redleghunter

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JESUS SAID IT.

Luke 8:13 JESUS SAYS:
13“Those on the rocky soil are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no firm root; they believe for a while, and in time of temptation fall away."

Mathew 13:20-21 JESUS SAYS:
20“The one on whom seed was sown on the rocky places, this is the man who hears the word and immediately receives it with joy; 21yet he has no firm root in himself, but is only temporary, and when affliction or persecution arises because of the word, immediately he falls away."

Jesus Himself said that the word was RECEIVED with JOY.
Who receives God's word with joy --- an unsaved person??
No. A saved person who has accepted God's word.

Jesus Himself said that it was ONLY TEMPORARY. The person was saved only temporarily. We don't know how long because
he FELL AWAY when persecution or affliction came.

So the person received God's word and was saved,
and then he fell away.
Doesn't say saved. Remember even the demons believe.

None had a firm root. The only root which is firm is Christ and that is why the good soil produced abundantly. Remember we can do nothing without Him.
 
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redleghunter

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If Jesus taught it or not is up for debate... What I was talking about was what the early Church taught, the time after the apostles up to 1500 AD ...
Chrysostom wrote extensive commentaries on the NT books. I'll look up a few on the verses I quoted if you would like. I'm sure he did not use the term perseverance of the saints, but will hazard an assessment he did opine on the sure promises of God.
 
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amariselle

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Definitely we are to take on a yoke. Remember?

But it's a very sweet yoke, of Love One Another, and such good things, that you are vastly better off with that His yoke than the destruction any would face rejecting His yoke.

Matthew 11:29 Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me; for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls.

Yes, and this “yoke” is not burdensome and it is not a yoke of “you must work to stay saved.” Jesus invites people to come to Him and “rest.”

Which is also spoken of in Hebrews 4:

1 Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.
2
For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.
3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.
4 For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.
5 And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest.
6 Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and
they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief:
7 Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts.
8 For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.
9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.
10
For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.
11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.
 
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redleghunter

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I do hope you know that Augustine was a gnostic before he became a Catholic.

And "others like Augustine"???
Like who for instance. He was the ONLY one who spoke about predestination. That was after the year 400.

NO ONE else even though of this till him.
And we all know why...
Because God is love and mercy and He wouldn't send anyone to hell without giving them a chance to be saved.
You can be assured Augustine when opining on election and predestination was not leaning on his previously renounced beliefs. He was responding to heretics known as Pelagians who thought humans retained enough goodness to meet God half way in their salvation.

Augustine's theology was well accepted in the Western Church so much so they held a council to confirm his teachings refuting the Pelagians and semi Pelagians. It was the Council of Orange in 529 AD.

Good read:

Historic Church Documents at Reformed.org
 
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Bible Highlighter

Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul.
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Ephesians 2: NASB
11Therefore remember that formerly you, the Gentiles in the flesh, who are called “Uncircumcision” by the so-called “Circumcision,” which is performed in the flesh by human hands—12remember that you were at that time separate from Christ, excluded from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. 13But now in Christ Jesus you who formerly were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.

This has to do with not being part of the promise. It says nothing of the Law of Moses.

The circumcision Israel
The uncircumcision Gentiles.

Gentiles now brought near by Christ's Blood.

They used to be separate but no longer.


That's interesting hyperbole. Just doesn't match up with the text.

The Bible has to be read as a whole.

7 "But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:
8 How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?
9 For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.
10 For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth.
11 For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious." (2 Corinthians 3:7-11).

"When God speaks of a "new" covenant, it means he has made the first one obsolete. It is now out of date and will soon disappear." (Hebrews 8:13) (NLT).

"But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter." (Romans 7:6).

"Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;" (Colossians 2:14).

20 "Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances,
21 (Touch not; taste not; handle not;
22 Which all are to perish with the using; ) after the commandments and doctrines of men?
23 Which things have indeed a shew of wisdom in will worship, and humility, and neglecting of the body: not in any honour to the satisfying of the flesh."
(Colossians 2:20-23).

“By abolishing in His [own crucified] flesh the enmity [caused by] the Law with its decrees and ordinances [which He annulled]; that He from the two might create in Himself one new man [one new quality of humanity out of the two], so making peace.” (Ephesians 2:15) (AMPC).

"The old [former] rule [commandment; regulation] is now set aside [nullified; abolished], because it was weak and useless [ineffective]." (Hebrews 7:18) (EXB).

9 “Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience;
10 Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation.” (Hebrews 9:9-10).
8 “Above when he said, Sacrifice and offering and burnt offerings and offering for sin thou wouldest not, neither hadst pleasure therein; which are offered by the law;
9 Then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second.” (Hebrews 10:8-9).

“And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, and said, Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved.” (Acts of the Apostles 15:1).

"But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses." (Acts of the Apostles 15:5).

"Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment" (Acts of the Apostles 15:24).

28 "For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things;
29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well." (Acts of the Apostles 15:28-29).


The Old Covenant says this about circumcision:

"And the uncircumcised man child whose flesh of his foreskin is not circumcised, that soul shall be cut off from his people; he hath broken my covenant." (Genesis 17:14).


Yet, the New Covenant says this about circumcision:

"Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing." (Galatians 5:2).


The Old Covenant says this about the Sabbath:

32 "And while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man that gathered sticks upon the sabbath day.

33 And they that found him gathering sticks brought him unto Moses and Aaron, and unto all the congregation.

34 And they put him in ward, because it was not declared what should be done to him.

35 And the Lord said unto Moses, The man shall be surely put to death: all the congregation shall stone him with stones without the camp.

36 And all the congregation brought him without the camp, and stoned him with stones, and he died; as the

Lord commanded Moses." (Numbers 15:32-36).


Yet, the New Covenant says this about the Sabbath:

"Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:" (Colossians 2:16).



So it appears things have changed.

This makes sense because Hebrews 7:12 says the Law has changed.


Some think that the laws were different for the Jews than they were for the Gentiles.

However, Romans 2:7-11 says,
7 To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:
8 But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,
9 Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;
10 But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:
11 For there is no respect of persons with God."
 
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Halbhh

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Yes, and this “yoke” is not burdensome and it is not a yoke of “you must work to stay saved.” Jesus invites people to come to Him and “rest.”

Which is also spoken of in Hebrews 4:

1 Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.
2
For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.
3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.
4 For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.
5 And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest.
6 Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and
they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief:
7 Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts.
8 For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.
9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.
10
For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.
11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.
A valuable passage. But be sure to have more translations when the wording is complex like this. Look and see what you can --

1Therefore, while the promise of entering his rest still stands, let us fear lest any of you should seem to have failed to reach it. 2For good news came to us just as to them, but the message they heard did not benefit them, because they were not united by faith with those who listened.a 3For we who have believed enter that rest, as he has said,

“As I swore in my wrath,
‘They shall not enter my rest,’”

although his works were finished from the foundation of the world. 4For he has somewhere spoken of the seventh day in this way: “And God rested on the seventh day from all his works.” 5And again in this passage he said,

“They shall not enter my rest.”

6Since therefore it remains for some to enter it, and those who formerly received the good news failed to enter because of disobedience, 7again he appoints a certain day, “Today,” saying through David so long afterward, in the words already quoted,

“Today, if you hear his voice,
do not harden your hearts.”

8For if Joshua had given them rest, Godb would not have spoken of another day later on. 9So then, there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God, 10for whoever has entered God’s rest has also rested from his works as God did from his.

11Let us therefore strive to enter that rest, so that no one may fall by the same sort of disobedience.


-----------
Hebrews 4 ESV
Hebrews 4 NIV

Hebrews 3:18 And to whom did He swear that they would never enter His rest? Was it not to those who disobeyed?

In these verses, those who truly believe obey.

Those who truly believe will ardently seek to hear His Words.

-------

As we continue reading, In a near chapter soon enough we see faith in action, as it must be --

10 God is not unjust; he will not forget your work and the love you have shown him as you have helped his people and continue to help them.
11 We want each of you to show this same diligence to the very end, so that what you hope for may be fully realized.
 
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ladodgers6

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1 Timothy 2:4
These persons whom God foreknew would come to accept Him and be saved, He predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son.

God predestined that the saved would be made like unto the image of His Son,,,NOT that they would be saved, but HOW that salvation would look.

Okay??? I'm scratching my head. So how do you make these fit together? Is it OUR Free-will choice or God's Election (Predestination)?
 
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mark kennedy

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<It's really late here and I have to go,
but...
I don't care for Augustine.
He came up with orignal sin, baby baptisms, the reason for evil --which he later recanted. He changed his beliefs at least 2 or 3 times during his lifetime.

He brought his gnosticism with him. He was also a manachaen.

This is different from relating a life of sin to your readers.
Paul DID NOT take the Mosaic Law with him when he converted to Chrisitanity. He left it behind.. Augustine didn't leave his beliefs behind.

Tomorrow.
Augistine went through some changes, after reading his Confessions I chalked it up to conversion. What I get from him is pretty consistant and he did not introduce original sin as doctrine, it is readily found in the writings of the early church fathers. It's also found in Romans 5 for that matter, to say nothing of Genesis 3.
 
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redleghunter

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The Bible has to be read as a whole.
Indeed. But not at the expense of the immediate context.

The audience was Gentile and the Law of Moses was not a consideration in the immediate text. To go outside the text of the context to inject something not topical is pretext.
 
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You can be assured Augustine when opining on election and predestination was not leaning on his previously renounced beliefs. He was responding to heretics known as Pelagians who thought humans retained enough goodness to meet God half way in their salvation.

Augustine's theology was well accepted in the Western Church so much so they held a council to confirm his teachings refuting the Pelagians and semi Pelagians. It was the Council of Orange in 529 AD.

Good read:

Historic Church Documents at Reformed.org

Whew had me worried there for a minute, I mean St. Augustine a covert Gnostic? Imagine all the implications if it were the case so early in Church history. It would appear to be the end of Church history as we know it (because the Church didn't know it), considering his Saint status and importance in Church history, and to the history of Christian doctrines taught historically.

P.S. If I could have rated both agree and winner, I would have.
 
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redleghunter

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In verse 9, the writer is denying the salvific power of doing the works of Law of Moses, and not that of the more general category of “good works”.
Again no, Paul says works. Paul has specifically used "The Law" and "works of the Law" elsewhere but not here. This is an assumption on your part not supported by the text.

There's a reason, he is addressing Gentiles who were never Jews or part of the Promise.

Consider the Greek or Hellanized Gentiles there. They did not live their lives as Jews. They were pagans who had a deep Greek philosophical background believing in the general virtue of mankind. That man alone is being who the gods made to live virtuous lives.

A leading philosophy of the time of Paul's ministry was Stoicism:

The Stoics thought that the good life (eudaimonia, often translated as “flourishing”) consisted in cultivating one's moral virtues in order to become a good person. The four cardinal virtuesrecognized by the Stoics were: Wisdom (sophia), Courage (andreia), Justice (dikaiosyne), and Temperance (sophrosyne).

A leading Stoic philosopher of this timeframe was Seneca the Younger (c. 4 BC – AD 65)

Seneca the Younger - Wikipedia

Once again, consider the audience. This is the background of beliefs of the universe and philosophy of the Gentiles Paul is addressing in Ephesians before their conversion. These people would know about virtue that people can aspire on their own to live good lives. Many did as they gave to the poor, improved social services for them and helped school them. These are the works of virtue Paul is speaking of in Ephesians 2:8.


A point of method: One cannot simply assert that the writer is talking about good works here. That begs the question, since the term “works” is not qualified by the term “good” or anything else that would rule out the possibility that the “works” of the Law of Moses is the subject.
Paul says works. Again the Gentiles he addressed were never under the Law of Moses. Your argument works for Romans 3, but not here.

3. Therefore, if Paul wants to reassure his Gentile readers that they too are beneficiaries of the promise of justification, what case does he need to make?
Which he did by showing the Gentiles are beneficiaries through the blood of Christ. This point is true but has nothing to do with the "works" Paul said could not save them. No verse links the works with the Law of Moses.

The only allusion to the Law was the ceremonial law fulfilled by Christ (verse 15) to bring peace to all peoples and nations. If you want to get 'work' out of that you can only point to Christ's work.

Obviously, the case that one is not justified by the works of the Law of Moses. Because if the works of the Law of Mose could justify, then only Jews could be justified since they are the only ones under the Law of Moses!
Actually justification is not specifically discussed. Paul says by Grace you are saved through faith.

No mention of the Jewish law.
And if this were not obvious enough, here is a text from Romans 3 that makes it crystal clear:
That is Romans not Ephesians. Why would Paul even mention the works of the Law in a post Jerusalem council Gentile audience who were never under the Law of Moses? That's why he did not other than show them in Eph 2:15 that Christ by His sacrifice He made peace for Jew and Gentile.

You are undermining your own argument. Let's tack your interpretation of verse 11 and following - which I heartily agree with - onto the the "thereofore" beginning at verse 11:
At verse 11 and following Paul discussed how both Jew and Gentile are made one in Christ. We agree on this but it does not undermine the definition of "works" I gave since I said "works." And as mentioned above the "works" would be understood by the Gentile audience as works they would do and not the Law of Moses.
 
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redleghunter

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Did I not explain this? If you have a Gentile audience who know that Jews believe that God will only justify Jews, it makes perfect sense for the author to assure those Gentiles that a person is not justified by doing the works of the Law of Moses, which only the Jew can do.

How is this not crystal clear?
The only Law work mentioned is in verse 15 and that is the work of Christ.
 
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zoidar

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Separate the sheep from the goats. The goats had it coming already.

... how did he separate the sheep and the goats? The text is pretty clear, by our deeds.
 
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1TIMOTHY.4: = The Great Apostasy
4 Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons, 2 speaking lies in hypocrisy, having their own conscience seared with a hot iron, 3 forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from foods which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth. 4 For every creature of God is good, and nothing is to be refused if it is received with thanksgiving; 5 for it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.
_ _ _ _ _ _ _

The Scripture is describing those apostates(= departed from the faith) who "forbid to marry, commanding to abstain from foods", etc and they may further say that the disobedients are not saved. Those who teach "justified by faith+works" may fall into this category of false teachers.

Forbidding to marry = eg commanding 18 years old committed Christian couples that they cannot just get married in the eyes of God but they must marry legally by applying for a marriage license = they are forced to wait at least 7 years until after 25 years old = a great burden.
....... Since the 1970s, most youngsters could only afford to get legally married after 25 years old.

Commanding to abstain from foods = commanding Christians that they must obey kosher food laws, eg cannot eat pork.

Commanding to pay tithe of one-tenth, commanding to volunteer for Church work, etc.

The false teachers often say, "If you disobey this commandment/law/rule, you are going to hell".
_ _ _ _ _ _

2TIMOTHY.3: = 14 But you must continue in the things which you have learned and been assured of, knowing from whom you have learned them, 15 and that from childhood you have known the Holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

16 All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, 17 that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work.
 
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zoidar

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Chrysostom wrote extensive commentaries on the NT books. I'll look up a few on the verses I quoted if you would like. I'm sure he did not use the term perseverance of the saints, but will hazard an assessment he did opine on the sure promises of God.

I don't know much about Chrysostom, but sure quote him. I don't know if it's true that perseverance of the saints was taught first in 1500AD, I haven't checked that up myself. No one seemed to have any argument against it, until you just did.
 
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zoidar

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A valuable passage. But be sure to have more translations when the wording is complex like this. Look and see what you can --

1Therefore, while the promise of entering his rest still stands, let us fear lest any of you should seem to have failed to reach it. 2For good news came to us just as to them, but the message they heard did not benefit them, because they were not united by faith with those who listened.a 3For we who have believed enter that rest, as he has said,

“As I swore in my wrath,
‘They shall not enter my rest,’”

although his works were finished from the foundation of the world. 4For he has somewhere spoken of the seventh day in this way: “And God rested on the seventh day from all his works.” 5And again in this passage he said,

“They shall not enter my rest.”

6Since therefore it remains for some to enter it, and those who formerly received the good news failed to enter because of disobedience, 7again he appoints a certain day, “Today,” saying through David so long afterward, in the words already quoted,

“Today, if you hear his voice,
do not harden your hearts.”

8For if Joshua had given them rest, Godb would not have spoken of another day later on. 9So then, there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God, 10for whoever has entered God’s rest has also rested from his works as God did from his.

11Let us therefore strive to enter that rest, so that no one may fall by the same sort of disobedience.


-----------
Hebrews 4 ESV
Hebrews 4 NIV

Hebrews 3:18 And to whom did He swear that they would never enter His rest? Was it not to those who disobeyed?

In these verses, those who truly believe obey.

Those who truly believe will ardently seek to hear His Words.

-------

As we continue reading, In a near chapter soon enough we see faith in action, as it must be --

10 God is not unjust; he will not forget your work and the love you have shown him as you have helped his people and continue to help them.
11 We want each of you to show this same diligence to the very end, so that what you hope for may be fully realized.

When I read the Bible I often check with a few different translations, and also greek translation (studylight.org), because of alla the errors that come along. It's sad to see that the Bible often is translated in accordance to a specific theology instead of a more literal translation. As we see here in Heb 4, who could have known that disobedience was changed to unbelief ... actually it makes me quite upset, because it keeps people away from the truth, and it makes it harder to study the Bible.
 
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GodsGrace101

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Lol....perhaps I have another Gospel. Sure, I will share the Gospel of Christ with you. Before I do , I want to explain and clarify some of what you have wrote here. In the Article of B.B. Warfield he explains it, in a lucid and concise precision.

We are saved by WORKS. What???? Yes, I said that. I hope you understand that the works that God accept as perfectly righteous; obviously have too be perfectly righteous! Can you name anyone in the Bible who has fulfilled God's Law with Perfect flawless works without a single blemish of sin? You agree that every sinner is under the curse of the Law? Why are sinners under the curse of the Law? Because the Law only brings knowledge of sin; and sin brings condemnation & death! This is the curse all sinners are under! Now if you understand this. Then you will understand Grace in Christ!
The law is a curse.
Galatians 3:10

When God made the covenant with Moses the curse was not the law, but the disobedience of it. God knew even then that the people could not keep the law. In fact, what was desired by God was the WILLINGNESS to keep the law. God desired belief in Him, even back then. Israel sinned because they did not trust God.
Numbers 13:11, Deuteronomy 1:32, 9:23, 2 Kings 17:14...

The Mosaic Covenant was based on Fatih, just like the New Covenant. God will forgive those who sin...Exodus 34:6-7
Exodus 20:6

The curses of this covenant can be found in
Leviticus 26:3-13
Deuteronomy 28:1-14....

Romans 7:12 tells us that the law is good...
God gave us the law for our own good. But the temptation of it (doing evil) is what Paul is talking about when he says it is a curse.

Here is Romans 8:1There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. 2For the law of the Spirit of life has set you free in Christ Jesus from the law of sin and death. 3For God has done what the law, weakened by the flesh, could not do. By sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and for sin, he condemned sin in the flesh, 4in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.

Here you have it. There is therefore NOW NO CONDEMNATION for those who are in Christ Jesus. Why because Christ condemned sin in the flesh, in ORDER that the righteous REQUIREMENT of the LAW might be fulfilled in us! In other words we received the imputed righteousness of Christ through Faith! His righteousness becomes ours! And our sins are imputed to Christ!
You said above that Jesus died so that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled IN US. The law has not been abolished Mathew 5:17 (the moral law), we are still required to obey the 10 commandments, what has changed is that we are now ABLE to keep them, whereas before we weren't.
Now we are no longer in the flesh, but in the spirit,
Romans 8:9

Now that we got some ground to understand our condition as sinners, and believers in Christ. Let's look at this verse in Romans 3:28.

28For we hold that one is justified by faith apart from works of the law.

Do you agree with this verse? Because if you do, then you'll understand what we are speaking about. On the doctrine of Justification by Faith. There is only two ways to be saved. Through the Law with Perfect flawless works that fulfill God's Law, or through Faith in Christ Alone! Alone means there is no other way for a sinner to be saved, except in Christ and His works! So when we say, Justification by Faith Alone; which is shorthand. We mean Justification in Christ Alone! And this we receive through faith; which is just a empty hand. We cannot offer anything in an exchange for this Gift of Christ! God's gives it freely to the ungodly who believe that this gift saves sinners!
Yes, I agree. The above is all correct.
Justification is given to us by God's grace, through our faith in Him.

This is called Grace, not obedience of the sinner, or works to maintain our salvation. Because Christ 'FINISH' His Father's will at the Cross! And what's His Father's will?

John 6:38For I have come down from heaven, not to do my own will but the will of him who sent me. 39And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day. 40For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.”
In your red above, it's stated that Jesus will raise IT up on the last day...not raise THEM up on the last day. What does IT refer to?
God sent Jesus to be our redeemer. If we follow Jesus, we will be raised on the last day in our glorious bodies.
The IT that is referred to is that Jesus takes the people sent to Him by the Father (whoever WILL go to the Son) and makes them straight with God and teaches them what God wants. This was spoken of in Jeremiah 31:34.
So the IT refers to Jesus' work and the finished product on the last day.
John 6:39

And in John 6:40 it speaks that the persons who were taught by Jesus and believed in Him will also be raised.

I pray that you read this and understand what God sent His Son to do for us.

Getting back to your question. I agree with you that the word 'ALONE' is not found in the Bible. But the concept is there. As Christians we must read, and study God's word, to understand it. So that we do not get deceived. Here's an example of the concept of the word Alone is taught in Scripture. Do you believe in the Trinity? Where in Scripture is the word Trinity found? Nowhere, does that mean, there is no Trinity, because the word is not there?

This is how we get the word Alone in Scripture. If one is justified by faith in Christ (who Jesus is and what He has done) apart from works of the Law. Then there is nothing else but Christ Alone through Faith Alone! Understand???
Again, yes, we are justified by faith alone.

Before I reply to these comments. I see you are not understanding us. I want to see what you have to say about this.

So how do you rectify what you say here. With the following passages:

Galatians 3:11Now it is evident that no one is justified before God by the law...

Galatians2:15 We ourselves are Jews by birth and not Gentile sinners; 16yet we know that a person is not justified by works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, so we also have believed in Christ Jesus, in order to be justified by faith in Christ and not by works of the law, because by works of the law no one will be justified.

Titus 3:5he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit, 6whom he poured out on us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior, 7so that being justified by his grace we might become heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

Romans 3:28 28For we hold that one is justified by faith apart from works of the law.

There is a lot more to quote, but these will suffice. Oh I have this last one.

1 Cor. 1:30 30It is because of him that you are in Christ Jesus, who has become for us wisdom from God—that is, our righteousness, holiness and redemption. 31Therefore, as it is written: “Let the one who boasts boast in the Lord.”
Nothing to reconcile. All the above is correct.

Why do you think Christ had to become our righteousness, holiness and redemption?

Now please, I want to remind you. We are speaking about, How a SINNER is justified before God? We are not speaking believers in sanctification. I am not trying to trap you or trick you here. That's not what I do. I only seek the truth! And hope you do too?

So please how do these passages fit into what you believe?
It won't be too easy to trick me. I know the truth and the truth sets me free.

So why are we NOT speaking about sanctification??

Have you read Galatians, this term come from the Apostle Paul! Galatians 1:6 I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting him who called you in the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel7not that there is another one, but there are some who trouble you and want to distort the gospel of Christ.
Galatians is talking about converted Jews that wanted to go back to the Law. We are not under the law but under grace.
Does this mean the Law has been abolished? I'm told by many that it has, but Jesus said He did not come to abolish the law.

After Paul was done admonishing the Jews to stay with the freedom found in Christ because the Law does not function, but love does, he does go on to say that we are to live by the Spirit.
Galatians 5:16-22
So it IS important to make new Christians understand that a life must be changed. Faith alone does not teach this. It teaches that all we have to do is have faith and worry about nothing else.

See Galatians 6:1-10
Jesus also has Laws.
We are to test our actions.
Let us not become weary of doing good.
We will reap a harvest, IF we do NOT GIVE UP.
Let us do good.

Then Paul mentions circumcision again which would be returning to the old law.

Could you make your point in two sentences?
Here's mine...
We are saved by justification alone. Nothing from us.
Sanctification is a work of the Holy Spirit but requires our cooperation. We must obey the HolySpirit or He cannot work in us.
 
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