleazy?

Paul of Eugene OR · Jun 28, 2018

Kazzy0614 said:
I have indeed been reading every comment. I'm kind of disappointed it has become a debate instead of what I came here for, advice.

A lot of you have been noting that you're working with the little information I have given you. Here's some more which may help you discern the situation better.

At 11 years old, my dad left my family for another woman. This REALLY messed me up. The next year when I was 12, some men broke in my house and tried to kill my family and I. I dealt with severe anxiety for 5 years, so bad I couldn't even sleep at night or have a normal day.

I'm telling you all this so you have a sense of my personal struggles, and so that you know I am hyper sensitive to people leaving me. Which could explain why I'm so afraid the man I love will leave me if I'm not perfect to him.

He is extremely insecure, and also jealous. His beliefs on no kissing, modesty etc are his own choice, not because he was raised like that. We go to the same church. We both believe the same spiritually.

He's never told me outright when I'm wearing something he doesn't appreciate, but he does tell me about things he'd prefer me wear. I.e the whole prom dress situation. He just seems very disappointed if my neckline is too low or my pants are too tight. Which hurts my self esteem.

The whole "dress code" situation has been bugging me but it's been heightened lately because he's not even talking with me like he used to. We used to have the most lighthearted, fun, amazing conversations that lasted most of the night but now I'm lucky if he texts me asking for something. Sometimes he even ignores me now. Perhaps I'm too scared to let it go...

Kissing before marriage is just fine. You just need to share the same boundaries, that's all. Dress we've discussed already. Just keep praying for guidance and treating him in a fair and square way. I'd say just keep dressing the way you want to be dressing for the rest of your life and if that drives him off he isn't right for you. You don't want to present him with a personality that isn't the real you, after all, that wouldn't be fair to him.

Brokenhill · Jun 29, 2018

Zoii said:
Good reply but I'd ask you to consider this.
The bible is a paradigm on which to live your life while being a decent person. Its not meant to prevent the social progression of norms - why should it - and even if it wanted to it can't hold back that tide.

You and I dont live in the time of the bible and we do adopt today's norms. That does not make you or I a bad person.

This girl is 18 and I'm 17. Why shouldn't we wear the trends of today's fashion. Why should men condemn her as having some sort of immoral heart for wearing today's clothes and wanting to feel good about how she dresses. What right have we to coerce or demoralise someone based on how they look. Using examples of a girl walking naked - Im a bit flabbergasted by that example

To take the other extreme - I see the exact arguments you are using to be completely dropped when threads start talking about the conservative dress of muslim women - so conservative they cover their whole head. Then we get the same people who are criticising the OP, also criticising the way some moslem women dress.

Just because a teenager dresses like your average teenager, doesn't make them a harlot or some of the other terrible insinuations thrown around on this forum.

Thank you for your reply.

The bible is not just about learning how to be a decent person. Yes, anyone (including atheists) can become decent people if they just apply the principals found in scripture. There's nothing wrong with using the bible for that purpose, but the bible is so much more.

The bible is about God creating a perfect world for humans to live peaceful and happy but subordinate to God. This world included free will (without free will, love does not exist)...and then us humans used our free will to rebel and inflate ourselves to try and be as God, which put a curse on humans and corrupted the perfect world.
The bible is about God's plan of reconciliation for his "lost" creation, so that they can once again finally live peacefully (but still subordinate to Him).

I'm sure you are familiar with a bit of Genesis, particularly the creation account. I just want to highlight one verse which is a nice condensed image for the summation of the curse:

Gen. 3:24
"24 So He drove the man out; and at the east of the garden of Eden He stationed the cherubim and the flaming sword which turned every direction to guard the way to the tree of life."

It's interesting that the very last book of the Bible, Revelation, perfectly wraps up and concisely concludes the story...after thousands of years of history and various dispensations, we finally are brought back to the garden of Eden.
Revelation 22:14,
"14 Blessed are those who wash their robes, so that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter by the gates into the city."

God brings us back!

Now, I went through that whole explanation to say this: We are still residing in a corrupt Earth. But God EXPECTS us to rise above the corruption and become spiritual people.

1 Peter 1:16 "because it is written, “You shall be holy, for I am holy.”"
Matthew 5:48 "Therefore you are to be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect."

Christianity is not just about being a decent person while we travel through life. It's about radically changing the way we think and act...rising above any societal corruption (regardless of what century or country we're living in).

________

Now, of course societies will change and "progress". And many societal changes are not harmful...they are not necessarily wrong to participate in. For example, using digital currency is something in our modern world that is obviously not in the bible...but it has no affect on our morality. But yet the principals of greed or stealing are still applicable...so it's equally wrong to steal comeone's credit card--not just their cash (I know, this is a duh statement).

Coming back to clothing...
While some modern fashions are perfectly acceptable to be a apart of...there are some aspects of fashion that are not appropriate for Christians based on the eternal principals of modesty that we find in scripture. We're told not to be stumbling blocks to our brothers/sisters. So within reason we should be able to help others by the way we dress so that they may be spiritually pure. Now, you can't please everyone...some men/women are going to have a lust problem no matter how modest the opposite sex is dressing...but at that point it's only the lusting person's fault. The other person has absolved themselves of fault.
Aside from sexuality, modesty actually another aspect to it...and that is the fact that we should not be pumping lots of money into our clothing/looks...the way we dress is not supposed to be a source of pride for us, it's supposed to be more-so for the functionality of covering, staying cool/warm/dry/etc.

Thank you for reading.

Zoii · Jun 29, 2018

Brokenhill said:
Thank you for your reply.

The bible is not just about learning how to be a decent person. Yes, anyone (including atheists) can become decent people if they just apply the principals found in scripture. There's nothing wrong with using the bible for that purpose, but the bible is so much more.

The bible is about God creating a perfect world for humans to live peaceful and happy but subordinate to God. This world included free will (without free will, love does not exist)...and then us humans used our free will to rebel and inflate ourselves to try and be as God, which put a curse on humans and corrupted the perfect world.
The bible is about God's plan of reconciliation for his "lost" creation, so that they can once again finally live peacefully (but still subordinate to Him).

I'm sure you are familiar with a bit of Genesis, particularly the creation account. I just want to highlight one verse which is a nice condensed image for the summation of the curse:

Gen. 3:24
"24 So He drove the man out; and at the east of the garden of Eden He stationed the cherubim and the flaming sword which turned every direction to guard the way to the tree of life."

It's interesting that the very last book of the Bible, Revelation, perfectly wraps up and concisely concludes the story...after thousands of years of history and various dispensations, we finally are brought back to the garden of Eden.
Revelation 22:14,
"14 Blessed are those who wash their robes, so that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter by the gates into the city."

God brings us back!

Now, I went through that whole explanation to say this: We are still residing in a corrupt Earth. But God EXPECTS us to rise above the corruption and become spiritual people.

1 Peter 1:16 "because it is written, “You shall be holy, for I am holy.”"
Matthew 5:48 "Therefore you are to be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect."

Christianity is not just about being a decent person while we travel through life. It's about radically changing the way we think and act...rising above any societal corruption (regardless of what century or country we're living in).

________

Now, of course societies will change and "progress". And many societal changes are not harmful...they are not necessarily wrong to participate in. For example, using digital currency is something in our modern world that is obviously not in the bible...but it has no affect on our morality. But yet the principals of greed or stealing are still applicable...so it's equally wrong to steal comeone's credit card--not just their cash (I know, this is a duh statement).

Coming back to clothing...
While some modern fashions are perfectly acceptable to be a apart of...there are some aspects of fashion that are not appropriate for Christians based on the eternal principals of modesty that we find in scripture. We're told not to be stumbling blocks to our brothers/sisters. So within reason we should be able to help others by the way we dress so that they may be spiritually pure. Now, you can't please everyone...some men/women are going to have a lust problem no matter how modest the opposite sex is dressing...but at that point it's only the lusting person's fault. The other person has absolved themselves of fault.
Aside from sexuality, modesty actually another aspect to it...and that is the fact that we should not be pumping lots of money into our clothing/looks...the way we dress is not supposed to be a source of pride for us, it's supposed to be more-so for the functionality of covering, staying cool/warm/dry/etc.

Thank you for reading.

That was a long answer; too long for me to respond to all of it. I'll focus on this:
the way we dress is not supposed to be a source of pride . Your argument seems to suggest that if she dresses in a manner such that she likes how she looks and wants to dress nicely; Its immoral by vitue of being prideful and shouldn't be spending lots of money.

I have no issues with having some pride. I think self respect, and a desire to look and feel good about yourself is admirable. I dont see any suggestion from her (or me) wanting to look like a harlot; but yet like me wants to wear swim wear at a beach and look neat and attractive when I go places.

What angers me about christian men is they want to turn that into something horrible and ugly. Your full of lust and pride and you dishonour God. Im not buying into that constant crush we get from Christian men. Christian men can think badly of us if that's what they want. I cant stop that. It doesn't mean I have to levy any respect towards them for it though - quite the opposite.

I also dont respect the way Christian men accuse women of wrong doing because the man cant control their lustful thoughts and I have to take some responsibility for that. You know I manage my thoughts just fine. Why cant men just sort themselves out and stop throwing their own failures and weakness back onto their partners.

Faith77 · Jun 29, 2018

GirdYourLoins said:
...Another (of many) possibility is that abusers often find people who are mentally weak, often because they are victims of abuse or trauma, and use this weakness to impose their control over them. We really dont have enough information and dont know either of you so its impossible for us to call.

The phrase "mentally weak" is a little misleading and may puzzle the OP. Evidence from research suggests that abusers seek out people who are kind and willing to put the partner ahead of themselves, whether they have been abused or not. The fact that sometimes offenders seem to target those with a background of abuse is because the abused discloses details of the past (in good faith) and a skilled offender uses that disclosure to find out what the fears and needs of the victims are to manipulate the victim. But a perpetrator will also target those who haven't been victimized, just anyone who will show willingness to pander to the needs of the perpetrator. Often the person also has a conscientious and kind heart.

Brokenhill · Jun 29, 2018

Zoii said:
That was a long answer; too long for me to respond to all of it. I'll focus on this:
the way we dress is not supposed to be a source of pride . Your argument seems to suggest that if she dresses in a manner such that she likes how she looks and wants to dress nicely; Its immoral by vitue of being prideful and shouldn't be spending lots of money.

I have no issues with having some pride. I think self respect, and a desire to look and feel good about yourself is admirable. I dont see any suggestion from her (or me) wanting to look like a harlot; but yet like me wants to wear swim wear at a beach and look neat and attractive when I go places.

What angers me about christian men is they want to turn that into something horrible and ugly. Your full of lust and pride and you dishonour God. Im not buying into that constant crush we get from Christian men. Christian men can think badly of us if that's what they want. I cant stop that. It doesn't mean I have to levy any respect towards them for it though - quite the opposite.

I also dont respect the way Christian men accuse women of wrong doing because the man cant control their lustful thoughts and I have to take some responsibility for that. You know I manage my thoughts just fine. Why cant men just sort themselves out and stop throwing their own failures and weakness back onto their partners.

I wouldn't equate self-respect with pride.

Also I've already addressed some of your complaints previously.

First of all, I wasn't necessarily making specific judgments on the OP...my responses are meant to be open to both men and women as I try to focus on biblical principals.

And I agree that ultimately the lustful person has the responsibility to control themselves. But as Christians we also have a responsibility to help our brother/sister to not lust.

At the end of the day though what you're telling me is just personal opinion...do you have scripture to back up your statements?

1 John 2:16
"16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh and the lust of the eyes and the boastful pride of life, is not from the Father, but is from the world."

Principatus · Jun 29, 2018

Kazzy0614 said:
I don't even feel pretty anymore...?

Dump him. You might think you love him but he's not going to improve. If you don't feel pretty around him now, you won't feel pretty around him when you have stretch marks, saggy boobs and a crying baby in your arms.

I have been through an abusive marriage, I know what its like to be constantly rejected and made to feel unattractive by my spouse. If you marry him you will either feel unsexy your whole life (your self esteem will plummet) or you will get divorced.

Those feelings of love and wanting to be with him your whole life are temporary. You could have those same feelings for someone else in time. Dump him, give yourself some time to get over him, and have some higher standards in men in the future.

S.O.J.I.A. · Jul 1, 2018

well, the well has been thoroughly poisoned by those accusing this guy of being an abuser and a manipulator based solely on assumptions of his motives of his desire for modesty with no proof of such motives.

a question:

can a godly woman dress as someone who works at a strip club as long as she has a good heart and is pure?

MournfulWatcher · Jul 1, 2018

THE W said:
well, the well has been thoroughly poisoned by those accusing this guy of being an abuser and a manipulator based solely on assumptions of his motives of his desire for modesty with no proof of such motives.

a question:

can a godly woman dress as someone who works at a strip club as long as she has a good heart and is pure?

Why are you comparing a girl who is ok with wearing skinny jeans and a tank top to a stripper? That's super demeaning.

S.O.J.I.A. · Jul 1, 2018

MournfulWatcher said:
Why are you comparing a girl who is ok with wearing skinny jeans and a tank top to a stripper? That's super demeaning.

nice dodge(and that's not what i'm doing BTW. i'm actually addressing the logic being used in this thread),

care to answer the question though?

David_AB · Jul 1, 2018

Best thing the OP can do is find someone confidential to talk to who knows both of them.

Sketcher · Jul 1, 2018

Kazzy0614 said:
I'm telling you all this so you have a sense of my personal struggles, and so that you know I am hyper sensitive to people leaving me. Which could explain why I'm so afraid the man I love will leave me if I'm not perfect to him.

He is extremely insecure, and also jealous. His beliefs on no kissing, modesty etc are his own choice, not because he was raised like that. We go to the same church. We both believe the same spiritually.

He's never told me outright when I'm wearing something he doesn't appreciate, but he does tell me about things he'd prefer me wear. I.e the whole prom dress situation. He just seems very disappointed if my neckline is too low or my pants are too tight. Which hurts my self esteem.

You're insecure, he's insecure. Maybe he's insecure about attention you might attract by dressing the way you like to. He definitely sounds insecure about how to deal with his own desires and thought life. If you're both around 18, this kind of insecurity is actually pretty common.

How can you make yourself less insecure? And how can you most effectively communicate devotion to him?

Kazzy0614 said:
The whole "dress code" situation has been bugging me but it's been heightened lately because he's not even talking with me like he used to. We used to have the most lighthearted, fun, amazing conversations that lasted most of the night but now I'm lucky if he texts me asking for something. Sometimes he even ignores me now. Perhaps I'm too scared to let it go...

You've said you were together for two years, and relationships evolve. Less texting isn't automatically a bad sign.

Now, he could literally be all over the place, I can't read his mind. I'm not saying it's as good as it can be, but I am saying it's not automatically as bad as it can be either.

MournfulWatcher · Jul 1, 2018

THE W said:
nice dodge(and that's not what i'm doing BTW. i'm actually addressing the logic being used in this thread),

care to answer the question though?

Boy do I love snarky replies.
Your question has no bearing on the op. The question is what she should do about her relationship with her boyfriend when he thinks what she likes to wear is sleazy, and that she changes her dress for him even though she doesn't agree with his modesty standards and it makes her feel bad about herself.
I'm not dodging. I'm just not going to debate you in an advice thread. Start your own thread about modesty if you're so concerned with it.

S.O.J.I.A. · Jul 1, 2018

MournfulWatcher said:
Boy do I love snarky replies.

and I love baseless accusations, like saying i'm comparing the OP to a stripper....or saying someone is an abuser and a manipulator.

MournfulWatcher said:
Your question has no bearing on the op.

rather, it brings into question the logic being used to respond to the OP.

gonna answer the question or no?

MournfulWatcher · Jul 1, 2018

THE W said:
and I love baseless accusations, like saying i'm comparing the OP to a stripper....or saying someone is an abuser and a manipulator.

rather, it brings into question the logic being used to respond to the OP.

gonna answer the question or no?

Nope. Because this isn't a debate thread. Have a wonderful day.

Joy · Jul 3, 2018

MOD HAT ON

After Staff Review

This Thread is now

Permanently Closed

Due to
SoP Violation
for

on-going Debating

despite Mod Hat

&

Flaming etc

MOD HAT OFF

Boyfriend thinks everything I wear is sleazy?

Finally Old Enough

Praise God, i'm satisifed.

Well-Known Member

Newbie

Praise God, i'm satisifed.

Member

Dynamic UNO

In the beginning was the Word.

Dynamic UNO

Active Member

Born Imperishable

In the beginning was the Word.

Dynamic UNO

In the beginning was the Word.

Well-Known Member

Similar threads